NZ fibre puts many countries to shame

[Carclis]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

on the fringe of suburbia or rural?

Suburbia but I wouldn't say fringe at all. I'm approximately 7km from the city centre which is about 50% to 70% as far as the suburbs go. The thing is where I live the city centre and areas that are more central to the city have not yet got NBN whereas all the areas that are almost rural have had it for years.

[Amazonsucks]

1 minute ago, GoldenLag said:

You are still ending up paying it one way or another. Of the free market was so great there would be no need for said govemerment to fund it. 

There isnt a NEED. Dont conflate a motive for a need.

 

2 minutes ago, GoldenLag said:

Youve seemed to miss our favorite nordic animal that isnt in the north at all iirc posts......

Animal?

 

3 minutes ago, GoldenLag said:

You meak regular taxpayer money....... Its not like they are thieves. 

 

You know that there arent exactly incompetent people doing this. Its not like they use random people to do this. They could fund a company to do the exact same thing and similar issue would appear, exept then they would blame the company and not the goverment.

Except the government has no competition and cant go out of business when the cost doubles, the product sucks and people want some alternative.

 

They are obviously incompetent if they quote a price,then it doubles and they still manage to make it suck. A private company that did that would go out of business and someone else would take their place.

 

Tax is theft if you dont voluntarily donate it. If you dont pay taxes men with guns do come for you to imprison you or tame your stuff so its theft.

 

8 minutes ago, GoldenLag said:

will admit. I didnt read the entire thing,

Probs should. "Knowledge is power." Francis Bacon.

[mr moose]

Just now, Carclis said:

Suburbia but I wouldn't say fringe at all. I'm approximately 7km from the city centre which is about 50% to 70% as far as the suburbs go. The thing is where I live the city centre and areas that are more central to the city have not yet got NBN whereas all the areas that are almost rural have had it for years.

The role out is a bit haphazard, I have a friend who is supposed to be getting it in feb, but 3month delays are not unusual.    The worst bit are those in established estates, especially the older ones on 60 Yo copper.  Basically only new estates are getting FTTP, FTTN is touch and go, but I have yet to find anyone who is getting less than the 12Mb.

[leadeater]

3 minutes ago, Amazonsucks said:

Tax is theft if you dont voluntarily donate it

There is absolutely nothing voluntary about tax, literally the only choice you have to not pay it is move to another country.... and pay their tax.

 

Quote

a compulsory contribution to state revenue, levied by the government on workers' income and business profits, or added to the cost of some goods, services, and transactions.

 

[mr moose]

Just now, leadeater said:

There is absolutely nothing voluntary about tax, literally the only choice you have to not pay it is move to another country.... and pay their tax.

 

 

Tax is the rent you pay to live in a country. If you want the benefits of that country you have pay for them.

[leadeater]

1 minute ago, mr moose said:

Tax is the rent you pay to live in a country. If you want the benefits of that country you have pay for them.

I mean good luck having money in the first place if nobody paid taxes, money isn't magic nor grows on trees. Off topic so meh, was such an amusing thing to say I had to comment at least once though.

[Amazonsucks]

 

10 minutes ago, mr moose said:

You are ignoring all the facts to continue this charade of whatever it is you don't like about the NBN,  you are literally trying to argue it is something it isn't because of a some sort of agenda, you don't live here, you don't have to search the plans (by the way did I mention you can choose from 150 different ISP's). it absolutely does not effect you, yet for some reason you have this urge to tell everyone they are wrong and the best you can do is bring up heavily politicized and sensationalized media

Oh, so you mean you dont like it when someone posts a thread specifically to brag about their country, while simultaneously telling another country that is very different(and even spends money to make their bragging possible) what they ought to do?

 

You dont like the OPs agenda based thread? You know the one youve been fine posting in until i point out that people are overlooking the issues and facts about their own countries while bitching about the USA?

 

Hmmm...

[Amazonsucks]

7 minutes ago, leadeater said:

There is absolutely nothing voluntary about tax, literally the only choice you have to not pay it is move to another country.... and pay their tax.

 

 

Thank you for reinforcing my point that it is indeed theft. Men with guns coming for you if you dont give them money is usually called robbery to be specific.

[mr moose]

3 minutes ago, leadeater said:

 money isn't magic nor grows on trees.

Not any more,  *polishes knuckles on chest*   that's another thing the world can thank Australia for,  polymer money.

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, Amazonsucks said:

 

Oh, so you mean you dont like it when someone posts a thread specifically to brag about their country, while simultaneously telling another country that is very different(and even spends money to make their bragging possible) what they ought to do?

 

You dont like the OPs agenda based thread? You know the one youve been fine posting in until i point out that people are overlooking the issues and facts about their own countries while bitching about the USA?

 

Hmmm...

 

You do realise that post doesn't actually make any sense don't you?

[leadeater]

1 hour ago, Amazonsucks said:

Thank you for reinforcing my point that it is indeed theft.

Then please stop using your roads, don't drink utility water and have no electricity. Also hand over all your federal printed and regulated money since you aren't paying for the privilege to have it in the first place.

 

Theft, ha calling it so not maketh. At least you are being highly entertaining.

[Amazonsucks]

2 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

You do realise that post doesn't actually make any sense don't you?

10 hours ago, R0ADK1LL said:

Many people like to talk about how the free market is best but NZ's government sponsored plan to roll out high speed internet to almost the entire country is going pretty well. Compare it to the US where a handful of companies have their own monopolies and refuse to upgrade the infrastructure, despite having received tax breaks for that specific purpose.

[leadeater]

3 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

You do realise that post doesn't actually make any sense don't you?

He is of course assuming the OP is from New Zealand, I'll let you figure out if that is actually the case.

[Amazonsucks]

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Then please stop using your roads, don't drink utility water and have no electricity. Also hand over all your federal printed and regulated money since you aren't paying for the privileged to have it in the first place.

 

Theft, ha calling it so not maketh. At least you are being highly entertaining.

You mean the Fiat currency thats worth less than the denim its printed on? I prefer gold anyway. I often take the toll roads by the way. Theyre faster and have better pavement. 

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, Amazonsucks said:

 

And?

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

He is of course assuming the OP is from New Zealand, I'll let you figure out if that is actually the case.

The problem with that assumption is that nothing I have said actually requires the OP to be anything.  In fact what I have said in this thread doesn't even require the OP to be correct. 

[GoldenLag]

3 minutes ago, Amazonsucks said:

Animal?

You know what a moose is right?

You tell him/her @mr moosein case he/she doesnt.

 

8 minutes ago, Amazonsucks said:

There isnt a NEED. Dont conflate a motive for a need.

There is a market. ROI time says no....... And your argument says what?

 

20 minutes ago, Amazonsucks said:

Probs should. "Knowledge is power." Francis Bacon.

And knowing the context and where info comes from is just as important as the info itself. 

[Amazonsucks]

Just now, mr moose said:

And?

The problem with that assumption is that nothing I have said actually requires the OP to be anything.  In fact what I have said in this thread doesn't even require the OP to be correct. 

 

3 minutes ago, leadeater said:

He is of course assuming the OP is from New Zealand, I'll let you figure out if that is actually the case.

 

Precisely. Doesnt matter if the OP is from NZ or not. The same "logic" applies. If @mr moose is fine commenting on the affairs of countries that he doesnt live in, but then asks why i am, he already has his answer.

 

And if the OP is simply misinformed and doesnt even live in NZ but is championing their government run internet, while complaining about the US then its even more amusing really.

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, GoldenLag said:

You know what a moose is right?

You tell him/her @mr moosein case he/she doesnt.

 

There is a market. ROI time says no....... And your argument says what?

 

And knowing the context and where info comes from is just as important as the info itself. 

@Amazonsucks what golden lag is saying is that I am not in the northern hemisphere and neither is the NBN. Your arguments (as wrong as they are) about the NBN do not apply as you think they do to Golden lag's country, government nor experience for that matter.

[mr moose]

Just now, Amazonsucks said:

 

 

Precisely. Doesnt matter if the OP is from NZ or not. The same "logic" applies. If @mr moose is fine commenting on the affairs of countries that he doesnt live in, but then asks why i am, he already has his answer.

 

And if the OP is simply misinformed and doesnt even live in NZ but is championing their government run internet, while complaining about the US then its even more amusing really.

Because I am not making shit up about the US nor am I digging through average news articles to prove a failed point. I am not bringing irrelevant points about tax or using the term nationalization as if it is a full gone conclusion of anything.

 

I quite like the NZ system, I think it is better than the Australian one.  They seem to have gone one step further in being able to provide a service that is very hard to do. 

 

 

[Amazonsucks]

1 minute ago, mr moose said:

@Amazonsucks what golden lag is saying is that I am not in the northern hemisphere and neither is the NBN. Your arguments (as wrong as they are) about the NBN do not apply as you think they do to Golden lag's country, government nor experience for that matter.

I was discussing Australia, NZ and the USA. I dont know where he is from. And your statements(as wrong as they are) do not apply since i wasnt presuming his country of residence...

[leadeater]

43 minutes ago, mr moose said:

I quite like the NZ system, I think it is better than the Australian one.  They seem to have gone one step further in being able to provide a service that is very hard to do. 

Ours wasn't any different to the first technical Aus plan, the only difference was that it was feasible for us and not for you. I remember very early on in the UFB planning the explicit mentioning of reusing the Aus plan. It's not by chance NBN and UFB are very similar in structure.

[mr moose]

4 minutes ago, Amazonsucks said:

I was discussing Australia, NZ and the USA. I dont know where he is from. And your statements(as wrong as they are) do not apply since i wasnt presuming his country of residence...

so you've gone back to not making any sense again.

[Amazonsucks]

8 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Because I am not making shit up about the US nor am I digging through average news articles to prove a failed point. I am not bringing irrelevant points about tax or using the term nationalization as if it is a full gone conclusion of anything.

 

I quite like the NZ system, I think it is better than the Australian one.  They seem to have gone one step further in being able to provide a service that is very hard to do. 

 

 

You mean a "foregone conclusion"?

 

I figured if i didnt link to Australian articles youd say i was "making shit up". Looks like you resorted to being hostile and insulting anyway but i know its ok for you to do so.

 

As for golden lag. What i am saying is that: I dont know where he lives and never claimed to. Your presumption is therefore incorrect, but its ok. I know youre pretending not to get it like telling me "the NBN doesnt concern you since you dont live here" while ignoring the entire NZ vs US premise of the OP.

[mr moose]

Just now, leadeater said:

Ours wasn't any different to the first technical Aus plan, the only difference was that it was feasible for us and not for you. I remember very early on in the UFB planning the explicit mentioning of reusing the Aus plan. It's not by chance NBN and UFB as very similar in structure.

I think you guys just did a feasibility study and realised it would work in your situation.  We did not do the feasibility study

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, Amazonsucks said:

You mean a "foregone conclusion"?

 

I figured if i didnt link to Australian articles youd say i was "making shit up". Looks like you resorted to being hostile and insulting anyway but i know its ok for you to do so.

you mean "didn't" and "you'd" and "I" and "it's"  not that correcting English adds anything to the discussion, but it seems important to you.

 

The problem is you aren't actually making an argument that is grounded in anything,   There are lots of articles (easily 1000's) of articles that have a go at the NBN, some of them are fair complaints and some are just rubbish, but they do not in any way represent the overall success of the NBN.  Pointing to some flaws is easy for anything, finding news articles that shit on a government project is even easier.  Any project.  That's not evidence and it certainly doesn't disprove any of what I have said.

 

The Australian NBN model is very similar to the NZ model and the fact of the matter is as a nationalized system it works exceedingly well.