[EOL] PSU Tier List rev. 14.8

[Juular]

5 minutes ago, Kaygooo said:

All spc units including supremo l2/m2,fm2 don't have OTP to meet A tier requirements. They're based on Sama oem's so probably also all their units don't have it.

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The combined limit for OPP was kinda problematic to achieve. Both lower rails being limited to about 20 A and having my +12V draw limit (in the meantime increased though), I could have only loaded the unit with about 950 W. It was close to shut down in the end though as the unit started cycling, which would suggest there is actually OTP present. As the supervisor had intermittent signal from OTP sensor (thermistor), it was showing this behaviour, as the unit cooled down, things returned to normal. So the unit can deliver the power and actual OPP (or +12 V OCP) limit is higher, but it has cooling problems when overloaded.

https://www.hardwareinsights.com/modecom-volcano-750-gold-review/6/

Usual shit, they just don't claim it but it's there. We also probably have half of tier B units like this, we're going to check them all eventually to see if there are such examples too. It's difficult tho as the only one reviewer that routinely tests OTP is Aris.

[Sapphiree]

But even if the manufacturer doesn't mention it, such power supplies should not be in tier A. FM2 exceeds 40 degrees allready for 70% load.

I think it's worth thinking about how to better separate (or sort) the most recommended units from those that are little known and barely meet the requirements of a given tier.

[Juular]

1 hour ago, Kaygooo said:

FM2 exceeds 40 degrees allready for 70% load.

So what ? If you're thinking of it's 40°C rating, it means that it can output full power at ambient temperature of 40°C, nothing else. 40°C operating temperature for a PSU is rather low, most high-end PSUs have OTP tripping point set somewhere 120-160°C, and operate at 60-100°C with full load under high ambient temperature (on the components, not exhaust airflow), thermals vary heavily so there's no universal thermals range so you could say that 'this is high', it depends on design.

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But even if the manufacturer doesn't mention it, such power supplies should not be in tier A.

That's kinda wrong, if OTP are there, why not tier it properly ?

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I think it's worth thinking about how to better separate (or sort) the most recommended units from those that are little known and barely meet the requirements of a given tier.

We're trying to do exactly that right now, making limits in ripple and load regulation for now. One of consequences of this are detiering of Corsair TXm to tier B+ for example. But these limits seem to have been there for a while now, just de-facto, for example Corsair CX would've qualified for tier A if not for it's high ripple (half-bridge LLC resonant, DC-DC, all protections) but you never seen it there, we're trying to make methodology more transparent.

[viceice]

How can "Rampage Everest ETX 750" can be Tier A PSU?

 

Here in Turkey  Rampage/Everest is aligned with bad quality bad PSUs. But this list claims this particular PSU is good?

 

https://www.hepsiburada.com/rampage-etx-750-1-750w-80-plus-gold-aktif-pfc-12cm-fan-oyuncu-power-supply-p-BD400172?magaza=Teknopcsarf&wt_gl=cpc.6802.shop.elk.it-ssc&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1r3q36CV6AIVjuiaCh3H9QjtEAkYASABEgI4GPD_BwE

 

514 Turkish Liras.

 

Practically, all the other PSUs from Tier A to Tier B costs 800+ Turkish Liras.

 

So what is the catch here? Why this particular PSU is being sold so cheaply? Can we be sure that its the same build quality PSU with the one mentioned in this list?

 

Because to get a "good Tier B and higher PSU" in Turkey usually ends up with you spending at least, at least 750-800 TL and 1000+ TL in most cases.

 

I really wonder how did you rate this PSU? Did you guys had it personally? Or you just rate it at Tier A bcoz you think its the same with Vivo24k/sama forza gold? How sure you can be that they're equal in terms of power delivering capabilities?

 

If really this is the case, than we wouldn't have to pay absurt levels of moneys to other high end PSUs.

 

Hydro G 750W for example costs "800" Liras. Corsair RMx sells for 1000+ Liras.

 

Why would I get a Corsair RMx at 1000+ liras when you deem it as teh same quality with a 500 TL unit?

 

I sincerely hope i can get a definitive answer on this. I would like to suggest this PSU to my friend and maybe buy it myself depending on your words... But know that Everest/Rampage is being frowned up in here Turkey. They always stuck in people's minds as bad quality brand bcoz of their bad quality products in general.

 

Sorry for the long post, have a good day. Thanks in advance!

[LukeSavenije]

2 minutes ago, viceice said:

How can "Rampage Everest ETX 750" can be Tier A PSU?

because of some... reviews (they were quite basic) had internal shots, indicating being the same SAMA internally

 

15 minutes ago, viceice said:

Why would I get a Corsair RMx at 1000+ liras when you deem it as teh same quality with a 500 TL unit?

RMx still would be better, since the fan controller and such is much more higher end, as well as other things we don't explicitly rate

[Juular]

1 hour ago, viceice said:

How can "Rampage Everest ETX 750" can be Tier A PSU?

Because as Luke said it's SAMA Forza Gold, just with a different label on it. They (Rampage) link PlugLoad 80+ certification report for SAMA FTX which is Forza Gold on the product page and it looks exactly like it externally too.

It's quite possible that other PSUs in Rampage product stack are very bad quality (not unheard of with most of other PSU brands too, just look at EVGA lineup) but this one should be good.

Exact same platform also used in SPC Supremo PSUs series, they're quite cheap on European market too but perform good enough to rival even some expensive high-end PSUs.

Corsair RMx is not the same performance tho, it's one of the best units over there overall (sub 1000W at least). IMO i'd rather compare SAMA Forza with smth like Corsair RM or Seasonic Focus and it's rebrands (forgive me Seasonic fanboys) if we only take performance into consideration. Of course i'd rather get Corsair or Seasonic over any of SAMA rebrands just to have longer warranty and possibly better support but if they're twice as expensive, i'll definitely think twice before paying considerably more for the same performance.

 

Here's some reviews on this platform :
https://www.hardwareinsights.com/modecom-volcano-750-gold-review/6/
https://ru.gecid.com/power/vinga_vps-750g/?s=all
https://ithardware.pl/testyirecenzje/silentiumpc_supremo_fm2_gold_750_w_najlepszy_w_swojej_cenie-4499.html
https://www.purepc.pl/zasilacze/premierowy_test_zasilacza_silentiumpc_supremo_fm2_gold_650w?page=0,7
https://www.jonnyguru.com/blog/2017/02/20/vivo-24k-650w-power-supply/4/

[NeptuneIX]

Hey why is the riotoro enigma g2 placed in A-? I wanted to pick it up for my (soon to be)2070 super system...

[Juular]

6 minutes ago, NeptuneIX said:

Hey why is the riotoro enigma g2 placed in A-? I wanted to pick it up for my (soon to be)2070 super system...

Because @LukeSavenije forgot to split it. Fresh revisions should be Focus GX based (like from late 2019 and 2020) so they don't have issues associated with Focus FX. Either way, even old FX v1 would probably be good with RTX2070S, it's not very high transient-ish GPU.

[NeptuneIX]

40 minutes ago, Juular said:

Because @LukeSavenije forgot to split it. Fresh revisions should be Focus GX based (like from late 2019 and 2020) so they don't have issues associated with Focus FX. Either way, even old FX v1 would probably be good with RTX2070S, it's not very high transient-ish GPU.

is there a chance that the store has some old stocks though or has seasonic recalled them?

[Juular]

16 minutes ago, NeptuneIX said:

is there a chance that the store has some old stocks though or has seasonic recalled them?

There is, it's highly unlikely Seasonic recalled even Focus v1, and it's even less likely for Riotoro. You could ask the retailer what's manufacturing date of the unit.

[NeptuneIX]

Alright, I'll see to it.

On another note why are the antec basiq VP PSUs in D tier? I've had my Antec VP500PC for 4 years and i've had 0 problems with it(ive been running an rx 580 since early last year)

[Juular]

2 minutes ago, NeptuneIX said:

On another note why are the antec basiq VP PSUs in D tier? I've had my Antec VP500PC for 4 years and i've had 0 problems with it(ive been running an rx 580 since early last year)

It's group regulated, can't find any good review of it with crossloads testing but it most likely fails spectacularly, i.e voltage regulation would be off 5% tolerances by ATX specification, this is the main reason.

[NeptuneIX]

1 minute ago, Juular said:

It's group regulated, can't find any good review of it with crossloads testing but it most likely fails spectacularly, i.e voltage regulation would be off 5% tolerances by ATX specification, this is the main reason.

a lot of the VP psus are made by different manufacturers tho

Some delta, some CWT etc
Like the vp450p is delta and the vp500pc that i have is CWT, and they vary in build quality 
But yea the lack of the reviews is the main reason i guess

[Juular]

9 minutes ago, NeptuneIX said:

a lot of the VP psus are made by different manufacturers tho

Some delta, some CWT etc
Like the vp450p is delta and the vp500pc that i have is CWT, and they vary in build quality 
But yea the lack of the reviews is the main reason i guess

I know that VPX50P are Delta, we're talking about VPX00PC which is CWT, smth old like GPK which doesn't perform very good either. Looks like Delta one performs okay (because it's DC-DC double mag amp), but as far as methodology is concerned it wouldn't be higher than tier D either because of the lack of UVP (or at least the apparent lack, i can't find specifications for the supervisor IC used tho).

[NeptuneIX]

1 hour ago, Juular said:

I know that VPX50P are Delta, we're talking about VPX00PC which is CWT, smth old like GPK which doesn't perform very good either. Looks like Delta one performs okay (because it's DC-DC double mag amp), but as far as methodology is concerned it wouldn't be higher than tier D either because of the lack of UVP (or at least the apparent lack, i can't find specifications for the supervisor IC used tho).

https://www.pctekreviews.com/Reviews/VP500PC.aspx 
this review has inside pics of it

[Juular]

9 minutes ago, NeptuneIX said:

https://www.pctekreviews.com/Reviews/VP500PC.aspx 
this review has inside pics of it

Yeah, i've seen it, smth close to CWT GPK, i'm not bothered enough to dig this group reg platform up.

[grmaster]

txm 650 and 550 doesnt have ripple over 50

[Elisis]

3 minutes ago, grmaster said:

txm 650 and 550 doesnt have ripple over 50

Source?

[grmaster]

ftp://members.cybenetics.report/PDF_Reports/d/cybenetics_Qn8.pdf

ftp://members.cybenetics.report/PDF_Reports/d/cybenetics_R7M.pdf

[Elisis]

3 minutes ago, grmaster said:

ftp://members.cybenetics.report/PDF_Reports/d/cybenetics_Qn8.pdf

ftp://members.cybenetics.report/PDF_Reports/d/cybenetics_R7M.pdf

Huh... This'll have to be discussed. 

[orbitalbuzzsaw]

Do we know anything about the EVGA GA? Just curious since I  just saw it on PCPP for the first time. It seems to be gold and modular in the vein of the G1+ from the pictures but,,,

[Juular]

1 minute ago, orbitalbuzzsaw said:

Do we know anything about the EVGA GA? Just curious since I  just saw it on PCPP for the first time. It seems to be gold and modular in the vein of the G1+ from the pictures but,,,

It's Andyson, and ... that's about it. Avoid until reviews will come out.

[orbitalbuzzsaw]

2 minutes ago, Juular said:

It's Andyson, and ... that's about it. Avoid until reviews will come out.

I was not particularly planning to buy one, just curious.

[LukeSavenije]

32 minutes ago, orbitalbuzzsaw said:

Do we know anything about the EVGA GA? Just curious since I  just saw it on PCPP for the first time. It seems to be gold and modular in the vein of the G1+ from the pictures but,,,

it's not even the same oem, actually

 

GA is as @Juular said made by Andyson, based off the PAD01 platform. unfortunately there are no reviews on GA or any other PAD01 based PSU to my knowledge, so it's hard to say where it would exactly come down to

[Tim Serious]

What is this ATX12VO (12 volt only) standard does it affect desktop pc's ??

 

Saw the new seasonic power supply on linus's YouTube.