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Tmansdc

Got four questions about my desktop computer. (Case fans and cpu cooler)

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Right now I'm looking at getting a third-party am4 backplate from amazon, two 140mm case fans, and a new cpu cooler. I only have $100 for all this. I see that the am4 backplate on amazon doesn't work too well with stock wraith coolers but I'm planning on getting an aftermarket cooler.

I got $100 in refund/account balance on amazon so I want to get this stuff on amazon. What I'm looking forward to getting is thermal grizzly cryonaut, two 140mm case fans (one for the top of the case and one for the front. Mobo only supports three fans and one is already being used for the rear exhaust fan.), and a cpu cooler. The questions I have is:

  1. When installing the two case fans, what would be the best way to use them? Should they both be exhaust fans, intake fans, or should one be an intake fan and one be an exhaust fan? Also what's the best position to install them at? I'm thinking center for both.
  2. Last time I tried a tower cpu cooler my gpu got about 10 celsius warmer than it did with the stock downdraft/top down cpu cooler. Will the two fans I'm getting help mitigate that? Did I install the cpu cooler wrong? I got a stock rtx 2070 super so the fans can get a bit loud with temperature and the cooling isn't the best. Yes I should have gotten an aftermarket version but oh well.
  3. What is the best cpu cooler I can get for under $50?
  4. Will this be sufficient enough to secure/mount the cooler? (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07C2BXDQM/ref=psdc_2998409011_t1_B0168H15DO) (https://www.amazon.com/Mounting-Plate-AMD-Socket-AM4/dp/B06X9VF8TN?ref_=ast_bbp_dp)

 

This was my first build. I have a ryzen 5 3600x, 32gb 2x16 ddr4 3200 t-force vulcan ram, 256gb nvme ssd, stock founders edition rtx 2070 super, asus tuf gaming x570 wifi board, evga 650w 80+ gold gq psu, a deepcool matrexx 50 case, and a nf-a12x25 2000rpm pwm fan for the rear exhaust case fan which is my only case fan. I hope I didn't do any permanent damage. What else can I do? Could reseating the cpu help with the heat? I spent like $1300 on this computer and it ran fine for the first month. Should have never redid the cooler. It was working OK before.

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What are you using the Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut for? Most coolers come with decent paste already. 

The backplate might not be necessary depending on what cooler you're using.

What system are you referring to that had a 10c rise for the gpu after replacing the cooler? The higher temps probably aren't a direct result from the new cooler but instead something else. For example, lower cpu temps causing case fans to not run as fast and thus less system case airflow. 

What cooler are you using and what are your temps?

 

Moved to Air Cooling.


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Posted · Original PosterOP

I used the noctua nf-u12s. Maybe the excess heat was caused by the heatsink?

 

I moved back to the stock cooler. Temps range between 33 celsius idle (up to 42 after a while). And just doing some college word processing and web browsing it sometimes revved up to 75 celsius. I was using a non mounted stock wraith spire on top of a 40x40mm innovation cooling graphite thermal pad. I know that's dangerous because it can slip off and ruin my system but I was trying it out.

 

I want the thermal grizzly because I heard it's basically the best non electrically conductive thermal paste and I was going to use that because that way if I utilize too much paste it won't fry the other components.

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1 hour ago, Tmansdc said:

I used the noctua nf-u12s. Maybe the excess heat was caused by the heatsink?

 

I moved back to the stock cooler. Temps range between 33 celsius idle (up to 42 after a while). And just doing some college word processing and web browsing it sometimes revved up to 75 celsius. I was using a non mounted stock wraith spire on top of a 40x40mm innovation cooling graphite thermal pad. I know that's dangerous because it can slip off and ruin my system but I was trying it out.

 

I want the thermal grizzly because I heard it's basically the best non electrically conductive thermal paste and I was going to use that because that way if I utilize too much paste it won't fry the other components.

The heatsink doesn't create any more heat. The fan uses power but it's minuscule. As mentioned, the raise in temps was probably not a directly caused by the cooler. 

You could just use the included thermal paste instead. The money would make a bigger difference going towards a better cooler to begin with as opposed to expensive TIM. 

If you already have the NH-U12S, use that. If gpu temps raise, the problem isn't the cooler. Pay attention to case fan speeds. 

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP

I already have an exhaust fan. The rear by the i/o shield. That's the one you're talking about with rear exhaust fan right?

Just got to find two good 140mm fans. I'm more worried/focused on the cpu cooler, paste, and replacement bracket/backplate/etc. for it first though. Then I'll worry about the case fans.

 

 

Plus I had my one rear exhaust case fan running at max speed which is 2100rpm. Didn't help with the higher gpu temperatures with the new cooler.

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1 minute ago, Tmansdc said:

Plus I had my one rear exhaust case fan running at max speed which is 2100rpm. Didn't help with the higher gpu temperatures with the new cooler.

What were you using to test gpu load temps?

A better cooler could allow the cpu to more aggressively boost and consume more power. 

Do you still have the NH-U12S? It's a great cooler already. As for case fans, NF-A14's are among the best and hard to go wrong with. 

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
14 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

What were you using to test gpu load temps?

A better cooler could allow the cpu to more aggressively boost and consume more power. 

Do you still have the NH-U12S? It's a great cooler already. As for case fans, NF-A14's are among the best and hard to go wrong with. 

 

Make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

I was using gpu-z 2.26. I already sent back the cooler.

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13 hours ago, Tmansdc said:

I was using gpu-z 2.26. I already sent back the cooler.

So you were running the same case fans and the same static rpm before and after getting the new cooler?

The NF-A12x25 is already about as good as it gets for rear exhaust.

For the cpu cooler, the Macho Rev. B is great: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/4TCrxr/thermalright-cpu-cooler-machorevb

No need for the stock AM4 mounting hardware.

A pair of NF-P14S would be great for stock intake: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/8r9KHx/noctua-case-fan-nfp14sredux1500pwm


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Posted · Original PosterOP

No I was using the fan that came with the case. However my gpu temps are pretty much nigh identical with the stock cooler both with the noctua rear fan and the fan that came with the case so I'm not worried.

 

 

Yeah I'm thinking the front fan will be intake and the top fan will be exhaust. 140mm is probably the best I could get to fit properly in my case.

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Would this advice I got on another forum be good as well?

 

 

You can also look at the Scythe Fuma 2, its an excellent cooler as well but it's slight harder to install and takes up more room. On the plus side it comes with a backplate and currently a 5% off coupon on Amazon. I would still swap 120x25 fans with the cooler and your Noctua A12 exhaust fan.

I would still go with three solid 140mm fans over two "better" 140mm fans for lower temps. If you want to "upgrade the fans" some options to look at

Noctua P-14 redux, the 900rpm 3-pin is silent and offers very good performance while the PWM versions offer up to 1200rpm, 1500rpm, or 1700rpm performance if needed. All are around $15. You can look at the Noctua A14 & 15 lines but having owned both series of fans mentioned the A14 & 15 primarily offer more goodies (splitter, rubber fan mounts, low noise adapters, etc.,) then necessarily better performance then the redux series.

Phanteks SP - series - I've owned four of these both led and non led. They are well built and performance wise they are great but they are loud compared to Noctua, you here a "motor whine" noise even at 900rpm. I'm a noise freak so I found it irritating and replaced them with Noctua fans.

If you want to buy a better 140mm fan I would put that one over the HSF for outake and use two solid 140mm fans for front intake

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Yeah I'm going to have to get one with a backplate. Plus it seems like I have no way to open the front of my case so I only have the top and rear exhaust fans. I could probably put two exhaust fans on top or maybe an intake towards the front most part of the top of the case and an exhaust fan towards the furthest rear part of the top of the case as well.

I am just using the stock cooler on top of a 40x40mm innovation cooling graphite pad. I'm getting up to 76 celsius just by browsing the internet and doing college work. I've optimized windows 10 following a guide from Tech Yes City and have absolutely nothing else running in the background.

It seems like I cannot open the front of my case which is a bummer. Until I get two 140mm fans for the top (Or since I can't open the front maybe I'll get 200mm fans now an intake for the front most part of the top of the case and an exhaust for the furthest rear part of the case)

Until I get the 140/200 top case fans I stuck the fan that came with my case in the middle of the top as an exhaust fan. It's doing ok. Don't think it's helping temperatures much though.

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On 10/18/2019 at 2:00 PM, Tmansdc said:

You can also look at the Scythe Fuma 2, its an excellent cooler as well but it's slight harder to install and takes up more room. On the plus side it comes with a backplate and currently a 5% off coupon on Amazon. 
I would still go with three solid 140mm fans over two "better" 140mm fans for lower temps. If you want to "upgrade the fans" some options to look at
Noctua P-14 redux, the 900rpm 3-pin is silent and offers very good performance while the PWM versions offer up to 1200rpm, 1500rpm, or 1700rpm performance if needed. All are around $15. You can look at the Noctua A14 & 15 lines but having owned both series of fans mentioned the A14 & 15 primarily offer more goodies (splitter, rubber fan mounts, low noise adapters, etc.,) then necessarily better performance then the redux series.
Phanteks SP - series - I've owned four of these both led and non led. They are well built and performance wise they are great but they are loud compared to Noctua, you here a "motor whine" noise even at 900rpm. I'm a noise freak so I found it irritating and replaced them with Noctua fans.

The Fuma 2 is great but not much better than the cheaper Macho Rev. B.

Everything mentioned here seems about right.

On 10/18/2019 at 6:13 PM, Tmansdc said:

It seems like I cannot open the front of my case which is a bummer. Until I get two 140mm fans for the top (Or since I can't open the front maybe I'll get 200mm fans now an intake for the front most part of the top of the case and an exhaust for the furthest rear part of the case)

The front panel can be removed. Looks like it's held on by plastic clips so you just pull the front off. http://www.deepcool.com/product/case/2019-04/9_10862.shtml

The front doesn't support 200mm's. Please refer to the specs. 

Spoiler

06_02.png

On 10/19/2019 at 3:44 PM, Tmansdc said:

Ok Here's what I've ordered.

https://imgur.com/a/VLNs79r

The splitters are unnecessary, Arctic's P14 PWM PST's can be daisy chained off of a single fan header. 

I haven't seen many reviews on the Macho Rev. C but it seems a bit noisier than the Rev. B from what I've read. That being said, I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make with the Arctic fans which aren't as quiet. 

Is the NH-L12S in the image the cooler you were referring to earlier? That's considerably worse than the NH-U12S. 

 

Make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.


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Posted · Original PosterOP

Haven't gotten my new cpu cooler yet but I got the fans. I installed two 140mm fans as exhaust on the top of the case but it didn't make a difference! In fact my cpu is acting just like it did and my gpu is actually idling at 31 to 33 now when it used to idle at 27 to 29.


Also I couldn't install my front case fans because I just cannot remove the front case. I looked up two videos and seen that they put the glass part back on after installing the fans. Is there a way I can get longer screws or something and mount them from the reverse side? Or if I can't should I send back the fans and just get two higher quality 140mm case fans with more airflow, static pressure, etc. And just make the fan closer to the front an intake and leave the one closer to the rear as an exhaust fan?


Thank you very much. I should probably look up how to undervolt my cpu because just running steam and chrome goes up to the low 80s temp wise.

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19 minutes ago, Tmansdc said:

I just cannot remove the front case

what case is that anyway? What have you done to try remove it?


"What's under the heatsink?" ep1, "Why it's not as good as it seem?" AMD fanboy edition out, episode 2 "Why my gaming board is a scam?" Intel fanboy edition coming soon (this is a link)

Hardware specs below

CPU: i7-2600K 4751MHz 1.44V (software) --> 1.4?V at the back of the socket Motherboard: Asrock Z77 Extreme4 (BCLK: 103.3MHz) CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 RAM: Adata XPG 2x8GB DDR3 (XMP: 2133MHz 10-11-11-30 CR2, custom: 2203MHz 10-11-10-26 CR1 tRFC:230 tREFI:14000) GPU: Asus GTX 1070 Dual (Super Jetstream vbios, +70(2025-2088MHz)/+400(8.8Gbps)) SSD: Samsung 840 Pro 256GB (main boot drive), Transcend SSD370 128GB PSU: Seasonic X-660 80+ Gold Case: Antec P110 Silent, 5 intakes 1 exhaust Monitor: AOC G2460PF 1080p 144Hz (150Hz max w/ DP, 121Hz max w/ HDMI) TN panel Keyboard: Logitech G610 Orion (Cherry MX Blue) with SteelSeries Apex M260 keycaps Mouse: BenQ Zowie FK1

 

Model: HP Omen 17 17-an110ca CPU: i7-8750H (0.125V core & cache, 50mV SA undervolt) GPU: GTX 1060 6GB Mobile (+80/+450, 1650MHz~1750MHz 0.78V~0.85V) RAM: 8+8GB DDR4-2400 18-17-17-39 2T Storage: 1TB HP EX920 PCIe x4 M.2 SSD + 1TB Seagate 7200RPM 2.5" HDD (ST1000LM049-2GH172), 128GB Toshiba PCIe x2 M.2 SSD (KBG30ZMV128G) gone cooking externally Monitor: 1080p 126Hz IPS G-sync

 

Desktop benching:

Cinebench R15 Single thread:168 Multi-thread: 833 

SuperPi (v1.5 from Techpowerup, PI value output) 16K: 0.100s 1M: 8.255s 32M: 7m 45.93s

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59 minutes ago, Tmansdc said:

Haven't gotten my new cpu cooler yet but I got the fans. I installed two 140mm fans as exhaust on the top of the case but it didn't make a difference! In fact my cpu is acting just like it did and my gpu is actually idling at 31 to 33 now when it used to idle at 27 to 29.


Also I couldn't install my front case fans because I just cannot remove the front case. I looked up two videos and seen that they put the glass part back on after installing the fans. Is there a way I can get longer screws or something and mount them from the reverse side? Or if I can't should I send back the fans and just get two higher quality 140mm case fans with more airflow, static pressure, etc. And just make the fan closer to the front an intake and leave the one closer to the rear as an exhaust fan?


Thank you very much. I should probably look up how to undervolt my cpu because just running steam and chrome goes up to the low 80s temp wise.

 

Can you list what components / parts you are using for your PC?

I have no idea what...your CPU / motherboard / case / graphics card, etc, etc is...

I checked your profile, and looked at your older thread, but you had something on Imgur...and it is being blocked on my work network...

 

If you put new exhaust fans at the top, and your temperatures are not improving, then:

  1. You are bad airflow COMING INTO the case
  2. The CPU cooler does like 90%+ of the CPU cooling, don't expect amazing temperatures with the stock cooler
  3. GPU temperature gone up after the top fan upgrade...refer to point #1, and new fans changed the direction/movement of the case airflow

E.g. the more powerful top exhaust fans are overpowering the front intake fans, and pulling the air out of the case before it can pass through the GPU.
GPU is using the warmer air around it, so temperatures have gone up a few degrees.


Intel X99 Rig -- CPU + PSU being RMA'ed
Intel Z390 Rig (*NEW* Primary)

  • i7-6800K @ 4.0 GHz --- i7-8086K
  • ASUS X99 Deluxe --- Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Master
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  • 32 GB, 16 GB DDR4 G.Skill Trident Z Red/Black 3000 MHz + 16 GB DDR4 G.Skill Trident Z RGB 3000 MHz
  • CM Hyper 212 EVO (temporary) .... EKwb Predator kit .... in-progress
  • SanDisk 480 GB SSD + 1TB Crucial MX 500 SSD + 1TB Samsung 860 EVO
  • EVGA SuperNOVA 850W P2 + Red/White CableMod Cables
  • Phanteks Enthoo Luxe Tempered Glass Edition
  • Logitech G502 Proteus Spectrum + Corsair K70 (Red LED, anodized black, Cheery MX Browns)

Intel Z97 Rig (Secondary)

  • Intel i5-4690K @ 4.6 GHz  4.8 GHz (still tweaking it)
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  • 20 GB (8GB X 2 + 4GB X 1) Corsair Vengeance DDR3 1600 MHz
  • Corsair A50 air cooler  NZXT X61
  • Kingston V300 120GB SSD [non-gimped version] + SanDisk Ultra II 240GB SSD + WD Caviar Black 1TB HDD
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AMD 990FX Rig (Decommissioned...for now)

  •  FX-8350 @ 4.8 / 4.9 GHz (given up on the 5.0 / 5.1 GHz attempt)
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  • Thermaltake Frio w/ Cooler Master JetFlo's in push-pull
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Posted · Original PosterOP

I have no front intake fans yet. Using these arctic 140mm pwm value case fans. Using an nf-a12x25 pwm for rear exhaust.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
On 10/21/2019 at 11:49 AM, WoodenMarker said:

The Fuma 2 is great but not much better than the cheaper Macho Rev. B.

Everything mentioned here seems about right.

The front panel can be removed. Looks like it's held on by plastic clips so you just pull the front off. http://www.deepcool.com/product/case/2019-04/9_10862.shtml

The front doesn't support 200mm's. Please refer to the specs. 

  Reveal hidden contents

06_02.png

The splitters are unnecessary, Arctic's P14 PWM PST's can be daisy chained off of a single fan header. 

I haven't seen many reviews on the Macho Rev. C but it seems a bit noisier than the Rev. B from what I've read. That being said, I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make with the Arctic fans which aren't as quiet. 

Is the NH-L12S in the image the cooler you were referring to earlier? That's considerably worse than the NH-U12S. 

 

Make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

Haven't gotten my new cpu cooler yet but I got the fans. I installed two 140mm fans as exhaust on the top of the case but it didn't make a difference! In fact my cpu is acting just like it did and my gpu is actually idling at 31 to 33 now when it used to idle at 27 to 29.


Also I couldn't install my front case fans because I just cannot remove the front case. I looked up two videos and seen that they put the glass part back on after installing the fans. Is there a way I can get longer screws or something and mount them from the reverse side? Or if I can't should I send back the fans and just get two higher quality 140mm case fans with more airflow, static pressure, etc. And just make the fan closer to the front an intake and leave the one closer to the rear as an exhaust fan?


Thank you very much. I should probably look up how to undervolt my cpu because just running steam and chrome goes up to the low 80s temp wise.

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4 hours ago, Tmansdc said:

Haven't gotten my new cpu cooler yet but I got the fans. I installed two 140mm fans as exhaust on the top of the case but it didn't make a difference! In fact my cpu is acting just like it did and my gpu is actually idling at 31 to 33 now when it used to idle at 27 to 29.


Also I couldn't install my front case fans because I just cannot remove the front case. I looked up two videos and seen that they put the glass part back on after installing the fans. Is there a way I can get longer screws or something and mount them from the reverse side? Or if I can't should I send back the fans and just get two higher quality 140mm case fans with more airflow, static pressure, etc. And just make the fan closer to the front an intake and leave the one closer to the rear as an exhaust fan?

The screws go into the fan and not the case. Longer screws wouldn't really help with that. 

Use the fans for front intake and not top exhaust. 

As mentioned, a few more case fans generally won't make a huge difference in cooling unless cooling was already inadequate. Your cpu and graphics card fans may also be running at lower rpm than before.

The front panel should just be clipped on. There's usually a hole from underneath and you can pull the panel off like this:

 


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Posted · Original PosterOP

Thank you for the help but from the forums I've asked this question on most people said do three front intake and use the other two as top exhaust. Now, should I only get front fans then? Because if so I'm going to send these back and just get two better/higher quality/higher airflow/higher static pressure/etc. fans for intake.

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3 minutes ago, Tmansdc said:

should I only get front fans then? Because if so I'm going to send these back and just get two better/higher quality/higher airflow/higher static pressure/etc. fans for intake.

That was my original recommendation, yes.


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Posted · Original PosterOP
3 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

That was my original recommendation, yes.

Well I'll try two front and two on top. Trying out two fans on the top as long as temperatures don't go high won't do any damage to my computer right so it might as well not hurt to try it while I've got the five fans and if there's no difference or an even worse difference I'll send them back and get two better 140mm fans.

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2 minutes ago, Tmansdc said:

Well I'll try two front and two on top. Trying out two fans on the top as long as temperatures don't go high won't do any damage to my computer right so it might as well not hurt to try it while I've got the five fans and if there's no difference or an even worse difference I'll send them back and get two better 140mm fans.

The top mount near the front is probably just going to remove fresh air before it gets to any components if you place an exhaust fan there.


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Posted · Original PosterOP
29 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

The top mount near the front is probably just going to remove fresh air before it gets to any components if you place an exhaust fan there.

That makes sense now that I think about it.

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