Upgrading laptops with CNVio WiFi adapters (eg Intel AC 9560) to newer Intel WiFi 6 (AX200) WiFi 6e (AX210) WiFi 7 (BE200) cards

[Alex Atkin UK]

To save everyone time I have summarised the conclusion we came to in the thread.

Summary updated 12th January 2024.

1. The AX201 (CNVIO2) can only work with Intel 10th Generation CPUs or newer!
2. The PCIe cards (in title) can work with some CNVIo laptops, it depends if the manufacturer included PCIe support as well in the slot and sadly they won't tell you, its trial and error.
3. PCIe cards or PCIe to M.2 WiFi adapters will work great on desktops, although many with M.2 WiFi sockets can also be swapped out.  I did on my ASUS Z370-I Gaming, but the same caveats apply if your existing card is CNVio, although it seems more common for them to support PCIe too than on laptops.

The Intel BE200 WiFi 7 card is now out, it should work equally as well except theres a chance it wont be fully WiFi 7 compliant as the standard has not been ratified yet, although Intel seem to think its likely to be fine.  As I wont be getting WiFi 7 until its ratified I will still cautiously recommend the Intel AX210 as it supports the full WiFi 6e (which will still work on WiFi 7) and seems to perform slightly better than the AX200 even on plain WiFi 5.  Although strangely I've also found the AX200 performs better than the AX210 on WiFi 6, though did not test this on the laptop so it may just be differences in antenna design.

 

Laptop that supports CNVIo2 but strangely seems to work better with a PCIe card:

ASUS VivoBook S15 S533EA

 

Laptops that came with CNVio cards but confirmed to be PCIe compatible:

ASUS GL703G

ASUS ZenBook Pro 15 UX580GE

Dell G7 7588

Dell Inspiron 7586 2-in-1

Dell Inspiron 7786 2-in-1

Dell Precision 3530

Lenovo Y540-17IRH-PG0

Lenovo Yoga S740

MSI GE 75 Raider 8SG

MSI GS63VR

MSI GL65-9SEK (AX200 performed slower than original card but AX210 may fix that)

MSI GS65-9SE

MSI GL75 9SFK

MSI GT72S

MSI Modern 14 A10M

ThinkPad X1 Extreme gen 1 (no bluetooth support as USB not supported on socket)

 

Laptops confirmed NOT to work:

Acer Swift 1 SF114-32

MSI GS75 - but was worked around by using spare NVMe socket intended for SSD.

GS75 Stealth 8SF

 

Motherboards confirmed to work with PCIe cards in their WiFi M.2 slot:

Gigabyte B360N GSM (with M.2 slot advertised as CNVi 1)

 

Motherboards confirmed NOT to work:

MSI B360i

 

 

 

The original thread continues below:

 

Has anyone successfully replaced an Intel® Wireless-AC 9560 with an AX201?

 

I tried on my ASUS GL703G and the laptop refuses to power up, or even detect the charger, with the card installed.  When I remove it the laptop immediately tries to power up (like it remembered I'd pressed the power button and the blocking factor was suddenly removed).  I even tried removing the battery to make sure it hadn't crashed the power management chip or something (kinda should have done that before swapping the cards I guess, but no damage done).

 

ASUS do not blacklist cards, but they also refuse to provide any support for aftermarket upgrades, the usual response of "if it doesn't work, it must not be compatible".  The seller I bought the AX201 from is repeating the same thing.

I'm almost certain the card MUST be faulty to behave like this, as Intel clearly list the AX201 as the replacement for the AC 9560, both being CRF cards. https://www.intel.co.uk/content/www/uk/en/support/articles/000026155/network-and-i-o/wireless-networking.html

 

It makes no sense a compatible but somehow not supported by the BIOS (why would it even need BIOS support if there is no blacklist?) card would prevent powering up.  At worst I'd expect it to not be detected.

 

Such a PITA after my other laptop, also by ASUS, went flawlessly upgrading from the 8265 to an AX200.  I just knew CRF/CNVIo was going to be trouble.

 

[TheNaitsyrk]

17 minutes ago, Alex Atkin UK said:

Has anyone successfully replaced an Intel® Wireless-AC 9560 with an AX201?

 

I tried on my ASUS GL703G and the laptop refuses to power up, or even detect the charger, with the card installed.  When I remove it the laptop immediately tries to power up (like it remembered I'd pressed the power button and the blocking factor was suddenly removed).  I even tried removing the battery to make sure it hadn't crashed the power management chip or something (kinda should have done that before swapping the cards I guess, but no damage done).

 

ASUS do not blacklist cards, but they also refuse to provide any support for aftermarket upgrades, the usual response of "if it doesn't work, it must not be compatible".  The seller I bought the AX201 from is repeating the same thing.

I'm almost certain the card MUST be faulty to behave like this, as Intel clearly list the AX201 as the replacement for the AC 9560, both being CRF cards. https://www.intel.co.uk/content/www/uk/en/support/articles/000026155/network-and-i-o/wireless-networking.html

 

It makes no sense a compatible but somehow not supported by the BIOS (why would it even need BIOS support if there is no blacklist?) card would prevent powering up.  At worst I'd expect it to not be detected.

 

Such a PITA after my other laptop, also by ASUS, went flawlessly upgrading from the 8265 to an AX200.  I just knew CRF/CNVIo was going to be trouble.

I'd like to know answer to this too.

1.73GB vs 2.7Gb is a decent WiFi upgrade.

[an1]

something similar happened to me when i changed my laptop's wifi card.

 

Those things moslty plug and play, I've rarely heard of blacklisted hardware, or even incompatibilities like that ( considering both chips are from same manufacturer) I see no reason for incompatibilty.

 

In my case, i ended up buying another chip before realising that i just forgot to change a setting in bios. I's say try fiddling with bios setting, something with the bus and peripherals, maybe in the wireless settings.

 

Once again, never heard of incompatible hardware in such a way, either the card has a default or a setting is blocking the bus from registering the card, and it blocks the entire computer at that stage, but works immediately when removed.

[Alex Atkin UK]

This is WAY before POST though.  Literally with the laptop powered off and the WiFi card plugged in, the AC detected LED doesn't light up when I plug in the power cord.

This is why I suspect the card is messing with a power line or something, as plugging in the power cord should surely only trigger the power management chip.  It sounds very much like a faulty card to me, but CRF is such a new thing its hard to know how it works being wired directly into the CPU.

[bentleyj1985]

I am experiencing the same thing. Replaced my 9560 wifi card with the new AX201 and can't get boot. No LED's, nothing. I'm on the latest drivers, BIOS and everything.

[Alex Atkin UK]

4 hours ago, bentleyj1985 said:

I am experiencing the same thing. Replaced my 9560 wifi card with the new AX201 and can't get boot. No LED's, nothing. I'm on the latest drivers, BIOS and everything.

I'm starting to think that one discussion on Intel support where someone asked if the AX201 will work in a CNVIo1 port as its a CNVIo2 card, was given incorrect information and its NOT compatible.

Do you have an 8th or 9th gen CPU?  Mine is 8th which I was wondering if CNVIo2 is 9th gen?

 

This is so frustrating as building the WiFi into the CPU saves $1-2 off the price of the WiFi card for the laptop manufacturer.  That's seems extreme penny pinching for laptops costing thousands.  Why can't we just have proper M.2 ports where upgrading to a new card is more or less guaranteed to work?

 

Guess we'll have to wait for USB cards to appear (ugh) or hope this can somehow be fixed in a BIOS update.

[bentleyj1985]

14 hours ago, Alex Atkin UK said:

I'm starting to think that one discussion on Intel support where someone asked if the AX201 will work in a CNVIo1 port as its a CNVIo2 card, was given incorrect information and its NOT compatible.

Do you have an 8th or 9th gen CPU?  Mine is 8th which I was wondering if CNVIo2 is 9th gen?

 

This is so frustrating as building the WiFi into the CPU saves $1-2 off the price of the WiFi card for the laptop manufacturer.  That's seems extreme penny pinching for laptops costing thousands.  Why can't we just have proper M.2 ports where upgrading to a new card is more or less guaranteed to work?

 

Guess we'll have to wait for USB cards to appear (ugh) or hope this can somehow be fixed in a BIOS update.

I have an 8th Gen CPU as well. I wasn't aware that there was a difference in the CNVi versions, thank you for that. 

 

I agree that this is frustrating and hope as well that this comes to life in a BIOS update. I don't want to have to get a USB adapter because I have a laptop and just want to use the internal port. I hope that we find something to help this since I can't use the AX200 either.

 

In some posts I've seen that the AX201 was a direct replacement for the 9560 (which I currently have) and made me believe that this new chip might work.

I'm ordering a AX200 for another laptop. I'll let you know if this works on the 8th Gen CNVi enabled laptop. I should get it in Wednesday.

[bentleyj1985]

Also, I know it might not be an exact to your PC (It isn't to mine) but some people are having luck with the AX200 chip. https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/c4mpf2/has_anyone_tried_intel_ax201_wifi_6_with_a/

[Alex Atkin UK]

Yes the AX200 is a breeze, as my other laptop is Ryzen based so uses standard M.2 and upgraded without a problem.

 

This is what makes it more frustrating, that a laptop costing nearly four times the price CAN'T be upgraded to WiFi 6.

It makes me want to ditch Intel just to avoid these stupid issues that they caused by tying the CPU and WiFi chip together with proprietary crap.

[bentleyj1985]

So I successfully installed the AX200 in my laptop. I just recently got a new BIOS update today but unfortunately didn't do anything for me regarding installing the AX201. 

I hope this brings you hope.

[Alex Atkin UK]

11 hours ago, bentleyj1985 said:

So I successfully installed the AX200 in my laptop. I just recently got a new BIOS update today but unfortunately didn't do anything for me regarding installing the AX201. 

I hope this brings you hope.

Not the same laptop, right?  Your laptop will work with either the AX200 (standard M.2 PCIe) or AX201 (CNVi), the socket is electrically either one or the other, it cannot support both.

[bentleyj1985]

Yes it was on the same laptop. I have a Dell G7 7588. It came with a CNVi intel 9560 Wifi chip. When I installed the AX200 last night (I got the Killer Networking AX1650 version) It saw it right away at boot and worked fine. 

[Alex Atkin UK]

Just now, bentleyj1985 said:

Yes it was on the same laptop. I have a Dell G7 7588. It came with a CNVi intel 9560 Wifi chip. When I installed the AX200 last night (I got the Killer Networking AX1650 version) It saw it right away at boot and worked fine. 

I'm starting to wonder if Intel are totally full of it, they claim CNVi and PCIe are completely incompatible.

But then they also claimed the AX201 CNVIo2 should work on CNVIo1.

[bentleyj1985]

True, and then they don't provide what the difference is between CNVio1 and CNVio2 is. My laptop is an 8th Gen i7 which is supposed to be compatible but I'm beginning to wonder if AX201 is only going to work for 9th gen. I have a Brother-In-Law who is going to give it a try in his 9th gen in the next few weeks.

[Alex Atkin UK]

Just now, bentleyj1985 said:

True, and then they don't provide what the difference is between CNVio1 and CNVio2 is. My laptop is an 8th Gen i7 which is supposed to be compatible but I'm beginning to wonder if AX201 is only going to work for 9th gen. I have a Brother-In-Law who is going to give it a try in his 9th gen in the next few weeks.

But if the AX200 works, there is zero point to using an AX201.  The only difference between the two cards is supposed to be PCIe vs CNVIo, functionally they are identical.

[bentleyj1985]

1 hour ago, Alex Atkin UK said:

But if the AX200 works, there is zero point to using an AX201.  The only difference between the two cards is supposed to be PCIe vs CNVIo, functionally they are identical.

Correct.Which is why it is confusing as to why it doesn't work on my laptop or others so far that use CNVio.

[Alex Atkin UK]

2 hours ago, bentleyj1985 said:

Correct.Which is why it is confusing as to why it doesn't work on my laptop or others so far that use CNVio.

Its more confusing that the AX200 does.

[Alex Atkin UK]

AX200 arrived today and can confirm, seems to work fine in a CNVi port - completely contrary to what Intel suggest.

I guess it IS a standard PCIe port after all with a few extra pins used for CNVi.

[mb300sd]

Same problem, AX201 in MSI GS75, however AX200 also does not work. With AX201 laptop will not power on at all. With AX200, it powers on, however the device is not detected. Why the hell did we need to integrate Wifi into the CPU now? My GT72S is much older and works fine with the AX200.

 

Now searching for a M.2 M-key to E-key adapter that'll fit in the spare NVMe slot, and breakout the USB from the CVNi slot.Might have to do a custom PCB, but I'm also the kind of guy that keeps a thunderbolt to 10GbE adapter velcroed to the back of my laptop.

[bentleyj1985]

2 hours ago, Alex Atkin UK said:

AX200 arrived today and can confirm, seems to work fine in a CNVi port - completely contrary to what Intel suggest.

I guess it IS a standard PCIe port after all with a few extra pins used for CNVi.

Glad to hear it worked for you.

[Alex Atkin UK]

32 minutes ago, bentleyj1985 said:

Glad to hear it worked for you.

The negative is the old problem I had of WiFi performing at half the speed in Windows as in Linux has returned.

[ttklt]

Here is what I encountered:

I have a ThinkPad X1 Extreme gen 1 comes with AC9560. When I try AX201, completely not booting. When I try AX200, boot normally, WiFi works fine, but no bluetooth device, possibly because the socket do not have usb protocol.

By the way, ThinkPad X1 Extreme gen 2 comes with AX200 and it definitely works fine.

[Alex Atkin UK]

On 10/28/2019 at 2:59 PM, ttklt said:

Here is what I encountered:

I have a ThinkPad X1 Extreme gen 1 comes with AC9560. When I try AX201, completely not booting. When I try AX200, boot normally, WiFi works fine, but no bluetooth device, possibly because the socket do not have usb protocol.

By the way, ThinkPad X1 Extreme gen 2 comes with AX200 and it definitely works fine.

Surely the socket supports USB as that is how Bluetooth worked on the AC9560 too.

[joshwaloveslotr]

On 8/15/2019 at 9:35 AM, bentleyj1985 said:

Yes it was on the same laptop. I have a Dell G7 7588. It came with a CNVi intel 9560 Wifi chip. When I installed the AX200 last night (I got the Killer Networking AX1650 version) It saw it right away at boot and worked fine. 

Did Bluetooth work as well? How have you liked the new Killer AX1650? My LG Gram has the AC-9560 and your comment gives me hope.

[Alex Atkin UK]

On 11/7/2019 at 3:04 AM, joshwaloveslotr said:

Did Bluetooth work as well? How have you liked the new Killer AX1650? My LG Gram has the AC-9560 and your comment gives me hope.

Bluetooth works fine for me.