power surge I need help please "Power supply surge detected during previous power on. ASUS Anti-Surge was triggered..."

[Didkopaynera]

Hi, i know there are already threads about this but i can't find a solution for my problem.
This is my first time posting on a forum so sorry if i make a mistake somewhere.
Here are my system specs:
CPU: i5 4690k
GPU: Radeon R9 280x
RAM: 8GB Hyper-x
Motherboard: ASUS z97m - PLUS
PSU: Cooler Master 600W
Win 10
Latest Radeon Drivers 18.9.3

I had this problem over 3 months now. I use this system for gaming mostly but for over 1 year i don't have much time to play games i started gaming again and i have this problem. In a variety of games like : Ring of Elysium The Evil Within 2 and other games But i played Minecraft for hours and hours and the pc isn't stopping. When i played The Evil Within 2 the pc crashed always then I pulled out my video card and played with integrated video for hours (with a lot of lag) but the pc didn't crash
When The evil within 2 was released i played it with same specs without problem. I read a lot of posts about this and a lot of people told me that the PSU can't give enough power to the video card or the ASUS Surge Protection is to sensitive and i should turn it off but i am scared to do it. And when i turn the PC back on i see a message something like : Default Radeon Wattman settings have crashed and been restored

So i know here are a lot of people who can help me with my problem. Thank you

Ps: I don't have another PSU to test

[suchamoneypit]

Sounds like a PSU issue. It likely occurs with the GPU as its pulling a lot more power, which is pushing the PSU too far and causing a crash. I had a friend with the same issue 4 weeks ago and I recommended he get a new PSU to avoid potential damage to his parts, and even it wasn't the issue, he had a real sketchy PSU he shouldn't be using anyways. When he replaced his PSU, issues went away, and he didn't have to worry about a PSU failing and taking parts with it to the grave.

 

Welcome to the forum.

[Jurrunio]

Could be that the PSU supplied voltage drop out of spec under load, which is common for these old group-regulated power supply designs (cooler master doesnt have a proven 600w unit as far as I'm aware). Replace it.

[Didkopaynera]

2 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

Sounds like a PSU issue. It likely occurs with the GPU as its pulling a lot more power, which is pushing the PSU too far and causing a crash. I had a friend with the same issue 4 weeks ago and I recommended he get a new PSU to avoid potential damage to his parts, and even it wasn't the issue, he had a real sketchy PSU he shouldn't be using anyways. When he replaced his PSU, issues went away, and he didn't have to worry about a PSU failing and taking parts with it to the grave.

 

Welcome to the forum.

 But before i played the same games with no problem does that mean  the PSU life is ending ?

If the PSU is dying  can you recommend me a PSU for my system.

 

Thank you !

[suchamoneypit]

4 minutes ago, Didkopaynera said:

 But before i played the same games with no problem does that mean  the PSU life is ending ?

If the PSU is dying  can you recommend me a PSU for my system.

 

Thank you !

PSUs degrade over time and will have a harder an harder time delivering the power. If you are using 400w on a 750w PSU, you might not ever notice. But if your pushing 700W on a 750W PSU, once the PSU starts dying/degrading, you will run into issues much sooner. A questionable brand PSU will likely die much quicker as well.

 

For buying a new one, follow this tiered chart for selecting a brand/model. Pick according to your budget not going lower than Tier 3.

[Didkopaynera]

Just now, suchamoneypit said:

PSU degrade over time and will have a harder an harder time delivering the power. If you are using 400w on a 750w PSU, you might not ever notice. But if your pushing 700W on a 750W PSU, once the PSU starts dying/degrading, you will run into issues much sooner.

 

For buying a new one, follow this tiered chart for selecting a brand/model

Okey thank you !

Is there a problem if i use the   PC with my PSU for now  until i get the money to replace  it ?

 Because in my country   150$ is my grandma pension.

[dgsddfgdfhgs]

I also seen this error sometime ago, but I'd just ignore it, havent seen it recently.

how often is warning pop up?

[suchamoneypit]

1 minute ago, Didkopaynera said:

Okey thank you !

Is there a problem if i use the   PC with my PSU for now  until i get the money to replace  it ?

 Because in my country   150$ is my grandma pension.

if it keeps spitting out that power surge error - your definetly walking on thin ice. You can definetly pick up a tier 3 PSU for ~$40-50

[Didkopaynera]

Just now, dgsddfgdfhgs said:

I also seen this error sometime ago, but I'd just ignore it, havent seen it recently.

how often is warning pop up?

Its different if i  start The evil within 2  now  my pc is going to restart   but if i play minecraft  its not going to happen

[suchamoneypit]

1 minute ago, dgsddfgdfhgs said:

I also seen this error sometime ago, but I'd just ignore it, havent seen it recently.

how often is warning pop up?

If your PC is telling you your power supply is SURGING power into your system, you generally shouldn't ignore it!

[Didkopaynera]

Just now, suchamoneypit said:

if it keeps spitting out that power surge error - your definetly walking on thin ice. You can definetly pick up a tier 3 PSU for ~$40-50

How many Watts should i look for my system  ?

[suchamoneypit]

2 minutes ago, Didkopaynera said:

Its different if i  start The evil within 2  now  my pc is going to restart   but if i play minecraft  its not going to happen

Evil Within 2 will stress your hardware a lot more than minecraft, meaning it also pulls a lot more power from the PSU to power your CPU/GPU.

[suchamoneypit]

Just now, Didkopaynera said:

How many Watts should i look for my system  ?

500-600W should be plenty for your specs.

[Didkopaynera]

Thank you a lot  !

[seon123]

29 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

this tiered chart for selecting a brand/model

No, no, no. Don't you see the things that are wrong on that list? Like, seriously?

23 minutes ago, Didkopaynera said:

How many Watts should i look for my system  ?

A decent 400-450W is plenty for overclocking. 

 

The Asus anti surge thing is triggered by anything. Not necessarily the PSU.

If the PSU can't provide enough power, there's no way for the system to know. There's no communication between the PSU and the rest of the system (except for the PS on and the power good signals). If the PSU has working protections, and detects that something is wrong, it'll shut down. 

Is anything overclocked?

[suchamoneypit]

3 minutes ago, seon123 said:

No, no, no. Don't you see the things that are wrong on that list? Like, seriously?

A decent 400-450W is plenty for overclocking. 

 

The Asus anti surge thing is triggered by anything. Not necessarily the PSU.

If the PSU can't provide enough power, there's no way for the system to know. There's no communication between the PSU and the rest of the system (except for the PS on and the power good signals). If the PSU has working protections, and detects that something is wrong, it'll shut down. 

Is anything overclocked?

Read everything he has posted about. Everything points to an issue with power delivery. I even myself had this identical issue, and new PSU solved it. That list has been approved and used by hundreds of people, on this forum, and by reddit. It was made by a community of PC enthusiasts. If you have a better guideline to provide, please do.

[Spotty]

Quote

"Power supply surge detected during previous power on. ASUS Anti-Surge was triggered..."

This is a generic warning message on Asus boards whenever the board experiences an unexpected shutdown or power loss. It does not always indicate that there is an issue with the power supply unit. As an example, the same message can sometimes be triggered when a CPU overclock is unstable and the system shuts down.

Check to see if there are any CPU overclocks applied and remove them. Since you're also getting a message relating to the graphics card crashing when you boot up, remove any overclocks on the GPU as well. Your GPU could also just be dying.

[seon123]

1 minute ago, suchamoneypit said:

Read everything he has posted about. Everything points to an issue with power delivery. I even myself had this identical issue, and new PSU solved it. That list has been approved and used by hundreds of people, on this forum, and by reddit. It was made by a community of PC enthusiasts. If you have a better guideline to provide, please do.

The Asus Anti Surge is known for being triggered by any crashes, no matter the reason for them. Not saying it isn't an issue with the PSU, but it's not a given. That's why I asked if anything is overclocked. 

A list from 2015 that has extremely obvious issues. Right. It's not being used on this forum, as we have our own (and I wouldn't just use a PSU tier list for deciding on a PSU). 

I'll just point out the first mistakes I see. I reiterate, these are extremely obvious things. 

Under tier 1, we find the M12 II. A decade old, low end, group regulated, loud PSU that lacks protections. Placed next to the Corsair AXi. 

Also under tier 1, the High Current Pro. Regulation similar to budget PSUs, and ripple worse than many system integrator level PSUs. So much for "most stable PSUs available". 

Under tier 2, we have the Earthwatts. That's 30 PSUs, that vary wildly in how good they are. 

 

And so on and so forth. Jumping to the last tier, and we find generalisations by brand. Raidmax has a Titanium efficiency Andyson unit in their lineup. So much for that tier. 

 

How about doing what you'd do with any other component? You know, reading reviews? Or is that too much effort, for something that's powering your entire system?

[suchamoneypit]

9 minutes ago, seon123 said:

The Asus Anti Surge is known for being triggered by any crashes, no matter the reason for them. Not saying it isn't an issue with the PSU, but it's not a given. That's why I asked if anything is overclocked. 

A list from 2015 that has extremely obvious issues. Right. It's not being used on this forum, as we have our own (and I wouldn't just use a PSU tier list for deciding on a PSU). 

I'll just point out the first mistakes I see. I reiterate, these are extremely obvious things. 

Under tier 1, we find the M12 II. A decade old, low end, group regulated, loud PSU that lacks protections. Placed next to the Corsair AXi. 

Also under tier 1, the High Current Pro. Regulation similar to budget PSUs, and ripple worse than many system integrator level PSUs. So much for "most stable PSUs available". 

Under tier 2, we have the Earthwatts. That's 30 PSUs, that vary wildly in how good they are. 

 

And so on and so forth. Jumping to the last tier, and we find generalisations by brand. Raidmax has a Titanium efficiency Andyson unit in their lineup. So much for that tier. 

 

How about doing what you'd do with any other component? You know, reading reviews? Or is that too much effort, for something that's powering your entire system?

 

9 minutes ago, Spotty said:

This is a generic warning message on Asus boards whenever the board experiences an unexpected shutdown or power loss. It does not always indicate that there is an issue with the power supply unit. As an example, the same message can sometimes be triggered when a CPU overclock is unstable and the system shuts down.

Check to see if there are any CPU overclocks applied and remove them. Since you're also getting a message relating to the graphics card crashing when you boot up, remove any overclocks on the GPU as well. Your GPU could also just be dying.

With the information he provided, its very obvious his issues only occur when his PSU is at high load. He even said he tested it with GPU removed, and its fine. He even said playing low-end games, when power draw is low, it doesn't happen, but as soon as he puts an intensive load on his hardware, it crashes, sometimes with this PSU related error. With all these hints, would you not agree that it is highly likely the PSU is the culprit? All basic troubleshooting methods, point to a PSU issue being the culprit (not to say its guaranteed). Im well aware of power surge errors being spit out for other possibly unrelated issues as well. I've also worked a lot with ASUS boards building PCs with them. Especially considering I had an identical scenario, and it was the PSU. The evidence is in overwhelming favor of a PSU problem.

 

As for you comments on the specific PSU models - Im no expert into those specifics, but the guidline is still an amazing guide to help people, and nothing should rule out pre-purchase research for anything.With what you listed 95% of the chart is accurate. Its either a nice easy chart for someone which clearly conveys the basics, or you can list out every single brand and their perks/drawbacks, and try to explain complicated things to someone clearly not advanced enough. Or you could simply say "Buy this", and he will never learn anything. With those options, the chart is fantastic.

[seon123]

12 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

With all these hints, would you not agree that it is highly likely the PSU is the culprit? 

Possibly power related, possibly a stability issue, related to an overclock. Again, I'm not saying it isn't an issue with the PSU, just that it's not confirmed. 

12 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

what you listed 95% of the chart is accurate.

Well, except I just listed the first and most obvious mistakes I found. I do have more issues that I could have listed, if it weren't 3:40AM right now. 

12 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

or you can list out every single brand and their perks/drawbacks,

Or, you could realise that every single brand is usually capable of selling crap, and that generalisations by brand don't work?

12 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

and try to explain complicated things to someone clearly not advanced enough

Doesn't have to be that advanced. One example: the M12 II in Tier 1 is crappy, because the voltages will go out of spec, the fan runs faster than on similarly priced PSUs, it lacks protections, and it has other misconfigured protections. That is very simple stuff. Wouldn't you say most people would be able to understand that?

12 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

Or you could simply say "Buy this", and he will never learn anything

Or, you know, they could ask, if they want to know more. How would one do that on a forum?

12 minutes ago, suchamoneypit said:

With those options, the chart is fantastic.

Misinforming people isn't really justifiable, imo. Especially not with your justifications. 

[suchamoneypit]

39 minutes ago, seon123 said:

 

Or, you could realise that every single brand is usually capable of selling crap, and that generalizations by brand don't work?

Doesn't have to be that advanced. One example: the M12 II in Tier 1 is crappy, because the voltages will go out of spec, the fan runs faster than on similarly priced PSUs, it

 

Its not by brand, its by brand and the line of PSUs. The only place it generalizes by mostly/completely brand is in Tier 5. You can explain why one is bad, but now do it for every PSU on that list. It'll take you a bit to give the rundown on everything.

39 minutes ago, seon123 said:

 

Or, you know, they could ask, if they want to know more. How would one do that on a forum?

Misinforming people isn't really justifiable, imo. Especially not with your justifications. 

Under your same logic, they could simply pick a PSU from the chart and then check with the forum.

 

He asked for PSU recommendation. Rather than do the specific research and tell him what to buy, I gave him a general chart and told him to follow the tiers as there are many PSUs that fit his criteria (as clearly seen to the chart), I left it up to him to pick his budget. Look at the chart. Look at all the options. That is difficult for someone to dive right into. Everything I say remains valid, and its very likely a PSU issue. I feel I've made some compelling arguments explaining my reasoning. There are certainly exceptions, but its silly to pick it apart like this. If you don't see my point, then we can agree to disagree. The only reason I continue this argument is because If I don't, I'm leaving OP uncertain of everything with two conflicting sides. I feel my answer and advice was very relevant and the conclusion of the PSU being the likely issue to be very likely, although certainly not 100% diagnosable on a text forum.

[Spotty]

1 hour ago, suchamoneypit said:

With the information he provided, its very obvious his issues only occur when his PSU is at high load. He even said he tested it with GPU removed, and its fine. He even said playing low-end games, when power draw is low, it doesn't happen, but as soon as he puts an intensive load on his hardware, it crashes

Just like what will happen with unstable GPU or CPU overclocks...

 

1 hour ago, seon123 said:

Possibly power related, possibly a stability issue, related to an overclock. Again, I'm not saying it isn't an issue with the PSU, just that it's not confirmed.  

^ This
In my opinion it's much smarter to test instability issues by dialling back or removing any overclocks before you go out and spend $50-$100 on a new PSU that might not even solve the problem you're having if it turns out not to be a PSU related issue. It costs nothing to remove any OCs, so you may as well give it a try to rule it out before spending money on replacing components.

 

1 hour ago, suchamoneypit said:

As for you comments on the specific PSU models - Im no expert into those specifics, but the guidline is still an amazing guide to help people, and nothing should rule out pre-purchase research for anything.With what you listed 95% of the chart is accurate. Its either a nice easy chart for someone which clearly conveys the basics, or you can list out every single brand and their perks/drawbacks, and try to explain complicated things to someone clearly not advanced enough. Or you could simply say "Buy this", and he will never learn anything. With those options, the chart is fantastic.

That chart you are referring to is at least 3 years old, and even accounting for its age still has some questionable placements.  You wouldn't use a CPU tier list from 3 years ago to determine which CPUs to buy, would you?

[suchamoneypit]

16 minutes ago, Spotty said:

Just like what will happen with unstable GPU or CPU overclocks...

 

^ This
In my opinion it's much smarter to test instability issues by dialling back or removing any overclocks before you go out and spend $50-$100 on a new PSU that might not even solve the problem you're having if it turns out not to be a PSU related issue. It costs nothing to remove any OCs, so you may as well give it a try to rule it out before spending money on replacing components.

 

That chart you are referring to is at least 3 years old, and even accounting for its age still has some questionable placements.  You wouldn't use a CPU tier list from 3 years ago to determine which CPUs to buy, would you?

If someone is smart enough to manually push their hardware past stock limits, they should be able to know that if it suddenly stops working they should try and dial it back. I don't think thats the issue here. And I never said it wasn't other issues, as a matter of fact I went a step further to explicitly say I couldn't 100% say PSU was the issue, but that it is highly likely.

 

And yes, I would still use the list. Your PSUs don't get 15% faster every generation with new capabilities/cores being added. They are very different. A generalization, but for example 5 year old speakers that were enthusiast at the time and sounded awesome, will still sound super good today. A 5 year CPU will not be blazingly fast if you got it today. a 3 year old PSU that is 800W and Platinum efficiency will still be that (accounting for normal lifespan degradation on a PSU). You simply can't compare PSU/CPU generational improvements. A 2014 Mazdaspeed 3 is practically the same core item as a 2011 MazdaSpeed 3 - same platform, same engine, same rough performance, same transmission. Even though they are 3 years apart, doesn't necessarily mean it would be super outdated advice. This rule does not apply to CPUs or GPUs.

 

Here is another list for use: 

 

[Spotty]

@suchamoneypit The problem with using a Tier List that hasn't been updated in 3 years is

A) some of the units on it might have already been a few years old when the list was made, such as the case for the Seasonic M12 PSU, which could mean units listed might now be 5-10 years old,

B) some of those units might not even be in production available for sale any longer, and
C) it will be missing a lot of newer units that have come out since the list was last updated.

So yes, a Corsair AXi was a good PSU back in 2015, and it still is a good PSU now... But there's been new PSUs released since that aren't considered in the list, including the refresh of the CX series (grey label), the RMx series, HXi, RXi, etc...

I'm not stating that all PSU Tier Lists are worthless (that's a different debate) - I'm just saying that the particular one you referenced is 3+ years out of date and should not be used to recommend what PSUs someone should buy at the end of 2018.

[Didkopaynera]

Hello guys,  please don't fight for the  Tier list

Here are some photos of my video card settings and HWmonitor  i never overclocked or pushed any settings  up on my PC   i even have GPU boost  button on my motherboard.  

 

https://prnt.sc/livcfe 

https://prnt.sc/livdt0

 

I tested a lot of games   like fortnite minecraft  don't starve  GTA V    the PC doesn't stop 

 

 But games like Ring of Elysium   The evil within 2  its stopping i pulled my GPU and i played  TEW2 with no problem  

If you see any problem from the photos  that i can fix i will be glad

in bios i have energy saving, turbo mode and normal should i try some of that ?