Video cards pulling 30 watts or less?

[Radium_Angel]

The GT 1030 will pull 30 watts, and the GT 730/710 less than that.

What else is out there that are that low powered? Haven't seen anything from ATI, am I missing them?

[Jurrunio]

AMD GPU (and CPU) arent as efficient, so they didnt bother making a card with super low TDP rating. It will just make them look bad

[FloRolf]

19 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

AMD GPU (and CPU) arent as efficient, so they didnt bother making a card with super low TDP rating. It will just make them look bad

Bullshit. 

The 2200G and 2400G APUs are almost on GT1030 level and have excellent power efficiency.

[Morgan MLGman]

20 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

AMD GPU (and CPU) arent as efficient, so they didnt bother making a card with super low TDP rating. It will just make them look bad

 

11 minutes ago, FloRolf said:

Bullshit. 

The 2200G and 2400G APUs are almost on GT1030 level and have excellent power efficiency.

Currently AMD CPUs are more efficient than what Intel has to offer

 

Also, please keep it civil. @FloRolf I edited out one part of your post, you know which one

[TechyBen]

Is this for a small form factor, or pre-built office pc etc?

[Jurrunio]

1 hour ago, FloRolf said:

The 2200G and 2400G APUs are almost on GT1030 level and have excellent power efficiency. 

Give me actual numbers on Vega 8 or 11's power draw when they are downclocked to perform the same as the 1030, that's the only way to be fair. I can't find any material talking about this. Besides, the curse of HBM will keep Vega graphics cards away from the low-powered cards and budget card market. Therefore, I will use RX560 2GB for comparison with the GTX 1050 instead because they are both current-gen budget cards of same VRAM capacity. They are also often compared to one and other.

This video is one of the newer ones I can find. Dont want old drivers to affect performance on both sides.

 

Overclocked cards are used, to make sure they are both squeezed as much as possible within power limit.

 

Games tested are Fortnite Battle Royal, Destiny 2, Star Wars Battlefront 2, Call of Duty World War 2, Wolfenstein 2, Assassin's Creed Origins, Evil Within 2, Middle-Earth : Shadow of War, Battlefield 1, PlayerUnknown's : BattleGround, Mass Effect : Andromeda ,Rise of the Tomb Raider, Grand Theft Auto 5, Rainbow Six Siege and Overwatch.

Looks like more Nvidia sponsored titles than AMD sponsored titles, but doesnt matter since the results of each game are showed independently.

 

The Zotac 1050 doesnt have a PCIe power plug so it's capped at 75W maximum. The Sapphire RX560 2GB Pulse has 1 6 pin power connector, and the default TDP is 90W. Dont know whether the tester increased the power limit even further, but it is allowed to draw more power than the 1050 nonetheless.

This means if the 1050 wins, Polaris, from AMD, isnt as efficient as Pascal, from Nvidia.

If they are equal, then the conclusion is the same as above.

If the RX 560 is faster, the test doesnt mean much and there's no concrete results to be drawn because the higher power draw of the RX 560 can take the blame.

 

Average frame rate comparison:

Assassin's Creed Origins: 1050 is 10.8% faster than 560.

Fortnite: 1050 is 20% faster than 560

Destiny 2: 1050 is 4.26% faster than 560

Star Wars Battlefront 2: 1050 is 2% ahead of the 560.

Call of Duty WW2: Same performance

Middle Earth: Shadow of War: 1050 is 9.5% faster than the 560

Wolfenstein 2: 1050 is 8.8% faster than the 560

Evil Within 2: 1050 is 4.3% faster than the 560

Hellblade: Same performance

Battlefield 1 (2016): Same performance

Mass Effect: Andromeda: 1050 is 5.3% faster than the 560

PUBG: 1050 is 21.6% faster than the 560.

Rise of the Tomb Raider: 1050 is 2% faster than the 560.

The Witcher 3: 1050 is 9.3% faster than the 560

GTA 5: 1050 is 9.3% faster than the 560

Hitman (2016): Same performance in average fps, but 560 is 8.5% faster than the 1050 when it comes to minimum fps.

Rainbow Six Siege: 1050 is 1.5% faster than the 560

Overwatch: 1050 is 5.2% faster than the 560

 

Whole system power draw

RX 560 system: 160W at load

GTX 1050 system: 145W at load

Dont know how and when is this measured, so just take a look and forget it.

 

So yes, AMD's offerings on the cheap side of the market is not as efficient as Nvidia's.

1 hour ago, Morgan MLGman said:

Currently AMD CPUs are more efficient than what Intel has to offer

Intel kind of hurt themselves here, since they are like 'Shit what can we do to hold off AMD's 6 core and 8 core Ryzen in the general consumer market? ah I know, raise the clock speeds and voltage of our 6 core CPUs and consider efficiency later'.

In the past, none of the locked Core i series CPUs get past the 4GHz mark on all-core turbo frequency (non-AVX, few users use it anyway) until 8th gen when the 8700 turbos to 4.3GHz. Even the 8400 goes up to 3.8GHz, much higher than the 7400 at only 3.3GHz.

[Morgan MLGman]

2 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

Intel kind of hurt themselves here, since they are like 'Shit what can we do to hold off AMD's 6 core and 8 core Ryzen in the general consumer market? ah I know, raise the clock speeds and voltage of our 6 core CPUs and consider efficiency later'.

In the past, none of the locked Core i series CPUs get past the 4GHz mark on all-core turbo frequency (non-AVX, few users use it anyway) until 8th gen when the 8700 turbos to 4.3GHz. Even the 8400 goes up to 3.8GHz, much higher than the 7400 at only 3.3GHz.

Yeah, it's a bit odd to be fair. Though if an R7 1800X draws less power in gaming than an i7-7700K which has half the cores and half the threads then Intel has a bit of a problem here. And it does draw less power under gaming loads

[Jurrunio]

5 minutes ago, Morgan MLGman said:

Yeah, it's a bit odd to be fair. Though if an R7 1800X draws less power in gaming than an i7-7700K which has half the cores and half the threads then Intel has a bit of a problem here. And it does draw less power under gaming loads

7700k does give better average frame rates, but it'd better be.

[Radium_Angel]

1 hour ago, TechyBen said:

Is this for a small form factor, or pre-built office pc etc?

Neither actually, it's for a system where the total power draw through the PCIe slot is capped at 30 watts.

I was looking at the GT 1030, but given the utter lunacy of video card prices, I was hoping I might find something lightly used in the reasonable price range and wanted to see what I could find from AMD that might be competitive.

[TechyBen]

Still not mentioned why/what it is you are doing.  What PC/motherboard is it? Does that mean we cannot have external 6/8 pin PSU sockets?

 

Gaming? Is it your PC? Work PC? etc.

 

The 1030 is half the performance of the 1050. Does this PC have a GPU, or is it running intel igpu?

[Radium_Angel]

14 minutes ago, TechyBen said:

Still not mentioned why/what it is you are doing.  What PC/motherboard is it? Does that mean we cannot have external 6/8 pin PSU sockets?

 

Gaming? Is it your PC? Work PC? etc.

 

The 1030 is half the performance of the 1050. Does this PC have a GPU, or is it running intel igpu?

It's a Dell Poweredge 2900 running Ubuntu 14.04 LTS.

It's currently running an nVidia GT 710 in the x8 slot (there are no x16 slots) and there is a built in ATI (RageXL or something, 16 MB dedicated RAM) card which is used to POST BIOS, once Ubuntu takes over, the video switches to the GT 710.

 

The PCIe slots are hard capped at 30watts. I can get a 6/8 pin cable to reach easily if need be.

I'm using the system as a test bed for all manner of things, and trying to find to find a better video card based on the 30watt limit.

[TechyBen]

Ok... you are using it as a testbed. Is the 710 not performing? As a test bed, are you trying to game on that thing?

 

Does the 710 give you tearing in the software you use? Low response? RAM bottling it? If it does, get a 1030... if not, keep the 710 and love it.

 

Or are you looking for AMD for driver support in Ubuntu (I forget off the top of my head which brand has better Linux support)?

 

I also wonder if the rest of the PC is going to bottleneck way before the GPU can even help it.

[Radium_Angel]

1 minute ago, TechyBen said:

Ok... you are using it as a testbed. Is the 710 not performing? As a test bed, are you trying to game on that thing?

 

Does the 710 give you tearing in the software you use? Low response? RAM bottling it? If it does, get a 1030... if not, keep the 710 and love it.

 

Or are you looking for AMD for driver support in Ubuntu (I forget off the top of my head which brand has better Linux support)?

I'm using it for many things, VM, Neural Network training, some gaming (and yes, the GT 710 is pretty bad at this) 

It's got 32GB of ram (ECC, so some delay there), so unlikely the RAM is a bottleneck, plus a pair of 4-core Xeons. I really feel the video card it holding things back here.

[TechyBen]

No, I mean is the GT710 RAM (1gb) bottling your gaming? If it's sufficient, you will gain nothing from an upgrade, as the PC will not be able to digest the actual games that would use a 1050ti etc...

 

I did find possibly what you need... as I'd love to build a mini itx one day, and may be stuck to a SFF motherboard, I did a search... I have not found them before, never used them, and have no idea if they would explode a PC or not... but as said, as I'd like to use one some day, would be interested... in these: https://www.moddiy.com/products/PCI%2dExpress-PCI%2dE-8X-to-16X-Riser-Card-Flexible-Ribbon-Extender-Cable-w{47}Molex-%2b-Solid-Capacitor.html

 

8x to 16x and external power. But I have no idea what wattage/voltage that molex would provide.

 

Also, can anyone confirm if a GT1080ti even uses the PCI power? Or just all the PSU supplied power? IIRC you can fit them in 1 slot risers/extenders and they "work".

[Radium_Angel]

12 minutes ago, TechyBen said:

No, I mean is the GT710 RAM (1gb) bottling your gaming? If it's sufficient, you will gain nothing from an upgrade, as the PC will not be able to digest the actual games that would use a 1050ti etc...

 

I did find possibly what you need... as I'd love to build a mini itx one day, and may be stuck to a SFF motherboard, I did a search... I have not found them before, never used them, and have no idea if they would explode a PC or not... but as said, as I'd like to use one some day, would be interested... in these: https://www.moddiy.com/products/PCI%2dExpress-PCI%2dE-8X-to-16X-Riser-Card-Flexible-Ribbon-Extender-Cable-w{47}Molex-%2b-Solid-Capacitor.html

 

8x to 16x and external power. But I have no idea what wattage/voltage that molex would provide.

 

Also, can anyone confirm if a GT1080ti even uses the PCI power? Or just all the PSU supplied power? IIRC you can fit them in 1 slot risers/extenders and they "work".

Yeah I know about the powered riser cables. That and the eGPU DIY solutions, but I have yet to find anyone who has actually used one in an older system. I don't really feel like frying my system on a test of unknown quality hardware...

[TechyBen]

Ok. Still leaves us looking for a solution. As said. Why do you need the upgrade? What games are you trying to play? Is everything acceptable except the games?

[Radium_Angel]

2 hours ago, TechyBen said:

Ok. Still leaves us looking for a solution. As said. Why do you need the upgrade? What games are you trying to play? Is everything acceptable except the games?

Everything is great, except gaming. I'm looking to replace Windows entirely. If I can get a good VM environment working right, then I can play Armoured Warfare under the VM (it doesn't work under Wine, and there is no direct Linux port) or World of Tanks (if I must) and I'd be good to go. The system handles everything else I need it to do.

[TechyBen]

WoT recommends a GeForce GTX660. You are not going to hit that on that system unless using an externally powered GPU, or a 1050(or ti) with 75 watts.

 

Depending on your budget, and entire new PC for gaming would be better A PS4 for WoT/AW would be better.

 

But if you do wish to mod that PC, it's going to be using a PCIe powered riser (I'd suggest more research on that though!), or finding out if a GTX660(or ti) will run with a PSU.

 

Does your PSU have a spare 12v rail to run a GPU?

 

Theoretically you can do it. 

As said, AFAIK the externally powered GPUs don't draw the full 75 watts from the PCIe. I am no expert though... so may be wrong.

 

A second hand GTX660 should be about half the price of a second hand 1050ti, and just a little less on performance, but a lot more on power draw. It will be about 50% faster than a 1030, and possibly cheaper too. What PSU do you have?

 

[edit] In the comments to that video, someone got a 650ti running. Not sure the exact spec of their server though. (See, specific and accurate answers to questions and a clear goal gives you good answers!  )

[Radium_Angel]

2 hours ago, TechyBen said:

WoT recommends a GeForce GTX660. You are not going to hit that on that system unless using an externally powered GPU, or a 1050(or ti) with 75 watts.

 

Depending on your budget, and entire new PC for gaming would be better A PS4 for WoT/AW would be better.

 

But if you do wish to mod that PC, it's going to be using a PCIe powered riser (I'd suggest more research on that though!), or finding out if a GTX660(or ti) will run with a PSU.

 

Does your PSU have a spare 12v rail to run a GPU?

 

Theoretically you can do it. 

As said, AFAIK the externally powered GPUs don't draw the full 75 watts from the PCIe. I am no expert though... so may be wrong.

 

A second hand GTX660 should be about half the price of a second hand 1050ti, and just a little less on performance, but a lot more on power draw. It will be about 50% faster than a 1030, and possibly cheaper too. What PSU do you have?

 

[edit] In the comments to that video, someone got a 650ti running. Not sure the exact spec of their server though. (See, specific and accurate answers to questions and a clear goal gives you good answers!  )

I have a spare 660GTX, plus a few other cards from before the current price expansion on video cards.

It's not the budget, I have a number of systems around I could use for AW/WoT/WT:GF, it's the challenge in making it work on hardware that was never designed for it. I'm at work right now so I'll check the video out later.

[TechyBen]

Ah. Ok. So if it's a challenge then go for it with the spare 660GTX!

That's great! Look for a molex adaptor or two, and check the PSU/power consumption is not going to overload the poor thing... what kind of powersupply does the Poweredge get?

[Radium_Angel]

55 minutes ago, TechyBen said:

Ah. Ok. So if it's a challenge then go for it with the spare 660GTX!

That's great! Look for a molex adaptor or two, and check the PSU/power consumption is not going to overload the poor thing... what kind of powersupply does the Poweredge get?

Twin 900 watt ones....I have the power.

Ahem (He-Man voice)

 

 

"I HAVE THE POWER!"

 

There is a backplane with power connectors there when I run molex to 6-pin power, it's rated for insane amounts of draw (here's to server-level build quality) my only question which I haven't found an answer to yet is the powered PCIe adapters....if they obey the 25watt limit on the original PCIe slot, and provide the extra power via the 6/8-pins. It's not something I've been able to find out concrete from my online searches...

 

My initial thought was build an eGPU case, found out Thunderbolt wouldn't be an option (even with a TB card, no way to connect to the motherboard) but some other options did present themselves, going with an expresscard PCIe adapter, but the performance hit from all that might not beat a native 1030 GT in the case.

 

So, still a testbed system, might make a big post about these endeavors yet. 

[TechyBen]

Do you need a powered PCIe extension adaptor? If running the GTX660 on external power, the 30w internal should theoretically be enough. I would have thought only the likes of the 1050ti and below draw the extra, as they don't have the option of drawing from the PSU.

[Radium_Angel]

1 hour ago, TechyBen said:

Do you need a powered PCIe extension adaptor? If running the GTX660 on external power, the 30w internal should theoretically be enough. I would have thought only the likes of the 1050ti and below draw the extra, as they don't have the option of drawing from the PSU.

It's the "theoretically" part that has me concerned...I plug it in, overdraw the voltage, and fry the video card (at best) or at worst the whole system.

But some times you just have to say "screw it, throw the switch!" and see what happens....

[TechyBen]

As far as I can tell, as those power lines will not be attached it will not pull anything more than the 35w provided by the 8x slot.

[Radium_Angel]

56 minutes ago, TechyBen said:

As far as I can tell, as those power lines will not be attached it will not pull anything more than the 35w provided by the 8x slot.

Hmmmm....

 

I'll say again....hmmmm....

ok, does the forum have any sort of recommendation for an external powered PCIe slot that's better than the rest?