New mirrorless camera - but which one?

[Senzelian]

Hey photographers!

I'm looking into buying a new camera.
Up until recently I was using a D3300 with a 18-55 kitlens, but I want something smaller with a few more features - so I'm looking at mirrorless cameras right now.

I take photos only as a hobby and so something a bit cheaper will do just fine. I have a budget of around 500€, but can extend it if necessary.

Most of the time I take pictures of landscapes and buildings, but sometimes also do portraits.

It would be great if the camera came with a kitlens, so I can get started right away.

 

There are a few features I would like to have, but aren't necessarily very important:

• Viewfinder
• Touchscreen
• Large and tiltable screen

 

I would like to just get a few suggestions and maybe also some tips what to look out for.
I'm not a complete beginner when it comes to cameras, but I'm far from beeing anywhere close to a professional.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Edit: I completly forgot to mention that I alredy took a look at the Sony Alpha 6000 and the Olympus OM-D E-M10 Mk. III
Both seem pretty nice, but the Sony is around 200€ cheaper. I wonder if the price difference is worth it.

[Enderman]

A5100 or A6000 would be my recommendation.

[cc143]

I personally like the fuji x range, their collection glass for crop sensors is more extensive and in some instances sharper imo. Maybe look for a used xt10/xe2s, although be warned the xt20 and xe3 are significant upgrades. 

 

Also, I tend to recommend people go for the a6300 instead of the a6000 because, their sensor is more compatible with smart lens adapters, and most importantly, it will charge over usb while operating, which is a particularly big deal given the poor battery life of earlier sony mirrorless cameras (basically anything with the older battery i.e. all sonys except the a9 and a7riii at this point.) 

 

Another option might be the Canon sl2/200d which is larger, but might prove a better compromise in some instances. 

 

Also keep in mind that when you take adapted or FF glass in consideration and the need for extra batteries, the sonys at least won't pack down that much smaller than your d3300. 

[Rootzy]

Lumix G7 is great, but I agree with Enderman that an a5100 or a6000 would be a good choice and is smaller than the G7

[Senzelian]

 

1 hour ago, cc143 said:

I personally like the fuji x range, their collection glass for crop sensors is more extensive and in some instances sharper imo. Maybe look for a used xt10/xe2s, although be warned the xt20 and xe3 are significant upgrades. 

 

Also, I tend to recommend people go for the a6300 instead of the a6000 because, their sensor is more compatible with smart lens adapters, and most importantly, it will charge over usb while operating, which is a particularly big deal given the poor battery life of earlier sony mirrorless cameras (basically anything with the older battery i.e. all sonys except the a9 and a7riii at this point.) 

 

Another option might be the Canon sl2/200d which is larger, but might prove a better compromise in some instances. 

 

Also keep in mind that when you take adapted or FF glass in consideration and the need for extra batteries, the sonys at least won't pack down that much smaller than your d3300. 

 

The Sony a6000 can charge over USB aswell, so I probably don't need any additional batteries, as I carry a power bank around with me at all times anyway.

The new Fujifilm X-A5 also seems pretty interesting to me. It has a touchscreen which I like and has integrated Bluetooth which might be a nice addition.
Any opinions about that camera?

[cc143]

12 minutes ago, Senzelian said:

 

 

The Sony a6000 can charge over USB aswell, so I probably don't need any additional batteries, as I carry a power bank around with me at all times anyway.

The new Fujifilm X-A5 also seems pretty interesting to me. It has a touchscreen which I like and has integrated Bluetooth which might be a nice addition.
Any opinions about that camera?

yes it can but it can't operate while charging over usb, unlike later models. 

 

I don't know about the xa cameras, I never liked them a lot, partly due to the lack of a viewfinder. 

[Bajantechnician]

7 hours ago, Senzelian said:

*snip*

Id suggest looking at the canon m-series cameras

 

7 hours ago, Enderman said:

A5100 or A6000 would be my recommendation.

ive got a 80d and a a6500

[thekillergazebo]

The canon M is trash for a mirrorless camera. It does video well only because of the dual pixel AF. Other then that not worth it. I’ve owned the Sony a6000 and still own the a6300 and have used my buddy’s fuji xt2 a lot and if you want a great APSC and don’t plan on shooting fast moving objects the fuji is the way to go. Their lenses are better then what Sony has to offer and at least in the xt2 the film simulators are amazing. You can apply the look after to take the shot. Hell he can even edit photos in camera, which still blows my mind. The ergonomics are better then sonys for sure as well. The fuji feels like a really well thought out and complete camera. Now Sony, I absolutely love them and I’m a bit of a fanboy, but their lenses arnt that great all around for what you pay compared to fuji. They sent horrible but not totally their if you going to be investing a lot of money. Their lack of weather sealing is frustrating to no end. But they are smaller then the fuji and have better AF. They also have a larger selection of lenses if you consider the full frame lenses you can get which are of amazing quality. Honestly sonys got a deal going on for their full frames in the USA where you can pick up a Sony A7ii for 1k with a kit lens I think. I’d go for that.  That way as you evolve you have access to better quality lenses and the body is better for portraits and landscapes then the other two cameras I menstioned. The a7 is cheaper I think it’s going for $700 or something now. Avoid that one!

[Senzelian]

3 hours ago, thekillergazebo said:

The canon M is trash for a mirrorless camera. It does video well only because of the dual pixel AF. Other then that not worth it. I’ve owned the Sony a6000 and still own the a6300 and have used my buddy’s fuji xt2 a lot and if you want a great APSC and don’t plan on shooting fast moving objects the fuji is the way to go. Their lenses are better then what Sony has to offer and at least in the xt2 the film simulators are amazing. You can apply the look after to take the shot. Hell he can even edit photos in camera, which still blows my mind. The ergonomics are better then sonys for sure as well. The fuji feels like a really well thought out and complete camera. Now Sony, I absolutely love them and I’m a bit of a fanboy, but their lenses arnt that great all around for what you pay compared to fuji. They sent horrible but not totally their if you going to be investing a lot of money. Their lack of weather sealing is frustrating to no end. But they are smaller then the fuji and have better AF. They also have a larger selection of lenses if you consider the full frame lenses you can get which are of amazing quality. Honestly sonys got a deal going on for their full frames in the USA where you can pick up a Sony A7ii for 1k with a kit lens I think. I’d go for that.  That way as you evolve you have access to better quality lenses and the body is better for portraits and landscapes then the other two cameras I menstioned. The a7 is cheaper I think it’s going for $700 or something now. Avoid that one!

The X-T2 costs around 1500€ just for the body. That's definitly not in my budget.

 

Another option that looks very promising is the X-E3, which just barely fits into my budget. That's around 900€, but I will need to import it from a different EU-country which isn't an ideal solution.

So far everything seems to point very much in the direction of the Sony A6000, or if I can justify the cost somehow, then the X-E3.

[cc143]

4 hours ago, thekillergazebo said:

The canon M is trash for a mirrorless camera. It does video well only because of the dual pixel AF. Other then that not worth it. I’ve owned the Sony a6000 and still own the a6300 and have used my buddy’s fuji xt2 a lot and if you want a great APSC and don’t plan on shooting fast moving objects the fuji is the way to go. Their lenses are better then what Sony has to offer and at least in the xt2 the film simulators are amazing. You can apply the look after to take the shot. Hell he can even edit photos in camera, which still blows my mind. The ergonomics are better then sonys for sure as well. The fuji feels like a really well thought out and complete camera. Now Sony, I absolutely love them and I’m a bit of a fanboy, but their lenses arnt that great all around for what you pay compared to fuji. They sent horrible but not totally their if you going to be investing a lot of money. Their lack of weather sealing is frustrating to no end. But they are smaller then the fuji and have better AF. They also have a larger selection of lenses if you consider the full frame lenses you can get which are of amazing quality. Honestly sonys got a deal going on for their full frames in the USA where you can pick up a Sony A7ii for 1k with a kit lens I think. I’d go for that.  That way as you evolve you have access to better quality lenses and the body is better for portraits and landscapes then the other two cameras I menstioned. The a7 is cheaper I think it’s going for $700 or something now. Avoid that one!

The m5 is actually a pretty nice little camera even if it doesn't look like that on paper. There seems to be a trend with people liking canon's new releases very much once they've used them even though it might not seem like that on paper. 

 

Sony's FF lenses are way too huge and pricey though, even compared to similar offerings from other brands. At that point, you may as well go with a dslr, it will end up costing less. 

 

I can corroborate most of what you said as a fuji user.

5 minutes ago, Senzelian said:

The X-T2 costs around 1500€ just for the body. That's definitly not in my budget.

 

Another option that looks very promising is the X-E3, which just barely fits into my budget. That's around 900€, but I will need to import it from a different EU-country which isn't an ideal solution.

So far everything seems to point very much in the direction of the Sony A6000, or if I can justify the cost somehow, then the X-E3.

The x-e3 is definitely worth it over the a6000. It has features like  a touchscreen and the glass availability shouldn't be overlooked. Its also more ergonomic, imo more satisfactory to use and fuji's coulour science is great. 

 

I know fuji sell refurbished stuff on their UK website, not sure if they will ship to the EU though...

[Senzelian]

15 minutes ago, cc143 said:

The m5 is actually a pretty nice little camera even if it doesn't look like that on paper. There seems to be a trend with people liking canon's new releases very much once they've used them even though it might not seem like that on paper. 

 

Sony's FF lenses are way too huge and pricey though, even compared to similar offerings from other brands. At that point, you may as well go with a dslr, it will end up costing less. 

 

I can corroborate most of what you said as a fuji user.

The x-e3 is definitely worth it over the a6000. It has features like  a touchscreen and the glass availability shouldn't be overlooked. Its also more ergonomic, imo more satisfactory to use and fuji's coulour science is great. 

 

I know fuji sell refurbished stuff on their UK website, not sure if they will ship to the EU though...

Alrighty.
I will look into the refurbished models once I have an idea of what my actual budget will look like. Really depends on how much I get for the D3300.

 

Basically this is what I'm looking at right now:
https://skinflint.co.uk/?cmp=1535670&cmp=1763020&cmp=1563492&cmp=1685039

I completly overlooked the XT-20 for some reason and you even suggested it 

That one seems like a nice camera aswell.

They all look like really nice cameras. Makes it quite difficult to find the right one for me...

Between the XT-20 and X-E3, what are the main differences, apart from the ones I can obviously see in the comparison?

[cc143]

2 minutes ago, Senzelian said:

Alrighty.
I will look into the refurbished models once I have an idea of what my actual budget will look like. Really depends on how much I get for the D3300.

 

Basically this is what I'm looking at right now:
https://skinflint.co.uk/?cmp=1535670&cmp=1763020&cmp=1563492&cmp=1685039

I completly overlooked the XT-20 for some reason and you even suggested it 

That one seems like a nice camera aswell.

 

They all look like really nice cameras.
Between the XT-20 and X-E3, what are the main differences, apart from the ones I can obviously see in the comparison?

there really isn't a lot into it, basically the same camera with very minor differences. I believe the xe3's touchscreen has more functionality and it has bluetooth, other than that, its a toss up, get the one you can get for cheaper. 

 

May I also suggest you go with the 18-55mm f/2.8-4.0 over the 16-50mm, the difference in price is more than justified given the difference in quality. 

[Senzelian]

2 minutes ago, cc143 said:

there really isn't a lot into it, basically the same camera with very minor differences. I believe the xe3's touchscreen has more functionality and it has bluetooth, other than that, its a toss up, get the one you can get for cheaper. 

 

May I also suggest you go with the 18-55mm f/2.8-4.0 over the 16-50mm, the difference in price is more than justified given the difference in quality. 

Okay, thank you!
Now I got a pretty good idea of what I will get depending on the budget.