Wolfenstein II to use Rapid Packed Math

[ravenshrike]

2 minutes ago, Humbug said:

Your attitude to everything always reminds me of Squidward in spongebob.

His name is Misanthrope. Its called truth in advertising.

[Mira Yurizaki]

3 hours ago, Humbug said:

I have watched some of the Vulkan developer talks and one interesting thing is that they do not oversell Vulkan.

They always emphasize that Vulkan should be used if you are a dev who has a deep understanding of graphics rendering.

 

Otherwise they say stick to the high level APIs.

 

So ya don't expect from ubisoft programmers the quality of work we see from Dice or iD.

Well an Ubisoft dev did say don't expect performance gains from DX 12 anyway: https://www.pcgamesn.com/microsoft/ubisoft-dx12-performance

 

Sidetracking; the other problem with "low level API" is if your computer has no trouble saturating your video card with work to do on DX11 or OGL, DX12 and Vulkan are not going to do anything for you. e.g., if your CPU usage is at 40% and your GPU usage is at 100%, making your CPU work less hard isn't going to change the fact your GPU is struggling at 100%. The workload is the same, the amount of time the CPU spends compiling that workload is different.

 

This is why I think the performance gains with OGL to Vulkan on Doom was more representative of how "eh" OGL was. Or how much AMD's support for it sucked.

[Notional]

This has nothing to do with consoles, but rather AMD's official collaboration with Bethesda.

 

It's nice to see these advanced features, as long as this game is optimized for older stuff too. Afaik it will use the same ID engine as DOOM, which had amazing VULKAN support. It will be very interesting to see the performance of this game.

[3DOSH]

4 hours ago, M.Yurizaki said:

Also keep in mind that DirectX 12 and Vulkan aren't straightforward to work with. It's easier to get it wrong and see almost no improvement over DX11/OGL (if not worse) than it is to do it right. So for a lot of developers, it may be easier to just use DX11/OGL. And some many not even need it.

 

Perhaps it's a crude comparison, but it's like going from C#, Java, or Python to C. You can do amazing things in C, but it's also very easy to shoot yourself in the foot.

AMD has partnership with Bethesda to optimize the its games for AMD tech, that include AMD engineers working hand in hand with the Dev's since many of those features are very complex as you said .

Quote

http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/amd-and-bethesda-2017feb28.aspx

AMD is also optimizing Quake Champions for Vega and Ryzen.

Quote

 

You can add that to the OP as well.

[Derangel]

5 hours ago, Valentyn said:

idtech was good enough for Rage and it was idTech 4 back then.

It's come a long way; and likely could handle it if used correctly; especially given how low level it is; and how well it performs.

Rage is nowhere even remotely near an Elder Scrolls or modern Fallout title in terms of what it demands from an engine. Bethesda needs a new engine, desperately, but it would probably have to be something they build from the ground up.

[Derangel]

4 hours ago, BuckGup said:

Yeah but it shows the software side of things can be improved upon greatly

True. Though, I think it also speaks to AMD's lacking DX performance at the time. Something I believe they did mostly fix in driver updates.

[Valentyn]

6 minutes ago, Derangel said:

Rage is nowhere even remotely near an Elder Scrolls or modern Fallout title in terms of what it demands from an engine. Bethesda needs a new engine, desperately, but it would probably have to be something they build from the ground up.

Rage was on the PS3 at 60FPS without issue featuring mega textures.

Since then idTech has increased by leaps and bounds, and should easily be able to be used for a modern Fallout and ElderScrolls game.

If they need to build one up, they best get id Software to do it, as none of the others used by Bethesda have been good for performance, and CPU utilisation in nearly a decade.

[Jito463]

8 hours ago, Misanthrope said:

3) Source 2 - See above: Valve is just not into making many games anymore, they're more into the business of selling knives and hats when they bother to code games at all

To be fair, I think they've run out of new game ideas, and they're still trying to figure out how to count above 2.

[Derangel]

2 hours ago, Valentyn said:

Rage was on the PS3 at 60FPS without issue featuring mega textures.

Since then idTech has increased by leaps and bounds, and should easily be able to be used for a modern Fallout and ElderScrolls game.

If they need to build one up, they best get id Software to do it, as none of the others used by Bethesda have been good for performance, and CPU utilisation in nearly a decade.

I would love to see id make an engine for Bethesda for those games. Even without Carmark there are some incredibly talented people working on engine design over at id and I feel like they could make something really amazing.

[Humbug]

50 minutes ago, Jito463 said:

To be fair, I think they've run out of new game ideas, and they're still trying to figure out how to count above 2.

LOL, I don't think Valve has any shortage of ideas. Rather they don't have the financial incentive to prioritize and finish their own games (cause of Steam).

 

Anyway they are actually working on 3 new VR games right now\

https://www.polygon.com/virtual-reality/2017/2/10/14580932/valve-is-working-on-three-full-vr-games

Using both source 2 and unity engines.

[Derangel]

2 minutes ago, Humbug said:

LOL, I don't think Valve has any shortage of ideas. Rather they don't have the financial incentive to prioritize and finish their own games (cause of Steam).

 

Anyway they are actually working on 3 new VR games right now\

https://www.polygon.com/virtual-reality/2017/2/10/14580932/valve-is-working-on-three-full-vr-games

Using both source 2 and unity engines.

This, so much this. To put some numbers behind it: Forbes estimates that Valve is worth over $3 billion right now. With the money Valve brings in from Steam, CSGo, TF2, and DOTA 2 there is absolutely no reason for them to develop new sequels or finish Half-Life. There is a reason so many writers have left Valve over the last year.

[Jito463]

3 minutes ago, Humbug said:

LOL, I don't think Valve has any shortage of ideas. Rather they don't have the financial incentive to prioritize and finish their own games (cause of Steam).

Give me some credit for the '2' joke.  It may not be original, but it's true.  

 

4 minutes ago, Humbug said:

Anyway they are actually working on 3 new VR games right now\

VR games aren't real games, so they don't count.  

[Misanthrope]

2 hours ago, Humbug said:

LOL, I don't think Valve has any shortage of ideas. Rather they don't have the financial incentive to prioritize and finish their own games (cause of Steam).

 

Anyway they are actually working on 3 new VR games right now\

https://www.polygon.com/virtual-reality/2017/2/10/14580932/valve-is-working-on-three-full-vr-games

Using both source 2 and unity engines.

The financial incentive is there: they only need to look at the top selling games on steam. No, what's really happening is that as an organization they just don't have the discipline to see a proper full AAA game through anymore. They barely pulled it off with HL2 to the point that "It will come out when it's done" became a proto-meme.

[Humbug]

1 hour ago, Misanthrope said:

The financial incentive is there: they only need to look at the top selling games on steam. No, what's really happening is that as an organization they just don't have the discipline to see a proper full AAA game through anymore. They barely pulled it off with HL2 to the point that "It will come out when it's done" became a proto-meme.

I agree that they don't have the discipline anymore.

Making a AAA game requires a multi-year effort towards a common goal coordinated across hundreds of employees.

 

My contention is that the reason they do not have the discipline is because of the revenue they generate through steam. It's much more lucrative to put their effort towards UGC on their multiplayer games and into Steam where they can obtain upto 30% cut from 3rd party devs sales.

 

Whereas other studios need to keep releasing games to stay afloat. If Valve needed to then they would have got disciplined / organized.

[KingKeith55]

14 hours ago, cj09beira said:

first doom and now this, ID has being showing who's the boss at coding 

We also have to remember the countless FPS games that are based on the Quake engine.

[Valentyn]

6 hours ago, Derangel said:

I would love to see id make an engine for Bethesda for those games. Even without Carmark there are some incredibly talented people working on engine design over at id and I feel like they could make something really amazing.

It's exactly what they need. It would also likely be the first new engine built from the ground up using a low level API; not a dx11 or OpenGL one that's been modified or has a wrapper.

 

Would be fantastic.