Apple hatred, Why is it, Honestly?

[Giggitygoebbels]

Of course they do !? They don't decide which components to use, or how tu use them. They are a  contract manufacturer. If they don't manufacturer within the demanded requirements they simply don't get paid.

 

 

 

Is there really that much marketing and commercials for Apple products in the US?

You aren't really paying any premium if your comparisons aren't apples to oranges (e.g. an iMac vs. a self built desktop).

You might argue, that there is no 'real' desktop Mac from Apple available, which is absolutely true. And if you really only after high performance per price, and don't care about the OS or the built quality, and don't care about the time you need to select components and build your system (which definitely can be enjoyable to some people), then you probably better of by not buying any Mac.

 

 

Your opinion. I used iPhoto on a 2006 Macbook with a core duo with several thousands of photos, and it definitely wasn't slow, nor useless. And what is bogged down with Safari? (I don't like, I use Firefox and/or Chrome)

I am not talking about components.Foxconn even when given quality components,cannot make something decent.

[MrSuperb]

I am not talking about components.Foxconn even when given quality components,cannot make something decent.

 

Of course they can. Where are you coming from with this assumption?

[Giggitygoebbels]

Of course they can. Where are you coming from with this assumption?

Because most of anything manufactured by foxconn,regardless of what brands it is,have failed on me.

Even my iPad's Power Button.

[KrazyKap]

Is there really that much marketing and commercials for Apple products in the US?

You aren't really paying any premium if your comparisons aren't apples to oranges (e.g. an iMac vs. a self built desktop).

You might argue, that there is no 'real' desktop Mac from Apple available, which is absolutely true. And if you really only after high performance per price, and don't care about the OS or the built quality, and don't care about the time you need to select components and build your system (which definitely can be enjoyable to some people), then you probably better of by not buying any Mac.

 

 

Your opinion. I used iPhoto on a 2006 Macbook with a core duo with several thousands of photos, and it definitely wasn't slow, nor useless. And what is bogged down with Safari? (I don't like, I use Firefox and/or Chrome)

 

I don't live in the US. I have no idea... but they have built a system where with any product launch, everyone knows about it and a lot of those people want it. That simple. It's very effective, but I don't think all the people that want it, want it because of exactly what it offers, they just want "the best" phone or tablet or laptop - and without much knowledge on the topic, the most popular seems to be the best. Therefore, Apple can charge a premium that is only justified by the fact that their products are so well recognised. This is where to me it looks like a lot of customers are drawn in unawares, and are paying for something they don't fully understand, or know what to expect. And that is my point, about something Apple does that I don't like.

 

As for there being no direct comparison, this is true, but in most cases, it wouldn't take a direct comparison to still get exactly what a customer wants, but as I lead to above, the customer will pay more than necessary, because they are paying for what they are tricked into thinking that they need - when something different, and cheaper will still give them the same results. Does that make sense?

 

I think, that if everyone knew as much as the average hardware geek around here, then less Apple computers would be purchased. I could be entirely wrong, but Apple devices are really not that magical. For example, their are very nice notebooks being built these days, that support high end hardware, that would compete directly with MBPs for cheaper, but don't carry the Apple logo, and the huge launch excitement. So a customer there, might just be after a powerful, well built notebook, and see very little option other than a Mac Book Pro. but are they better off with a Mac Book Pro?

 

Yes, the Apple software stuff is entirely my opinion, and I didn't realise I hadn't edited "slow" out of the iPhoto categorisation. But my point there is, for most people, they are absolutely nothing special, and are talked up as buying points when in most cases they shouldn't be - as well as just about everything about Apple devices... talked up to make sales, when they're not all that special. There are cases where Apple hardware suits perfectly, but I think that is only in the minority of cases of Apple devices sold.

[Advent]

People hate on Apple for myriad reasons. Chiefly among them being the fact that a large percentage of Apple users are elitists without a clue.

#1
They believe their platform is perfect without any issues whatsoever. Stereotypes like "Apples don't get viruses because they are more secure", when they in fact are not more secure, they are just less profitable to attack as they hold a lower market share vs Windows. Or did all the Apple uses gloss over that huge Flash-based infection that owned 600,000 apples in like 3 weeks? Or the elitist additude that because you own an Apple product you are somehow better than someone who doesn't.

#2
The whole "think difference/innovator" crap that Apple and their fan base spews. Apple hasn't innovated anything since the iPhone. And even then it wasn't that innovative. They added a few flashy features and acted like it was some Renaissance-level breakthrough.

#3
Price. Apple products are the way Sony laptops used to be. All flash and no substance for a huge markup because it bears the brands name/logo. $3,000 for something that looks nice but is underpowered? Uh, no.... I'll pass.

#4
Proprietary. Proprietary. Proprietary.... The fact that Apple as a company locks down everything tighter than a virgin is a big reason they get so much hate. People want the ability to modify the things that they own. Computers especially. The fact that you have to get Apple parts at a huge markup is another reason. On a standard PC platform I have a ton of vendors to choose from and multiple price points to select from. With Apple you pay what you pay. Or the scumbag moves they have been pulling recently like swapping the screws on iPads/Pods that go in for repair so that your average customer can't repair them or tinker with them unless they find a maker of a special screwdriver/bit.

These are the major ones. Every platform has it's uses. That goes for Linux, OS X and Windows. Anyone who thinks any one of those platforms is inherently better than the other is a fool. They all have areas they excel at and areas they fail horribly at.

EDIT: Sure is getting trolly up in here.
EDIT: OS X is very closed down. You have a hard time using ANY software that isn't approved by Herr Overlord Apple. It isn't as customizable as Windows/Linux. I can do pretty much anything I want to my Windows or Linux distros.
 

[mealto]

First of all, I do not own a Mac computer but I do own multiple iOS devices (& other non apple devices). And also note that this is coming from someone who knows the advertising space and statistical analysis.

 

1. Who is to say what is of value that Apple products? Apple products do cost more in many cases but it's the end user who determines value. And please do not call owners of Apple products uninformed because they chose to purchase an Apple product. In fact, the latest poll I saw was that Apple users fall more into the higher income / higher education group than Android users. That is like saying BMW owners all suck because they could have gotten an Acura that costs less and has more technology.

 

2. As for advertising (yes, Samsung has many more products to research and market), the last numbers I saw was that in 4 quarters, Apple spent 1 billions in ad dollars while Samsung spent 4+ billion. What does that tell you? Look at this chart.

 

[Osmium]

Me personally, I do not like the OSX. I am not sure if I am just used to windows but the way the "windows" function really annoy me, you cannot make them actually fullscreen and they constantly seem to end up getting super cluttered. Speaking of clutter just look at the apple equivalent of a taskbar ew...

 

Operating system aside they price their products absurdly high. A long time ago nobody else could compete with their very good build quality but now they are just downright mediocre, and yet they price their laptops well above everyone else's. Even though I am not an ultrabook fan, Ultrabooks are much faster and cost as much. Even on the mobile market iOS is not longer number 1 in my opinion. Apple had their run on top of the food chain but now they are just average.

[mr moose]

First of all, I do not own a Mac computer but I do own multiple iOS devices (& other non apple devices). And also note that this is coming from someone who knows the advertising space and statistical analysis.

 

1. Who is to say what is of value that Apple products? Apple products do cost more in many cases but it's the end user who determines value. And please do not call owners of Apple products uninformed because they chose to purchase an Apple product. In fact, the latest poll I saw was that Apple users fall more into the higher income / higher education group than Android users. That is like saying BMW owners all suck because they could have gotten an Acura that costs less and has more technology.

 

2. As for advertising (yes, Samsung has many more products to research and market), the last numbers I saw was that in 4 quarters, Apple spent 1 billions in ad dollars while Samsung spent 4+ billion. What does that tell you? Look at this chart.

 

Sorry that chart doesn't mean anything without a product breakdown.  Samsung advertises t.v's, fridges, microwaves, building construction etc etc etc.  Samsung is not merely 4 times bigger, their product ranges is absolutely mammoth compared to apple. 

 

I agree,  People are not necessarily uneducated or "less informed" because they choose apple,  however the same applies for the other 92% of the population that choose not to use apple pc's.

[solosdk]

 

 

 

Nuff said.

[Osmium]

Sorry that chart doesn't mean anything without a product breakdown.  Samsung advertises t.v's, fridges, microwaves, building construction etc etc etc.  Samsung is not merely 4 times bigger, their product ranges is absolutely mammoth compared to apple. 

 

I agree,  People are not necessarily uneducated or "less informed" because they choose apple,  however the same applies for the other 92% of the population that choose not to use apple pc's.

The thing about apple though is I do not really believe products are superior to other products even in their own price range. No I do not think people are uneducated for buying from them but I do think Apple's clever marketing plays a big role in people thinking they are the top of the line.

 

Uneducated no, Misinformed yes.

[brat137]

I hate their advertising. Its all so smug and arrogant and makes me want to punch the marketing director in the face. They all sound like Apple are claiming all the credit for every invention known to man. I just feel like someone needs to tell them they didn't invent the wheel! Also not everyones hands are the same size so that fucking iPhone advert with the thumb reaching the screen is ridiculous and annoying! /rant!

[mealto]

Uneducated no, Misinformed yes.

 

This is what you believe because you do not think other people are smart enough to choose. Funny.

[mealto]

There will always be Apple fan boys, just like there will always be PC fan boys who hate all things apple. In the older days, many Apple users were elitest. This is not the case anymore. Many older parents and grandparents use iPhones and iPads because it's easy to use.

[mr moose]

 

 

 

Nuff said.

really?  this is not an indication of changes to the industry because of iphone, this is an indication of changes to the industry due to touch screen adoption. 

 

Pre-iphone:

 

[solosdk]

Well, I am not sure I want to go into this.

 

1. Locked down OS.

2. Hasn't "innovated" since the original iPhone. Im sure the iPad is also an innovation. 

3. Steals others ideas, markets as own. See my post above this one ^

4. Makes the biggest case for cutting down on child labor while still doing it themselves. Not too sure about that. Im pretty sure most companies are like that, not just Apple

5. Overpriced. A HTC One (which I have), is priced at £420 brand new atm. You can get the more powerful 5s for about £500. Macbooks are expensive though

6. Underpowered. I don't see how underpowered the 5s or even the 5 is. 

7. Proprietary. 

8. Other pointless arguments.

 

I myself am a fan of Apple's computers. That's about it. Android as a mobile OS is far superior in my eyes, though I personally use an iPhone 5 (don't mind it, but it's not my cup of tea and I think I want a Galaxy Note 3) I hackintoshed as well (Welcome to the club ) and I am loving it. I just need to get the USB Audio Card and I'm good. Also, maybe I can get the hard drive kit for my Mac Mini and it can be used then as an HTPC.

 

Bare in mind I switched from an iPhone 5 to a HTC One, and I hate it. I absolutely hate android. It doesn't do what I want properly and its such a hassle trying to do things that my iPhone did so simply. 

[solosdk]

really?  this is not an indication of changes to the industry because of iphone, this is an indication of changes to the industry due to touch screen adoption. 

 

Pre-iphone:

 

 

That is just ONE phone that is similar-ish to the iPhone. Look at ALL the phones now...

[mr moose]

That is just ONE phone that is similar-ish to the iPhone. Look at ALL the phones now...

Just because all phones look the same now does not mean it is the result of iphone, it just means that iphone and all the other phones are going down the same path.  There is only one way to implement a touch screen. 

[solosdk]

Just because all phones look the same now does not mean it is the result of iphone, it just means that iphone and all the other phones are going down the same path.  There is only one way to implement a touch screen. 

 

It doesn't matter. I don't care what anyone says but, after the iPhone in 2007 is what made the phones today. 

[mr moose]

It doesn't matter. I don't care what anyone says but, after the iPhone in 2007 is what made the phones today. 

Bull dust,  the iphone is only one phone, the prada is only one phone, the ipaq, etc etc. They have been evolving into what they are today because that is how technological evolution works. Just because apple joint the mobile market right at the point when full touchscreens became viable doesn't make them the ones that dictated the whole process. To try and insinuate that iphone is the reason phones look the way they do is to totally ignore technological history and evolutions across the other 30 besquillion companies that have been involved  in R&D from day dot.

[solosdk]

Bull dust,  the iphone is only one phone, the prada is only one phone, the ipaq, etc etc. They have been evolving into what they are today because that is how technological evolution works. Just because apple joint the mobile market right at the point when full touchscreens became viable doesn't make them the ones that dictated the whole process. To try and insinuate that iphone is the reason phones look the way they do is to totally ignore technological history and evolutions across the other 30 besquillion companies that have been involved  in R&D from day dot.

 

If that was the case, why was there no iPhone-like phone introduced before 2007? If they had all these so called ideas, why was there no phone that did what iPhone introduced, before 2007? Same goes with iPad. Why did no one make an iPad-like tablet before 2010 if they "already had ideas"?

[mr moose]

If that was the case, why was there no iPhone-like phone introduced before 2007? If they had all these so called ideas, why was there no phone that did what iPhone introduced, before 2007? Same goes with iPad. Why did no one make an iPad-like tablet before 2010 if they "already had ideas"?

there was, I posted it already, the LG prada was released before Iphone,

And:

http://www.osnews.com/story/26230

and:

http://allthingsd.com/20100318/htc-to-apple-we-built-a-touchscreen-phone-before-you-did/

 

It's simple: iphones are great for what they are, but to say they are the reason phones evolved into what they are is completely erroneous.

 

EDIT: tablets:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_tablet_computers

 

but I never mentioned them so I don't know why you are bringing it up.

[Osmium]

This is what you believe because you do not think other people are smart enough to choose. Funny.

No that is not at all what I am saying, I am saying they are willingly making the choice to buy apple. I think people buy apple because apple has been the best thing money can buy in the past, but that is simply not the case anymore.

[LogicDeifying]

Lying to consumers that they've innovated when they haven't.

Overpriced ,

So a year ago.

And finally lawsuits and patent mumbo jumbo.

[Lyons]

Well, I am not sure I want to go into this.

1. Locked down OS.

Wrong

2. Hasn't "innovated" since the original iPhone.

Wrong

3. Steals others ideas, markets as own.

Who doesn't do this?

4. Makes the biggest case for cutting down on child labor while still doing it themselves.

Who doesn't do this?

5. Overpriced.

Subjective/wrong

6. Underpowered.

Subjective/wrong

7. Proprietary.

Who doesn't do this?

8. Other pointless arguments.

Keep digging

[Advent]

1. Locked down OS.

Wrong

2. Hasn't "innovated" since the original iPhone.

Wrong

3. Steals others ideas, markets as own.

Who doesn't do this?

4. Makes the biggest case for cutting down on child labor while still doing it themselves.

Who doesn't do this?

5. Overpriced.

Subjective/wrong

6. Underpowered.

Subjective/wrong

7. Proprietary.

Who doesn't do this?

8. Other pointless arguments.

Keep digging

<sarcasm>Nice way to "shoot down arguments" without actually arguing.</sarcasm>