rx 480 RX 480 AFTERMARKET RELEASE DATE?

[SpyingAround]

29 minutes ago, App4that said:

Nvidia is saying the 1060 will match a 980, and beat the 480 in every scenario. And since there are already confirmed board partner cards with open coolers at 260us that would be quite impressive. But other than the pricing those are rumors. Along with multi GPU support on the 1060, which all that's been confirmed is that Nvidia won't support it. There are rumors of board partners with SLI support, namely the iChill. But we still don't know what Nvidia has planned. SLI is just one type of multi GPU support. In 24hrs we'll know for sure.

The price of the gtx 1060 isn't rumoured. NCIX accidently leaked it, and i found out about it, and made a thread about it on this Forum. They leaked a reference Zotac gtx 1060, a Zotac AMP gtx 1060 and a MSI Gaming X gtx 1060. The reference was priced at 343 CAD and the Gaming X at 443 CAD. 

Here's the thread i made about it: 

What you are telling me is, that Nvidia dropped SLI on gtx 1060 because SLI is stupid? 

[LooneyJuice]

3 minutes ago, App4that said:

Yes, seriously. How long have you been PC gaming? Do you know how many times SLI/Crossfire have been pushed and the all clear has been sounded? The number of times the new API has "fixed" it? Yet every serious reviewer says not to do it because of the issues found. If multi card support is dropped from the Nvidia side, that is why. And when a company whos stock price is ten times that of AMD says it's a bad idea, and people try and share their experiences with you in an attempt to save you the frustration, you go ahaid and do it.

 

Well I'm sure we can commiserate with you when the topic related to your issues pops up.

 

 

Concur. A lot of this multi-gpu "freshness" is once again coming up as a result of a new releases. Multi-gpu setups have always had issues, and always will, especially when it's up to developers to accommodate it. You're asking developers to spend a good chunk of time optimizing a platform for a niche multi-gpu audience. Not everyone is going to do that. AAA titles occasionally do because of the prestige, and the fact that more players means that multi-gpu setups are going to become a good chunk of the demographic simply due to the law of averages.

 

Additionally, all this Vulkan and DX12 hype is just that, hype. Sure it may become better in the future, and all that jazz, but the keywords here are "may" and "future". What about all the current, future, and past DX9/11/OGL games etc. Just because Vulkan and DX12 may favor multi-GPU setups more, doesn't make the rest mysteriously work better.

[App4that]

2 minutes ago, Brian McKee said:

The 480 is already close to 1070 performance in Vulcan/DX12 performance, I don't see the 1060 turning any heads unless the pricing is incredibly competitive.

No it's not  

 

Doom is the only such game and async is disabled for Nvidia. The patch in a few days will clear that up  

[SpyingAround]

2 minutes ago, Brian McKee said:

The 480 is already close to 1070 performance in Vulcan/DX12 performance, I don't see the 1060 turning any heads unless the pricing is incredibly competitive.

The price is 343 to 450 CAD. Leaked from NCIX. gtx 1060 Gaming X was priced at 443.xx CAD. Go to my other thread, the price is there.  So the reference gtx 1060 from zotac is a bit over the price of rx 480. 

[Brian McKee]

3 minutes ago, App4that said:

No it's not  

 

Doom is the only such game and async is disabled for Nvidia. The patch in a few days will clear that up  

You might want to do a bit of research, I sincerely doubt that async will give even 2-3% performance boost to nvidia. One of the (massive) reasons AMD saw such a powerspike was alleviating CPU overhead, something nvidia has always had an advantage with their superior drivers. But that won't matter with Vulcan/DX 12 since it's on the developers.

[App4that]

3 minutes ago, SpyingAround said:

The price of the gtx 1060 isn't rumoured. NCIX accidently leaked it, and i found out about it, and made a thread about it on this Forum. They leaked a reference Zotac gtx 1060, a Zotac AMP gtx 1060 and a MSI Gaming X gtx 1060. The reference was priced at 343 CAD and the Gaming X at 443 CAD. 

Here's the thread i made about it:What you are telling me is, that Nvidia dropped SLI on gtx 1060 because SLI is stupid? 

For lower end graphics cards, yes.

 

I won't even SLI my 980ti. SLI and Crossfire are last resort options. They are for when you have no other solution. With a 480 or 1060 all you have to do is sell that card and buy the better one.

[App4that]

2 minutes ago, Brian McKee said:

You might want to do a bit of research, I sincerely doubt that async will give even 2-3% performance boost to nvidia. One of the (massive) reasons AMD saw such a powerspike was alleviating CPU overhead, something nvidia has always had an advantage with their superior drivers.

No again  

 

The reason AMD saw a "powerspike" was AMD was not on the same version of OpenGL so wasn't getting anywhere near the fps the Nvidia side was. So what happened is AMD caught up, which is good.

[don_svetlio]

2 minutes ago, Brian McKee said:

 

 

2 minutes ago, App4that said:

 

Guys - it's late so I don't feel like a long argument.

Let me sum it up:

Nvidia Pascal CAN do A-sync
AMD GCN is still better at it

So while the 480 won't beat a 1070 even with A-sync the 1060 won't really be able to beat the 480's A-sync as software support is simply inferior to hardware support. Tis' all.

[SpyingAround]

2 minutes ago, App4that said:

For lower end graphics cards, yes.

 

I won't even SLI my 980ti. SLI and Crossfire are last resort options. They are for when you have no other solution. With a 480 or 1060 all you have to do is sell that card and buy the better one.

They didn't drop SLI on gtx 1060 because it's stupid. They dropped it because SLI gtx 1060 would outperform gtx 1080, making it cheaper and better than the gtx 1080, which would lead to fewer sales of a single gtx 1080, and higher sales of gtx 1060. Also, what is a lower end gpu today? The rx 480 can max out 1080, and play some 1400p at high settings. 

Nvidia dropped sli on 1060 because it would outperform 1080. 

[App4that]

3 minutes ago, don_svetlio said:

 

Guys - it's late so I don't feel like a long argument.

Let me sum it up:

Nvidia Pascal CAN do A-sync
AMD GCN is still better at it

So while the 480 won't beat a 1070 even with A-sync the 1060 won't really be able to beat the 480's A-sync as software support is simply inferior to hardware support. Tis' all.

Exactly. And a source we all agree on showing the 1070 way ahead of the 480.

 

 

[don_svetlio]

2 minutes ago, App4that said:

Exactly. And a source we all agree on showing the 1070 way ahead of the 480.

 

 

Of course - it's a superior product. But if we were talking a 1060, then I'd be seriously skeptical about it's DX12/Vulkan performance being as good as GCN 4,0

[App4that]

2 minutes ago, SpyingAround said:

They didn't drop SLI on gtx 1060 because it's stupid. They dropped it because SLI gtx 1060 would outperform gtx 1080, making it cheaper and better than the gtx 1080, which would lead to fewer sales of a single gtx 1080, and higher sales of gtx 1060. Also, what is a lower end gpu today? The rx 480 can max out 1080, and play some 1400p at high settings. 

Nvidia dropped sli on 1060 because it would outperform 1080. 

No they didn't  OMG  

 

So why does the 970 have SLI support?  

[SpyingAround]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

No they didn't  OMG  

 

So why does the 970 have SLI support?  

Because sli 970 is more expensive than 980? 

[App4that]

1 minute ago, don_svetlio said:

Of course - it's a superior product. But if we were talking a 1060, then I'd be seriously skeptical about it's DX12/Vulkan performance being as good as GCN 4,0

Like you said, remains to be seen. I don't think so ether but the benchmarks tomorrow will tell the story. Because you know Doom will be on the list.

[Brian McKee]

9 minutes ago, App4that said:

Exactly. And a source we all agree on showing the 1070 way ahead of the 480.

 

 

I'm talking price to perf. For the 1060 to be competitive it not only needs to match but it needs to be heavily price competitive.

 

I'm not too sure about it, but we'll see.

[App4that]

1 minute ago, SpyingAround said:

Because sli 970 is more expensive than 980? 

Not more expensive than a 980ti though, and 970 SLI when working beats a 980ti.

 

Please, don't fall into the aluminum hat crowd.

[don_svetlio]

3 minutes ago, App4that said:

Like you said, remains to be seen. I don't think so ether but the benchmarks tomorrow will tell the story. Because you know Doom will be on the list.

True - though with Pascal price at the moment, I doubt we'll be able to see the 1060 be competitive till at least september.

[App4that]

1 minute ago, Brian McKee said:

I'm talking price to perf, the 480 bridges the gap significantly. For the 1060 to be competitive it not only needs to match but it needs to be heavily price competitive.

To calculate price to performance you need a level playing field, which we don't have here. Once id enables async for Nvidia then we will see.

[SpyingAround]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

Not more expensive than a 980ti though, and 970 SLI when working beats a 980ti.

 

Please, don't fall into the aluminum hat crowd.

Okey, so now you're comparing it to the gtx 980 ti. A gtx 980 ti in Denmark costs 4400 DKK which = 655 USD. 1 Gtx 970 costs 357 USD in Denmark. SLI the gtx 970 and you'll get 714 USD: 

655 USD GTX 980 ti vs 714 USD SLI 970. How isnt that more expensive if i can ask? 

[App4that]

2 minutes ago, SpyingAround said:

Okey, so now you're comparing it to the gtx 980 ti. A gtx 980 ti in Denmark costs 4400 DKK which = 655 USD. 1 Gtx 970 costs 357 USD in Denmark. SLI the gtx 970 and you'll get 714 USD: 

655 USD GTX 980 ti vs 714 USD SLI 970. How isnt that more expensive if i can ask? 

Because prices are goofy right now. I paid 730us for my Hybrid.

 

Here, bit off topic but this video sums it up perfectly. Don't look at the title, just watch it.

 

 

[Briggsy]

2 hours ago, App4that said:

Have you run a multi graphics card configuration? Not worth it. I ran a 290/390 crossfire set up and now have a 980ti. The crossfire set up beats my 980ti in Firestrike but my 980ti destroys the crossfire set up in every game while running cooler and using less power. 

 

Even if you get a 480 my advice is don't get suckered into running multiple graphics cards when the support from developers isn't there. Sell it and trade up to Vega once it launches. 

I was in the same boat. had crossfire 290's and it was not a great experience. I remember when dragonage inquisition launch was getting close, I bought the second 290 so I could get good performance, and even water cooled both cards. It took a couple months for the crossfire support to arrive... That wasn't the only time a game that could really use the crossfire support wouldn't work. Now using a 1070 (similar to the 980ti) and I get a guaranteed minimum performance level that the 290's might have beaten in a few games, but using 4x the power draw.   480's in crossfire would probably be similar, at 2x the power draw (still bad).  fool me once... fool me twice...

[SpyingAround]

2 minutes ago, App4that said:

Because prices are goofy right now. I paid 730us for my Hybrid.

 

Here, bit off topic but this video sums it up perfectly. Don't look at the title, just watch it.

 

 

You can't tell me not to fall into the aluminium hat crowd, and then when I comeback with an answer blowing yours away, then tell me than prices are goofy right now, and than i should look at A YEAR OLD video to compare with the tech TODAY? Are you fucking kidding me? I don't want to buy a GPU in a YEAR or wait half a year. Okey, so lets say prices are "goofy" right now.

 

My point was still correct. SLi 970 is more expensive than 980 ti. 

 

You are looking at a videoover a year old, comparing those resulsts i can't even use for what? 

[App4that]

2 minutes ago, SpyingAround said:

You can't tell me not to fall into the aluminium hat crowd, and then when I comeback with an answer blowing yours away, then tell me than prices are goofy right now, and than i should look at A YEAR OLD video to compare with the tech TODAY? Are you fucking kidding me? I don't want to buy a GPU in a YEAR or wait half a year. Okey, so lets say prices are "goofy" right now.

 

My point was still correct. SLi 970 is more expensive than 980 ti. 

 

You are looking at a videoover a year old, comparing those resulsts i can't even use for what? 

Why the aggression? When looking at the 970 and 980ti you have to look to when they were relevant, not now. Nvidia wants to sell cards, lots of cards. They make the same or possibly more money off two 1060s as one 1080. It makes no sense to limit how many cards you can sell from a manufacturers standpoint.

[SpyingAround]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

Why the aggression? When looking at the 970 and 980ti you have to look to when they were relevant, not now. Nvidia wants to sell cards, lots of cards. They make the same or possibly more money off two 1060s as one 1080. It makes no sense to limit how many cards you can sell from a manufacturers standpoint.

First of all, Nvidia doesn't make the same ammount of money off of 2 1060's as they do of 1 1080. Nvidia wants money. Giving 1060 sli support means less money to them, since people would buy 2 cheaper 1060's instead of 1 1080. 

Which means they make less money. 

Why would they not include the sli support, if they know that there are actually people who are going to spend more money on another card later? 
Don't tell me it's because they don't want people to use SLI on a lower end GPU.. man srsly, gtx 1060 isn't low end. The 980 was high end, right? Nvidia said gtx 1060 would have 980 perfomance, how is that low end? Why not sli a card that performs as a 980? 980 wasn't low end? 

[App4that]

2 minutes ago, SpyingAround said:

First of all, Nvidia doesn't make the same ammount of money off of 2 1060's as they do of 1 1080. Nvidia wants money. Giving 1060 sli support means less money to them, since people would buy 2 cheaper 1060's instead of 1 1080. 

Which means they make less money. 

Why would they not include the sli support, if they know that there are actually people who are going to spend more money on another card later? 
Don't tell me it's because they don't want people to use SLI on a lower end GPU.. man srsly, gtx 1060 isn't low end. The 980 was high end, right? Nvidia said gtx 1060 would have 980 perfomance, how is that low end? Why not sli a card that performs as a 980? 980 wasn't low end? 

I'll try one last time.

 

The 1060 is a new architecture, so the performance can't be compared to the last architecture. When compared to the Titan P when it launches the 1060 will look like a 960. It's a lower end card. It just looks better than it is because of the architecture change and the fact only a few cards have been released. Same goes for a RX 480, once Vega hits it will look like a 380. Which the 380 is a much better card than a 960 so it will be interesting how that relationship is this time.

 

If I said I wanted to put 960s in SLI people would laugh their ass off.

 

Every company wants money, that's how they stay in business. None of us would have jobs if companies weren't out to make money. Why excluded SLI from the 1060 we will find out tomorrow, I keep saying that. Less than 24hrs. Chill my brother.