Surface Pro 3 Review

[bry.yyyy]

did everyone already see linus lamborghini hahaha i love it linus

[steffen_anywhere]

Microsoft is not trying to deplete Macbook Air sales at all.

With back to school coming up many students purchase macs in general, Macbook Air being popular because of its mass.

 

Microsoft has been putting Onenote and their stylus at the center of attention, because you can much easier take notes and mark up .pdf textbooks. This being a great option for myself, as I will be getting one. I would agree as well though, this device is not for Linus.

I wouldn't say it is "[making] them look extremely unprofessional at all" however, this device is aimed at students and the business market (I mean it comes with Windows 8.1 Pro). 

The best selling device for business users and students is the Macbook Air! So of course it makes sense to compare that product to the surface because it is the best selling one. 

If Microsoft said don't buy a Macbook Air it sucks, that would be unprofessional. Comparing the product and saying Surface 3 Pro has this..., and Macbook Air doesn't, that is stating what one has and the other doesn't. It is called competition, it makes the market stronger, and if the Macbook Air is better, then Apple should handle those rejections made by the Surface 3 Pro.

 

Ok yeah, I think I responded in a partially subjective way...

 

I still think that their marketing is somewhat stupid if you look at this:

http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-us/products/compare

 

"Compare a Surface (non-pro) to other tablets" - pulls out iPad to shit upon...

 

Then moving on to the Surface Pro against the MacBook Air below on that site: They are again criticizing that the MacBook is not a tablet (this is dumb imo because it depends on what the user wants and is therefore not a suitable point of comparison, like saying "OSX is the best OS and Windows is shit", which is simply not true and the end user has to decide what experience they want.

 

They do have a comparison against the Galaxy Tab, but throughout every single one, there is not a single point against the Microsoft products. Even when clearly mentioning that the iPad has a much bigger App ecosystem, they still put a tick next to the Surface. Unbelievable. I understand that they want to advertise their product, but you can do this without even mentioning the competition. Just my two cents, and this is not me arguing against the surface at all. Just against their marketing...

 

And yes to be fair the stylus and OneNote look really good and the fact that you can just annotate things like a textbook is a major advantage.

[kache]

SECOND KID? Wtf... :blink:

No wonder you always complain about not being able to pay your employees a lot... :lol:

[kache]

Very very nice review. I love it when Linus is critical and negative.

 

But

 

Don't forget to subscribe for more videos just like this one

 

Is incorrect, since the negative videos from linus are very few and far in between. <_<

[LinusTech]

For print screen: Fn+Space does print screen

Fn+Alt+Space does print screen on the focused window as well.

The keyboard magnet is so strong on my Surface Pro 2, once I snap the cover and where there was with a peace of dirt or something, and it made a dent on the metal of my device.

The idea of the microSD card, is for extended storage like your phone, beside from tear-down pictures, there is no room on the system board for anything larger, let alone another USB port. Maybe with Broadwell having more integrated component it would open this door, but so far that is the case. So I guess, that's the excuse.

 

Wacom pen on the Wacom Cintiq is not any really better than the Surface Pro 2. Sure it takes 2048 pressure level compared to 1024, but it still can't track properly on corners, and the device has NO keyboard. 13.3inch, 3.9lb, 25 ms response time (yes, VERY slow, and that is what Wacom shows, so it's probably worst in real life, as it is always the case), 1080p, has a 3rd gen Core i processor which is more power hungry. The 1.799$ is a special price, the normal price of the device is 1,999$. So assuming you miss out on the special, the Surface Pro 2 or 3 is cheaper.

 

The Surface Pro 3 uses N-Trig pen which has it's ups and downs over Wacom's. For one you don't need to calibrate it, and it works great on corners. Sure it supports only 256 pressure levels, but this is a high-end N-Trig digitize (unlike what Sony was putting in their systems). Also, more and more programs are said to make their software high-DPI aware, including Adobe starting with PhotoShop. Yes, I agree that is it is retarded in Microsoft part to not have updated many of their system related panels to be high DPI aware. Hopefully Windows 9 will correct that.

 

 

My Surface Pro 2 notes in math class (all made in OneNote, thanks to handwritten to math conversion):

 

Great catch on fn+space. I spent a about 10 minutes googling and for whatever reason I didn't find that solution (windows + volume was one that came up a few times). I guess my Google Fu is weak. Added an annotation to the video to correct that.

 

Thanks for the post overall. You're someone for whom the Surface makes sense. I guess a lot of my negativity comes from thinking it was the right product for me when in actuality it wasn't at all. It's just not useful for me.

 

Linus

[RH00D]

Seems to me like Linus is being unfairly harsh on it, is it just because its made by Microsoft? Linus also seems to just fly off the handle stating things without doing very much research, such as saying double-clicking the pen's button as the only way to take a screenshot.

 

Overall this type of stuff, which has happened in previous reviews, has made me less keen on taking Linus's reviews as seriously because I can't be assured that what Linus is saying is 100% true. I think Wendell's review from Tek Syndicate was much more fair and balanced.

[marioo1182]

Ok yeah, I think I responded in a partially subjective way...

 

I still think that their marketing is somewhat stupid if you look at this:

http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-us/products/compare

 

"Compare a Surface (non-pro) to other tablets" - pulls out iPad to shit upon...

 

Then moving on to the Surface Pro against the MacBook Air below on that site: They are again criticizing that the MacBook is not a tablet (this is dumb imo because it depends on what the user wants and is therefore not a suitable point of comparison, like saying "OSX is the best OS and Windows is shit", which is simply not true and the end user has to decide what experience they want.

 

They do have a comparison against the Galaxy Tab, but throughout every single one, there is not a single point against the Microsoft products. Even when clearly mentioning that the iPad has a much bigger App ecosystem, they still put a tick next to the Surface. Unbelievable. I understand that they want to advertise their product, but you can do this without even mentioning the competition. Just my two cents, and this is not me arguing against the surface at all. Just against their marketing...

 

And yes to be fair the stylus and OneNote look really good and the fact that you can just annotate things like a textbook is a major advantage.

I totally agree with this, didn't think it was this harsh. And ya, there is check marks for apps on the iPad. If you look carefully it is that the Surface ones are highlighted, I missed it too till I double checked. Pretty cheesy to me.

But what I didn't like is when they said you're limited to iWork, even though they create Microsoft Office apps for iPad a couple months ago LOL  :lol:

[GoodBytes]

But what I didn't like is when they said you're limited to iWork, even though they create Microsoft Office apps for iPad a couple months ago LOL  :lol:

Yea. But for office it's not the "full Office". It is a light version, and you don't have stuff like Access.  But yea.

[Edwouldzilla]

Great review, had thoughts about this surface but think I let it pass now

[Crook7]

Pretty correct review if you ask me. He touched everything that needed to be touched. Had some good remarks on things that need improvement and he clearly states the assumptions he has for a device like this. I own a surface RT (first version) myself as I bought it with the massive education discount. It was acutally pennies to buy and I didn't regret it as I've used it a lot to take notes in class. Would not have bought it if it was the normal price though. 

[eugenius]

A review from somebody who just wants a laptop and bought the wrong thing. Not very informative.

 

For instance, no mention of the fact that the pro3 is the best A4 PDF reading device on the market . Sony wants more money than the surface for a comparable size e-ink reader for example. No stylus testing etc.

 

I too would like a battery keyboard with a couple more USB ports, hdmi 2.0 and low profile mechanical switches and a way to lock it to the main body. MS should offer that option with the broadwell refresh.

 

They keep ignoring their core market for this dumbed down touch screen interface for the masses. The simple touch interface isn't a bad idea in itself and the way MS is doing it shows promise but MS is big enough to keep working on both. If Windows9 finally offers DPI scaling in the classic interface and unifies Windows Mobile with RT and a decent touch app ecosystem, they'll win on both types of apps not just on the pro apps where they win by default anyway. 

 

But they need to do the work to seamlessly integrate touch apps with pro apps. I don't need a touch Onenote and a pro Onenote each with it's own file structure, I need a Onenote that works with the same files seamlessly whatever interface you choose. Even if the touch version is just a little more than a viewer, they still need to be integrated.

 

I mean you're in full Word editing your next review. You take out the tablet part and Word switches to touch for reading and light editing and annotation . What could be better? That is the stuff a device like the surface pro should be capable of doing.

 

PS: MS finally saw the light, 16:9 tablets are stupid in portrait mode. 3:2 aspect ratio forever!

 

PS2: I actually think they should up the size again to 14.3" for a full A4 screen for the pro version (or at least offer the option) and keep the consumer version between 8" and 9". 14" is the optimal size for a pro laptop anyway. That and a real battery keyboard would make the surface pro THE professional unifying device that only actual professionals would use. I think there is the technology to make such a tablet and still keep it under 1kg for the tablet part. 1500$ start price would be no problem for such a device. Call it a macbook pro competitor if you NEED to compare to Apple every two seconds.

 

The problem is that MS doesn't care about pro users (or PC gamers either). They're too busy competing with the macbook air with ... a tablet with immature software when they already have ultrabooks with mature software.

 

So finally, the surface pro 3. It's freaking great and it's very cheap for what it is. You just need to know it's not a laptop and it's not a consumer tablet and it's not a mass market device that people will buy instead of an actual laptop. Luckily you can find out these things just by looking at it.

[Blazin Phoenix]

Couldn't they just permanently connect the keyboard to the Surface so it can have a built in screen cover, act as a tablet with the keyboard flipped to the back, and be a keyboard when you need it? I can't see how they haven't decided to try that throughout all three generations.

 

Would also like to see the stylus to be implemented in the same fashion as the Tegra Note 7 where there's a built in home for it. Obviously the stylus should be smaller as well. If it mean that the Surface would be slightly bulkier then I wouldn't mind. Better than the lazy implementation they have now.

[GoodBytes]

Couldn't they just permanently connect the keyboard to the Surface so it can have a built in screen cover, act as a tablet with the keyboard flipped to the back, and be a keyboard when you need it? I can't see how they haven't decided to try that throughout all three generations.a

Sometimes you want to remove it, and if you spill a drink on it, you can open a laptop to dry it out and clean it, here you can't. So it is 130$ not another 1300$+ (or 1000$ if you have the base line model). Not to mention swap the keyboard for the thinner Touch Keyboard (which isn't available for the Surface Pro 3, at least not yet.. probably will be with the Surface 3 non-Pro, if that comes out)

 

Would also like to see the stylus to be implemented in the same fashion as the Tegra Note 7 where there's a built in home for it. Obviously the stylus should be smaller as well. If it mean that the Surface would be slightly bulkier then I wouldn't mind. Better than the lazy implementation they have now.

Everyone that uses the thin and small pens, hate them deeply, and reviewers hate them deeply as well.

A proper pen, needs to be a pen. making them thin and small, is like using a pen like this:

Good freaking luck.

You can slide the pen on the keyboard cover (as shown on a previous post (page 2, by: wilsoneku), you can put in it you pocket, bag or carrying pouch pocket with the Surface Pro. If you use the pen, you won't forget it behind, believe me.

[Blazin Phoenix]

Good points. I'm just really iffy about the fact that the Surface doesn't ship with a keyboard in the first place.

 

I'll go with your word for now on the pen. Don't have much experience with digipens. 

[GoodBytes]

Good points. I'm just really iffy about the fact that the Surface doesn't ship with a keyboard in the first place.

 

I'll go with your word for now on the pen. Don't have much experience with digipens. 

Yea, I also thought it would be an issue initially, even before buying the Surface Pro, but really, ended up.

[Blazin Phoenix]

Yea, I also thought it would be an issue initially, even before buying the Surface Pro, but really, ended up.

How would you rate your experience with the Surface without the keyboard. How limited are you with using touchscreen keyboard. I know someone who's hyped up for grabbing a Surface Pro 3, but I'm still on the fence with the laptop/tablet idea.

[GoodBytes]

So I use my Surface Pro 2 in tablet on the bus (1h trip to get to work), and some moments here and there during the day.

Using the desktop experience at 100% DPI on touch only, is a bit of a pain... you learn to be more accurate with your touch, but stuff like clocking a Firefox tab, is a serious pain as the button is too small. Same for menu navigation. But 100% DPI is something I have chosen, as I use the device for me, so I can read the small test just fine, and I use it more often as a laptop with a mouse, outside of school. However, I do draw diagrams, GUI design/layout and plans for software development.

If you use the device at 150% or better yet 200%, then it will be less of an issue, as everything is bigger.

Play touch supported games (Civilization 5, Broken Age, Trine 2, etc) or Windows 8 Apps is perfectly fine, due to the larger buttons, native support (of course), even at 100% DPI, and Modern UI set to Small, and not the default large.

Now, as using the system only with touch keyboard, it is OK. It depends on what I do.

If I do "power user" stuff, or programming, then it requires the full keyboard layout, which, due to high number of keys, makes the keys very close and opens room for accidental miss key types. As for "normal" every day stuff, then it is OK. I can write a message on a forum fine. I have no tablet or smartphone to compare, but IO expect the same experience, touch is touch.

I would definitely not type a post of this length using touch, unless I am desperate (then again, that is why I got the keyboard).

Basic navigation, typing a URL on the web browser, it's all good. You can use the thumb keyboard layout too, which requires some serious getting used to, I sill haven't mastered it, then again, I have really not used it many times.

[Blazin Phoenix]

Sounds just about what I was expecting. Still don't understand why the keyboard isn't included. At least it's not expensive in comparison to the Surface.

 

For now I think I'll wait a while longer for more improvements. Looks promising, but it's not for me right now.

[GoodBytes]

Sounds just about what I was expecting. Still don't understand why the keyboard isn't included. At least it's not expensive in comparison to the Surface.

 

For now I think I'll wait a while longer for more improvements. Looks promising, but it's not for me right now.

Agreed.

If you can wait, wait at least the pro 4, where it will have Haswell, and any bugs and issues with the current new design will be also ironed out.

[menendez1293]

So the touch input on my Surface Pro 3 stopped working. Ran some updates and now the Surface Pro Touch Controller Firmware has a warning in Device Manager. Tried rolling it back, uninstalling and re installing, and nothing seems to work. 

[GoodBytes]

So the touch input on my Surface Pro 3 stopped working. Ran some updates and now the Surface Pro Touch Controller Firmware has a warning in Device Manager. Tried rolling it back, uninstalling and re installing, and nothing seems to work.

Open Device Manager, Uninstall the touch screen device, and restart the system. Once restarted, let it fully load, and check for Windows update.

If Windows is fully updated, and the touch screen still doesn't work, but is detected back in Device Manager do the following:

-> Shutdown the device and wait about 5sec (just to be sure its really off, and not just the screen turned off). Press and hold the volume up button, and press and hold the power button. Keep holding. The Surface will turn on, go to the UEFI screen, then off. Now, you can release both button. The device should turn back on (I beleive) after a few second by itself after, if not, hit the power button to turn it on. Does the touch screen work now?

[menendez1293]

Open Device Manager, Uninstall the touch screen device, and restart the system. Once restarted, let it fully load, and check for Windows update.

If Windows is fully updated, and the touch screen still doesn't work, but is detected back in Device Manager do the following:

-> Shutdown the device and wait about 5sec (just to be sure its really off, and not just the screen turned off). Press and hold the volume up button, and press and hold the power button. Keep holding. The Surface will turn on, go to the UEFI screen, then off. Now, you can release both button. The device should turn back on (I beleive) after a few second by itself after, if not, hit the power button to turn it on. Does the touch screen work now?

Done the uninstall and reinstall with restarting multiple times, and deleted the driver from Windows and re-downloaded it from Microsofts download center each time. It just finished installing another batch of updates and is restarting now. I will see if that fixes it, if it does not, then I will try the UEFI method.

 

I have had to already go into the UEFI once because the Surface refused to turn on, Have had the device for about a week and a half now and have quite a few problems with it. 

 

Edit: Updates and UEFI did not work. Went to a last resort and did a system restore to earlier this week and still did not work. 

[GoodBytes]

Done the uninstall and reinstall with restarting multiple times, and deleted the driver from Windows and re-downloaded it from Microsofts download center each time. It just finished installing another batch of updates and is restarting now. I will see if that fixes it, if it does not, then I will try the UEFI method.

 

I have had to already go into the UEFI once because the Surface refused to turn on, Have had the device for about a week and a half now and have quite a few problems with it.

You might have had a faulty unit. Then again, this is a redesign to it could be bugs. I recall reading strange issues with the first Surface Pro. They got fixed with the first and second set of firmware. So, if everything works again, it should be fine. If not, then you have a faulty unit, maybe you have a bad capacitor or something that does wacky things to the system. It's rare, but manufacture error happens. Sucks when it does.

If you ordered it from MS store (in store or online), you have 30-days period to return it. You don't pay the return shipping. Microsoft will order and e-mail you a pre-paid shipping.

[menendez1293]

You might have had a faulty unit. Then again, this is a redesign to it could be bugs. I recall reading strange issues with the first Surface Pro. They got fixed with the first and second set of firmware. So, if everything works again, it should be fine. If not, then you have a faulty unit, maybe you have a bad capacitor or something that does wacky things to the system. It's rare, but manufacture error happens. Sucks when it does.

If you ordered it from MS store (in store or online), you have 30-days period to return it. You don't pay the return shipping. Microsoft will order and e-mail you a pre-paid shipping.

Bought it from BestBuy, and they are usually pretty good with faulty equipment. I just checked updates after the system restore and the firmware update was there again. I set it to install that update alone and see what happens. As of right now the screen does not work and nor does the windows button on the left hand side of the screen. 

 

Thanks for the help and the quick responses though. 

 

Edit the Firmware update did not work either, I guess I will just have to wipe the device and get a different one at BestBuy or I might just return it outright. And I forgot to mention, in the UEFI the touch screen did not work at all and nor did the type cover. I had to plug in a USB mouse to navigate through it and exit. I ran out of ideas for now, I will see if I can get anything tomorrow. Just want to warn everybody that this Software update might be a cause of something. I had zero problems with my screen till I installed this. 

 

 

So that everyone sees what I am saying, here is the error I see in Device manager 

 

 

[GoodBytes]

Yea touch screen should work in the UEFI. Definitely you fell with a faulty device.

All I can think off is bad circuit board components.