searching a sff pc fitting a tesla p4 and m4

[lenn_box]

Hi,

 

I'm looking for an SFF prebuilt that can deliver 75W through one PCIe x16 slot and 50W through another PCIe x16 slot, connected as x8 or x4.

 

Does anyone know of a model off the top of their head? Optiplex 990 and 790 in SFF won't work. (see: attachment)

 

Otherwise, I can't think of any other models with 2x PCIe x16 slots (it's okay if one is only connected via x4 or x8).

 

The unit, without a GPU, shouldn't cost more than ~75€ used.

 

My goal:

CPU:

4C 8T

min. turbo frequency: 3,8ghz

 

RAM:

16GB

 

GPU:

1x Nvidia Tesla M4 (50W via pcie)

1x Nvidia Tesla P4 (75W via pcie)

 

form factor:

as small as possible 

 

price: 

under 180€

 

What i was calculating with:

M4 ~ 60€

P4 ~ 80€

pre build ~ 40€

 

 

Thanks in advance,

Lenn

[jaslion]

Whats the usecase? Like these cards are OLD. A simple rtx 2060 OBLITERATES these.

 

Also these are NOT USABLE IN A DESKTOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

They have NO ACTIVE COOLING!!! They NEED A SERVER CHASSIS AIRFLOW. Just having normal desktop fans blowing through them IS NOT ENOUGH.

 

I would recommend you rethink this as NO sff pc will be able to provide the needed cooling. Your best bet is a used server which has it's own major downsides.

 

Is this like for machine learning? If so these gpu's kinda suck at it. They have gotten EXTREMELY outclassed by current day budget stuff.

[brob]

33 minutes ago, lenn_box said:

 

I'm looking for an SFF

 

I take it that you are looking for an mATX build?

[tkitch]

I agree with @jaslion you seem to be looking to solve an absurdly esoteric solution that's looking for problems.

 

What are you trying to do specifically, because I can't imagine a scenario where this is a good plan to build.

[Agall]

55 minutes ago, lenn_box said:

Hi,

 

I'm looking for an SFF prebuilt that can deliver 75W through one PCIe x16 slot and 50W through another PCIe x16 slot, connected as x8 or x4.

 

Does anyone know of a model off the top of their head? Optiplex 990 and 790 in SFF won't work. (see: attachment)

 

Otherwise, I can't think of any other models with 2x PCIe x16 slots (it's okay if one is only connected via x4 or x8).

 

The unit, without a GPU, shouldn't cost more than ~75€ used.

 

My goal:

CPU:

4C 8T

min. turbo frequency: 3,8ghz

 

RAM:

16GB

 

GPU:

1x Nvidia Tesla M4 (50W via pcie)

1x Nvidia Tesla P4 (75W via pcie)

 

form factor:

as small as possible 

 

price: 

under 180€

 

What i was calculating with:

M4 ~ 60€

P4 ~ 80€

pre build ~ 40€

 

 

Thanks in advance,

Lenn

 

Safe power draw through the 24 pin is an interesting discussion point, but in general, I'd say 150W is sufficient.

 

Back in the day, high end motherboards would have an AUX 6 pin connector for the PCIe bus for using 3 or 4 way SLI. dGPUs regardless of if they have AUX power or not draw from the PCIe bus, up to 75W (hopefully).

 

Now does a PCIe 4.0 or 5.0 capable motherboard have thicker traces to support higher power draw through the 24 pin? Potentially, peaked my curiosity enough to investigate.

 

As others have pointed out, the necessity of the request is quite strange. Whatever it is you're trying to do can probably be done better with a powerful APU and/or a newer dGPU, including having a ton of display outputs.

[venomtail]

SFF PC/Motherboard that can support more than 1 PCIE card? Kinda polarising requirement. Sort of like wanting a sports car than can sit 6 people. I've heard of people trying to use M.2 to PCIE riser frankensteins to get more PCIE lanes when board doesn't allow it. Then you gotta figure out how to align 2 1x slot cards into a 1 2x slots.

[lenn_box]

5 hours ago, jaslion said:

Whats the usecase? Like these cards are OLD. A simple rtx 2060 OBLITERATES these.

 

Also these are NOT USABLE IN A DESKTOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

They have NO ACTIVE COOLING!!! They NEED A SERVER CHASSIS AIRFLOW. Just having normal desktop fans blowing through them IS NOT ENOUGH.

 

I would recommend you rethink this as NO sff pc will be able to provide the needed cooling. Your best bet is a used server which has it's own major downsides.

 

Is this like for machine learning? If so these gpu's kinda suck at it. They have gotten EXTREMELY outclassed by current day budget stuff.

Would cool them with a active fan cooler with some 3d printed adapter. The GPUs are absolutely fine for what i'll do with them, although i know there probably would be better options.

[jaslion]

1 hour ago, lenn_box said:

Would cool them with a active fan cooler with some 3d printed adapter. The GPUs are absolutely fine for what i'll do with them, although i know there probably would be better options.

Where will you put that? There is NO room in these cases for ANY additional fans.

 

Also you need A SERVER LEVEL AIRFLOW a dinky little 40mm fan or so IS NOT ENOUGH. I think you are underestimating the airflow these need. These things GET HOT. Like extremely so. They REQUIRE a EXTREME amount of airflow. Basically think a 200mm desktop fan blowing through them pretty much. Literally not possible in a tiny sff box. Technically they require more cfm and pressure than ANY normal desktop fan can do.

 

The reason you can cool the bigger non lp versions somewhat is because they have a bigger heatsink. These lp version do not and rely EXTREMELY on the stupid amounts of airflow from a delta fan.

 

Also no you cannot run a delta fan normally in a desktop. They are 24v a desktop psu is 12. You can convert up to the voltage but the sff psu's are literally too low wattage as these fans pull like 20w+ a piece.

 

What are you doing? If these are good there are other better options that will actually work. These are old weak cards and why 2 of them that are so different? Like the p4 is over double the performance of the m4.

[tkitch]

16 hours ago, jaslion said:

Also no you cannot run a delta fan normally in a desktop. They are 24v a desktop psu is 12. You can convert up to the voltage but the sff psu's are literally too low wattage as these fans pull like 20w+ a piece.

plenty of deltas are 12V.

They're still gonna pull 2-3A each at full tilt, so they have to be run off SATA or Molex, and sure as hell not off the motherboard.  (So no PWM control, go-go gadget rheostat!)

[tkitch]

17 hours ago, lenn_box said:

Would cool them with a active fan cooler with some 3d printed adapter. The GPUs are absolutely fine for what i'll do with them, although i know there probably would be better options.

you still haven't said "what you're doing with them"

You're trying to find a really stupid solution to a really stupid self-made problem. 

[jaslion]

41 minutes ago, tkitch said:

plenty of deltas are 12V.

They're still gonna pull 2-3A each at full tilt, so they have to be run off SATA or Molex, and sure as hell not off the motherboard.  (So no PWM control, go-go gadget rheostat!)

Oh sick yeah thats great.

 

Still no clue where op would put those + a bracket for em in a sff without a lot of mutilation of the case and removing the storage and disk bay (and leaving them open for airflow).

 

 

[tkitch]

17 minutes ago, jaslion said:

Oh sick yeah thats great.

 

Still no clue where op would put those + a bracket for em in a sff without a lot of mutilation of the case and removing the storage and disk bay (and leaving them open for airflow).

 

 

Here's a "low powered" delta (lolol) 
https://www.amazon.com/Delta-Updated-AFB1212SHE-Cooling-Connector/dp/B07F7Z2YCM

 

[jaslion]

43 minutes ago, tkitch said:

Here's a "low powered" delta (lolol) 
https://www.amazon.com/Delta-Updated-AFB1212SHE-Cooling-Connector/dp/B07F7Z2YCM

 

"Delta confidental"

 

Hahahaha thanks amazon

[lenn_box]

2 hours ago, tkitch said:

you still haven't said "what you're doing with them"

You're trying to find a really stupid solution to a really stupid self-made problem. 

Oh yeah sorry, wanna render 3d stuff with the m4 and finetune LLM's on the p4. Both cards would fit my needs, both are pretty cheap. Doing AI stuff and 3d rendering on the same GPU is pure pain...

 

"You're trying to find a really stupid solution to a really stupid self-made problem." - And I love doing that!