Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[yidifo3313]

12 hours ago, LinusTech said:

There won't be a big WAN Show segment about this or anything. Most of what I have to say, I've already said, and I've done so privately.

To Steve, I expressed my disappointment that he didn't go through proper journalistic practices in creating this piece. He has my email and number (along with numerous other members of our team) and could have asked me for context that may have proven to be valuable (like the fact that we didn't 'sell' the monoblock, but rather auctioned it for charity due to a miscommunication... AND the fact that while we haven't sent payment yet, we have already agreed to compensate Billet Labs for the cost of their prototype). There are other issues, but I've told him that I won't be drawn into a public sniping match over this and that I'll be continuing to move forward in good faith as part of 'Team Media'. When/if he's ready to do so again I'll be ready.

To my team (and my CEO's team, but realistically I was at the helm for all of these errors, so I need to own it), I stressed the importance of diligence in our work because there are so many eyes on us. We are going through some growing pains - we've been very public about them in the interest of transparency - and it's clear we have some work to do on internal processes and communication. We have already been doing a lot of work internally to clean up our processes, but these things take time. Rome wasn't built in a day, but that's no excuse for sloppiness.

Now, for my community, all I can say is the same things I always say. We know that we're not perfect. We wear our imperfection on our sleeves in the interest of ensuring that we stay accountable to you. But it's sad and unfortunate when this transparency gets warped into a bad thing. The Labs team is hard at work hard creating processes and tools to generate data that will benefit all consumers - a work in progress that is very much not done and that we've communicated needs to be treated as such. Do we have notes under some videos? Yes. Is it because we are striving for transparency/improvement? Yeah... What we're doing hasn't been in many years, if ever.. and we would make a much larger correction if the circumstances merited it. Listing the wrong amount of cache on a table for a CPU review is sloppy, but given that our conclusions are drawn based on our testing, not the spec sheet, it doesn't materially change the recommendation. That doesn't mean these things don't matter. We've set KPIs for our writing/labs team around accuracy, and we are continually installing new checks and balances to ensure that things continue to get better. If you haven't seen the improvement, frankly I wonder if you're really looking for it... The thoroughness that we managed on our last handful of GPU videos is getting really incredible given the limited time we have for these embargoes. I'm REALLY excited about what the future will hold.

 

With all of that said, I still disagree that the Billet Labs video (not the situation with the return, which I've already addressed above) is an 'accuracy' issue. It's more like I just read the room wrong. We COULD have re-tested it with perfect accuracy, but to do so PROPERLY - accounting for which cases it could be installed in (none) and which radiators it would be plumbed with (again... mystery) would have been impossible... and also didn't affect the conclusion of the video... OR SO I THOUGHT...

 

I wanted to evaluate it as a product, and as a product, IF it could manage to compete with the temperatures of the highest end blocks on the planet, it still wouldn't make sense to buy... so from my point of view, re-testing it and finding out that yes, it did in fact run cooler made no difference to the conclusion, so it didn't really make a difference.

 

Adam and I were talking about this today. He advocated for re-testing it regardless of how non-viable it was as a product at the time and I think he expressed really well today why it mattered. It was like making a video about a supercar. It doesn't mater if no one watching will buy it. They just wanna see it rip.  I missed that, but it wasn't because I didn't care about the consumer.. it was because I was so focused on how this product impacted a potential buyer. Either way, clearly my bad, but my intention was never to harm Billet Labs. I specifically called out their incredible machining skills because I wanted to see them create something with a viable market for it and was hoping others would appreciate the fineness of the craftsmanship even if the product was impractical. I still hope they move forward building something else because they obviously have talent and I've watched countless niche water cooling vendors come and go. It's an astonishingly unforgiving market.

 

Either way, I'm sorry I got the community's priorities mixed-up on this one, and that we didn't show the Billet in the best light. Our intention wasn't to hurt anyone. We wanted no one to buy it (because it's an egregious waste of money no matter what temps it runs at) and we wanted Billet to make something marketable (so they can, y'know, eat).

 

With all of this in mind, it saddens me how quickly the pitchforks were raised over this. It also comes across a touch hypocritical when some basic due diligence could have helped clarify much of it. I have a LONG history of meeting issues head on and I've never been afraid to answer questions, which lands me in hot water regularly, but helps keep me in tune with my peers and with the community. The only reason I can think of not to ask me is because my honest response might be inconvenient. 

 

We can test that... with this post. Will the "It was a mistake (a bad one, but a mistake) and they're taking care of it" reality manage to have the same reach? Let's see if anyone actually wants to know what happened. I hope so, but it's been disheartening seeing how many people were willing to jump on us here. Believe it or not, I'm a real person and so is the rest of my team. We are trying our best, and if what we were doing was easy, everyone would do it. Today sucks.

 

Thanks for reading this.

you are a liar and a cheat, you willingly are trying to cover the mistakes of your team, which you are responsible for up to today because you hired them and you trained them, the fact that you stepped down as CEO does not make you automagically stop taking responsibilities for the actions of your own staff. your post is full of excuses and attempts to clear the image of your staff and yourself by sweeping under the rug the elephant in the room: that you stole the only prototype from a start up and used it to fuel your narcissistic supply by auctioning it via LTX to charity, thinking that one hand cleans the other and that you will get away with free karma, well Linus you will see that karma will bite you harder than ever, if you think for one minute that you can hide behind a wall of apologies, denials and unwillingness to accept that you cheated and willingly stole product from a company!

[Karon]

12 hours ago, LinusTech said:

If you haven't seen the improvement, frankly I wonder if you're really looking for it...

Can't double down without gas lighting your audience.

 

Maybe the improvements aren't as visible as you think they are?

[Dom1252]

3 minutes ago, FUTDomi said:

Show me when has Linus reviewed a laptop since the "conflict of interests" for example.

you're claiming LMG didn't post a single laptop video since then? 

I mean, Linus pretends they have new CEO, but even here the statements are from Linus, not CEO, so Linus clearly (I mean, he and his wife are owners of the company) run the company 

every laptop review (or unboxing or whatever) made by LMG is to be treated as if Linus did it personally 

[bandainamcofan]

Just now, FUTDomi said:

Show me when has Linus reviewed a laptop since the "conflict of interests" for example.

I never said he did? I have no concerns with Linus having an investment as long as it's disclosed properly. I have immense concerns with refusing to review a product in a way that would be accurate, then saying it isn't a problem that he didn't. I find that directly opposed to the entire idea of having a testing lab. That's been my stance this whole time.

[TheProfosist]

4 minutes ago, ConcernedCitizen said:

Is the charity donation tax deductible?

I think that all depends on local tax law, or tax law of the person donating.

[filpo]

Just now, Dom1252 said:

ou're claiming LMG didn't post a single laptop video since then? 

ah so he means since he dropped CEO

Here's two 

5 minutes ago, FUTDomi said:

Show me when has Linus reviewed a laptop since the "conflict of interests" for example.

what do you even mean?

he hasn't done it personally but LMG has

[Bograt]

12 hours ago, LinusTech said:

There won't be a big WAN Show segment about this or anything. Most of what I have to say, I've already said, and I've done so privately.

To Steve, I expressed my disappointment that he didn't go through proper journalistic practices in creating this piece. He has my email and number (along with numerous other members of our team) and could have asked me for context that may have proven to be valuable (like the fact that we didn't 'sell' the monoblock, but rather auctioned it for charity due to a miscommunication... AND the fact that while we haven't sent payment yet, we have already agreed to compensate Billet Labs for the cost of their prototype). There are other issues, but I've told him that I won't be drawn into a public sniping match over this and that I'll be continuing to move forward in good faith as part of 'Team Media'. When/if he's ready to do so again I'll be ready.

To my team (and my CEO's team, but realistically I was at the helm for all of these errors, so I need to own it), I stressed the importance of diligence in our work because there are so many eyes on us. We are going through some growing pains - we've been very public about them in the interest of transparency - and it's clear we have some work to do on internal processes and communication. We have already been doing a lot of work internally to clean up our processes, but these things take time. Rome wasn't built in a day, but that's no excuse for sloppiness.

Now, for my community, all I can say is the same things I always say. We know that we're not perfect. We wear our imperfection on our sleeves in the interest of ensuring that we stay accountable to you. But it's sad and unfortunate when this transparency gets warped into a bad thing. The Labs team is hard at work hard creating processes and tools to generate data that will benefit all consumers - a work in progress that is very much not done and that we've communicated needs to be treated as such. Do we have notes under some videos? Yes. Is it because we are striving for transparency/improvement? Yeah... What we're doing hasn't been in many years, if ever.. and we would make a much larger correction if the circumstances merited it. Listing the wrong amount of cache on a table for a CPU review is sloppy, but given that our conclusions are drawn based on our testing, not the spec sheet, it doesn't materially change the recommendation. That doesn't mean these things don't matter. We've set KPIs for our writing/labs team around accuracy, and we are continually installing new checks and balances to ensure that things continue to get better. If you haven't seen the improvement, frankly I wonder if you're really looking for it... The thoroughness that we managed on our last handful of GPU videos is getting really incredible given the limited time we have for these embargoes. I'm REALLY excited about what the future will hold.

 

With all of that said, I still disagree that the Billet Labs video (not the situation with the return, which I've already addressed above) is an 'accuracy' issue. It's more like I just read the room wrong. We COULD have re-tested it with perfect accuracy, but to do so PROPERLY - accounting for which cases it could be installed in (none) and which radiators it would be plumbed with (again... mystery) would have been impossible... and also didn't affect the conclusion of the video... OR SO I THOUGHT...

 

I wanted to evaluate it as a product, and as a product, IF it could manage to compete with the temperatures of the highest end blocks on the planet, it still wouldn't make sense to buy... so from my point of view, re-testing it and finding out that yes, it did in fact run cooler made no difference to the conclusion, so it didn't really make a difference.

 

Adam and I were talking about this today. He advocated for re-testing it regardless of how non-viable it was as a product at the time and I think he expressed really well today why it mattered. It was like making a video about a supercar. It doesn't mater if no one watching will buy it. They just wanna see it rip.  I missed that, but it wasn't because I didn't care about the consumer.. it was because I was so focused on how this product impacted a potential buyer. Either way, clearly my bad, but my intention was never to harm Billet Labs. I specifically called out their incredible machining skills because I wanted to see them create something with a viable market for it and was hoping others would appreciate the fineness of the craftsmanship even if the product was impractical. I still hope they move forward building something else because they obviously have talent and I've watched countless niche water cooling vendors come and go. It's an astonishingly unforgiving market.

 

Either way, I'm sorry I got the community's priorities mixed-up on this one, and that we didn't show the Billet in the best light. Our intention wasn't to hurt anyone. We wanted no one to buy it (because it's an egregious waste of money no matter what temps it runs at) and we wanted Billet to make something marketable (so they can, y'know, eat).

 

With all of this in mind, it saddens me how quickly the pitchforks were raised over this. It also comes across a touch hypocritical when some basic due diligence could have helped clarify much of it. I have a LONG history of meeting issues head on and I've never been afraid to answer questions, which lands me in hot water regularly, but helps keep me in tune with my peers and with the community. The only reason I can think of not to ask me is because my honest response might be inconvenient. 

 

We can test that... with this post. Will the "It was a mistake (a bad one, but a mistake) and they're taking care of it" reality manage to have the same reach? Let's see if anyone actually wants to know what happened. I hope so, but it's been disheartening seeing how many people were willing to jump on us here. Believe it or not, I'm a real person and so is the rest of my team. We are trying our best, and if what we were doing was easy, everyone would do it. Today sucks.

 

Thanks for reading this.

This is some strange denial, projection and playing the victim and I genuinely don't understand how you could think that insulting us all, including the people who your content hurts, somehow reconciles the actions of YOU, your employees and your company.
This is absolutely shameful.

[dustypaws]

1 minute ago, Karon said:

Can't double down without gas lighting your audience.

 

Maybe the improvements aren't as visible as you think they are?

He's just behaving like `Anker`...

[MotherboardsInThePark]

4 minutes ago, DaemonWasTaken said:

Fact verification by Steve: "Luke seems to disagree based on his facial expressions, therefore even Luke disagrees"

 

 

bro both sides are shitty just hop of that cock 

We do know that Luke disagrees. Luke is a decent person, unlike the clown.

[yidifo3313]

1 minute ago, Karon said:

Can't double down without gas lighting your audience.

 

Maybe the improvements aren't as visible as you think they are?

He is a textbook narcissist, he very cleverly disguised it for years since 15 years but now his true face is revealed to the world

[Ottoman420]

5 minutes ago, yidifo3313 said:

you are a liar and a cheat, you willingly are trying to cover the mistakes of your team, which you are responsible for up to today because you hired them and you trained them, the fact that you stepped down as CEO does not make you automagically stop taking responsibilities for the actions of your own staff. your post is full of excuses and attempts to clear the image of your staff and yourself by sweeping under the rug the elephant in the room: that you stole the only prototype from a start up and used it to fuel your narcissistic supply by auctioning it to LTX to charity, thinking that one hand cleans the other and that you will get away with free karma, well Linus you will see that karma will bite you harder than ever, if you think for one minute that you can hide behind a wall of apologies, denials and unwillingness to accept that you cheated and willingly stole product from a company!

No need for this,

 

Nobody thinks Linus is doing this because he is a bad person, Its more about checks and balances and Linus has shown plenty of times he is willing to be transparent about stuff like this and try be better.

 

But its also continued situations like these that can make Linus decide to give up on being transparent its a tough line to walk from his perspective to be honest.

[bandainamcofan]

8 minutes ago, DaemonWasTaken said:

Fact verification by Steve: "Luke seems to disagree based on his facial expressions, therefore even Luke disagrees"

"Seems to" is a key phrase. Weasel-wordy? Debatably so. Does it make his other points wrong?

 

It is in my objective interest as a consumer that both GN and LTT produce quality content with correct information and data. 

[qQDY]

Bold of Linus to even say "proper journalistic practices". For what?? For a 500USD savings on video costs? Its clear LMG employees are scared of trying to make things right when Linus is involved. Even a 5 second Linus re-shoot for mistakes caught pre-publishing, I imagine, would be unthinkable?

 

For sure you got rich, Linus, but not tackling THIS issue "head on" (like your LONG history) to me seems dishonest. Also that waterblock fiasco is sickening - spreading misinformation about it and then stealing it and then selling it to a potential competitor - like how disgusting can LMG be?

[FUTDomi]

2 minutes ago, Dom1252 said:

you're claiming LMG didn't post a single laptop video since then? 

I mean, Linus pretends they have new CEO, but even here the statements are from Linus, not CEO, so Linus clearly (I mean, he and his wife are owners of the company) run the company 

every laptop review (or unboxing or whatever) made by LMG is to be treated as if Linus did it personally 

 

Yes, I am claiming that. He did what he had to do: disclose with detail his (personal) deal, and step away and let others review laptops.

 

Saying there is a conflict of interests here is simply laughable.

[filpo]

1 minute ago, MotherboardsInThePark said:

unlike the clown

At least it's better than no beard squeaky linus (all jokes linus, no hate)

[MotherboardsInThePark]

1 minute ago, Ottoman420 said:

No need for this,

 

Nobody thinks Linus is doing this because he is a bad person, Its more about checks and balances and Linus has shown plenty of times he is willing to be transparent about stuff like this and try be better.

 

But its also continued situations like these that can make Linus decide to give up on being transparent its a tough line to walk to be honest.

No need for this? Really? What if it was your startup, how would you feel then?

 

I can assure you that many people think Linus is a bad person. Most people just don't see it.

[Texbobcat]

1 minute ago, Ottoman420 said:

No need for this,

 

Nobody thinks Linus is doing this because he is a bad person, Its more about checks and balances and Linus has shown plenty of times he is willing to be transparent about stuff like this and try be better.

 

But its also continued situations like these that can make Linus decide to give up on being transparent its a tough line to walk to be honest.

You don't triple down on a bad take and be condescending, then gas light your community if you are a good person.

[MotherboardsInThePark]

1 minute ago, filpo said:

At least it's better than no beard squeaky linus (all jokes linus, no hate)

Those were the days...before the monster revealed his true self

[Reclus]

3 hours ago, DeerDK said:

I haven't defended LMG. But people keep going "GN didn't have to reach out to LMG for a comment".

Yes they did. IF they have that journalistic integrity they talk so much about. This is not an attempt to create whataboutism, its a point that just because people sympathise with GN on this we should not let these principles slip.

 

Right now you are going "Well LMG did this bad thing". So what?! Does that absolve GN from THEIR professional responsibilities?

Sure, if you wanna view this vid as revenge in an ongoing beef between GN and LMG, sure, then its like reading the Opinion pieces between two media outlets in some onegoing culture war. But then don't claim it to be valid criticizm, and don't claim it to be journalism. I want to view it as legitimate, so I insist in they should uphold the ethics of journalism.

No they don't. Not only that they don't, it would jeopardise their integrity by allowing LTT to just brush it under the carpet. And judging by LTT's reaction to this vid they were absolutely right not to do it. The video, the WAN show after and the  LTX auction literally show how lost LTT is on this issue.  LTT is a corpo entity now worth 100 mil which they constantly repeat in their videos, which is a good thing as a sign of being proud of their achievements. But when faced with a problem of their own making on which they have doubled up on later in full view of the public in a really poor arrogant way, they act like they are a small youtuber, so you shouldn't really look into it because it might hurt them and their bottom line - which you know they need because of all the equipment they bought. You can't buy integrity. And any attempts at it are quickly recognised by the people that watch you. 

You are deflecting. Nothing else but deflecting. And this type of behaviour will really hurt LTT if it won't be addressed correctly. A decade of fun passionate videos will go down the drain because they aren't treating this issue with the respect it deserves and literally started to throw money at the problem and using the terms like "trust me bro?!?!" Where Trust is the main component of that sentence!

I am here like many others - signed up just to see how LTT will fix this problem. Instead I was met with - no discussion will be held, money will be thrown, journalists are bad and I don't care. And the absolute fanboying on the forum is really just making it worse. You are defending what Linus would absolutely describe as irresponsible corporate behaviour just a few years ago.

[yidifo3313]

3 minutes ago, Ottoman420 said:

No need for this,

 

Nobody thinks Linus is doing this because he is a bad person, Its more about checks and balances and Linus has shown plenty of times he is willing to be transparent about stuff like this and try be better.

 

But its also continued situations like these that can make Linus decide to give up on being transparent its a tough line to walk from his perspective to be honest.

He clearly knew the behind the scenes and birocracy involved with that specific waterblock, because he is an OCD control freak, if he was a good person he would had stepped in and stop the auction, instead he blindly let the staff move forward with it!

[Ottoman420]

1 minute ago, Texbobcat said:

You don't triple down on a bad take and be condescending, then gas light your community if you are a good person.

Yeah i agree the waterblockgate is bad and worst of these allegations but again to say he is a BAD PERSON or these were intentional or pre-meditated is going too far imo.

 

More neglegent

[Polderviking]

I feel a lot of that is adressed by GN can be solved by slowing down a bit.

Surely there's wiggle room for more time in QA even if the amount of video's are dialed back only slightly?

 

Everybody on earth is subscribed to MrBeast it seems like, they only do one a week or so, so surely it's not a death sentance.

[filpo]

2 minutes ago, yidifo3313 said:

He clearly knew the behind the scenes and birocracy involved

 

2 minutes ago, yidifo3313 said:

if he was a good person he would had stepped in and stop the auction, instead he blindly let the staff move forward with it!

well, technically we don't know that. He  might've made a statement about the waterblock to protect his employees and frankly I like to think that he didn't intervene because he didn't know. Unfortunately, that's not what the world is like so we can only speculate

 

1 minute ago, Ottoman420 said:

but again to say he is a BAD PERSON or these were intentional or pre-meditated is going too far imo.

exactly 

 

3 minutes ago, yidifo3313 said:

He clearly knew the behind the scenes and birocracy involved with that specific waterblock, because he is an OCD control freak, if he was a good person he would had stepped in and stop the auction, instead he blindly let the staff move forward with it!

stuff like this is going a bit far but to some extent is true (though we don't exactly know)

 

1 minute ago, Polderviking said:

I feel a lot of that is adressed by GN can be solves by slowing down a bit.

I would be sad if they stopped 1 video a day but clearly they have to so if it goes down to 2 or 3 LTT vids a week but they're higher quality then that would be preferred over quantity

[lawney]

The lack of accountability and ethical rigor regarding the Billet Labs situation is a black spot on LMG, and not something that can be paid away.

 

The reason I say that is because what bothers me more is Linus's clear ire for the product. During the review, he seems angry and vindictive about the prototype block, which is frankly bordering on being a work of art. And in Linus's response in this thread, he makes it seem like slandering Billet Labs and their prototype block is doing them a favor because he wants them to make practical products and "eat."

 

Linus, this was an experimental halo product, something to show off Billet's machining mastery. And yes, it is indeed like a supercar, and who wouldn't want to see it rip? Linus. The fact that Linus didn't shows how jaded he is. So jaded that he is apparently frustrated and angered by a unique product on-screen, and he still is today.

 

Is he jealous in some way? All of this makes it seem like Linus auctioned off the prototype block on purpose. An act of cruelty

 

This needs to be addressed, and it needs to be made right. I'll unsubscribe after 10 years of following Linus if it doesn't.

[MotherboardsInThePark]

Just now, Ottoman420 said:

Yeah i agree the waterblockgate is bad and worst of these allegations but again to say he is a BAD PERSON or these were intentional or pre-meditated is going too far imo.

 

More neglegent

The fact is: We don't know how the waterblock situation was handled and by who. We only know how it was resolved, and that resolution plus the very poor response to the GN video speak volumes about Linus' character.