Expensive headphones switch quality when using microphone, why?

[neyoneit]

Hi,

 

I'm having trouble with expensive or semi-expensive headphones. I bought the Sennheiser EPOS ADAPT 660 AMC, but when I started using the microphone, the audio quality switched to poop. I contacted support, but they couldn't tell me what the issue was or if it was even an issue, so I returned them. I then bought the Sony WH-1000XM5 and they have the same problem. Why is this happening? I've searched online and found others with the same issue, but their solution is to return the headphones or not use the built-in mic. I haven't found any information on why this is happening or how to find headphones that don't have this issue. Reviewers aren't mentioning it and I'm curious why. As a gamer, I often use headphones for both gaming/music while having a "call" and this issue makes it impossible, because of the quality switch when using mic.

I also have the Logitech G733 and they don't have this issue, the sound quality remains the same whether I use the microphone or not.

I kinda have two questions: why is this "normal" and how can I find out if a particular set of headphones will have this issue before I buy them?

 

Thanks a lot.

[johnno23]

its software in most cases. I simply added a seperate microphone thats inserted into the headphone jack and then has a splitter to my PC with the sound and mic inputs.

quite often when you switch over to voice the sound parameters are changed to help with background noise etc. I dont like the results either hence my choice to keep my headphones and add the mic on a boom that just inserts into the headphone mini jack

[Kilrah]

39 minutes ago, neyoneit said:

I kinda have two questions: why is this "normal" and how can I find out if a particular set of headphones will have this issue before I buy them?

It's a limitation of Bluetooth, once you use the mic it falls back from "stereo" profile to "call" profile with telephone quality audio, so if you want to avoid the issue don't get something Bluetooth but something with dedicated wireless like your Logitech.

[Kilrah]

Nope, talking of BT audio profiles, unrelated.

[neyoneit]

10 hours ago, Kilrah said:

It's a limitation of Bluetooth, once you use the mic it falls back from "stereo" profile to "call" profile with telephone quality audio, so if you want to avoid the issue don't get something Bluetooth but something with dedicated wireless like your Logitech.

To be honest i never knew logitech G733 was using something different than bluetooth, because everywhere in my country where i checked, was and still is categorized as bluetooth. But on logitech site it clearly states 2,4ghz.

Any idea if new bluetooth will allow using mic with full audio quality of headphones?

[neyoneit]

5 minutes ago, billbill said:

If the sound is being processed by the sound card then it is related.  

Whenever my the epos or sony i have now detect i am using microphone, the sound quality switches to poop. On windows i have to choose different device one with microphone in order to actually hear anybody... on android it does this switch automatically, but yea its more likely what Kilrah is talking about, because logitech doesnt suffer from this at all and they are not using bluetooth.

[Kilrah]

8 hours ago, billbill said:

If the sound is being processed by the sound card then it is related.  

But we're not talking of volume, we're talking of quality.

 

8 hours ago, neyoneit said:

Any idea if new bluetooth will allow using mic with full audio quality of headphones?

Maybe one day there will, but I'm not aware of any solution that exists today.

 

I believe there are some gaming headsets (HyperX?) that have both dedicated RF and BT so that you can use them with your PC with full quality like the logitech but also use BT for your phone or such with the limitations. 

[neyoneit]

2 hours ago, billbill said:

You would have to have a sound profile for both the headphones and the microphone. Yet a Windows update can cause audio issues even if it is not a driver update through Windows update. For whatever reason sometimes Windows updates just breaks things. Also the sound card at times will no play nicely with the GPU's HDMI output even if you are not running audio through your video card. 

Ok i am 100% sure its not what you are talking about. Its the bluetooth limitation.

[CrunchyCookie]

The Bluetooth headphones will use the HFP/HSP bluetooth profile, instead of the A2DP profile that is used for music, on windows when the mic is in use. Because the headset establishes a second data stream for the mic the bandwidth limitations of bluetooth really start to show.  I think some newer technologies have improved this on bluetooth but I have not delved deep enough into the BT stack to answer that. Logitech avoids this by not using bluetooth.

As I was double checking the profiles I found this article from sony. Unfortunately the profile for audio + mic on bluetooth causes the issue you are having. https://www.sony.com/electronics/support/wireless-headphones-bluetooth-headphones/linkbuds-s/articles/00250089

[neyoneit]

On 2/5/2023 at 10:09 PM, billbill said:

You cannot really rule out anything. The only way is to troubleshoot things one by one. Windows Security could even cause audio issues since it scans everything loaded into system memory. 

Yes i can, Since i confirmed it, Its the bluetooth issue, nothing with Windows.