SSD vs NVMe Help

[Sparky862]

I know that NVMe is the faster and prob better option, but I need help here. 

I currently have a 10 year old SATA SSD 128GB running Windows 10. The 128GB SSD is no nearly full cause of all the updates and applications, so I need to upgrade from my 10 year old 128GB SSD. These are my option

https://www.evetech.co.za/hikvision-e100-1tb-ssd/best-deal/6636.aspx

Now, the NVMe issue.......

Can I just pop this into my Motherboard and it will work without me having to worry? Like is a NVMe plug and play like a SATA is? Or does Windows need to be installed in a specific way to run the NVMe? What if I want to move Windows from SSD to the NVMe?

https://www.evetech.co.za/hikvision-e3000-1tb-nvme-ssd/best-deal/13336.aspx

My PC specs are as follows

B660M K4 Asus Mobo
I5 12400F
RTX 3060 TI

[podkall]

If your motherboard has an NVMe connector, you can safely plug it in and that's it.

 

You might have to remove the GPU so you can put the NVMe in but that's about it, no program needed it's just another storage.

 

 

[Crunchy Dragon]

7 minutes ago, Sparky862 said:

Can I just pop this into my Motherboard and it will work without me having to worry? Like is a NVMe plug and play like a SATA is? Or does Windows need to be installed in a specific way to run the NVMe? What if I want to move Windows from SSD to the NVMe?

1. You should be fine, NVMe is mostly plug and play. I would check your motherboard's manual and take note of which SATA ports, if any, are disabled when the NVMe slot is populated.

2. You should be able to install Windows just the same as any other SSD or hard drive.

3. I don't recommend this. It's far less hassle just to back up your important data and do a clean install of Windows.

[Dedayog]

Nothing wrong with leaving Windows on the SATA drive and using the NVMe for games, media, etc.

 

Btw, it's not SSD vs NVMe, it's SATA vs NVMe.  They're both SSDs

 

Also, NVMe is faster on paper but not usually noticeable.  Don't feel you NEED NVMe for any reason, just go with bang for buck unless you have a need, but you'd know if you did.

[adm0n]

Just a small note, some time in the future (probably 2023, but who knows), DirectStorage should be coming to PC. As far as I know, it will only work with NVMe drives. I don't really think it makes sense buying anything based on this. You will probably be fine with a SATA SSD for years to come. But if trying out new features means anything, you could at least take it into consideration.

[podkall]

11 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

1. You should be fine, NVMe is mostly plug and play. I would check your motherboard's manual and take note of which SATA ports, if any, are disabled when the NVMe slot is populated.

Motherboards do that?

[Crunchy Dragon]

2 minutes ago, podkall said:

Motherboards do that?

Maybe I'm confusing M.2 NVMe with M.2 SATA

[Dedayog]

2 minutes ago, podkall said:

Motherboards do that?

Yep, they do.  My Gigabyte z370 manual outlines what happens...

 

[mariushm]

Install the M.2 nvme SSD into your computer 

 

Install Macrium Reflect (free version on their website)  and choose to clone your 120 GB SSD to the M.2 nvme drive. 

When done or when cloning, optionally choose to stretch the newly created 120 GB partition on the nvme SSD to use up the full space possible (Macrium software will have that option during the cloning process) 

 

Reboot the computer, press DEL or F2 to enter BIOS.  Select your nvme as boot drive. 

Done. 

 

Your old SATA SSD can now be formatted, pulled out, doesn't matter anymore, because you will boot from the nvme drive. 

[podkall]

4 minutes ago, Dedayog said:

Yep, they do.  My Gigabyte z370 manual outlines what happens...

 

I find the charts quite confusing,

 

also I believe this should be resolved and only appear in very cheap motherboards right?

[mariushm]

It's simple. 

You have three M.2 connectors : M2M, M2A , M2P

 

M2M :  No SSD installed -> all sata ports are good.   If you install a m.2 SSD, ports 4 and 5 get disabled. Doesn't matter if it's SATA M.2 (AHCI) or PCI-e M.2 (NVME).

 

M2A :  No SSD installed -> all sata ports are good.   If you install a m.2 SSD, sata port 0 gets disabled if you use a SATA M.2 (AHCI)  - think of it like wires going to port 0 are redirected to M.2 connector. 

 

M2P : This one only supports pci-e M.2 SSD (NVME) drives. There's no SATA wires going to the connector, and no sata ports get disabled if you install a SSD here. 

 

 

So if you have a nvme SSD, the best choice is to use M2P as it doesn't affect any SATA ports, and it can only do nvme SSDs

The next best choice is M2A, because nvme SSD doesn't cause any sata port to be disabled.  

Last and worst choice is M2M, if you install nvme SSD there, sata ports 4 and 5 get disabled.

 

So you can have 3 nvme SSDs installed, but you lose 2 sata ports (4 and 5) 

You can have 2 nvme SSDs installed and one SATA (ahci) SSD,  but you lose 2 SATA ports, ports 4 and 5 (nvme in M2P and M2A, sata ssd in M2M)

You can have 1 nvme SSD and two SATA M.2, but you lose 3 sata ports (because port0 gets redirected to M2A to give it sata functionality)

 

[Sparky862]

 

11 minutes ago, mariushm said:

It's simple. 

You have three M.2 connectors : M2M, M2A , M2P

 

M2M :  No SSD installed -> all sata ports are good.   If you install a m.2 SSD, ports 4 and 5 get disabled. Doesn't matter if it's SATA M.2 (AHCI) or PCI-e M.2 (NVME).

 

M2A :  No SSD installed -> all sata ports are good.   If you install a m.2 SSD, sata port 0 gets disabled if you use a SATA M.2 (AHCI)  - think of it like wires going to port 0 are redirected to M.2 connector. 

 

M2P : This one only supports pci-e M.2 SSD (NVME) drives. There's no SATA wires going to the connector, and no sata ports get disabled if you install a SSD here. 

 

 

So if you have a nvme SSD, the best choice is to use M2P as it doesn't affect any SATA ports, and it can only do nvme SSDs

The next best choice is M2A, because nvme SSD doesn't cause any sata port to be disabled.  

Last and worst choice is M2M, if you install nvme SSD there, sata ports 4 and 5 get disabled.

 

So you can have 3 nvme SSDs installed, but you lose 2 sata ports (4 and 5) 

You can have 2 nvme SSDs installed and one SATA (ahci) SSD,  but you lose 2 SATA ports, ports 4 and 5 (nvme in M2P and M2A, sata ssd in M2M)

You can have 1 nvme SSD and two SATA M.2, but you lose 3 sata ports (because port0 gets redirected to M2A to give it sata functionality)

 

Prime B660M-K D4 offers a total of two M.2 slots that support data-transfer speeds of up to 64 Gbps via PCIe® 4.0, enabling quicker boot-up and app load times with OS or application drives.

 

 

 

This is what it states on Asus Website. I am not sure what M.2 type it is of the 3 actually?

 

I would actually like to instally NVMe and copy my SSD over to my NVMe as the new drive for my OS, while still using the SSD even if it is only 128GB in size because I can install ally other apps and editing on the 128GB.

 

But not sure if it would disable my SATA like you said it would. If it does disable my SATA, I also have 3 HDDs and don't want them disabled because of a NVMe

 

[Dedayog]

19 minutes ago, podkall said:

I find the charts quite confusing,

 

also I believe this should be resolved and only appear in very cheap motherboards right?

No. You only have so many PCIe lanes from a chipset design.  You can't have unlimited drives or slots.

 

Some newer boards simply drop SATA ports and be done. 4 is common now, not 6.  

[Sparky862]

Also I noticed that the NVMe I linked is PCIe Gen 3 .... My board has x2 PCIe Gen 4 M.2 Slots .....

 

Will this matter??

[podkall]

12 minutes ago, Sparky862 said:

Also I noticed that the NVMe I linked is PCIe Gen 3 .... My board has x2 PCIe Gen 4 M.2 Slots .....

 

Will this matter??

no gen doesn't matter

[Sparky862]

https://www.asus.com/motherboards-components/motherboards/prime/prime-b660m-k-d4/

 

It states my Board has x2 NVMe PCI e Gen 4 Slots, but not what M.2 slots it supports.

 

I am now cautious because I have x4 Sata Ports on my Board which is working.

 

If I install the NVMe type which disablesy Port 4, one of my HDDs won't work.

 

Unless I take out the 128GB seeing as I will have the NVMe and not use Port 4 SATA.

[Dedayog]

3 minutes ago, Sparky862 said:

https://www.asus.com/motherboards-components/motherboards/prime/prime-b660m-k-d4/

 

It states my Board has x2 NVMe PCI e Gen 4 Slots, but not what M.2 slots it supports.

 

I am now cautious because I have x4 Sata Ports on my Board which is working.

 

If I install the NVMe type which disablesy Port 4, one of my HDDs won't work.

 

Unless I take out the 128GB seeing as I will have the NVMe and not use Port 4 SATA.

At some point, you need to move to more capacity drives, as 128GB is very small.  A lot of AAA games won't even fit on that alone.

 

 

[Sparky862]

2 minutes ago, Dedayog said:

At some point, you need to move to more capacity drives, as 128GB is very small.  A lot of AAA games won't even fit on that alone.

 

 

Which is why I want a 1TB Storage to move my Windows to from the 128GB.

 

Would've loved keeping my 128GB for my Apps and other edditing things I use, but I guess it won't be the case as I delved deeper in the Manual and saw it's M.2M it supports on the board, meaning according to this thread port 4 and 5 SATA will be disabled. 

 

But can't find in the Manual where it states what will be disabled. But I trust it's like the Forums states Poet 4 and 5 will be disabled if I install the NVMe

[Dedayog]

4 minutes ago, Sparky862 said:

Which is why I want a 1TB Storage to move my Windows to from the 128GB.

 

Would've loved keeping my 128GB for my Apps and other edditing things I use, but I guess it won't be the case as I delved deeper in the Manual and saw it's M.2M it supports on the board, meaning according to this thread port 4 and 5 SATA will be disabled. 

 

But can't find in the Manual where it states what will be disabled. But I trust it's like the Forums states Poet 4 and 5 will be disabled if I install the NVMe

 

14 minutes ago, Sparky862 said:

https://www.asus.com/motherboards-components/motherboards/prime/prime-b660m-k-d4/

 

It states my Board has x2 NVMe PCI e Gen 4 Slots, but not what M.2 slots it supports.

 

I am now cautious because I have x4 Sata Ports on my Board which is working.

 

If I install the NVMe type which disablesy Port 4, one of my HDDs won't work.

 

Unless I take out the 128GB seeing as I will have the NVMe and not use Port 4 SATA.

For clarity...

 

NVMe are infact automatically M.2 slots.  There are no SATA NVMe drives I know of.  So that's fine.

 

Also, your manual says you have 4x SATA ports, but I can't see where any are disabled.  MINE get disabled (I have 6 and 2 shut down), I don't think yours do (you have 4, so no need to shut down any?).  

 

Can someone else clarify?

 

Edit: Port 4 and 5 are named starting from Zero, so they are actually 5 and 6.  You don't have a 5 and 6, it was just an example of my board, not every board.

[Sparky862]

Sorry to keep on bumping this thread but I come from the HDD era ..... Not NVMe.

 

I also did some research and they say you should also look IF your BIOS support NVMe otherwise you can only use a NVMe as a Storage and not a Boot Up AND Storage....meaning you can't install your OS on a NVMe cause it won't boot.

 

I see nothing of that in my manual or things being disabled. But the disabled SATA ports won't concern me as much. I can just chug out my SSD and still have it all working fine IF something get's disabled.

 

But now the whole boot up thing concerns me and also what about dimensions? 

 

If the NVMe Form Factor fits with my board Form Factor I am good to go? Meaning if the Form Factors match that my Board Supports, the NVMe will fit?

[Dedayog]

3 minutes ago, Sparky862 said:

Sorry to keep on bumping this thread but I come from the HDD era ..... Not NVMe.

 

I also did some research and they say you should also look IF your BIOS support NVMe otherwise you can only use a NVMe as a Storage and not a Boot Up AND Storage....meaning you can't install your OS on a NVMe cause it won't boot.

 

I see nothing of that in my manual or things being disabled. But the disabled SATA ports won't concern me as much. I can just chug out my SSD and still have it all working fine IF something get's disabled.

 

But now the whole boot up thing concerns me and also what about dimensions? 

 

If the NVMe Form Factor fits with my board Form Factor I am good to go? Meaning if the Form Factors match that my Board Supports, the NVMe will fit?

Yes, NVMe come in different sizes as marked by their name.  2280 NVMe are 22mm wide by 80 mm long, which is the standard for almost all we use today.   ANy mainstream NVMe will work on your board, and you can boot from it.  This was an issue years ago, but you have a modern board and it will boot.  

 

Both the SATA SSD and NVMe you linked will work on your motherboard without issue.

[mariushm]

Only on some of the old motherboards when M.2 connectors were super new, it was not possible to boot from M.2 connectors, because the code to make this possible was not present in the BIOS.

In modern motherboards, almost all motherboards out there can boot from M.2 drives.

 

As for your particular motherboard, Asus B660M-K D4 Prime ... you just have to take it one step further and read the manual, where it will say what each m.2 connector supports.

 

A sort of long explanation of M.2

 

M.2 is a sort of universal connector - it can have pins for lots of things : pci-e lanes, sata , usb, i2c, sim cards but not all pins are connected at the same time.

 

The manufacturer of the motherboard can choose which contacts/pins are active in the M.2 connector.

 

For storage, the manufacturer may choose to put only the SATA pins to the connector, it may put only pci-e wires to the pins, it may do other things. 

 

For example, it's possible to have up to 4 pci-e lanes in the m.2 connector but in laptops one "special" M.2 connector often has just one pci-e lane, plus the pins for a USB connection, because it makes it possible to connect a wireless m.2 card to that single pci-e lane, and the usb connection connects the bluetooth part of the wireless card to the laptop motherboard.

 

For storage, M.2 connectors will have UP TO 4 pci-e lanes and / or SATA.

The motherboard manufacturer can choose to connect 1, 2 or 4 pci-e lanes to the connector.

The SSD controller may also support only 1 or 2 pci-e lanes, but most support using 4 pci-e lanes to communicate with the computer.

In addition to this, there are multiple versions of pci-e, each pci-e version increases the maximum transfer speed through a single pci-e lane.  The versions are backwards compatible : a pci-e 4.0 capable device will work in a slot or M.2 connector which only knows pci-e 3.0 or pci-e 2.0 

 

pci-e 2.0 : 500 MB/s per lane , so 4 lanes = 2 GB/s

example M.2 connectors connected to B450 chipset will have up to 4 pci-e 2.0 lanes

pci-e 3.0 : aprox. 985 MB/s per lane, so 4 lanes = aprox 3.8 GB/s

example M.2 connectors connected to A520 / B550 chipset

pci-e 4.0 : aprox 2 x 985 MB/s per lane, so 4 lanes = aprox 2 x 3.8 GB/s

 

A pci-e 4.0 SSD may do 7 GB/s read speed in a M.2 with 4 pci-e 4.0 lanes, but will work just fine in a M.2 connector that has only pci-e 3.0 lanes, only the maximum speed will drop to around 3.6-3.8 GB/s and in old motherboards that only support pci-e 2.0, the speed could drop to 1.9 GB/s -ish.

 

 

[Sparky862]

14 minutes ago, Dedayog said:

Yes, NVMe come in different sizes as marked by their name.  2280 NVMe are 22mm wide by 80 mm long, which is the standard for almost all we use today.   ANy mainstream NVMe will work on your board, and you can boot from it.  This was an issue years ago, but you have a modern board and it will boot.  

 

Both the SATA SSD and NVMe you linked will work on your motherboard without issue.

 

Thank you, so the only question left standing is, does the NVMe disable one, two or no SATA Slots seeing as I only have 4 SATA.

 

If it Disables one SATA it's fine, I chug the SSD.

 

If it Disables two SATA I'm screwd, cause I run and use x3 HDDs alongside my SSD.

 

If it Disables nothing (which I doubt cause my board says I got x2 M.2M Slots), it's a win basically.

 

My Manual states nothing about Disabled Ports, so I have no idea how many ports the NVMe is going to disable.

[Dedayog]

1 minute ago, Sparky862 said:

 

Thank you, so the only question left standing is, does the NVMe disable one, two or no SATA Slots seeing as I only have 4 SATA.

 

If it Disables one SATA it's fine, I chug the SSD.

 

If it Disables two SATA I'm screwd, cause I run and use x3 HDDs alongside my SSD.

 

If it Disables nothing (which I doubt cause my board says I got x2 M.2M Slots), it's a win basically.

 

My Manual states nothing about Disabled Ports, so I have no idea how many ports the NVMe is going to disable.

From what I can read, it disables none.  I think you're fine using all 4 SATA ports.  

 

 

[Sparky862]

5 minutes ago, mariushm said:

Only on some of the old motherboards when M.2 connectors were super new, it was not possible to boot from M.2 connectors, because the code to make this possible was not present in the BIOS.

In modern motherboards, almost all motherboards out there can boot from M.2 drives.

 

As for your particular motherboard, Asus B660M-K D4 Prime ... you just have to take it one step further and read the manual, where it will say what each m.2 connector supports.

 

A sort of long explanation of M.2

 

M.2 is a sort of universal connector - it can have pins for lots of things : pci-e lanes, sata , usb, i2c, sim cards but not all pins are connected at the same time.

 

The manufacturer of the motherboard can choose which contacts/pins are active in the M.2 connector.

 

For storage, the manufacturer may choose to put only the SATA pins to the connector, it may put only pci-e wires to the pins, it may do other things. 

 

For example, it's possible to have up to 4 pci-e lanes in the m.2 connector but in laptops one "special" M.2 connector often has just one pci-e lane, plus the pins for a USB connection, because it makes it possible to connect a wireless m.2 card to that single pci-e lane, and the usb connection connects the bluetooth part of the wireless card to the laptop motherboard.

 

For storage, M.2 connectors will have UP TO 4 pci-e lanes and / or SATA.

The motherboard manufacturer can choose to connect 1, 2 or 4 pci-e lanes to the connector.

The SSD controller may also support only 1 or 2 pci-e lanes, but most support using 4 pci-e lanes to communicate with the computer.

In addition to this, there are multiple versions of pci-e, each pci-e version increases the maximum transfer speed through a single pci-e lane.  The versions are backwards compatible : a pci-e 4.0 capable device will work in a slot or M.2 connector which only knows pci-e 3.0 or pci-e 2.0 

 

pci-e 2.0 : 500 MB/s per lane , so 4 lanes = 2 GB/s

example M.2 connectors connected to B450 chipset will have up to 4 pci-e 2.0 lanes

pci-e 3.0 : aprox. 985 MB/s per lane, so 4 lanes = aprox 3.8 GB/s

example M.2 connectors connected to A520 / B550 chipset

pci-e 4.0 : aprox 2 x 985 MB/s per lane, so 4 lanes = aprox 2 x 3.8 GB/s

 

A pci-e 4.0 SSD may do 7 GB/s read speed in a M.2 with 4 pci-e 4.0 lanes, but will work just fine in a M.2 connector that has only pci-e 3.0 lanes, only the maximum speed will drop to around 3.6-3.8 GB/s and in old motherboards that only support pci-e 2.0, the speed could drop to 1.9 GB/s -ish.

 

 

 

My board specs states x2 PCIe x4 Mode

 

Check last line.