Major dilemma with RAM selection.

[DeathStalkerGR]

Hey there guys!

After a successful buy of my new GPU the RX 5700XT Nitro +, I was thinking of changing my 16GB Corsair Vengeance Ram that runs on the specced 2400MHZ  to 3200MHZ that is the cap of my motherboard support. 
My question is this.  Should I get the officially supported QVL RAM or should I buy the one that makes more sense to bang for my buck?  I have in mind 3 sets of memory and two of them are officially supported by the QVL (one is RYZEN ready too) and the last one isn't. 

1)https://www.skroutz.gr/s/7332757/Corsair-Vengeance-LPX-16GB-DDR4-3200MHz-CMK16GX4M2B3200C16.html?from=account_favorites
(Supported)
2)https://www.skroutz.gr/s/11436424/G-Skill-Flare-X-16GB-DDR4-3200MHz-F4-3200C14D-16GFX.html?from=account_favorites
(Supported)
3)https://www.skroutz.gr/s/7730092/G-Skill-RipjawsV-16GB-DDR4-3200MHz-F4-3200C16D-16GVKB.html?from=account_notifications#sku_review_667901
(Not Supported)

The Flare X ones are better than the other two (CAS Latency 14 - and are Ryzen Ready) but they are slightly more expensive.
Which one to pick?
 

NOTE: The links are of a Greek price checking and comparing site that is very handy for buyers from my country (Greece). Keep in mind that all in all the prices of these RAM are kinda the same worldwide (not taking into account some weird or sudden deals). I would like your opinion on the quality of RAM and what you think is best on my setup.  Spend the extra money for the peace of mind and CAS 14 or save these money for an upcoming ryzen 5 3600 or even 4600? 

Thanks a lot! 

 

[Demonic Donut]

I have similar g.skill ram but at 3600mhz. It runs great, especially for the price. Haven't done much tweaking with it, but it runs XMP fine.

[Chabax]

https://www.skroutz.gr/s/11436424/G-Skill-Flare-X-16GB-DDR4-3200MHz-F4-3200C14D-16GFX.html?from=account_favorites

is one of best, and it can easly be overclocked 3600mhz cl14 afaik

[Chabax]

https://www.skroutz.gr/s/11436424/G-Skill-Flare-X-16GB-DDR4-3200MHz-F4-3200C14D-16GFX.html?from=account_favorites

is also guaranteed samsung B die chip, whic are best for ryzen

[DeathStalkerGR]

6 minutes ago, Demonic Donut said:

I have similar g.skill ram but at 3600mhz. It runs great, especially for the price. Haven't done much tweaking with it, but it runs XMP fine.

Which G Skill kit you're referring to? The flare X or the Ripjaws? 

[DeathStalkerGR]

3 minutes ago, Chabax said:

https://www.skroutz.gr/s/11436424/G-Skill-Flare-X-16GB-DDR4-3200MHz-F4-3200C14D-16GFX.html?from=account_favorites

is also guaranteed samsung B die chip, whic are best for ryzen

So the flare X you think is better for my situation? Spending the little extra money for that? Thank you !

 

[Chabax]

2 minutes ago, DeathStalkerGR said:

So the flare X you think is better for my situation? Spending the little extra money for that? Thank you !

 

its worth it tbh, with this kit ur latency will drop alot and u will have much more stable FPS in any game, just remember to enable D.O.C.P ram profile in bios

[Demonic Donut]

7 minutes ago, DeathStalkerGR said:

Which G Skill kit you're referring to? The flare X or the Ripjaws? 

Sorry, I have the ripjaws kit. With the research I did, I couldn't justify something with lower timings for the cost increase.

 

[DeathStalkerGR]

1 minute ago, Chabax said:

its worth it tbh, with this kit ur latency will drop alot and u will have much more stable FPS in any game, just remember to enable D.O.C.P ram profile in bios

Thank you my friend ! One last thing though. In a Greek forum one person told me that it's gonna be better for my FPS stability and overall smoothness if I get the Ryzen 5 3600 now instead and then buy the 3200MHZ ram because the tradeoff will be much higher , cause ZEN2 gives less emphasis on faster ram. Is it true in my situation? That CPU is 176,57€ which is roughly 190,92$ in price. 

[Chabax]

15 minutes ago, DeathStalkerGR said:

Thank you my friend ! One last thing though. In a Greek forum one person told me that it's gonna be better for my FPS stability and overall smoothness if I get the Ryzen 5 3600 now instead and then buy the 3200MHZ ram because the tradeoff will be much higher , cause ZEN2 gives less emphasis on faster ram. Is it true in my situation? That CPU is 176,57€ which is roughly 190,92$ in price. 

well its true, if u go from 1600 to 3600 its better upgrade then ram upgrade, but u should trow in few more bucks and get 3600X version, cuz X version clocks higher by default ingames so u wont have to bother overclocking CPU, also u can get RAM later on when u save some money, whic is also gona improve ur performance alot, also make sure ur BIOS version supports ryzen 3rd gen

[Demonic Donut]

9 minutes ago, Chabax said:

well its true, if u go from 1600 to 3600 its better upgrade then ram upgrade, but u should trow in few more bucks and get 3600X version, cuz X version clocks higher by default ingames so u wont have to bother overclocking CPU, also u can get RAM later on when u save some money, whic is also gona improve ur performance alot, also make sure ur BIOS version supports ryzen 3rd gen

I'd disagree. Price to performance the 3600 is a better deal. Then you could get a ram upgrade for a bit more money with what you save. You will probably want to undervolt anyway, so then you might as well OC. I can run 4.4ghz all core in games on my 3600 non-X.

[DeathStalkerGR]

13 minutes ago, Demonic Donut said:

I'd disagree. Price to performance the 3600 is a better deal. Then you could get a ram upgrade for a bit more money with what you save. You will probably want to undervolt anyway, so then you might as well OC. I can run 4.4ghz all core in games on my 3600 non-X.

So in that situation a CPU upgrade is a better choice overall , right? I have issues only in Assassins Creed games (Origins for that matter) but I guess Odyssey  will be equally as bad or even worse in terms of CPU limitation.  I find it weird that in large cities my framerates fluctuate all over the place and when I'm in somewhere "quiet" I hit 120FPS ... And graphical settings doesn't seem to make any difference. That's why I wanted to ask whether to change RAM or CPU first... 

[Demonic Donut]

40 minutes ago, DeathStalkerGR said:

So in that situation a CPU upgrade is a better choice overall , right? I have issues only in Assassins Creed games (Origins for that matter) but I guess Odyssey  will be equally as bad or even worse in terms of CPU limitation.  I find it weird that in large cities my framerates fluctuate all over the place and when I'm in somewhere "quiet" I hit 120FPS ... And graphical settings doesn't seem to make any difference. That's why I wanted to ask whether to change RAM or CPU first... 

If you want to pinpoint you need to log CPU and GPU utilization. The only other thing it could be is data being slow from the drive to the CPU. Is the game in question on one of your SSDs?

 

It doesn't sound like GPU issues. It reminds me of my wife's computer, which is getting upgraded today actually, that stutters a lot whenever new textures need to be loaded etc. Its a CPU bottleneck.

 

Also have you tried OCing your ram?

[DeathStalkerGR]

1 minute ago, Demonic Donut said:

If you want to pinpoint you need to log CPU and GPU utilization. The only other thing it could be is data being slow from the drive to the CPU. Is the game in question on one of your SSDs?

 

It doesn't sound like GPU issues. It reminds me of my wife's computer, which is getting upgraded today actually, that stutters a lot whenever new textures need to be loaded etc. Its a CPU bottleneck.

 

Also have you tried OCing your ram?

I have 2 SSDS and I run all my demanding and *main* games off of them . I've tried OC'ing my RAM from 2400MHZ to 2666MHZ without touching timings and volts and it's stalbe for only a handful of games and make others crash. I am sure that if I adjust the timings using RAM Calculator I could squeeze 2666MHZ but I'm positive that I couldn't go further from that.  I also think it's kinda absurd that I'm CPU limited on a very capable gaming CPU of 2017 on a game that launched the same year. What I mean by that is what kind of CPU should I have to play this game or any other poorly optimised game with respectable , stable *60* fps ?  Thanks for your answer though !

 

[nutzaalex]

1 hour ago, Demonic Donut said:

I'd disagree. Price to performance the 3600 is a better deal. Then you could get a ram upgrade for a bit more money with what you save. You will probably want to undervolt anyway, so then you might as well OC. I can run 4.4ghz all core in games on my 3600 non-X.

What voltage are you at though for 4.4?

[Demonic Donut]

33 minutes ago, nutzaalex said:

What voltage are you at though for 4.4?

1.32 vcore

[nutzaalex]

24 minutes ago, Demonic Donut said:

1.32 vcore

Was curious because I also got a 5 3600 and got it to 4.3 1.25v. Careful about that voltage though, I know you didn't ask for opinions but some say 1.3 is not totally safe in longrun.

[Demonic Donut]

2 hours ago, DeathStalkerGR said:

I have 2 SSDS and I run all my demanding and *main* games off of them . I've tried OC'ing my RAM from 2400MHZ to 2666MHZ without touching timings and volts and it's stalbe for only a handful of games and make others crash. I am sure that if I adjust the timings using RAM Calculator I could squeeze 2666MHZ but I'm positive that I couldn't go further from that.  I also think it's kinda absurd that I'm CPU limited on a very capable gaming CPU of 2017 on a game that launched the same year. What I mean by that is what kind of CPU should I have to play this game or any other poorly optimised game with respectable , stable *60* fps ?  Thanks for your answer though !

 

Ryzen loves good RAM, so try going farther and see if performance improves. You can generally get voltage up to 1.35 for RAM. That'll help stability at higher clocks. Definitely don't go over 1.5V.

 

Games usually prefer single thread performance, more GHz more better. A 1600 is still a solid performer, but it's a good 20pct behind the 3600. If money isn't an issue, a 9900k is the best gaming CPU due to it being able to hit 5ghz or near it pretty easily. The best per dollar upgrade for you is probably a 3600.

 

Have you tried OCing the cpu too? I'm not familiar with that motherboard, but it should be able to handle a light OC at least.

 

[Demonic Donut]

53 minutes ago, nutzaalex said:

Was curious because I also got a 5 3600 and got it to 4.3 1.25v. Careful about that voltage though, I know you didn't ask for opinions but some say 1.3 is not totally safe in longrun.

Yea, I'm aware. I saw something a while ago that said AMD recomends 1.325 max, so I was aiming at that. If I leave everything on auto, I get 1.38V underload, 4.1ghz on all cores and pulling an average of 86W, max 90W, according to monitoring software. My 4.3 all core runs cooler and at lower voltage than what stock gets. So I don't see it being a problem, unless running at higher cycles causes an issue in the chip that I'm not aware of. If I get degradation, oh well. I just started trying 4.4, so time will tell if it's game stable, for now it seems to be. 

 

I do appreciate the heads up though.

[nutzaalex]

2 minutes ago, Demonic Donut said:

Yea, I'm aware. I saw something a while ago that said AMD recomends 1.325 max, so I was aiming at that. If I leave everything on auto, I get 1.38V underload,

Yes, but at the same time people are saying and having limited background into this that it's one thing for it to boost to that voltage for short periods and another to keep it set like that forever since so small nm process.

 

And np!

[Demonic Donut]

4 hours ago, nutzaalex said:

Yes, but at the same time people are saying and having limited background into this that it's one thing for it to boost to that voltage for short periods and another to keep it set like that forever since so small nm process.

 

And np!

I'm curious if auto will pull back voltage after some time. I'll check it out next time I'm tinkering. Or do you know if it will? I was under the impression it's all related to heat.

 

There isn't a lot of information out, but that's somewhat the nature of it. By the time people have long term information, new products are out. When I needed my hardware to last as long as possible, I was much more careful. A dead CPU or GPU meant I wouldn't be gaming or have general computer usage for at least a month, probably more. Now it's not the case and if I get degradation or something fails, I'll replace it and I'll be posting about it so we'll have another data point at the very least.

[nutzaalex]

7 hours ago, Demonic Donut said:

I'm curious if auto will pull back voltage after some time. I'll check it out next time I'm tinkering. Or do you know if it will? I was under the impression it's all related to heat.

While I do have some electrical background, I don't have much oc experience/ how boards behave, what should happen etc. so I can't answer that, I also think its related to heat, but I don't think having that to auto + really good cooler means for example 4.3 all core oc to be stable, let alone 4.4, I could be wrong, I'm just guessing here, if that works and it doesn't go over a certain threshold that you envision of being safe, then I guess it's ok?

 

 

My approach is to keep it at one voltage flat, even though this new ryzens are not meant to be oc this way, people say... since I deem the voltage safe and also I got soc v manually dialled in and am working on an aggressive memory oc, I wouldn't want voltages to fluctuate as I think it might create random instability that I might label as "this ram timing cannot go lower" etc...

 

But if you're just oc-ing the processor, I guess you can try that approach and see, different setups calls for different settings anyways I don't think there is a "fix all questions" clearly defined best way to do it.