28nm vs 22nm

[Gauzl]

What's the difference and how would it effect performance?

[NameOfNoInterest]

What's the difference and how would it effect performance?

The difference is 6nm (28nm - 22nm = 6nm it's simple math)

[_ASSASSIN_]

more transistors = more better

basically the smaller the die the better, so 22 nm is going to be better if the architecture isn't incompetent 

[Gauzl]

The difference is 6nm (28nm - 22nm = 6nm it's simple math)

Guess I better go back to school then.

[NameOfNoInterest]

Guess I better go back to school then.

Probably man. 

[NJM1112]

28nm vs 22nm is the size or length of a transistor in a silicon chip. The smaller they are the more you can have in a certain area. thus more transistors = more work (or more performance) being done.

 

There's some problems with them getting smaller Physics say we can't get smaller than about 5or 6nm because at that point we won't be able to see where the electrons are.  Que Heisenberg's uncertenty principle.

 

Also- more transistor in one are means more heat. However since they're smaller they can use less voltage (look at haswell using very little voltage compared to 32nm parts) thus producing less heat.

 

Here's a related thread on teksyndicate talking about Maxwell and the jump to 20nms on the GPU side of things: https://teksyndicate.com/users/rsilverblood/blog/2014/02/06/gpu-wars-enter-maxwell-nvidias-successor-kepler

[scaryjam823]

The difference is 6nm (28nm - 22nm = 6nm it's simple math)

Damn... I thought the answer was 2...

[NameOfNoInterest]

Damn... I thought the answer was 2...

No, I'm taking Algebra, I know my variables

[MG2R]

These values are referred to as the litography or the litographic size. They denote the width of a transistor inside an Integrated Circuit (IC or chip). Inherently the litography doesn't affect performance at all, it merely changes the size of the IC die (the piece of silicon onto which the IC is etched).

 

Properties of the IC that are (proportionally) affected by the litography:

• operating voltage
• maximum current throughput
• breakdown voltage
• heat output
• physical die size

 

By using a smaller manufacturing process, IC manufacturers are able to put more chips on one wafer. This increases the yield, as little spot errors in the silcon will affect a smaller percentile of chips. This, in turn, decreases the cost of producing one chip. This is mandatory to stay competitive. In order to make their CPU's more powerful, CPU manufacturers need an increasing number of transistors (the basic building stones of IC's). Without shrinking the process, CPU dies would be incredibly big by now, meaning that the yield during manufactering would be dreadfully low.

 

A process shrink is a double-edged sword in terms of IC temperature. Inherently, heat output goes down by shrinking the die, this is because the operating voltage for he transisors goes down. On the other hand, making the die smaller also decreases the surface through which it conducts this heat to your heatsink, making the heat transfer less efficient, thus increasing the temperature of the chip.

[Gauzl]

These values are referred to as the litography or the litographic size. They denote the width of a transistor inside an Integrated Circuit (IC or chip). Inherently the litography doesn't affect performance at all, it merely changes the size of the IC die (the piece of silicon onto which the IC is etched).

Properties of the IC that are (proportionally) affected by the litography:

• operating voltage
• maximum current throughput
• breakdown voltage
• heat output
• physical die size

By using a smaller manufacturing process, IC manufacturers are able to put more chips on one wafer. This increases the yield, as little spot errors in the silcon will affect a smaller percentile of chips. This, in turn, decreases the cost of producing one chip. This is mandatory to stay competitive. In order to make their CPU's more powerful, CPU manufacturers need an increasing number of transistors (the basic building stones of IC's). Without shrinking the process, CPU dies would be incredibly big by now, meaning that the yield during manufactering would be dreadfully low.

A process shrink is a double-edged sword in terms of IC temperature. Inherently, heat output goes down by shrinking the die, this is because the operating voltage for he transisors goes down. On the other hand, making the die smaller also decreases the surface through which it conducts this heat to your heatsink, making the heat transfer less efficient, thus increasing the temperature of the chip.

How much can it increase performance between GPUs? Apparently maxwell is going to have 28nm and 22nm GPUs.

[MG2R]

How much can it increase performance between GPUs? Apparently maxwell is going to have 28nm and 22nm GPUs.

As I said: inherently the litography doesn't affect performance at all. The only possible performance increase is from either more transistors being jammed in the IC, or the IC design being improved. Since we're talking about a die shrink, it probably will be the latter, in which case, we probably won't see that much of an improvement. If it's the former, permance improvement can be quite huge.

 

Just as a disclaimer: I have no knowledge about specific GPU's and their specification, expecially not about GPU's that aren't out yet. Everything I said in my previous post is purely the scientific side of the story. Anything I said here is based on what we have seen happening for the past years on the CPU side of IC manufactering (tic-toc paradigm from Intel) and may thus be completely wrong.

Edited February 10, 2014 by MG2R