Cheap Steel frame vs Carbon for a Bike

[Guest]

1 minute ago, mr moose said:

Go and pick one up and you'll wet your knickers.  A good carbon fibre bike can be lifted with your little finger (well I can anyway).  How much speed that gains you is upto the gears and your health of course, but the reality is the less weight your pulling in thee frame the faster you can go.

 

 

I’m pretty limited by gears, or at least I feel atm. Going to upgrade to 52/40/30-something. Surely all Shimano is Shimano. I can keep up with road bikes for the most part, but I feel the weight of my bike is there. 

 

Not to sure about any cardio. My resting heart rate is in the 50s and my lowest for the day is 42. I try and keep fit by running, try to keep 20 minutes sustained at 13km/hr. Trying to put that up, but my diet is a bit rubbish and can only train at night, uni is priority. 

 

Training for biking is pretty new to me, so I’ll take any advice I can get

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, floofer said:

I’m pretty limited by gears, or at least I feel atm. Going to upgrade to 52/40/30-something. Surely all Shimano is Shimano. I can keep up with road bikes for the most part, but I feel the weight of my bike is there. 

 

Not to sure about any cardio. My resting heart rate is in the 50s and my lowest for the day is 42. I try and keep fit by running, try to keep 20 minutes sustained at 13km/hr. Trying to put that up, but my diet is a bit rubbish and can only train at night, uni is priority. 

 

Training for biking is pretty new to me, so I’ll take any advice I can get

you sound pretty fit.  If your serious,look at second hand Carbon fibre, if you can feel the weight of a cromoly frame you'll likely notice the difference straight up.

 

 

[zassou]

7 hours ago, floofer said:

I’m pretty limited by gears, or at least I feel atm. Going to upgrade to 52/40/30-something. Surely all Shimano is Shimano. I can keep up with road bikes for the most part, but I feel the weight of my bike is there.

as a road bike rider, there are 3 things that i think can do to make your bike feels lighter.

1. road tyres
2. rigid fork
3. clipless pedals

knobby off-road tyres are designed for loose surface, not paved ones. consider get a pair of road slicks for your wheels. tyres are the most important bike component that people often overlook.

 

hydraulic shocks absorb some amount of work you put out, and for road you're not jumping very much, a rigid fork makes road feel much direct and of course, bouncy.

 

lastly clipless pedals makes heaven and earth, greatly improve the efficiency and massively reduce knee strain. definitely worth trying. get a pair of entry level shimano spd mtb pedals and shoes.

 

 

[Guest]

4 hours ago, zassou said:

as a road bike rider, there are 3 things that i think can do to make your bike feels lighter.

1. road tyres
2. rigid fork
3. clipless pedals

knobby off-road tyres are designed for loose surface, not paved ones. consider get a pair of road slicks for your wheels. tyres are the most important bike component that people often overlook.

 

hydraulic shocks absorb some amount of work you put out, and for road you're not jumping very much, a rigid fork makes road feel much direct and of course, bouncy.

 

lastly clipless pedals makes heaven and earth, greatly improve the efficiency and massively reduce knee strain. definitely worth trying. get a pair of entry level shimano spd mtb pedals and shoes.

 

 

I need the nice knobby tires I have to go off-road and in gravel. I also don’t want to buy new shoes and pedals, I’m not sure how easy it is to unclip. When I got new tires was a big upgrade.

 

I am slightly interested in buying a road bike, but really i’d prefer to just have the one bike.

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, comander said:

The little bit of research that I've seen basically is this - if you have flat pedals you can only push down. If you have clips or clipless you can pull up. The net of this is that your maximum force going down ends up reduced as the other leg can offset it. 

From an energy perspective - think of going from leg 1@90% and leg 2 @10% to leg1@70% and leg2 @30% - biomechanically going to the 70-100% range is a lot less efficient than keeping it lower. 

It’s more if I start to lose control downhill, I usually use my feet, as I’m often on gravel, where brakes are ok, but 50-60 gets a little scary.

[Guest]

24 minutes ago, comander said:

I can see that and I'm a dash scared of such a thing myself. 

In my own case I'm 99% on pavement, 95% on a dedicated bike trail and have hills and am not doing jumps. At the same time, I am limited in how fast I can go because I feel pain in my knees (yay, aging) when I push myself and am very adverse to injuring myself (I'd rather be in the gym 20 days a month than in there 5 days a month and nursing injuries). 

Oh I am terrible at injuring myself. It’s a lot easier on pavement (regarding stability at speed) and I can see why you’d have pedals, always assumed for proper foot placement - makes a big difference in efficiency. 

 

When you go too fast on gravel, you can’t brake too hard or you’ll start to swerve (I’ve found). It’s not too hard on you when you crash, it’s just a little shock. Best thing is just to keep going or put your toes on the ground to brake without unbalancing (if you want to slow down). 

[Guest]

36 minutes ago, comander said:

Some advice from a slowly getting older guy with probably a bit too much mass on a skinny-person frame... take care of your body and go easy on it - also have a solid diet.

 

I’ll be fine, I’m usually pretty safe, but I love getting out there. 

36 minutes ago, comander said:

I'm torn between wanting to gain another 20lbs (for strength/ego) and lose another 20lbs (which would be for joint health - this is something I've heard bodybuilders and athletes comment on).

Depends on your age, weight and height. I’m around 6’1” and 90kg, I used to be a lot stronger, but uni is priority.  Being strong is one thing, but if you’re not living as comfortable or as good as you can be, there’s no real win. 

[zassou]

15 hours ago, comander said:

Tell me more. I'm currently having to reduce my intensity when bicycling due to knee strain. I physically can do more but I don't want to regret it later. 

im a road rider, i have virtually zero mtb experience, so some may not apply to trail or down hill.

 

you probably already know that, road rider to a certain degree of seriousness, except commuting, use clipless pedals. from my own perspect, i feel significantly less fatigue when riding a bike with clipless pedals, compared to another bike with flat padels over the same distance. i have two bikes, an 2013 model giant ocr 3500 with shimano PD-r550 pedal, a merida flat bar road bike with flat pedals. both are 8 speed, but i can cover over 40km in one session without resting on giant, but i cant say for sure i can with the merida.

 

you probably wont believe me say this, but i dont know how to ride a bicycle for most of my life, right until someday i got my pay and i decided i should start riding, and ride road bike only. the clipping motion while seems daunting at first, but as soon as you learned it, is almost as natural as riding the bike itself. if you can ride a bike very slowly, like slower than walking, you'll be fine.

 

im not a fast rider, my physique isnt great and im not a sporty person either, i cant even keep pedaling at 30kmh. i have seen people ride faster than me on a mtb. but my point is clipless pedals can make you less tired while having the same amount of excercing. like mechanical keyboards, once you hooked, you'll never got away from it.

 

i can put another wall of text on different types of pedals, shoes; road vs mtb etc. but there're tons of great videos about this topic. my advice? go shimano, they build like a tank and last for ages.

[ravenshrike]

On 5/22/2019 at 7:47 PM, dizmo said:

If it's a really cheap bike, it's not steel. It's probably chromoly.

Wat? No seriously, Wat? 4130 steel is definitely steel.

[dizmo]

1 hour ago, ravenshrike said:

Wat? No seriously, Wat? 4130 steel is definitely steel.

It's shit steel.

[ravenshrike]

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

It's shit steel. 

No... just... no. Hi tensile steel is the "shit" steel. CroMoly is the "good" stuff. Although how either actually holds up in practice has significantly more to do with bike design than steel type. The only actual downsides are weight and that it will rust if the paint or other protective coatings used are thin and cheap.

[dizmo]

5 minutes ago, ravenshrike said:

No... just... no. Hi tensile steel is the "shit" steel. CroMoly is the "good" stuff. Although how either actually holds up in practice has significantly more to do with bike design than steel type. The only actual downsides are weight and that it will rust if the paint or other protective coatings used are thin and cheap.

It is. It's used on entry level bikes. Reynolds 725 etc is used on high end steel bikes.

[ravenshrike]

2 hours ago, dizmo said:

It is. It's used on entry level bikes. Reynolds 725 etc is used on high end steel bikes.

Jesus fucking christ. Reynolds 725 is a heat treated cromoly alloy. You clearly don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about.

 

http://www.reynoldstechnology.biz/materials/steel/s-725/

 

Why it works:

UTS: 1080-1280 MPa, density 7.78gm/cc

Based on a 0.3% carbon steel alloy which has been heat-treated and back-tempered for increased ductility. The chromium content promotes hardenability and resistance to oxidation. The molybdenum works in conjunction with the chrome to stabilize the alloy and maintain strength after heat-treatment and in use.