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JustSum

I7 8700k vs 9700k

9700k IMO, because of how hyperthreading works.  Each of the extra threads is optimistically, about 45-50% of the power of a "true core" from there, we can do some maffs and see an incredibly rough idea of the total performance each chip could output in a full load scenario (all other factors being equal) 

 

9700k 

8*1=8

8700k

6*1 + 6*0.5 = 9

 

The theoretical lead with an 8700k becomes slim, right?  But now we add in three major factors - IPC, clockspeed and latency.  The 9700k will have higher IPC/clockspeed, and lower latency as there are less cores to divvy up the work.  The 8700k wins out in situations that require a lot of instances with less of a speed requirement, but that is definitely not your usecase.

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Posted · Original PosterOP

I was going amd but since my ram is only 3000mhz, i already have a z370 evga ftw that i will be selling to a friend , but i also got a board on amazon hope it works "Gigabyte Z390 AORUS PRO", since it was " like new". The 2 reason why i didn't go AMD is I dont want to deal with ram overclock and cpu overclock on it, also since i already have 4 sticks on corsair vengeance 3000, and ryzen needs 3600, from what i gathered .

 

So my problem is 

i7 8700k 279.99

or i7 9700k 299.99

I'll try to do price match on Bestbuy with Microcenter.

I'll Also oc the cpu to 5ghz if the cpu lets me.

Not sure if my 360 Thick rad will be enough for the cpu and a 1080 ti i hope it is.

 

I mostly play BF5 and any fps games to come out.

I play at 144hz 1440p.

Im one of those people who play at low-mid settings to get 144hz+.

 

So my Question is i7 8700k or i7 9700k?

6 core 12t vs 8 core 8t?

Not worth the 20$ difference ?

 

I am planning not to change cpu/gpu for a good 2 years.

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Posted · Best Answer

9700k IMO, because of how hyperthreading works.  Each of the extra threads is optimistically, about 45-50% of the power of a "true core" from there, we can do some maffs and see an incredibly rough idea of the total performance each chip could output in a full load scenario (all other factors being equal) 

 

9700k 

8*1=8

8700k

6*1 + 6*0.5 = 9

 

The theoretical lead with an 8700k becomes slim, right?  But now we add in three major factors - IPC, clockspeed and latency.  The 9700k will have higher IPC/clockspeed, and lower latency as there are less cores to divvy up the work.  The 8700k wins out in situations that require a lot of instances with less of a speed requirement, but that is definitely not your usecase.


Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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15 minutes ago, JustSum said:

also since i already have 4 sticks on corsair vengeance 3000, and ryzen needs 3600, from what i gathered .

No one says you "need" them, they just work better with higher frequency. You wont lose more than 5% of performance at worst, usually not even that noticeable without hitting specific workloads

 

17 minutes ago, JustSum said:

I dont want to deal with ram overclock and cpu overclock on it...

I'll Also oc the cpu to 5ghz if the cpu lets me.

*confused*

Ryzen 3rd gen nearly doesnt have overclocking headroom on the core, so that's 1 less trouble


CPU: i7-2600K 4751MHz 1.44V (software) --> 1.47V at the back of the socket Motherboard: Asrock Z77 Extreme4 (BCLK: 103.3MHz) CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 RAM: Adata XPG 2x8GB DDR3 (XMP: 2133MHz 10-11-11-30 CR2, custom: 2203MHz 10-11-10-26 CR1 tRFC:230 tREFI:14000) GPU: Asus GTX 1070 Dual (Super Jetstream vbios, +70(2025-2088MHz)/+400(8.8Gbps)) SSD: Samsung 840 Pro 256GB (main boot drive), Transcend SSD370 128GB PSU: Seasonic X-660 80+ Gold Case: Antec P110 Silent, 5 intakes 1 exhaust Monitor: AOC G2460PF 1080p 144Hz (150Hz max w/ DP, 121Hz max w/ HDMI) TN panel Keyboard: Logitech G610 Orion (Cherry MX Blue) with SteelSeries Apex M260 keycaps Mouse: BenQ Zowie FK1

 

Model: HP Omen 17 17-an110ca CPU: i7-8750H (0.125V core & cache, 50mV SA undervolt) GPU: GTX 1060 6GB Mobile (+80/+450, 1650MHz~1750MHz 0.78V~0.85V) RAM: 8+8GB DDR4-2400 18-17-17-39 2T Storage: 1TB HP EX920 PCIe x4 M.2 SSD + 1TB Seagate 7200RPM 2.5" HDD (ST1000LM049-2GH172), 128GB Toshiba PCIe x2 M.2 SSD (KBG30ZMV128G) gone cooking externally Monitor: 1080p 126Hz IPS G-sync

 

Desktop benching:

Cinebench R15 Single thread:168 Multi-thread: 833 

SuperPi (v1.5 from Techpowerup, PI value output) 16K: 0.100s 1M: 8.255s 32M: 7m 45.93s

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Posted · Original PosterOP
7 minutes ago, Damascus said:

9700k IMO, because of how hyperthreading works.  Each of the extra threads is optimistically, about 45-50% of the power of a "true core" from there, we can do some maffs and see an incredibly rough idea of the total performance each chip could output in a full load scenario (all other factors being equal) 

 

9700k 

8*1=8

8700k

6*1 + 6*0.5 = 9

 

The theoretical lead with an 8700k becomes slim, right?  But now we add in three major factors - IPC, clockspeed and latency.  The 9700k will have higher IPC/clockspeed, and lower latency as there are less cores to divvy up the work.  The 8700k wins out in situations that require a lot of instances with less of a speed requirement, but that is definitely not your usecase.

That make sense,  Not a expert but it makes sense 9700k it is.

I was just asking since i was looking at some benchmark that yes the 9700k had 1-5 fps more then the 8700k , but the 9700k was at like 90-100% usage and the 8700k was at 80sh%. The 2 cpu where at 5ghz.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
8 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

No one says you "need" them, they just work better with higher frequency. You wont lose more than 5% of performance at worst, usually not even that noticeable without hitting specific workloads

 

*confused*

Ryzen 3rd gen nearly doesnt have overclocking headroom on the core, so that's 1 less trouble

Yes but then again i'm just a gamer , so i only need speed :).

The only amd cpu would be the 3700x, same price as the intel, Sure more threads ,but losing fps from the core speed and ram and still try to get the max oc i'll stick with intel for now.

 

thats only from 3200 probably another 5fps going to 3000.

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3000MHz ram will still work fine with Ryzen, so I don't see what the huge deal is.


Intel Xeon E5 1650 v3 @ 3.5GHz 6C:12T / CM212 Evo / Asus X99 Deluxe / 16GB (4x4GB) DDR4 3000 Trident-Z / Samsung 850 Pro 256GB / Intel 335 240GB / WD Red 2 & 3TB / Antec 850w / RTX 2070 / Win10 Pro x64

HP Envy X360 15: Intel Core i5 8250U @ 1.6GHz 4C:8T / 8GB DDR4 / Intel UHD620 + Nvidia GeForce MX150 4GB / Intel 120GB SSD / Win10 Pro x64

 

HP Envy x360 BP series Intel 8th gen

AMD ThreadRipper 2!

5820K & 6800K 3-way SLI mobo support list

 

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14 minutes ago, JustSum said:

The only amd cpu would be the 3700x, same price as the intel, Sure more threads ,but losing fps from the core speed and ram and still try to get the max oc i'll stick with intel for now.

The argument for AMD is to actually spend less (say a R5 3600) and get faster cards. What will you use?


CPU: i7-2600K 4751MHz 1.44V (software) --> 1.47V at the back of the socket Motherboard: Asrock Z77 Extreme4 (BCLK: 103.3MHz) CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 RAM: Adata XPG 2x8GB DDR3 (XMP: 2133MHz 10-11-11-30 CR2, custom: 2203MHz 10-11-10-26 CR1 tRFC:230 tREFI:14000) GPU: Asus GTX 1070 Dual (Super Jetstream vbios, +70(2025-2088MHz)/+400(8.8Gbps)) SSD: Samsung 840 Pro 256GB (main boot drive), Transcend SSD370 128GB PSU: Seasonic X-660 80+ Gold Case: Antec P110 Silent, 5 intakes 1 exhaust Monitor: AOC G2460PF 1080p 144Hz (150Hz max w/ DP, 121Hz max w/ HDMI) TN panel Keyboard: Logitech G610 Orion (Cherry MX Blue) with SteelSeries Apex M260 keycaps Mouse: BenQ Zowie FK1

 

Model: HP Omen 17 17-an110ca CPU: i7-8750H (0.125V core & cache, 50mV SA undervolt) GPU: GTX 1060 6GB Mobile (+80/+450, 1650MHz~1750MHz 0.78V~0.85V) RAM: 8+8GB DDR4-2400 18-17-17-39 2T Storage: 1TB HP EX920 PCIe x4 M.2 SSD + 1TB Seagate 7200RPM 2.5" HDD (ST1000LM049-2GH172), 128GB Toshiba PCIe x2 M.2 SSD (KBG30ZMV128G) gone cooking externally Monitor: 1080p 126Hz IPS G-sync

 

Desktop benching:

Cinebench R15 Single thread:168 Multi-thread: 833 

SuperPi (v1.5 from Techpowerup, PI value output) 16K: 0.100s 1M: 8.255s 32M: 7m 45.93s

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Posted · Original PosterOP
3 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

The argument for AMD is to actually spend less (say a R5 3600) and get faster cards. What will you use?

 

I'll be using a 1080 ti.Since i already have a z370/z390 coming from amazon , sure i can cancel/return it if i want.

and since i do want 144fps stable at 1440p every fps matters i guess.

and since i do have a cpu waterblock that i think its only for intel since its a xspc block i would also probably need a xspc amd kit. Too much work .

 

12 minutes ago, NumLock21 said:

3000MHz ram will still work fine with Ryzen, so I don't see what the huge deal is.

Not much really just that if i'm looking for most fps and i already have most intel part.

if i do go amd i would have to do a few things that i just dont want to deal with.

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Equally clocked, generally they are pretty even. Most benchmarks you see compare stock for stock, and that's going to be a 4.3ghz vs 4.6ghz all-core comparison. That said, nobody (should) be running these at stock, and a conservative 5ghz for each pretty much brings them into margin of error. In cases where they are similarly clocked, the difference is in fps is so far beyond perceivable difference it may as well not even exist.

 

HT gives about a 25-30% efficiency boost, but it can be tricky to really calculate exactly how it affects each individual application, if it even uses HT effectively.

 

In some cases, it won't matter either way, but in other cases, the lack of HT can cause some problems in some poorly coded software.

 

Personally, I wouldn't take anything without HT/SMT.

 

I would personally also choose the 8700k because the STIM in the 9th generation is not renowned for being very good, and the 8700k is much easier to delid and apply LM.

 

I also personally have a gripe with the existence of the 9700k, as it's just an excuse to sell defective 9900ks which Intel chose to elevate to a whole new mainstream segment, the i9.


My System: i7-8700k 5.0ghz All-core delidded @1.375v // Cryorig H7 Quad Lumi // Gigabyte Aorus Z370 Gaming 5 // 32GB (4x8) Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3200 // XFX Radeon RX 5700 XT RAW II // Corsair 275R Airflow // Seasonic Focus Plus Gold 850w // Intel 660P 1TB NVME M.2 SSD/1TB Samsung 860 EVO/512GB Silicon Power A55/1TB 2.5" HGST HDD/2TB Seagate Barracuda // Displays: AOC AGON AG241QX/Lenovo L24Q-30/Lenovo L24Q-30 // Razer Black Widow TE Chroma - Logitech G502 // Corsair H70 Gaming Headset

 

Wife's System: i7-8700 // Arctic Freezer 33 // Gigabyte Z390M Gaming // 16GB (2x8) Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 // Sapphire Vega 64 // NZXT S340 // Seasonic Focus Plus Gold 850w // 1TB Samsung 860 EVO/4TB Western Digital HDD // Displays: ASUS VG248QE/ASUS VG245H/ASUS VP248Q // Corsair K68 Mechanical Keyboard // Logitech G602 // LG BDRW // NexStar 5.25" USB 3 Enclosure

 

TV Gamer: Ryzen 5 1600 3.9ghz All-core @1.39v // Wraith PRISM // Gigabyte B450 Aorus M // 16GB (2x8) Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 // XFX Radeon RX 580 8GB XXX Edition // Thermaltake Versa H17 // Corsair Vengeance Silver 650W // 120GB Sandisk SSD/120GB PNY CS900/4TB Western Digital Blue // Display: 50" Westinghouse 1080p // Rii Wireless Mini Keyboard w/Touchpad/Xbox One Controllers

 

Son's System: i5-9400 // Cryorig H7 Quad Lumi // ASRock Z370 Extreme 4 // 16GB GeIL Potenza DDR 3200 // ASUS RX 570 4GB OC // NZXT S340 Black // Seasonic S12II 620w Bronze // 525GB Crucial MX300/500GB Wester Digital Blue // Display: Dell P2417H - Eagletech KG010 Mechanical Keyboard // Logitech G203

 

Daughter's System: i3-8350k // Cooler Master i71c // MSI H310M Pro VDH-Plus // 16GB T-Force Vulkan 2666 (2400) // Zotac GTX 1060 3GB Mini // DarkFlash Micro ATX White // Corsair CX550 // 480GB PNY CS1311 SSD // Display: Scepter 20" 1080p - Logitech Keyboard and Mouse

 

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I had to make the same choice 1 year ago, between i7-8700K and i7-9700K. 

I chose i7-9700K, and I don’t regret it! 

 

The i7-9700K has more “muscles”, it stays cooler, and it works better in games. 

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8700K for its HT

9th gen desktop i7 are the only i7s ever in Intel history without HT. 


Intel Xeon E5 1650 v3 @ 3.5GHz 6C:12T / CM212 Evo / Asus X99 Deluxe / 16GB (4x4GB) DDR4 3000 Trident-Z / Samsung 850 Pro 256GB / Intel 335 240GB / WD Red 2 & 3TB / Antec 850w / RTX 2070 / Win10 Pro x64

HP Envy X360 15: Intel Core i5 8250U @ 1.6GHz 4C:8T / 8GB DDR4 / Intel UHD620 + Nvidia GeForce MX150 4GB / Intel 120GB SSD / Win10 Pro x64

 

HP Envy x360 BP series Intel 8th gen

AMD ThreadRipper 2!

5820K & 6800K 3-way SLI mobo support list

 

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I was in the same boat. Got the 8700k. Kinda wish I got the 9700 but after all this back and forth and them being so close, I realized I should have got the 9900k. 


Main RIg Corsair Air 540, I7 8700k, ASUS ROG Strix Z370-H, G.Skill TridentZ 16GB, EVGA 1080TI SC Black, EVGA 850 GQ, Acer xG270HU 2560x1440@144hz

 

Spare RIg Corsair Air 540, I7 4770K, Asus Maximus VI Extreme, G.Skill Ares 32Gb, EVGA 1080sc & 1060 SSC, Corsair CX850M, Acer KG251Q 1920x1080@240hz 

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP

thanks for the help i'll just play,eeny meeny,since there are no wrong answers.

i do plan to oc to 5ghz if the cpu lets me and if temps are in control if anything i'll delid it if i do go 8700k. got tp wait till tomorrow still since bb wont price match on Holiday .

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28 minutes ago, JustSum said:

thanks for the help i'll just play,eeny meeny,since there are no wrong answers.

i do plan to oc to 5ghz if the cpu lets me and if temps are in control if anything i'll delid it if i do go 8700k. got tp wait till tomorrow still since bb wont price match on Holiday .

I’d take the advice of Mick Naughty and buy the i9-9900K, or even i9-9900KS, (if you can afford that, of course...)

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Posted · Original PosterOP
55 minutes ago, NDRE said:

I’d take the advice of Mick Naughty and buy the i9-9900K, or even i9-9900KS, (if you can afford that, of course...)

if i where to do that i would def just go AMD, ryzen 9 3900x for 500$. I'll stick with the i7 for now.

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I have the 8700k, but the 9700k just seems like a better buy.

 

8 true cores

no toothpaste between the ihs and the die

easier to OC in my experience


My Gaming PC:
Asus Strix RTX 2080 2150MHz core, 8000MHz memory (3080 soon :D)
i7 8700k @4.95GHz delid + a fuckton of voltage (1.375V LLC3, yeah its a below average OCer) - NZXT x72
G.Skill Trident Z @3450MHz 32GB CL15 (3466 and 3200 mixed CL16) OC
Asus Maximus X Hero
Samsung 840 PRO 128GB (Windows)

Crucial P1 M.2 NVME 1TB (Games)
Samsung 860 EVO 1TB (Games)
Samsung 860 EVO 500GB (Stuff)
Seagate Backup Plus 8TB (Shadowplay and Backups)
Corsair RM-850X

Lian Li O11Dynamic
Dell S2721DGF 165hz 1440p / ASUS ROG SWIFT PG258Q  240hz, BenQ ZOWIE XL2720 144hz, Acer S242HLDBID 60hz

Logitech G Pro Wireless (Corepad Skatez) / Razer Viper Ultimate / Endgame Gear XM1 / Cooler Master MM711
Ducky One 2 Mecha Mini (MX Black) / One 2 TKL (Silver/Blue)

 

My Silent Multimedia PC:

Ryzen 2700 @4GHz 1.337V - Noctua NH-D15

Powecolor RX 5700 XT Red Devil 2030MHz Core, 935MHz Memory, undervolt

G.Skill Trident Z 3200MHz

MSI B450 Pro Carbon AC

Kingston A400 240GB (Windows) + 480GB (Games)

Corsair RM-650

Be Quiet Silent Base 601 with 1x 140mm Noctua exhaust from my D15

Samsung Q60R (4k 60hz for Windows, 1440p 120hz Freesync for gaming)

Logitech G Pro Wireless

Ducky One 2 TKL (Silver/Blue)

 

My Notebook:

Asus Zephyrus G14 Top Spec 120hz

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