FTC & EU Commission Zero in on NVIDIA GPP Calls for Investigation & Complaints

[Kamjam21xx]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

So, you admit how silly the idea of making up laws in order to charge a person who's already done the action not against the law at the time, is?

are you stating that believe it for a fact to be silly?

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

So, you admit how silly the idea of making up laws in order to charge a person who's already done the action not against the law at the time, is?

Exactly,  Very few laws are ever applied retrospectively.  There is a very good reason for that too.  IF Nvidia can;'t be charged under current laws then they cannot make new laws for yesterdays actions.    

 

I can't believe people are even discussing this, it is hardly a complex concept.

[App4that]

Just now, Kamjam21xx said:

are you stating that believe it for a fact to be silly?

The fact is you and any government can do as they want.

 

They're also held liable by the global market and other countries. Also a fact. 

[Notional]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

Wouldn't bother Nvidia at all, they'd sit back and let the board partners go to town on it. 

It wouldn't bother NVidia to lose the second largest market in the world? Are you high? What do you think the board partners are going to do? All their stuff is made outside of the EU. It would be barred from being imported in the EU.

[Kamjam21xx]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

The fact is you and any government can do as they want.

 

They're also held liable by the global market and other countries. Also a fact. 

What... ?

[App4that]

3 minutes ago, Notional said:

It wouldn't bother NVidia to lose the second largest market in the world? Are you high? What do you think the board partners are going to do? All their stuff is made outside of the EU. It would be barred from being imported in the EU.

If Nvidia can't do buisness in the EU, you lose MSI, ASUS, EVGA, GIGABYTE, and anyone wanting to sell Nvidia products. 

 

2 minutes ago, Kamjam21xx said:

What... ?

Making up laws to charge citizens for actions they took before the law took place, is one reason wars happen. 

[Razor01]

9 minutes ago, Notional said:

No problem, because I said 'Murica. Besides the intersectional seminists are way ahead of you. Everything they don't like is "hate" speech, and hate speech is illegal

 

EUC can easily prove it. They can ask for full access to ALL communications between NVidia and other companies, as well as pull them into a trial to testify. Sure, if NVidia doesn't have EU offices, they can just deny and refuse, but that would just give them an instant guilty sentence. A company in an EU court is not necessarily innocent until proven guilty.

 

You keep bringing the FTC into it. The EUC has convicted companies with no involvement to the FTC.

Yes they could. That would not go well for NVidia.

 

Please show me because the two you already talked about MS (windows explorer) and Google search, I already showed you the FTC cases, which started before the EU's

 

No its much harder to prove in the EU.

 

EU's laws and the way they proceed protect the party that is being looked into, the US on the other hand it protects the person that is pursuing the case.

 

Come on this was talked about after VW's fiasco

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-consumers/eu-plans-more-powers-for-consumers-to-sue-companies-idUSKBN1HI1KI

 

This is also why US is looked as a sue heaven nation.

[mr moose]

3 minutes ago, Notional said:

It wouldn't bother NVidia to lose the second largest market in the world? Are you high? What do you think the board partners are going to do? All their stuff is made outside of the EU. It would be barred from being imported in the EU.

That'll never happen.  Consumer demand would tear the EU apart before they let a government interfere with their businesses.   There is a reason why brexit happened,  don't make the mistake of thinking it's just the stupid English who would turn on the EU if they started preventing specific products from being sold in the EU.

[Notional]

3 minutes ago, App4that said:

If Nvidia can't do buisness in the EU, you lose MSI, ASUS, EVGA, GIGABYTE, and anyone wanting to sell Nvidia products. 

 

Making up laws to charge citizens for actions they took before the law took place, is one reason wars happen. 

All those companies sell AMD GPU's, motherboards, and at least two af them sells laptops in the EU as well. Heck some of them sell desktops and monitors too in the EU. Are you honestly telling me, that these companies would some how stand behind NVidia "sign our GPP or get fracked", by pulling their entire operations out of the second largest market in the world? You didn't think this through, did you?

2 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

Please show me because the two you already talked about MS (windows explorer) and Google search, I already showed you the FTC cases, which started before the EU's

 

No its much harder to prove in the EU.

 

EU's laws and the way they proceed protect the party that is being looked into, the US on the other hand it protects the person that is pursuing the case.

https://mlexmarketinsight.com/contact-us/ftcwatch/selected-2017-articles/ftc-urged-to-reopen-google-probe-after-record-eu-fine

[Notional]

4 minutes ago, mr moose said:

That'll never happen.  Consumer demand would tear the EU apart before they let a government interfere with their businesses.   There is a reason why brexit happened,  don't make the mistake of thinking it's just the stupid English who would turn on the EU if they started preventing specific products from being sold in the EU.

Brexit happened because the EU took too much power away from the citizens of the UK, and forced bonkers immigration laws on the UK. It had nothing to do with products or companies. The FTC barred plenty of (albeit obsolete) products in the law suit between NVidia and Samsung. You don't see anyone whine about that?

[App4that]

2 minutes ago, Notional said:

All those companies sell AMD GPU's, motherboards, and at least two af them sells laptops in the EU as well. Heck some of them sell desktops and monitors too in the EU. Are you honestly telling me, that these companies would some how stand behind NVidia "sign our GPP or get fracked", by pulling their entire operations out of the second largest market in the world? You didn't think this through, did you?

https://mlexmarketinsight.com/contact-us/ftcwatch/selected-2017-articles/ftc-urged-to-reopen-google-probe-after-record-eu-fine

AMD can't keep up now, they admit it. It would make the mining craze look like a sunday sale compaired to Black Friday. Would never be allowed to happen. 

[Razor01]

1 minute ago, Notional said:

All those companies sell AMD GPU's, motherboards, and at least two af them sells laptops in the EU as well. Heck some of them sell desktops and monitors too in the EU. Are you honestly telling me, that these companies would some how stand behind NVidia "sign our GPP or get fracked", by pulling their entire operations out of the second largest market in the world? You didn't think this through, did you?

https://mlexmarketinsight.com/contact-us/ftcwatch/selected-2017-articles/ftc-urged-to-reopen-google-probe-after-record-eu-fine

Did you read that link?  dude I don't think you read it, because the evidence was there, the US thought the evidence was too close to call, the EU found it they could make the call against Google.

 

Who got the info?  FTC did, the EU went on its coat tails.

[mr moose]

2 minutes ago, Notional said:

Brexit happened because the EU took too much power away from the citizens of the UK, and forced bonkers immigration laws on the UK. It had nothing to do with products or companies. The FTC barred plenty of (albeit obsolete) products in the law suit between NVidia and Samsung. You don't see anyone whine about that?

And you don't think taking business and products away from the citizens of other countries won't lead to the same thing?   If the UN told Australia we couldn't import Nvidia GPU's I'd be lobbying my government to give the UN the middle finger.  Along with every University, production company/college, and business that relies on such products.

 

Please,  that will never happen and you are very deluded if you think it will.

[Kamjam21xx]

15 minutes ago, App4that said:

If Nvidia can't do buisness in the EU, you lose MSI, ASUS, EVGA, GIGABYTE, and anyone wanting to sell Nvidia products. 

 

Making up laws to charge citizens for actions they took before the law took place, is one reason wars happen. 

Corporations arent people, idc what they said. 

[Razor01]

6 minutes ago, mr moose said:

And you don't think taking business and products away from the citizens of other countries won't lead to the same thing?   If the UN told Australia we couldn't import Nvidia GPU's I'd be lobbying my government to give the UN the middle finger.  Along with every University, production company/college, and business that relies on such products.

 

Please,  that will never happen and you are very deluded if you think it will.

It would be interesting for the FTC to go up against a panel of Senators and try to explain why they are trying to crush multi billion company that makes super computers for NASA, US military, all the colleges and research facilities in the US and be look it here its hurting AMD, but AMD can't make tech to replace nV's.  And the EU will look the same, since both the US and EU don't want to be eclipsed by China in that race.

[Notional]

4 minutes ago, App4that said:

AMD can't keep up now, they admit it. It would make the mining craze look like a sunday sale compaired to Black Friday. Would never be allowed to happen. 

IF it happened (and that is such a big IF, that I doubt it ever will), it would free up ressources at TSMC,that AMD could easily fill up. It's basically a zero sum game here. Besides, Samsung can make AMD's products as well at this point.

3 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

Did you read that link?  dude I don't think you read it, because the evidence was there, the US thought the evidence was too close to call, the EU found it they could make the call against Google.

 

Who got the info?  FTC did, the EU went on its coat tails.

Yes. I have yet to see anyone anywhere claim that the FTC fought against Google's prioritization of their own store links and google affiliated stores on their search engine. The FTC looked at other things, but I have yet to see any evidence that they did that. 

Just now, mr moose said:

And you don't think taking business and products away from the citizens of other countries won't lead to the same thing?   If the UN told Australia we couldn't import Nvidia GPU's I'd be lobbying my government to give the UN the middle finger.  Along with every University, production company/college, and business that relies on such products.

 

Please,  that will never happen and you are very deluded if you think it will.

No. Most people don't even know what NVidia is, nor care. The few edgy fanboys can't vote, so their opinion doesn't matter. If the news simply stated NVidia had been convicted for anti consumer behaviour, refused to pay up, and as a result got an import ban, absolutely no one would be an this non household name companies side.

That being said, I doubt we will ever see such a ban. If it happened, NVidia would instantly fold as the shareholders would tear them a new one.

[Razor01]

2 minutes ago, Notional said:

IF it happened (and that is such a big IF, that I doubt it ever will), it would free up ressources at TSMC,that AMD could easily fill up. It's basically a zero sum game here. Besides, Samsung can make AMD's products as well at this point.

Yes. I have yet to see anyone anywhere claim that the FTC fought against Google's prioritization of their own store links and google affiliated stores on their search engine. The FTC looked at other things, but I have yet to see any evidence that they did that. 

No. Most people don't even know what NVidia is, nor care. The few edgy fanboys can't vote, so their opinion doesn't matter. If the news simply stated NVidia had been convicted for anti consumer behaviour, refused to pay up, and as a result got an import ban, absolutely no one would be an this non household name companies side.

That being said, I doubt we will ever see such a ban. If it happened, NVidia would instantly fold as the shareholders would tear them a new one.

 

 

I didn't say they fought them to the point they could win, they looked into it and opened the case prior to anything the EU did.  Don't try to change the goal posts here.

 

Tell that to the people that are in the multi billion dollar super computer race. The US and the EU gov is part of that.  They know who its going to upset.  You are looking at from a very narrow few.  The people that really matter to the gov, are the other corporations that its going to hurt if they do such a thing.  And trust me those corporations and Gov agencies will be PISSED if they go and try something like that.

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, Notional said:

No. Most people don't even know what NVidia is, nor care. The few edgy fanboys can't vote, so their opinion doesn't matter. If the news simply stated NVidia had been convicted for anti consumer behaviour, refused to pay up, and as a result got an import ban, absolutely no one would be an this non household name companies side.

That being said, I doubt we will ever see such a ban. If it happened, NVidia would instantly fold as the shareholders would tear them a new one.

Surely you aren't that naive. 

[Notional]

2 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

I didn't say they fraught them to the point they could win, they looked into it and opened the case prior to anything the EU did.  Don't try to change the goal posts here.

 

Tell that to the people that are in the multi billion dollar super computer race. The US and the EU gov is part of that.  They know who its going to upset.

EU convicted Google on their prioritization of stores in their search engines. Show me where the FTC looked into that? FTC looked into a bunch of things, but they never accused Google of that.

 

2 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Surely you aren't that naive. 

Plenty of things gets banned in the EU all the time. No one gives a frack. They just buy something else. Only us tech nerds know NVidia. The average joe only knows the brand on the final product. WHen it comes to computers, people know Microsoft, Google and Apple. Maybe Intel, but most don't. Then they know the brands of their laptops (if they are well known), tv's and smartphones. As long as there is an alternative, no one cares.

 

You really think over 700 million people would be so mad at the ban of a single companies products, that at that point is convicted of anti competitive practices, would brign the entirety of the EU down?

 

Now THAT is being naive. If you don't work at a tech company, ask your co workers what NVidia is. Most won't know or care.

[App4that]

@mr moose, I sounded like this, didn't I? 

 

I'm so sorry. Lesson learned. 

[Razor01]

11 minutes ago, Notional said:

EU convicted Google on their prioritization of stores in their search engines. Show me where the FTC looked into that? FTC looked into a bunch of things, but they never accused Google of that.

 

Plenty of things gets banned in the EU all the time. No one gives a frack. They just buy something else. Only us tech nerds know NVidia. The average joe only knows the brand on the final product. WHen it comes to computers, people know Microsoft, Google and Apple. Maybe Intel, but most don't. Then they know the brands of their laptops (if they are well known), tv's and smartphones. As long as there is an alternative, no one cares.

 

You really think over 700 million people would be so mad at the ban of a single companies products, that at that point is convicted of anti competitive practices, would brign the entirety of the EU down?

 

Now THAT is being naive. If you don't work at a tech company, ask your co workers what NVidia is. Most won't know or care.

 

 

What I linked to, in 2013 they made their judgement on it, it was what they looked into prior to that lol

 

again the link

 

https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/documents/public_statements/statement-commission-regarding-googles-search-practices/130103brillgooglesearchstmt.pdf

 

Seriously thinking you are reading other's posts.

[Notional]

2 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

What I linked to in 2013 it was what they looked into lol

 

again the link

 

https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/documents/public_statements/statement-commission-regarding-googles-search-practices/130103brillgooglesearchstmt.pdf

This is all that the EU convicted Google of wrong doing:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_vs._Google

 

If the FTC prosecuted Google for their shopping prioritization, then I stand corrected. But that is not all the EU convicted Google of. Stating that the FTC is somehow responsible of all of this, is a little bizarre.

[mr moose]

8 minutes ago, Notional said:

EU convicted Google on their prioritization of stores in their search engines. Show me where the FTC looked into that? FTC looked into a bunch of things, but they never accused Google of that.

 

Plenty of things gets banned in the EU all the time. No one gives a frack. They just buy something else. Only us tech nerds know NVidia. The average joe only knows the brand on the final product. WHen it comes to computers, people know Microsoft, Google and Apple. Maybe Intel, but most don't. Then they know the brands of their laptops (if they are well known), tv's and smartphones. As long as there is an alternative, no one cares.

 

You really think over 700 million people would be so mad at the ban of a single companies products, that at that point is convicted of anti competitive practices, would brign the entirety of the EU down?

 

Now THAT is being naive. If you don't work at a tech company, ask your co workers what NVidia is. Most won't know or care.

That's almost sad that you don't know the difference between one of a hundred similar products and a single product (GPU) that most of the research and half the production world relies on.    You go and tell CERN they can't use nvidia.  Or what about the swiss national super computer having to upgrade to AMD next?  

 

You really don't understand just how big Nvidia are do you?  They are not just small time domestic products.

[mr moose]

5 minutes ago, App4that said:

@mr moose, I sounded like this, didn't I? 

 

I'm so sorry. Lesson learned. 

It's all good, I learn from it too. 

[Notional]

1 minute ago, mr moose said:

That's almost sad that you don't know the difference between one of a hundred similar products and a single product (GPU) that most of the research and half the production world relies on.    You go and tell CERN they can't use nvidia.  Or what about the swiss national super computer having to upgrade to AMD next?  

 

You really don't understand just how big Nvidia are do you?  They are not just small time domestic products.

The consumers can still buy their favourite brand. It will just have different component in it.

 

But like I've stated several times, I very much doubt we will see an import ban in the EU. No responsible company would ever let it come to that, dispite their level of vindictiveness. NVidia would fold long before that would happen.