Does anyone else dislike water cooling and overclocking?

[Cyracus]

3 minutes ago, RollTime said:

So put a good fan in an AIO.

yeah, but that pushes the cost up, part of the reason most big air coolers are super competitive with AIOs is that they can afford to put decent fans on them 

[Damascus]

6 minutes ago, emosun said:

so pentium 4 and 6800 gt water blocks were free then?

Id have them wait a few months an get an 8800. No sense in overclocking a dx9 gpu when dx10 was replacing it. 

Not free but if we are talking purely OC and get results you don't need a waterblock.  Every modern gpu auto iverclocks itself massively - no matter if its watercooled or not.  

6 minutes ago, emosun said:

or just turn off AA but whatever floats your boat

Or do both and get double the results.  What if you turn every setting dosn to lowest possible and you still aren't getting what you want?  At that point you can upgrade or oc and I can tell you the oc will be a lot less expensive

[emosun]

1 minute ago, Damascus said:

At that point you can upgrade or oc and I can tell you the oc will be a lot less expensive

less it fries then it's even more expensive as you cant resell a fried gpu lol. 

 

nah , sell off the gpu and buy a faster one. i'm sorry but not really going to change my mind on this issue just curious if others agree and it seems so.

[sazrocks]

7 hours ago, emosun said:

so pentium 4 and 6800 gt water blocks were free then?

1. Of course not, but they could be an investment that lasts multiple CPU generations. 

2. Water blocks aren't necessary to begin overclocking.

7 hours ago, emosun said:

Id have them wait a few months an get an 8800. No sense in overclocking a dx9 gpu when dx10 was replacing it. 

I'd argue the opposite. What does it matter that you are potentially shaving a few months off the 8 year life of a GPU when you are going to be upgrading soon? Heck, that's when I would say throw caution to the wind and overclock the crap out of that thing. It isn't an either or thing; you can overclock until you have money to upgrade, whether that is in a few moths or a few years.

7 hours ago, emosun said:

or just turn off AA but whatever floats your boat

I... really don't understand this argument. So instead of getting free performance I should degrade my graphical experience? How about I keep the graphical experience and the competitive edge and overclock?

 

7 hours ago, emosun said:

less it fries then it's even more expensive as you cant resell a fried gpu lol. 

I dare you to try to fry a pascal-based GPU without a BIOS mod.

Heck, any modern GPU should be fine.

Heat is the only real issue, and that 

A. Is easily monitorable

B. Not even that much of a problem (see: laptops)

[emosun]

1 minute ago, sazrocks said:

So instead of getting free performance I should degrade my graphical experience?

i wish i lived on whatever planet you live on where water cooling components are free. 

 

course apparently all pc parts where you live are free if frying them overclocking isn't an issue. In your rare case I say go ahead and overclock then. 

[Cyracus]

4 minutes ago, emosun said:

less it fries then it's even more expensive as you cant resell a fried gpu lol. 

nah , sell off the gpu and buy a faster one. i'm sorry but not really going to change my mind on this issue just curious if others agree and it seems so.

well, with pascal cards you have to physically modify the card to push enough voltage to fry the card so... also every gpu I've fiddled with can raise the core clock without touching voltage, and even if you do increase the voltage a little research and you can learn pretty well safe ranges that you can increase voltage if you still want more. 

[Drak3]

1 hour ago, emosun said:

Nor do the gains from overclocking seem worth the small risk that the components may have a shorter lifespan or fail

Modern components aren't likely to fail from overclocking without removing multiple safeguards. And even with extreme overclocking, the component will outlive its usable lifespan.

 

52 minutes ago, emosun said:

honestly if i could run a vw engine in my car and eliminate the radiator I would do it just to simplify the engine more.

That's a fairly stupid idea. Air cooled VWs are less reliable than similar vehicles that are watercooled because they're far more prone to overheating. The only engines I can think of that are more reliable when aircooled are smaller dirt bike motors.

 

1 hour ago, emosun said:

I usually don't recommend it as the cost doesn't seem quite worth the hassle of dealing with/maintaining a water cooling system.

With a little fore thought, a reliable, low maintenance loop can be had that can EASILY outlast multiple systems.

[sazrocks]

4 minutes ago, emosun said:

i wish i lived on whatever planet you live on where water cooling components are free. 

I'm just going to go ahead and quote a different section from the post you are quoting.

8 minutes ago, sazrocks said:

Water blocks aren't necessary to begin overclocking.

As an addition, essentially everything in my PC that can be overclocked, is, yet you will find not a single drop of water in my system (check my sig).

 

4 minutes ago, emosun said:

course apparently all pc parts where you live are free if frying them overclocking isn't an issue. In your rare case I say go ahead and overclock then. 

Read my posts please. I've quoted them below for your convenience:

7 minutes ago, sazrocks said:

I dare you to try to fry a pascal-based GPU without a BIOS mod.

Heck, any modern GPU should be fine.

Heat is the only real issue, and that 

A. Is easily monitorable

B. Not even that much of a problem (see: laptops)

 

34 minutes ago, sazrocks said:

As for risk, it is minimal/almost nonexistent except for absolute trash components, as long as you use a shred of common sense.

As an addition, most motherboard BIOSes have locks in them to prevent accidental absurd voltages, which are even then only applicable to CPUs.

[Guest]

Sorta ties into what I was saying here;

 

Sure you can do it but are you actually going to notice that 5% increase in performance?

[Drak3]

2 minutes ago, Windspeed36 said:

Sure you can do it but are you actually going to notice that 5% increase in performance?

I sure notice the 28% or so OC on my 5930K.

[sazrocks]

6 minutes ago, Windspeed36 said:

Sorta ties into what I was saying here;

*snip*

 

Sure you can do it but are you actually going to notice that 5% increase in performance?

12% (4.2GHz -> 4.7GHz) in my case, and yes, I can. PUBG for example is noticeably smoother.

[emosun]

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

I sure notice the 28% or so OC on my 5930K.

now all you have to do is get it to 50% and you'll be a little bit closer to where a budget cpu will be

like if I use nitrogen on a pentium 4 I might be able to get it as fast as just one core on an early dual core cpu lol.

[Cyracus]

9 minutes ago, Windspeed36 said:

Sure you can do it but are you actually going to notice that 5% increase in performance?

I notice in all the games that I go from under 60 fps to at or above

[PETRGangKing]

13 minutes ago, Windspeed36 said:

Sorta ties into what I was saying here;

 

Sure you can do it but are you actually going to notice that 5% increase in performance?

I've got about a 20% overclock on my CPU and a 34% overclock on my GPU. I definitely notice it over stock speeds

[Drak3]

Just now, emosun said:

now all you have to do is get it to 50% and you'll be a little bit closer to where a budget cpu will be

like if I use nitrogen on a pentium 4 I might be able to get it as fast as just one core on an early dual core cpu lol.

That was one of the stupidest things I've read.

 

[Damascus]

1 hour ago, emosun said:

less it fries then it's even more expensive as you cant resell a fried gpu lol. 

 

nah , sell off the gpu and buy a faster one. i'm sorry but not really going to change my mind on this issue just curious if others agree and it seems so.

How in the world are you going to fry a modern gpu?  Its so difficult you woild need to bios mod or make physical volt mods.  To get a stable, safe and impacting (10% or more sometimes) involves no risk and little effort.

[emosun]

Just now, Damascus said:

How in the world are you going to fry a modern gpu?  Its so difficult you woild need to bios mod or make physical volt mods.  To get a stable, safe and impacting (10% or more sometimes) involves no risk and little effort.

hmm ok go buy some old mining gpu's then and let me know how those work out what with them not frying and all.

[Damascus]

2 minutes ago, emosun said:

hmm ok go buy some old mining gpu's then and let me know how those work out what with them not frying and all.

Mining gpus are generally undervolted and run 24/7 their entire lifespan.  That has nothing to do with OC, its the natural result of running a gpu nonstop 100% load for months or years.

[Cyracus]

6 hours ago, Drak3 said:

-snip-

Somebody failed to crush the Kardashians back in the early 2000s and look where the F we are now. But simply, I spent ~$70 on my cpu cooler, my OC is clear in my sig, my graphics card factory OC has the core hitting high 1700s to low 1800s, the extra ~250 and a few hundred mhz on the memory makes a big difference in at least a handful of games, and my gpu is definitely on the cheap side but the cooler is great (the fins run the length of the card so it even pushes some heat out of the case )

6 hours ago, emosun said:

hmm ok go buy some old mining gpu's then and let me know how those work out what with them not frying and all.

yeah, cards often pushed to their limit and and run full bore non-stop for who knows how long... That's like saying that a chevy small block v-8 ran at redline until it dies is a bad engine because it gave out

[emosun]

7 minutes ago, Damascus said:

Mining gpus are generally undervolted and run 24/7 their entire lifespan.  That has nothing to do with OC, its the natural result of running a gpu nonstop 100% load for months or years.

Yeah no way that running a gpu at 140% it's speed is comparable lol.

I see whats happening here , I understand when you're new to computers you don't have a lot to fall back on , but give it some time and you'll learn the whole correlation between running something beyond it's spec and shortened lifespan.

Usually you learn this right after shooting a 100 shot of nos into your stock honda civic but this will also be a comparable learning experience.

[Cyracus]

7 minutes ago, emosun said:

Yeah no way that running a gpu at 140% it's speed is comparable lol.

for a few hours a day vs 24/7 yeah, not really an apples to apples comparison there, also you aren't exceeding the potentials of the silicon, you're pushing it closer to it's limit, so stock would be like 80% and a perfect OC would get it to 99-100%, most are closer to 95%so the foundation of you're argument is false, might wanna start by reevaluating that

 

[emosun]

10 minutes ago, Cyracus said:

the foundation of you're argument is false

oh gee let me use a much more scientific argument like.....

10 minutes ago, Cyracus said:

stock would be like 80%

much in the same way a light bulb is only 80% of it's brightness...... just bump up the wall voltage and watch it get brighter......

10 minutes ago, Cyracus said:

you're pushing it closer to it's limit

and everyone knows the gpu works best when its right on the edge of crashing.

 

ideally it should be pushed so hard that if it was pushed a single % more it would crash. nothing wrong with that. SUPER good for longevity. 

 

no , i agree with you. A+ methodology.

[sazrocks]

1 minute ago, emosun said:

oh gee let me use a much more scientific argument like.....

much in the same way a light bulb is only 80% of it's brightness...... just bump up the wall voltage and watch it get brighter......

and everyone knows the gpu works best when it right on the edge of crashing.

 

ideally it should be pushed so hard that if it was push a single % more it would crash. nothing wrong with that. SUPER good for longevity. 

 

no , i agree with you. A+ methodology.

How does it hurt the GPU to run on the edge of crashing?

[emosun]

Just now, sazrocks said:

How does it hurt the GPU to run on the edge of crashing?

how does it hurt an electrical component to run several times above it's specification for an extended period of time?

gee i dont know what a mystery. 

I'm amazed you don't see the correlation between a mining card running at 100% it's speed constantly vs a gaming card running at 140% it's speed for a few hours a day. amazing

[Guest]

If people keep going off topic with this I’ll have to get one of the mods to start nuking accounts