Anyone bench Kaby Lake with DDR3L??

[utroz]

So there are Z170 boards that used DDR3 so I was wondering if anyone has run Kaby Lake on them. I would like to see a comparison between DDR3 and DDR4.  An example of such a board is https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/GA-Z170-HD3-DDR3-rev-10#ov 

[rip]

RAM would be the least that effect system performance.

 

[utroz]

Just now, rip said:

RAM would be the least that effect system performance.

 

Yes I know this but I am just wondering if anyone actually runs such a system in real life. 

[Enderman]

Probably someone does, but no reviewer is going to waste their time reviewing something that 3 and a half people use...

[dizmo]

Agreed. Not enough boards support the feature, so it's not worth reviewing. Honestly if you're basically buying everything anyway, just pony up the money to get new RAM as well.

[rip]

2 minutes ago, Enderman said:

a half people use...

hmm

[utroz]

5 minutes ago, Enderman said:

Probably someone does, but no reviewer is going to waste their time reviewing something that 3 and a half people use...

But that is the whole novelty of it. Kinda like 28 core Xeon's, Xeon Phi's, Arm development boards, Ln2 cooling. Sometimes the rarer something is the more interesting it can be even if the results are easy to predict (such as using DDR4 at the same speeds and timings as DDR3(L).  Kinda like Linus's HOLY $hit episodes..

[Enderman]

3 minutes ago, utroz said:

But that is the whole novelty of it. Kinda like 28 core Xeon's, Xeon Phi's, Arm development boards, Ln2 cooling. Sometime the rarer something is the more interesting it can be even if the results are easy to predict (such as using DDR4 at the same speeds and timings as DDR3(L). 

"omg I'm using slightly older ram technology, so I get half an fps less"

so interesting!

 

Stuff like xeon phis and LN2 cooling actually makes a huge difference, and a lot of people use those compared to the people who spent money on a new motherboard, new CPU, but couldn't afford an extra few bucks to replace their DDR3L. Oh, and that's already for the extremely small number of people who were using DDR3L instead of DDR3.

It's a niche within a niche.

 

Just like the number of people using IDE drives with their GTX1080ti gaming PC.

Maybe we should do benchmarks on how much fps loss you get when using IDE for gaming in 2017! I bet there are at least two people who care!

[dexT]

Should be same perf at same freq/timings.

[utroz]

1 minute ago, Enderman said:

"omg I'm using slightly older ram technology, so I get half an fps less"

so interesting!

 

Stuff like xeon phis and LN2 cooling actually makes a huge difference, and a lot of people use those compared to the people who spent money on a new motherboard, new CPU, but couldn't afford an extra few bucks to replace their DDR3L. Oh, and that's already for the extremely small number of people who were using DDR3L instead of DDR3.

It's a niche within a niche.

I am well aware I was just curious. The first odd ram setup I ever had was using a RAM Tree that allowed me to used 4 30Pin SIMMS in one 72 Pinn SIMM slot. It actually did effect performance due to the fact that the ram was rated at a higher NS (Nano Second) rating. So another kinda weird thing is could they make a DDR3(L) Z370 board or did Intel actually change the IMC on Coffee Lake from Kaby Lake and Skylake? The info doesn't seem to be out in the public.. 

[utroz]

Just now, dexT said:

Should be same perf at same freq/timings.

Actually DDR3 should be faster by a bit at the same speeds and timings due to the design of DDR4. This has always been true since going from DDR to DDR2, and DDR2 to DDR3 (and maybe even before like FPM to EDO and SDR to DDR..)

[dexT]

1 minute ago, utroz said:

Actually DDR3 should be faster by a bit at the same speeds and timings due to the design of DDR4. This has always been true since going from DDR to DDR2, and DDR2 to DDR3 (and maybe even before like FPM to EDO and SDR to DDR..)

I can see that. My DDR2 1400 C5 tears it up and scores higher in a lot of benches using the same CPU than faster DDR3/higher CL but still being nearly even in the latency mathematical equation.

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, dizmo said:

Agreed. Not enough boards support the feature, so it's not worth reviewing. Honestly if you're basically buying everything anyway, just pony up the money to get new RAM as well.

DDR3L is different to DDR3 and is typically used in the SODIMM form factor, I would say OP would be looking at buying new RAM anyway  

[utroz]

Just now, RorzNZ said:

DDR3L is different to DDR3 and is typically used in the SODIMM form factor, I would say OP would be looking at buying new RAM anyway  

Yes DDR3L SODIMM's save a couple watts which helps you get 15min extra battery life on your laptop.. The whole reason that Skylake used DDR3L and not regular DDR3 was that the voltage was too high for DDR3 and Intel thought it could fry the CPU and IMC in the long run. Also I am not buying any DDR4 anytime soon.. No point for me with my current setups..

[dizmo]

3 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

DDR3L is different to DDR3 and is typically used in the SODIMM form factor, I would say OP would be looking at buying new RAM anyway  

DDR3L is just low voltage. I don't think any of the boards use SODIMM.

[utroz]

1 minute ago, dizmo said:

DDR3L is just low voltage. I don't think any of the boards use SODIMM.

Exactly, you can just undervolt DDR3 and you have DDR3L.. Well there may be some weird mini ITX board that use SODIMM DDR3L or some other small form factor.. 

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, dizmo said:

DDR3L is just low voltage. I don't think any of the boards use SODIMM.

Laptops and boards that use form factors that are mini-ITX or similar use it. DDR3L is not just low voltage. Boards that are compatible with DDR3L may not be compatible with DDR3. It is not interchangeable! I believe there are some Skylake boards that do support standard DDR3 however.

[dizmo]

1 minute ago, RorzNZ said:

Laptops and boards that use form factors that are mini-ITX or similar use it. DDR3L is not just low voltage. Boards that are compatible with DDR3L may not be compatible with DDR3. It is not interchangeable! I believe there are some Skylake boards that do support standard DDR3 however.

Not really. Finding an mITX board with SODIMM slots is extremely rare. Look it up. Every single motherboard that's DDR3L compatible for Skylake uses standard sized DIMMs.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, dizmo said:

Not really. Finding an mITX board with SODIMM slots is extremely rare. Look it up. Every single motherboard that's DDR3L compatible for Skylake uses standard sized DIMMs.

I'd take another look to see whether it is really DDR3L. 

[dizmo]

5 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

I'd take another look to see whether it is really DDR3L. 

Here, let me explain it for you in the most simplest way with this AsRock board.

http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/H110M-HDVD3/

Quote

ASRock Super Alloy

Supports 7th and 6th Generation Intel® Core™ Processors (Socket 1151)

Supports Dual Channel DDR3/DDR3L 1866(OC)

 

Now, let's take a look at the Kaby page on the Intel website.

https://ark.intel.com/products/88195/Intel-Core-i7-6700K-Processor-8M-Cache-up-to-4_20-GHz

Quote

Memory Types DDR4-1866/2133, DDR3L-1333/1600 @ 1.35V

No mention of DDR3, so yo can't claim that it's only referring to that for the write up of the AsRock board.

 

Here's three companies making DDR3L in standard DIMMs, easily found with a quick Google search.

http://www.adata.com/en/specification/225

http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/ct102464bd160b

http://www.legitreviews.com/silicon-power-now-offering-ddr3-ultra-low-voltage-memory_127601

 

Which is yet another reason why it's not widely adopted.