Please Recommend me a UPS

[Mohak Arora]

Hi

I'm building a video-editing PC for Personal use, with a Power Supply of 650W rating and maximum 3 monitors attached. With these considerations & some studying on the internet. I found that 1200VA should be my UPS rating.

I'm from India. Brownouts here, are very frequent, therefore a UPS is needed, not for Backup (I already have fine offline backup), but for handling fluctuations. So my requirements:

• Low Backup but Line interactive
• Cost Effective
• High lifespan (of both battery & UPS)
• No need for any additional features

Please recommend me a UPS, based on the above requirements (without considering availability). Also, is my calculation of 1200VA correct? Here are my build plan specs:

 

Monitors: 2 or 3 

Processor: Ryzen 7 1700 (Overclock to 3.7GHz with Wraith Spire cooler)

Graphics Card: ZOTAC GeForce GTX 1070 Mini - it has 2 fans

RAM: CORSAIR Vengeance LPX 16GB (2x8GB) 3000MHz DDR4 model: CMK16GX4M2B3000C15 - Overclock to 2933MHz

Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-AB350 Gaming 3

SSD: Samsung 850 EVO 1TB

Hard Drive: WD Blue 2TB.

Power Supply: CoolerMaster V650 80+ Gold Fully Modular

Case: CoolerMaster MasterCase 5 (windowed) & using only 2 fans that are pre-included.

 

Thanks a lot

[manikyath]

is APC available in your region? they're my personal preference, and appareantly also the preference of the company i work at and all their customers (except the ones that have the budget for something like eaton's racks of solid lead)

[Mohak Arora]

2 minutes ago, manikyath said:

is APC available in your region? they're my personal preference, and appareantly also the preference of the company i work at and all their customers (except the ones that have the budget for something like eaton's racks of solid lead)

Thanks for reply. Yes, APC is quite famous here & available. Should I go for 1000VA or 1100VA or 1500VA?

[ATFink]

Unfortunately I don't know the availability of product from Amazon in India, but here are some options I found. I own the Cyberpower model and it is very good.

 

APC:

https://www.amazon.com/APC-Back-UPS-Battery-Protector-BR1300G/dp/B0038ZU2FC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1494367180&sr=8-1&keywords=apc+battery+backup+%26+surge+protector+1350

 

Cyberpower:

https://www.amazon.com/CyberPower-CP1500AVRLCD-Intelligent-Mini-Tower-Features/dp/B000OFXKFI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1494367149&sr=8-1&keywords=cyberpower%2B1500avr&th=1

[Mohak Arora]

3 minutes ago, ATFink said:

Unfortunately I don't know the availability of product from Amazon in India, but here are some options I found. I own the Cyberpower model and it is very good.

 

APC:

https://www.amazon.com/APC-Back-UPS-Battery-Protector-BR1300G/dp/B0038ZU2FC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1494367180&sr=8-1&keywords=apc+battery+backup+%26+surge+protector+1350

 

Cyberpower:

https://www.amazon.com/CyberPower-CP1500AVRLCD-Intelligent-Mini-Tower-Features/dp/B000OFXKFI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1494367149&sr=8-1&keywords=cyberpower%2B1500avr&th=1

No worries, actually buying stuff in India is kinda awkward. Online prices are higher than the ones available from local vendors. So I just wanted to get some recommendations on VA value to get & some models, without considering availability. This helps.

[ATFink]

You could probably slide by with a 1000VA model depending on the power consumption of your monitors. Your PC probably doesn't pull more 300 watts at any point in time, factor in a 1.25 efficiency loss component from your PSU and you have 375 watts from the wall with your PC at maximum (the 1.25 factor is a little overkill, you probably get about 84-87% efficiency with your PSU, not 80%). Lets round up to 400 watts. The 3 monitors must each pull greater than 66 watts to require a UPS with a greater than 1000VA rating. If power goes out a lot you may want to consider a UPS with a greater VA rating to reduce strain on the UPS. As you can see with the Cyberpower model the price variation is not that great.

[Mohak Arora]

19 minutes ago, ATFink said:

You could probably slide by with a 1000VA model depending on the power consumption of your monitors. Your PC probably doesn't pull more 300 watts at any point in time, factor in a 1.25 efficiency loss component from your PSU and you have 375 watts from the wall with your PC at maximum (the 1.25 factor is a little overkill, you probably get about 84-87% efficiency with your PSU, not 80%). Lets round up to 400 watts. The 3 monitors must each pull greater than 66 watts to require a UPS with a greater than 1000VA rating. If power goes out a lot you may want to consider a UPS with a greater VA rating to reduce strain on the UPS. As you can see with the Cyberpower model the price variation is not that great.

Wow! I never knew that my PC would just pull 300W. 1080p Monitors that I'm considering pull 30W (MAXIMUM). I think you're right, 1500VA should be an overkill. But this hits another question in my mind. Do I need think about future consideration, like buying an audio system after an year? What is the lifespan of a good quality UPS like APC BR1500G?

[ATFink]

I assumed about 100 watts from your CPU, and 200 watts from you're GPU when both are overclocked. Other components pull some power, but not much. That's a very harsh scenario for both CPU and GPU assuming (I'm 100% certain you won't be). Maybe 20 watts of power from the rest of the system combined, and that's why I chose a liberal loss coefficient and then rounded up another 25 watts on top of that for the power drawn from the wall.

[Mohak Arora]

23 minutes ago, ATFink said:

I assumed about 100 watts from your CPU, and 200 watts from you're GPU when both are overclocked. Other components pull some power, but not much. That's a very harsh scenario for both CPU and GPU assuming (I'm 100% certain you won't be). Maybe 20 watts of power from the rest of the system combined, and that's why I chose a liberal loss coefficient and then rounded up another 25 watts on top of that for the power drawn from the wall.

I think you're right, we all are kinda overbuying our power supplies. Can you tell me anything about the lifespan of ups or your experience with them?

[ATFink]

Just now, Mohak Arora said:

I think you're right, we all are kinda overbuying our power supplies. Can you tell me anything about the lifespan of ups or your experience with them?

I had a CyberPower 825VA unit before the 1500VA unit I have now, and It worked fine with my rig when I had a GTX 760. I had the 825VA unit for 4 years and it worked like a charm. I gave it to my mom to backup her computer and again, works like a charm. Now that I have an OCed R9 Fury I needed something more. It has a display unit which is pretty cool as well. I have had several power fluctuations in my apartment and the in-line protection and backup kicks in so fast the computer stays on without slowing down or even noticing there was an issue. I can speak for the cyberpower units as a 2 time customer (they're very good by the way), but apparently APC is also really good based on other replies in this thread. 

[manikyath]

7 hours ago, ATFink said:

 

Cyberpower:

https://www.amazon.com/CyberPower-CP1500AVRLCD-Intelligent-Mini-Tower-Features/dp/B000OFXKFI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1494367149&sr=8-1&keywords=cyberpower%2B1500avr&th=1

that thing's a simulated sinewave, which is very much not recommended for any electronics.

[ATFink]

7 hours ago, manikyath said:

that thing's a simulated sinewave, which is very much not recommended for any electronics.

What's wrong with that? I don't know so links or somewhere I can start looking? Plus wouldn't the PSU take care of the input wave as long as its fairly consistent?

[manikyath]

4 hours ago, ATFink said:

What's wrong with that? I don't know so links or somewhere I can start looking? Plus wouldn't the PSU take care of the input wave as long as its fairly consistent?

there's a few things UPSes can do to "simulate" an actual pure sine wave like produced by a generator, here organised by cost of implementing and quality of signal:

- simulated sinewave, which is essentially just "turnin on and off DC power" 100 or 120 times per second (for 50 or 60Hz, once positive, once negative) and keeping them on for the same "duty cycle" as a sine wave would have (so for example a fillament light bulb would consume the same wattage). this is only really suitable for stuff like light bulbs, your vaccuum cleaner, and very unsensitive devices.

- stepped approximation, which is basicly the same concept as the last one, except it has "steps" instead of just on or off, and it can progressively step up and down to come to what is essentially a very low quality sine wave. the output singal of this is comparable to what you'd get on a very low quality cable with lots of devices doing all kinds of things they really shouldnt, etc. while it's certainly not perfect, it is deemed acceptable for most devices aside from the absolute most sensitive ones. and is also MUCH more mainstream affordable than better solutions.

- pure sine, which as the name sates, is essentially another "step" on top of the last one, which also contains the extra hardware to "smooth" out the nasty sine wave into a nice curve, this is essentially only affordable for the big guys tho. i doubt you'll even find these at all on consumer market in india (where OP mentioned he's from) let alone be affordable.

 

in image form: a pure sinewave (black), a stepped approximation (red) and a simulated sinewave (blue)

[Mohak Arora]

 

I had a CyberPower 825VA unit before the 1500VA unit I have now, and It worked fine with my rig when I had a GTX 760. I had the 825VA unit for 4 years and it worked like a charm. I gave it to my mom to backup her computer and again, works like a charm. Now that I have an OCed R9 Fury I needed something more. It has a display unit which is pretty cool as well. I have had several power fluctuations in my apartment and the in-line protection and backup kicks in so fast the computer stays on without slowing down or even noticing there was an issue. I can speak for the cyberpower units as a 2 time customer (they're very good by the way), but apparently APC is also really good based on other replies in this thread. 

Thanks for sharing your experieince, so I know they have a good life, only the batteries need to be replaced

[manikyath]

 

Thanks for sharing your experieince, so I know they have a good life, only the batteries need to be replaced

a UPS with a low lifespan doesnt deserve to exist

 

depending on how hard you are on the batteries (surprisingly, even lead-acid cells have trouble with the amperage required for a UPS ) you'll have to replace them every 4-10 years, or even up to 20 if you're *extremely* lucky

 

as for the lifetime of the UPS itself.. the market that UPSes were originally targetted at *expects* them to last no less than 10 years, preferably much, much longer. seeing a 10+ year old UPS in a professional setting is pretty common.

[Mohak Arora]

 

there's a few things UPSes can do to "simulate" an actual pure sine wave like produced by a generator, here organised by cost of implementing and quality of signal:

- simulated sinewave, which is essentially just "turnin on and off DC power" 100 or 120 times per second (for 50 or 60Hz, once positive, once negative) and keeping them on for the same "duty cycle" as a sine wave would have (so for example a fillament light bulb would consume the same wattage). this is only really suitable for stuff like light bulbs, your vaccuum cleaner, and very unsensitive devices.

- stepped approximation, which is basicly the same concept as the last one, except it has "steps" instead of just on or off, and it can progressively step up and down to come to what is essentially a very low quality sine wave. the output singal of this is comparable to what you'd get on a very low quality cable with lots of devices doing all kinds of things they really shouldnt, etc. while it's certainly not perfect, it is deemed acceptable for most devices aside from the absolute most sensitive ones. and is also MUCH more mainstream affordable than better solutions.

- pure sine, which as the name sates, is essentially another "step" on top of the last one, which also contains the extra hardware to "smooth" out the nasty sine wave into a nice curve, this is essentially only affordable for the big guys tho. i doubt you'll even find these at all on consumer market in india (where OP mentioned he's from) let alone be affordable.

 

in image form: a pure sinewave (black), a stepped approximation (red) and a simulated sinewave (blue)

Thanks for sharing this information. I thought that Battery Backups, VA rating & Line Interactive were the only things I needed to care about, but as it turns out Steeped approximation or pure sine wave generation is also important. Really good info.

 

I did some digging into the matter: In india, offline power backup is very common to use in houses because power cuts can last 6 hours or more. The UPS (commonly called inverter) and the high capacity Battery are separate units. In my house I had 2 of these things installed, one for my room and one for rest of the house. The UPS unit now, dedicated to my room is 700VA. Now, I need to research for myself the best possible combo to utilize my current offline power storage (inverter) and/or UPS for computer and also power my new system during power cuts.  There are many Indian companies (known good brands) that are now fulfilling these needs. So yeah! pure sine wave Inverters are available here. In fact, I saw this unit today at my friend's educational institute: https://www.luminouseshop.com/collections/pure-sine-wave-inverter/products/luminous-cruze-3-5-kva-commercial-ups

During determining a good UPS unit (whether for my battery or like the traditional APC one), do I need to think about other factors than these below?:

 

• Battery Backups
• VA rating
• Line Interactive
• Sine waveform

[manikyath]

 

So yeah! pure sine wave Inverters are available here. In fact, I saw this unit today at my friend's educational institute: https://www.luminouseshop.com/collections/pure-sine-wave-inverter/products/luminous-cruze-3-5-kva-commercial-ups

that's actually a rather expensive unit for not coming with batteries. still not to the level of something like a vetus tho, which starts at one extra zero behind the price, and ends at "price on demand"

[Mohak Arora]

 

that's actually a rather expensive unit for not coming with batteries. still not to the level of something like a vetus tho, which starts at one extra zero behind the price, and ends at "price on demand"

hahhaa True that. Actually he runs about 8 computers (200-400$ each) with 8-10 tubelights, 7-8 fans, projector etc. with this beast. So 3.5kVA. Today I saw the load to be 991 Watts with 5 computers On, 2-3 laptops being charged, tubelights & fans as usual (coz who turns them off during the day. lol!). Anyways talking about that, this is what I need to look for right? -

-Battery Backup
-VA rating
-Line Interactive
-Sine waveform

[manikyath]

 

hahhaa True that. Actually he runs about 8 computers (200-400$ each) with 8-10 tubelights, 7-8 fans, projector etc. with this beast. So 3.5kVA. Today I saw the load to be 991 Watts with 5 computers On, 2-3 laptops being charged, tubelights & fans as usual (coz who turns them off during the day. lol!). Anyways talking about that, this is what I need to look for right? -

-Battery Backup
-VA rating
-Line Interactive
-Sine waveform

well.. if you wanna get into it you start talking about capacitor ratings, expected duty cycles, cooling setup (because these things eventually do get hot), battery maintenace, and an infinite list of other things.

 

but honestly, as long as you buy a device from a company that is trustworthy to be honest about their specs, which offers a decent warranty, can switch over to battery backup quick enough (there's a standard for that somewhere, but memory = rusty), and beyond that has appropriate specs.. there's little that can go wrong.

[Mohak Arora]

Thank a lot to both @manikyath and @ATFink for sharing some very useful info. I now need to find a sweet spot between the inverters (some even advertise to have a UPS mode) and/or UPS. Maybe, I can better ask a question again, after some research.

 

P.S. - While writing this, there was a power cut and my current 700VA (Microtek EB700) inverter with a separate big battery didn't cause my current old computer to shut down or anything. I'm still writing this reply as if there was no power cut. Makes me think more.

[mayanktanwar]

Hey Mohak Arora, as you mention that 1200VA ups you require for running video-editing PC and maximum 3 monitors. In India many brands ups are available you can purchase according to your requirement. At least buy 1400VA ups and along with that use two batteries of 150Ah, it would give 5-6 hours continuous power backup.

[Boochik]

Im using pure sinewave luminous cruze 2kva, actually rig with 6 gtx 1070(always in full load)

It is running fine for now,

But is that specs what i need for heavy computer's,

Im pretty sure is luminous is not low quality brand, its one of best brand in india.. quality of plastc and design and their website also shows quality

But its well known brand from many years..

Back to the point ,

If im running this for heavy computer, is computer is in danger?

On 10/05/2017 at 11:38 PM, manikyath said:

well.. if you wanna get into it you start talking about capacitor ratings, expected duty cycles, cooling setup (because these things eventually do get hot), battery maintenace, and an infinite list of other things.

 

but honestly, as long as you buy a device from a company that is trustworthy to be honest about their specs, which offers a decent warranty, can switch over to battery backup quick enough (there's a standard for that somewhere, but memory = rusty), and beyond that has appropriate specs.. there's little that can go wrong.