Server/Remote Desktop for mobile business

[berderder]

Hi everyone,

 

I have a really fun opportunity I get to work on.

 

It's a mobile veterinary clinic that wants to Remote Desktop to a server at his home base. He only has one vet clinic van right now, but plans on the possibility of 4 or 5 vet clinic vans as his operation expands.

 

His current and only vet clinic van uses cellular data via the router to communicate over the internet as he travels on the road. 

 

He wants vans to Remote Desktop into the server at home as needed. At the home office, he will have 4 or 5 clients networked with the server (a stationary office environment).

 

I want to fill in the gaps of any knowledge, best practices, or procedures I may not be thinking of.

 

How would you handle this situation?

 

He wants to use all pre-existing software and hardware he owns, and he needs to buy a server. He uses a specialized CRM for vets for scheduling, invoicing, contact info, etc. We're thinking of putting Windows Server 2016 on the server he buys.

 

How would you handle this situation?

 

I appreciate any thoughts or suggestions you have!

[dalekphalm]

I would question the need for remote desktop. Why not use a VPN connection to tunnel into his "home" network, and then treat his mobile computer as if it were simply back at the office?

[gtx1060=value]

4 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

I would question the need for remote desktop. Why not use a VPN connection to tunnel into his "home" network, and then treat his mobile computer as if it were simply back at the office?

that's a little more complicated than just using teamviewer

[dalekphalm]

2 minutes ago, gtx1060=value said:

that's a little more complicated than just using teamviewer

Yeah, and? It's not more complicated once its setup.

 

Once its setup. It'll be easier to use. You just connect the VPN connection, through a shortcut or by clicking on the Network Icon (Depends on what OS they're running on the mobile device), and then you just use your regular applications as if you were there locally.

 

Sure, Teamviewer will work. But it's not the right way to do it. Setting up a proper VPN server isn't too difficult, either. Hell, his router might already have built in functionality to act as a VPN Server (Otherwise, the "Server" computer could do it).

[AnonymousGuy]

This sounds like something that would be better handled by having a server side web application.  Remote desktop doesn't handle multiple clients connecting to the same host.  VNC can but 5 people trying to use one machine at the same time....ugh.

[gtx1060=value]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

Yeah, and? It's not more complicated once its setup.

 

Once its setup. It'll be easier to use. You just connect the VPN connection, through a shortcut or by clicking on the Network Icon (Depends on what OS they're running on the mobile device), and then you just use your regular applications as if you were there locally.

 

Sure, Teamviewer will work. But it's not the right way to do it. Setting up a proper VPN server isn't too difficult, either. Hell, his router might already have built in functionality to act as a VPN Server (Otherwise, the "Server" computer could do it).

didn't he mean laptops by mobile units? i got the impression it was something like a vet in a van kind of job - setting up a VPN should be fairly easy but then again, 5 or 6 mobile units trying to connect at once on a limited bandwith may slow everything down

[dalekphalm]

1 minute ago, AnonymousGuy said:

This sounds like something that would be better handled by having a server side web application.  Remote desktop doesn't handle multiple clients connecting to the same host.  VNC can but 5 people trying to use one machine at the same time....ugh.

Remote Desktop can handle multiple clients. But they each would need their own unique login info. Furthermore, Teamviewer can only handle a single remote "user" at once (You can have as many people as you want connect remotely, but they all see the same thing, and only one user can do something at a time).

 

A web application may work. But that's getting into custom programming/dev work. There may not be an "off the shelf" application that they can just use. Using a VPN instead would allow all pre-existing software to work. The only difficult part is configuring the VPN server and getting clients setup the first time.

[dalekphalm]

2 minutes ago, gtx1060=value said:

didn't he mean laptops by mobile units? i got the impression it was something like a vet in a van kind of job - setting up a VPN should be fairly easy but then again, 5 or 6 mobile units trying to connect at once on a limited bandwith may slow everything down

I have no idea what he meant by "mobile units". Laptops are a good assumption, but he might mean iPads, or Surface RT's, or Surface Pro's, or any other number of devices.

 

A VPN connection over 5 different mobile users would be far more efficient then 5 different Teamviewer sessions. If he has bandwidth issues, he'll have to deal with those separately.

[jefmes]

1 minute ago, AnonymousGuy said:

This sounds like something that would be better handled by having a server side web application.  Remote desktop doesn't handle multiple clients connecting to the same host.  VNC can but 5 people trying to use one machine at the same time....ugh.

It sounds like we're going off the assumption that the client already has the CRM software established, has all the other software, and thinks they need server hardware. I would ask:

1. Where does the CRM software currently run? Is a "workstation" acting as a server and the other clients at the office are connecting to it? Where is the database?

2. What is the actual workflow for the clients in the office vs the remote client? Are they the same, just connecting from different locations?

3. If he needs to buy a server, AND the software can run anywhere, does he already have the hardware in place to support remote clients via VPN? Maybe a Server 2016 server running in Azure would be more appropriate?

 

Like Anon here said, why limit yourself to letting one client connect to the server at a time? Is the software client-server based already and it could it run decently over the internet with a VPN? If the server is placed at home, you have to concern yourself with the entire internet facing piece of his network, whereas if you need a server anyway, maybe a "cloud server" would keep that complexity out of the office.

 

Random brainstorm thoughts, I dunno if any of that helps!

[gtx1060=value]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

I have no idea what he meant by "mobile units". Laptops are a good assumption, but he might mean iPads, or Surface RT's, or Surface Pro's, or any other number of devices.

 

A VPN connection over 5 different mobile users would be far more efficient then 5 different Teamviewer sessions. If he has bandwidth issues, he'll have to deal with those separately.

sorry for the confusion, i thought it would just be one van right now and more to come later, teamviewer would be more efficient for 1 van and maybe 2, but the vpn seems like the better option,but it does seem expensive to be able to handle 5 or 6 remote connections, that would require at least 100 mbps to run all 5 (i think, could be 15 mbps per connection_

[dalekphalm]

1 minute ago, gtx1060=value said:

sorry for the confusion, i thought it would just be one van right now and more to come later, teamviewer would be more efficient for 1 van and maybe 2, but the vpn seems like the better option,but it does seem expensive to be able to handle 5 or 6 remote connections, that would require at least 100 mbps to run all 5 (i think, could be 15 mbps per connection_

Teamviewer would not be more efficient. Period. It broadcasts the entire desktop (with compression), whereas a VPN would only forward network traffic. There is no situation where Teamviewer would be more efficient then a VPN connection.

 

For a single user? Sure, teamviewer would be fine. But that's it. With 2 users, how would you even set that up? You'd actually have to have two physical (or VM's) machines sitting there doing nothing except waiting for a teamviewer session. Waste of hardware. Even virtualized, it's a waste.

 

Not saying VPN is the only route.

 

@jefmes has some good thoughts on this too. Same with @AnonymousGuy (Sorry friend, Forum doesn't want to tag you). A web side or cloud based option may also work. But using Teamviewer is a bandaid solution at best, and as soon as his operation grows, and he needs more than one user, he's fucked and has to re-do the mobile setup.

[gtx1060=value]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

Teamviewer would not be more efficient. Period. It broadcasts the entire desktop (with compression), whereas a VPN would only forward network traffic. There is no situation where Teamviewer would be more efficient then a VPN connection.

 

For a single user? Sure, teamviewer would be fine. But that's it. With 2 users, how would you even set that up? You'd actually have to have two physical (or VM's) machines sitting there doing nothing except waiting for a teamviewer session. Waste of hardware. Even virtualized, it's a waste.

 

Not saying VPN is the only route.

 

@jefmes has some good thoughts on this too. Same with @AnonymousGuy (Sorry friend, Forum doesn't want to tag you). A web side or cloud based option may also work. But using Teamviewer is a bandaid solution at best, and as soon as his operation grows, and he needs more than one user, he's fucked and has to re-do the mobile setup.

@jefmes's post would work, but azure with windows server 2016 is a couple thousand bucks worth of software there, i honestly doubt a vet office would even bother to install windows server or spend the money on it, by now i guess we've established a vpn network is the best option, and teamviewer is the lazy way out for 1 connection at max, but maybe he could host the data and stuff on a webapp using angular and some sql/php to host the info online on a secure server, that would bypass the need for a vpn connection

[berderder]

20 minutes ago, gtx1060=value said:

didn't he mean laptops by mobile units? i got the impression it was something like a vet in a van kind of job - setting up a VPN should be fairly easy but then again, 5 or 6 mobile units trying to connect at once on a limited bandwith may slow everything down

Yes, it's traveling vets in vans type of situation. By "mobile units" I met vet vans.

 

Sorry I'm not inputting more feedback. I got busy all of a sudden

[berderder]

18 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

I have no idea what he meant by "mobile units". Laptops are a good assumption, but he might mean iPads, or Surface RT's, or Surface Pro's, or any other number of devices.

 

A VPN connection over 5 different mobile users would be far more efficient then 5 different Teamviewer sessions. If he has bandwidth issues, he'll have to deal with those separately.

He pays for 100 Mbps Down at his server office location 

[dalekphalm]

1 minute ago, berderder said:

He pays for 100 Mbps Down at his server office location 

Download is not what you need to be concerned about, it's upload. Is the connection synchronous? (100 down/100 up?)

[berderder]

2 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Download is not what you need to be concerned about, it's upload. Is the connection synchronous? (100 down/100 up?)

No I don't think it's symmetric. I'll have to double check. It maybe something like 100 down 50 up

[dalekphalm]

7 minutes ago, berderder said:

No I don't think it's symmetric. I'll have to double check. It maybe something like 100 down 50 up

If that's the case, it's probably still good enough for multiple VPN connections and is probably fine.

[berderder]

2 hours ago, jefmes said:

It sounds like we're going off the assumption that the client already has the CRM software established, has all the other software, and thinks they need server hardware. I would ask:

1. Where does the CRM software currently run? Is a "workstation" acting as a server and the other clients at the office are connecting to it? Where is the database?

2. What is the actual workflow for the clients in the office vs the remote client? Are they the same, just connecting from different locations?

3. If he needs to buy a server, AND the software can run anywhere, does he already have the hardware in place to support remote clients via VPN? Maybe a Server 2016 server running in Azure would be more appropriate?

 

Like Anon here said, why limit yourself to letting one client connect to the server at a time? Is the software client-server based already and it could it run decently over the internet with a VPN? If the server is placed at home, you have to concern yourself with the entire internet facing piece of his network, whereas if you need a server anyway, maybe a "cloud server" would keep that complexity out of the office.

 

Random brainstorm thoughts, I dunno if any of that helps!

Thank you for your input. I will respond to your questions shortly.

[berderder]

2 hours ago, jefmes said:

It sounds like we're going off the assumption that the client already has the CRM software established, has all the other software, and thinks they need server hardware. I would ask:

1. Where does the CRM software currently run? Is a "workstation" acting as a server and the other clients at the office are connecting to it? Where is the database?

2. What is the actual workflow for the clients in the office vs the remote client? Are they the same, just connecting from different locations?

3. If he needs to buy a server, AND the software can run anywhere, does he already have the hardware in place to support remote clients via VPN? Maybe a Server 2016 server running in Azure would be more appropriate?

 

Like Anon here said, why limit yourself to letting one client connect to the server at a time? Is the software client-server based already and it could it run decently over the internet with a VPN? If the server is placed at home, you have to concern yourself with the entire internet facing piece of his network, whereas if you need a server anyway, maybe a "cloud server" would keep that complexity out of the office.

 

Random brainstorm thoughts, I dunno if any of that helps!

Sorry, I rated you as best answer. I did that by accident.

[berderder]

5 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

If that's the case, it's probably still good enough for multiple VPN connections and is probably fine.

Thank you for all the feedback everyone. This is very, very useful.

 

Like @dalekphalm, I may suggest Team Viewer as an immediate bandaid and then roll out the VPN server situation. 

 

It's only one van at the moment and his stationary office with the server and clients he wants to set up.

[berderder]

5 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

Hell, his router might already have built in functionality to act as a VPN Server (Otherwise, the "Server" computer could do it).

Do you mean the router in the van or the router back at the home office?

[berderder]

5 hours ago, AnonymousGuy said:

 VNC can but 5 people trying to use one machine at the same time....ugh.

So it sounds like this thread agrees that VPN would be better than VNC?

[Guest]

5 hours ago, jefmes said:

It sounds like we're going off the assumption that the client already has the CRM software established, has all the other software, and thinks they need server hardware. I would ask:

1. Where does the CRM software currently run? Is a "workstation" acting as a server and the other clients at the office are connecting to it? Where is the database?

2. What is the actual workflow for the clients in the office vs the remote client? Are they the same, just connecting from different locations?

3. If he needs to buy a server, AND the software can run anywhere, does he already have the hardware in place to support remote clients via VPN? Maybe a Server 2016 server running in Azure would be more appropriate?

 

 

Exactly - what is the need to use remote desktop? Where possible, it is recommended to avoid RDP unless you're looking at a complete VDI like VMWare Horizon View.

 

@OP - what are you trying to accomplish? Forget the server requirements, what software are you trying to run?

[berderder]

5 hours ago, jefmes said:

It sounds like we're going off the assumption that the client already has the CRM software established, has all the other software, and thinks they need server hardware. I would ask:

1. Where does the CRM software currently run? Is a "workstation" acting as a server and the other clients at the office are connecting to it? Where is the database?

2. What is the actual workflow for the clients in the office vs the remote client? Are they the same, just connecting from different locations?

3. If he needs to buy a server, AND the software can run anywhere, does he already have the hardware in place to support remote clients via VPN? Maybe a Server 2016 server running in Azure would be more appropriate?

 

Like Anon here said, why limit yourself to letting one client connect to the server at a time? Is the software client-server based already and it could it run decently over the internet with a VPN? If the server is placed at home, you have to concern yourself with the entire internet facing piece of his network, whereas if you need a server anyway, maybe a "cloud server" would keep that complexity out of the office.

 

Random brainstorm thoughts, I dunno if any of that helps!

1. The CRM and database will be on the server in the stationary office location. It will be a dedicated servers. All clients include 4 or 5 in the stationary office, and possibly 5 different vet vans with their own desktops in the next couple of years. He wants scalability.

 

2. The workflow in the stationary environment as I understand it will be administrative/intake/billing stuff. All these clients will connect to the server. Each van will have it's own workstation, and also connect to the server using as of now probably the VPN connection. The van workstations will probably be using, I'm not sure, proprietary vet software and the CRM.

 

3. What hardware specifically are you referring to? We will have the stationary office router, a router in each van, a switch at the stationary office, and a server at the

stationary office. Also, will probably set up a firewall concerning the Internet facing side of the network.

 

What distinction would you make between a "cloud server" and a VPN situation? 

[berderder]

4 minutes ago, Windspeed36 said:

 

 

@OP - what are you trying to accomplish? Forget the server requirements, what software are you trying to run?

I think his main concern is running the CRM and Database via the server on the van workstations. As of now, this would be achieved with VPN