New PC for my Parents

[cwuzzell]

Not sure if this is the right place, but here it goes. As the title states, I'm trying to make a decision. My parents have an ancient Dell desktop that came with a monitor, and probably mouse and keyboard. They bought it roughly 6 or 7 years ago, and it wasn't top of the line when they bought it. Needless to say, it hasn't aged well. The staples link at the bottom is probably it, but the operating system is either Windows 7 or Vista. I'm looking to do one of two things; either get a mini PC, like the Skull Canyon NUC, or ASRock Beebox-S, add RAM, storage, OS, and get a new monitor. This would probably cost less than option 2, which would be to get a decently spec'd All-In-One from a company like Dell, HP, or Lenovo. The reason why I would want to go with an AIO over a NUC is that there's no hassle of installing RAM, hard drive, and OS, as well as there being more I/O, and the possibility of a touchscreen, which my mom would love. I'll put links to the NUC, Beebox-S, and some of the AIOs I'm looking at down below. What do ya'll think? I have a moderately soft price cap of $1200, I'm in no rush to buy, but I'd like to make a final decision before early February. I'll try to reply to all suggestions, thanks in advance!

 

 

The current PC:

 http://www.staples.com/Refurbished-Dell-OptiPlex-755-USFF-Desktop-Intel-Core-2-Duo-316Ghz-4GB/product_2429305?cid=PS:GooglePLAs:2429305&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=2429305&KPID=2429305&cvosrc=PLA.google-SALES.Laptop %26 Desktop Computers&lsft=cid:PS-_-GooglePLAs-_-2429305,kpid:2429305,adtype:pla,channel:online&gclid=CjwKEAiA4dPCBRCM4dqhlv2R1R8SJABom9pH3tlH92pN8IL4jI45RdQlUKB3OtH9qUNLbfFUCf5sZxoCpWzw_wcB##specificationsContent

 

Skull Canyon NUC:

https://www.amazon.com/Intel-NUC-Kit-NUC6i7KYK-Mini/dp/B01DJ9XS52/ref=pd_sbs_147_5?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01DJ9XS52&pd_rd_r=5WH333C3DD6CSS2YHXXC&pd_rd_w=IL59C&pd_rd_wg=Poun7&psc=1&refRID=5WH333C3DD6CSS2YHXXC

 

ASRock Beebox-S (7200U):

https://www.amazon.com/ASRock-Barebone-Components-BEEBOX-S-7200U/dp/B01N53RNWL/ref=pd_sbs_147_1?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01N53RNWL&pd_rd_r=Y6KZ64YEKV244PX3G5M5&pd_rd_w=ccH09&pd_rd_wg=jnvj4&psc=1&refRID=Y6KZ64YEKV244PX3G5M5

 

Some of the AIOs:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B015P3SJ7W/ref=asc_df_B015P3SJ7W4705860?tag=52348_iceleadscom-20&creative=395261&creativeASIN=B015P3SJ7W&linkCode=asn&ascsubtag=s1482017035915j5wxa52348

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01JJDFFAS/ref=asc_df_B01JJDFFAS4705860?tag=52348_iceleadscom-20&creative=395261&creativeASIN=B01JJDFFAS&linkCode=asn&ascsubtag=s1482017035915j5wxa52348

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DDHW9CI/ref=asc_df_B01DDHW9CI4703683?tag=52348_iceleadscom-20&creative=395261&creativeASIN=B01DDHW9CI&linkCode=asn&ascsubtag=s1482017035915j5wxa52348

[dizmo]

What do they use their PC for?
I have a feeling you're going overboard by quite a bit.

[Electronics Wizardy]

Id probably get a laptop, something like a dell inspirion 15 5000 series, and then connect a external monitor and keyboard and mouse when your at the desk. You then also have a portable computer.

[cwuzzell]

30 minutes ago, dizmo said:

What do they use their PC for?
I have a feeling you're going overboard by quite a bit.

You're right, they mostly just look at news articles, check e-mails, and use Exel. However, I want whatever I get them to work well for a long time, so an i5 or i7 would probably be best for longevity.

[cwuzzell]

31 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Id probably get a laptop, something like a dell inspirion 15 5000 series, and then connect a external monitor and keyboard and mouse when your at the desk. You then also have a portable computer.

That would probably work, but neither has ever expressed the desire for any type of portable electronics except for a smartphone. Also, with a laptop, you'd be giving up a fair amount of desk space, which there isn't a ton of to being with.

[Murilo_A]

Check this out:

This looks perfect for only basic tasks, the only bad side is that you would have to buy a HDD or SSD and RAM separately.

 

If you got interested in it, I'd recommend this:

The Mini PC (Core i3 version)

4GB DDR4 RAM

120GB SSD

[cwuzzell]

7 minutes ago, Murilo_A said:

Check this out:

This looks perfect for only basic tasks, the only bad side is that you would have to buy a HDD or SSD and RAM separately.

 

If you got interested in it, I'd recommend this:

The Mini PC (Core i3 version)

4GB DDR4 RAM

120GB SSD

Yep, saw that video earlier today, and the Beebox is one of the products I included in my original post. I figured that with a copy of Windows 10, 16GB of RAM, a 500GB Samsung SSD, and a decent monitor, the total cost would end up around $900, for the i5-7200U version. My problem comes from not knowing whether to get this, the Skull Canyon NUC, or an Alll-in-One desktop, seeing as each has its own advantages and disadvantages, but for about the same price.

[Murilo_A]

1 minute ago, cwuzzell said:

Yep, saw that video earlier today, and the Beebox is one of the products I included in my original post. I figured that with a copy of Windows 10, 16GB of RAM, a 500GB Samsung SSD, and a decent monitor, the total cost would end up around $900, for the i5-7200U version. My problem comes from not knowing whether to get this, the Skull Canyon NUC, or an Alll-in-One desktop, seeing as each has its own advantages and disadvantages, but for about the same price.

Why would you get a Core i5, 16GB of RAM and 500GB SSD, if they use it only for basic stuff.

Okay, 500GB SSD might be an option depending on how much pics they have, and etc. But 16GB and a Core i5 is way too overkill

[cwuzzell]

7 minutes ago, Murilo_A said:

Why would you get a Core i5, 16GB of RAM and 500GB SSD, if they use it only for basic stuff.

Okay, 500GB SSD might be an option depending on how much pics they have, and etc. But 16GB and a Core i5 is way too overkill

Now that I'm thinking about it, 16GB would probably be a bit overkill (16 is just the standard number for gaming PCs, so I guess I automatically went there), but I've heard that an i5 is best for longevity, which is one of the more important things I'm considering while buying. As for the 500GB SSD, they have a 320GB mechanical drive in the current machine, and I don't want to go with anything less than that. I would also do a 480 as well, but i think the extra 20GB for a few dollars isn't a bad trade off. Also, I'm trying to decide between a NUC and an AIO PC, trying to figure out which would make more sense for some people that don't do anything intensive, but would enjoy stuff like a clean desk space, more I/O ports, a touchscreen, etc.

[dizmo]

1 hour ago, cwuzzell said:

You're right, they mostly just look at news articles, check e-mails, and use Exel. However, I want whatever I get them to work well for a long time, so an i5 or i7 would probably be best for longevity.

While in theory that's a smart idea, in practice it falls flat on its face. What they're doing are generally single threaded workloads, which change very little both from a Pentium to an i7, as well as year over year.

You can see single thread benchmarks here. https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html

You'll see that Extreme Edition i7 CPUs are getting worse scores than some i3s. Not only that, there's hardly a degradation of performance over 5 years. It would be cheaper to build an i3 system now, and another one later, than to go with an i7 system.

 

Do they use a lot of tabs? More than 60, across 20 windows and 2 browsers?

If not, then they can easily get away with 4GB of RAM, though 8GB wouldn't be terrible.

 

480GB is a boatload for a system that likely won't have more than a few things on it. I'd step down to a 128GB SSD, and grab a 2TB HDD. The HDD is better for safe, long term storage.

 

I mean, I totally get wanting to get something great for your parents. But I think it's more important where you spend the money. For example, if they never notice the difference between the i3 and the i7, or 4GB of RAM and 16GB of RAM, is it really worth the money? Probably not. Instead, drop down to an i3, less RAM and get them a really nice monitor, mouse and keyboard. Maybe a really nice aluminium case if you want to splurge a little. These are things that are tangible. They'll notice and appreciate them in day to day us, and they'll carry on build to build.

 

6 minutes ago, Murilo_A said:

Why would you get a Core i5, 16GB of RAM and 500GB SSD, if they use it only for basic stuff.

Okay, 500GB SSD might be an option depending on how much pics they have, and etc. But 16GB and a Core i5 is way too overkill

I agree, except even the SSD is a little overkill. For storage of pictures an HDD would be a smarter idea.

[cwuzzell]

1 minute ago, dizmo said:

While in theory that's a smart idea, in practice it falls flat on its face. What they're doing are generally single threaded workloads, which change very little both from a Pentium to an i7, as well as year over year.

You can see single thread benchmarks here. https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html

You'll see that Extreme Edition i7 CPUs are getting worse scores than some i3s. Not only that, there's hardly a degradation of performance over 5 years. It would be cheaper to build an i3 system now, and another one later, than to go with an i7 system.

 

Do they use a lot of tabs? More than 60, across 20 windows and 2 browsers?

If not, then they can easily get away with 4GB of RAM, though 8GB wouldn't be terrible.

 

480GB is a boatload for a system that likely won't have more than a few things on it. I'd step down to a 128GB SSD, and grab a 2TB HDD. The HDD is better for safe, long term storage.

 

I mean, I totally get wanting to get something great for your parents. But I think it's more important where you spend the money. For example, if they never notice the difference between the i3 and the i7, or 4GB of RAM and 16GB of RAM, is it really worth the money? Probably not. Instead, drop down to an i3, less RAM and get them a really nice monitor, mouse and keyboard. Maybe a really nice aluminium case if you want to splurge a little. These are things that are tangible. They'll notice and appreciate them in day to day us, and they'll carry on build to build.

Thanks for the single thread benchmarks, I had no clue. I might consider getting something with an i3, now that I know that.

 

They usually don't have too many tabs open, never more than 6.

 

Again, the reason I went with 8GB is for longevity, their current computer is not great in the RAM department, although that may be because its DDR2-1066.

 

They do have a fair amount of pictures and documents, which my dad backs up to a 1TB external drive every Sunday. I went with the 500GB SSD because in the review I saw of the Beebox, you could only fit a single 2.5" drive and a single M.2 drive into the chassis, so a 500GB SSD was a compromise between speed and storage.

 

As for you last point, that's what I'm trying to decide. Is a NUC or an AIO more suited for their needs? Their main concerns would be 1) Is it faster than the current computer? There's a 99.9% probability that whatever I choose is going to fulfill that requirement. 2) How can we save space and not have a giant tower on our desk? And that's why I posted. Thanks for the suggestions about RAM and processor, but the main question still remains in my mind: NUC or AIO?

 

 

[Murilo_A]

9 minutes ago, cwuzzell said:

Now that I'm thinking about it, 16GB would probably be a bit overkill (16 is just the standard number for gaming PCs, so I guess I automatically went there), but I've heard that an i5 is best for longevity, which is one of the more important things I'm considering while buying. As for the 500GB SSD, they have a 320GB mechanical drive in the current machine, and I don't want to go with anything less than that. I would also do a 480 as well, but i think the extra 20GB for a few dollars isn't a bad trade off. Also, I'm trying to decide between a NUC and an AIO PC, trying to figure out which would make more sense for some people that don't do anything intensive, but would enjoy stuff like a clean desk space, more I/O ports, a touchscreen, etc.

You can get a 240GB or even 120GB SSD mSATA SSD and use the 2.5" to put a HDD for other stuff (pics, videos, etc). About the i5, it wouldn't make much difference, if you pick up a very old PC with a Pentium 4, and put a new HDD, it would be enough to do basic tasks. You'd be fine for much time before you need a CPU upgrade. About the AIO vs NUC, I think the NUC might be better because you can upgrade the RAM and Storage.

[Murilo_A]

4 minutes ago, cwuzzell said:

Thanks for the single thread benchmarks, I had no clue. I might consider getting something with an i3, now that I know that.

 

They usually don't have too many tabs open, never more than 6.

 

Again, the reason I went with 8GB is for longevity, their current computer is not great in the RAM department, although that may be because its DDR2-1066.

 

They do have a fair amount of pictures and documents, which my dad backs up to a 1TB external drive every Sunday. I went with the 500GB SSD because in the review I saw of the Beebox, you could only fit a single 2.5" drive and a single M.2 drive into the chassis, so a 500GB SSD was a compromise between speed and storage.

 

As for you last point, that's what I'm trying to decide. Is a NUC or an AIO more suited for their needs? Their main concerns would be 1) Is it faster than the current computer? There's a 99.9% probability that whatever I choose is going to fulfill that requirement. 2) How can we save space and not have a giant tower on our desk? And that's why I posted. Thanks for the suggestions about RAM and processor, but the main question still remains in my mind: NUC or AIO?

 

 

There are mounts to put the NUC on the back of the monitor,  you might want to take a look

[cwuzzell]

1 minute ago, Murilo_A said:

There are mounts to put the NUC on the back of the monitor,  you might want to take a look

So your suggestion would be to go with a NUC? Thanks for all the help man, I really appreciate it.

[dizmo]

3 minutes ago, cwuzzell said:

Thanks for the single thread benchmarks, I had no clue. I might consider getting something with an i3, now that I know that.

 

They usually don't have too many tabs open, never more than 6.

 

Again, the reason I went with 8GB is for longevity, their current computer is not great in the RAM department, although that may be because its DDR2-1066.

 

They do have a fair amount of pictures and documents, which my dad backs up to a 1TB external drive every Sunday. I went with the 500GB SSD because in the review I saw of the Beebox, you could only fit a single 2.5" drive and a single M.2 drive into the chassis, so a 500GB SSD was a compromise between speed and storage.

 

As for you last point, that's what I'm trying to decide. Is a NUC or an AIO more suited for their needs? Their main concerns would be 1) Is it faster than the current computer? There's a 99.9% probability that whatever I choose is going to fulfill that requirement. 2) How can we save space and not have a giant tower on our desk? And that's why I posted. Thanks for the suggestions about RAM and processor, but the main question still remains in my mind: NUC or AIO?

 

 

No worries. Yeah, an i3 is as high as I'd go. You could easily do a Pentium most likely, if you wanted to save even more money. That's what I plan to be putting into my office machine, which will be handling significantly heavier workloads than your parents.

 

The general trend is to use less memory, not more. The scenario I described is how I use my ultrabook, and it only has 4GB of RAM. So I think they should be more than fine with 4GB as well. After all, if they do end up needing 8GB (I'd be willing to bet you real dollars they don't ) you can always add it later, unless you don't live close to home.

 

If you were going that route I'd go with a 128GB m.2 and a 1 or 2 TB 2.5" HDD.

 

Personally, if I was you, I'd make my own AIO. You can get mITX sized cases that have mounts to attach to the VESA mounts on the back of the monitor. This lets you upgrade and switch out parts as you see fit. Did the mobo die? It doesn't take out the CPU with it as well, and it's a $40 fix instead of a $200 fix. Plus you can swap out the mobo and CPU down the line, instead of replacing the entire NUC. It's much smarter from a financial standpoint, and will probably impress your parents more

Not only that, you can get a much nicer monitor than the AIO would likely have.

[Murilo_A]

4 minutes ago, dizmo said:

No worries. Yeah, an i3 is as high as I'd go. You could easily do a Pentium most likely, if you wanted to save even more money. That's what I plan to be putting into my office machine, which will be handling significantly heavier workloads than your parents.

 

The general trend is to use less memory, not more. The scenario I described is how I use my ultrabook, and it only has 4GB of RAM. So I think they should be more than fine with 4GB as well. After all, if they do end up needing 8GB (I'd be willing to bet you real dollars they don't ) you can always add it later, unless you don't live close to home.

 

If you were going that route I'd go with a 128GB m.2 and a 1 or 2 TB 2.5" HDD.

 

Personally, if I was you, I'd make my own AIO. You can get mITX sized cases that have mounts to attach to the VESA mounts on the back of the monitor. This lets you upgrade and switch out parts as you see fit. Did the mobo die? It doesn't take out the CPU with it as well, and it's a $40 fix instead of a $200 fix. Plus you can swap out the mobo and CPU down the line, instead of replacing the entire NUC. It's much smarter from a financial standpoint, and will probably impress your parents more

Not only that, you can get a much nicer monitor than the AIO would likely have.

The problem with building his own AIO, instead of just buying a NUC or an AIO, is that it would be bigger and louder (not a big deal, but I'd consider that for something that is meant to save space) 

[dizmo]

1 minute ago, Murilo_A said:

The problem with building his own AIO, instead of just buying a NUC or an AIO, is that it would be bigger and louder (not a big deal, but I'd consider that for something that is meant to save space) 

Depends on the case you get. There are very small cases available for mITX boards. It won't really be loud, because they won't be stressing any of the components. The case is on the back of the monitor. They'd likely never notice.

[Murilo_A]

3 minutes ago, dizmo said:

Depends on the case you get. There are very small cases available for mITX boards. It won't really be loud, because they won't be stressing any of the components. The case is on the back of the monitor. They'd likely never notice.

True. Then it depends if he wants to spend a bit more and have the confort of not having to build anything more than the RAM and SSD/HDD, or just build everything.

[dizmo]

1 minute ago, Murilo_A said:

True. Then it depends if he wants to spend a bit more and have the confort of not having to build anything more than the RAM and SSD/HDD, or just build everything.

It'd likely be cheaper.

[cwuzzell]

30 minutes ago, dizmo said:

No worries. Yeah, an i3 is as high as I'd go. You could easily do a Pentium most likely, if you wanted to save even more money. That's what I plan to be putting into my office machine, which will be handling significantly heavier workloads than your parents.

 

The general trend is to use less memory, not more. The scenario I described is how I use my ultrabook, and it only has 4GB of RAM. So I think they should be more than fine with 4GB as well. After all, if they do end up needing 8GB (I'd be willing to bet you real dollars they don't ) you can always add it later, unless you don't live close to home.

 

If you were going that route I'd go with a 128GB m.2 and a 1 or 2 TB 2.5" HDD.

 

Personally, if I was you, I'd make my own AIO. You can get mITX sized cases that have mounts to attach to the VESA mounts on the back of the monitor. This lets you upgrade and switch out parts as you see fit. Did the mobo die? It doesn't take out the CPU with it as well, and it's a $40 fix instead of a $200 fix. Plus you can swap out the mobo and CPU down the line, instead of replacing the entire NUC. It's much smarter from a financial standpoint, and will probably impress your parents more

Not only that, you can get a much nicer monitor than the AIO would likely have.

Yeah...I'd like to build as little as possible. Not because I can't, but because I don't feel like I could do as well (in terms of build quality and cost efficiency) as an AIO made by a company. Also, their current computer uses DDR2 RAM. I'm not going to even try to reuse that, considering a fair amount of computers and even some phones are using DDR4 now.

The 128GB m.2 and 1TB HDD sounds good, I'll probably do that. So I've got: i3 CPU, 4GB RAM, 128GG M.2, 1 TB HDD, as well as Windows 10, a monitor, and maybe mouse and keyboard.

[dizmo]

I'd do something like this.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-6100 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor  ($109.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: ASRock H110M-ITX Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard  ($63.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: Team Elite Plus 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR4-2400 Memory  ($22.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: Kingston HyperX Fury 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive  ($52.99 @ Best Buy)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint M8 1TB 2.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive  ($58.99 @ Amazon)
Case: Antec ISK 110 VESA Mini ITX Desktop Case w/90W Power Supply  ($62.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Monitor: Dell U2715H 27.0" 2560x1440 60Hz Monitor  ($434.48 @ Amazon)
Mouse: Logitech M705 Wireless Laser Mouse  ($19.99 @ Best Buy)
Other: Matias Wireless aluminium keyboard ($110.95)
Total: $937.35
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-12-17 21:44 EST-0500

 

They get an SSD to boost speed, an HDD for storage of important files/photos, a wireless keyboard (1+ year battery life) and a wireless mouse (3 year battery life), with a really nice looking bezel-less monitor.

 

You could easily save hundreds by going with a 24" 1080p monitor instead.

[Murilo_A]

2 minutes ago, dizmo said:

I'd do something like this.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-6100 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor  ($109.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: ASRock H110M-ITX Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard  ($63.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: Team Elite Plus 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR4-2400 Memory  ($22.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: Kingston HyperX Fury 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive  ($52.99 @ Best Buy)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint M8 1TB 2.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive  ($58.99 @ Amazon)
Case: Antec ISK 110 VESA Mini ITX Desktop Case w/90W Power Supply  ($62.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Monitor: Dell U2715H 27.0" 2560x1440 60Hz Monitor  ($434.48 @ Amazon)
Mouse: Logitech M705 Wireless Laser Mouse  ($19.99 @ Best Buy)
Other: Matias Wireless aluminium keyboard ($110.95)
Total: $937.35
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-12-17 21:44 EST-0500

 

They get an SSD to boost speed, an HDD for storage of important files/photos, a wireless keyboard (1+ year battery life) and a wireless mouse (3 year battery life), with a really nice looking bezel-less monitor.

90W PSU? That's not enough. Also, a 1440p is completely unnecessary, a 1080p is more than enough

[dizmo]

6 minutes ago, Murilo_A said:

90W PSU? That's not enough. Also, a 1440p is completely unnecessary, a 1080p is more than enough

Sometimes the sharpness is nice. That would be up to the OP, since he knows his parents better than we do. It's not our place to say how good their vision is.

How do you figure the 90W PSU isn't enough? Where's the huge power draw?

If needed it's only $10ish more to get a 6100T. Which would be fine.

[cwuzzell]

2 minutes ago, dizmo said:

Sometimes the sharpness is nice. That would be up to the OP, since he knows his parents better than we do. It's not our place to say how good their vision is.

How do you figure the 90W PSU isn't enough? Where's the huge power draw?

My parents are 56 and 57, but my dad is a pretty big 4K fanatic. Not sure if he'd like it for a computer monitor seeing as he doesn't even have a 4K TV (yet) but that being said he has expressed interest in higher resolutions than regular HD.

 

As for the 90w not being enough, your own parts list says so. At the bottom of the list it tells you that the power draw is 108w.

[Murilo_A]

1 minute ago, dizmo said:

Sometimes the sharpness is nice. That would be up to the OP, since he knows his parents better than we do. It's not our place to say how good their vision is.

How do you figure the 90W PSU isn't enough? Where's the huge power draw?

I think 1080p is enough, they wouldn't be taking much advantage on a 1440p monitor, unless the price is similar. About the PSU, PCPartPicker already says that it's probably not enough, this PSU calculator recommends a 147W PSU, and this low end PSUs are usually shit, they can't do what they promise, so it's not good overload it