@Greek people, do you want to go back to the drachma or stay with the euro?

[brokencross]

What do you mean by "survive"?

The moment they leave the EU, their entire economy and financial structure collapses. 

[stconquest]

The moment they leave the EU, their entire economy and financial structure collapses. 

 

Yes, but they will eat food and continue to go to work (at least the ones that have jobs).  The resource economy will live, and that is more important.

 

I am not saying they won't suffer.

[Pansysk75]

The moment they leave the EU, their entire economy and financial structure collapses. 

 

Economy and financial structure? What's that? Can I eat it?

[Vozella]

.

[brokencross]

Yes, but they will eat food and continue to go to work (at least the ones that have jobs).  The resource economy will live, and that is more important.

 

I am not saying they won't suffer.

Unfortunately a country can't really function nor properly maintain its sovereignty through a solely resource economy.  

[Tacitus]

Greece overspent, and now the Greek people are suffering heavily for it.

 

Greece joined the EU in 1981. For many years prior to that, and since then, many Greek men and women have worked hard and paid into the state to secure some form of future income as a pensioner. The state pension has now been slashed by 44%, public sector pay has fallen by 33% and 50% of Greek youths - who didn't cause the issue in the first place - are unemployed. While I am generally centre-right in my politics and a Europhile, the demands made by Greece's creditors are simply untenable. How much more can you suck from those most in need to pay the debts created by the rich?

 

If a central goal of EU is to improve the living standards of our European friends then we should show compassion, allow Greece to restructure its debts, write some off and impose less severe terms while allowing it to enact the widespread reform Syriza want that will overcome oligarchies, corruption and massive austerity drives.

 

If we cannot show this compassion Greece should walk away from the EU enterprise, as it has delivered nothing but extreme boom and bust.

[brokencross]

Greece overspent, and now the Greek people are suffering heavily for it.

 

Greece joined the EU in 1981. For many years prior to that, and since then, many Greek men and women have worked hard and paid into the state to secure some form of future income as a pensioner. The state pension has now been slashed by 44%, public sector pay has fallen by 33% and 50% of Greek youths - who didn't cause the issue in the first place - are unemployed. While I am generally centre-right in my politics and a Europhile, the demands made by Greece's creditors are simply untenable. How much more can you suck from those most in need to pay the debts created by the rich?

 

If a central goal of EU is to improve the living standards of our European friends then we should show compassion, allow Greece to restructure its debts, write some off and impose less severe terms while allowing it to enact the widespread reform Syriza want that will overcome oligarchies, corruption and massive austerity drives.

 

If we cannot show this compassion Greece should walk away from the EU enterprise, as it has delivered nothing but extreme boom and bust.

That's something that has to be worked out within Greece itself. Not something others have to work out for the greeks themselves. 

And what you said applies to any other european country that was in a crisis.

[pedro69]

Greece has a 55% unemployment rate from 18 to 35 Years old.

Sorry but the overall rate is 25%:

http://www.google.com/publicdata/explore?ds=z8o7pt6rd5uqa6_&met_y=unemployment_rate&idim=country:el:es:it&hl=en&dl=en#!ctype=l&strail=false&bcs=d&nselm=h&met_y=unemployment_rate&fdim_y=seasonality:sa&scale_y=lin&ind_y=false&rdim=country_group&idim=country:el&ifdim=country_group&hl=en_US&dl=en&ind=false

 

And this still does not explain why many of those who have a job aren't paying their share of taxes or how do you explain a tax evasion rate of 25%. Is it also because of the "assholes" Germany and France? Are they forcing you to evade taxes and electing corrupt politicians?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_evasion_and_corruption_in_Greece

[stconquest]

Unfortunately a country can't really function nor properly maintain its sovereignty through a solely resource economy.  

 

They can function, and might do much better without the EU.  Sovereignty is a whole other ball game, there needs to be a physical threat to life for this to matter.

 

Greece overspent, and now the Greek people are suffering heavily for it.

 

Greece joined the EU in 1981. For many years prior to that, and since then, many Greek men and women have worked hard and paid into the state to secure some form of future income as a pensioner. The state pension has now been slashed by 44%, public sector pay has fallen by 33% and 50% of Greek youths - who didn't cause the issue in the first place - are unemployed. While I am generally centre-right in my politics and a Europhile, the demands made by Greece's creditors are simply untenable. How much more can you suck from those most in need to pay the debts created by the rich?

 

If a central goal of EU is to improve the living standards of our European friends then we should show compassion, allow Greece to restructure its debts, write some off and impose less severe terms while allowing it to enact the widespread reform Syriza want that will overcome oligarchies, corruption and massive austerity drives.

 

If we cannot show this compassion Greece should walk away from the EU enterprise, as it has delivered nothing but extreme boom and bust.

 

Well said.

[Real_PhillBert]

In the minds (and hearts) of a lot of Greeks, the austerity will lengthen the crisis in Greece... and will amplify it.  This ideal has merit.

 

It is okay to pick a fight with me, I don't hold a grudge.  I even like to be proven wrong... but not as much as I like being right  :lol: .

 

Personally I think the Greek government is being (and has been) pretty reckless with their finances. Now they have found themselves in a fairly large mess.

[stconquest]

Personally I think the Greek government is being pretty reckless with their finances.

 

Screw that!, the former Greek governments were 100% reckless with their finances for decades.  I can't really say much about the new gov.  They are an extreme, but so is the current situation in Greece.  Still early.

[michaelk12]

All the Greeks in America I know are very hardworking, basically every Greek I know own a business. All the hard workers must've left with my grandparents' generation, leaving mainly free loaders who think that pensions and welfare grow on trees. The rest of the EU has been exceedingly generous up to this point, giving them an insane amount of credit, but the rest have finally said enough. I think they oughta stay in the EU, their economy is fragile enough already without having to go through such a big change. I was suprised by the vote, since my Yiayia assured me everyone would vote yes, lol.

[Tacitus]

That's something that has to be worked out within Greece itself. Not something others have to work out for the greeks themselves. 

And what you said applies to any other european country that was in a crisis.

 

You act as if they're not trying. The Greek governments of the past borrowed stupidly huge sums of money from creditors to fund ridiculous policy that anyone with half a brain knew was unsustainable. The creditors should have pulled the plug on it many, many years before, but instead they continued to fuel what would become the Greek crisis. Hairdressers were allowed to retire at 50 for goodness sake, and what did the lenders do? They continued pumping money into a country that would never be able to pay it back. No major party would ever get elected on a platform of deep spending cuts to bring the budget deficit down before it was too late, curtailing the unsustainable public debt.

 

Now the "establishment parties" (I hate that term) have been crushed at the ballot box because they are the architects of the enormous suffering taking place among the working class communities of Greece, and sought to protect the wealthy creditors' investments rather than the impoverished man's pension.

[dimitriianghelov]

USD is more powerfull than the Euro atm.

1 Euro=1.1 USD atm (the lowest in 9 years)