Memory upgrade to 32GB compatibility sanity check.

[Mihle]

My custom system is Ryzen R5 3600 in B450 Mortar max and RX 5700 XT.
Memory is currently 16GB (2x8GB) memory Kingston KHX3200C16D4/8GX. (3200 with 16-18-18).
In some games(not many yet), memory usage have reached 14,5-15GB, and therefore I am thinking upgrading to 32GB might be worth it, DDR4 arent expensive.

I tried finding the exact same ram, but its not available anymore, so looking for alternatives. Ones I have looked at:
Kingston KF432C16RBK2/16 (3200 with 16-18-18)
Kingston KF432C16BBK2/16 (3200 with 16-18-18)
(I think its the same ram with different heatspreader?)

Both of those should be fine, even if they arent the exact same model, right?
If its not worth the risk I can go for 2x16GB, costs more.

(I am considering maybe getting an 5800X3D at some point but not right now)

[Tan3l6]

It's better to go upgrading path of 2x16GB i think. Older Ryzen processors might have a bit of a problem sometimes with 4x sticks (not sure if 3000 series is that incompatible though).

  

9 minutes ago, Mihle said:

Both of those should be fine, even if they arent the exact same model, right?

Usually yeah. 

But 3600MT/s RAM is not that more expensive probably. If going 2x16GB.

[Levent]

Get whatever is cheaper and hope that it has the same dram chips and layout. I am personally running a 5800X and 3600 with 4x8G and 4x32G ram with both at 3800mhz.

[podkall]

7 minutes ago, Levent said:

Get whatever is cheaper and hope that it has the same dram chips and layout. I am personally running a 5800X and 3600 with 4x8G and 4x32G ram with both at 3800mhz.

is AM4 good with running quad channel?

[Levent]

1 minute ago, podkall said:

is AM4 good with running quad channel?

Depends. If you expect XMP to work, then no. If you plan on spending some time on tweaking frequency, timings and stability then yes.

[Tan3l6]

  

5 minutes ago, podkall said:

is AM4 good with running quad channel?

 

AM4 does not have quad channel support to be blunt though. 

Dual-channel even with 4 sticks.

Or am I wrong?

[Alex Atkin UK]

16 minutes ago, Tan3l6 said:

  

 

AM4 does not have quad channel support to be blunt though. 

Dual-channel even with 4 sticks.

Or am I wrong?

Correct, but its true 4x sticks is more prone to problems than 2x.  That's not to say it wont work, its just a safer bet to replace both sticks than add two more.  Plus you get the slight improvement (honestly not sure its enough to care) of being able to go for 3600MT RAM.

[Somerandomtechyboi]

1 hour ago, Mihle said:

My custom system is Ryzen R5 3600 in B450 Mortar max and RX 5700 XT.
Memory is currently 16GB (2x8GB) memory Kingston KHX3200C16D4/8GX. (3200 with 16-18-18).
In some games(not many yet), memory usage have reached 14,5-15GB, and therefore I am thinking upgrading to 32GB might be worth it, DDR4 arent expensive.

I tried finding the exact same ram, but its not available anymore, so looking for alternatives. Ones I have looked at:
Kingston KF432C16RBK2/16 (3200 with 16-18-18)
Kingston KF432C16BBK2/16 (3200 with 16-18-18)
(I think its the same ram with different heatspreader?)

Both of those should be fine, even if they arent the exact same model, right?
If its not worth the risk I can go for 2x16GB, costs more.

(I am considering maybe getting an 5800X3D at some point but not right now)

send thaiphoon burner screenshot to identify ic and find some oem bare pcbs with the same ic

 

oem bare pcbs have specific part numbers that specify ic revision density and rank config so something like 8gb hma41gu6afr8n is 4gbit dual rank (double sided) hynix afr or 16gb m378a2k43db1 which is dual rank samsung 8gbit d die, if you order that specific part number you will always get the exact ram ic rank config and density

Spoiler

this is also a trick ram ocers like me use to get dirt cheap rams that oc like mad and destroy xmp rams with the only downside being no real binning but that doesnt really matter unless you are shooting for insane freq or you are trying to bench, and even in the example shown above i can still hit 3400 ddr3 on some generic m378b2873gb0 1gbit gdie binned for 1333, if i wanna buy some more sticks thatll have similar capabilities and have guaranteed compatibility with eachother then i simply just look for someone selling m378b2873gb0 and boom more 3000+ capable sticks though you dont wanna do this on really inconsistent ics like samsung bdie that are complete garbage unbinned and for ics that arent garbage but somewhat inconsistent like samsung gdie gonna have to buy an extra stick or 2 just to weed out any of the bad samples (got one that needs 2.3v just for 3000 whilst the other 2 will run that at only 2v and this 3400 at 2.3v) but this doesnt matter if you arent shooting for high freq like me (ex only 3800-4000 ddr4 and not 5000+ ddr4)

 

if oem bare pcbs with the same ic or a similar ic revision are unavailable either new or used then buy the cheapest 3200c16/3600c18 kit you can find and be done with it since youll almost always get some random ic with plastic heatspreader xmp sticks so its not even worth considering brands or specific models of heatspreader with the exception being hynix or micron based sticks as you can buy either klevv (hynix) or crucial (micron) and be guaranteed ics from that particular manufacturer albiet revision is usually random unless they only have 1 ic for that particular bin so if your sticks happen to be hynix or micron then you can buy klevv or crucial and get matching ics or atleast something thatll be compatible and likely work at xmp speeds

[Mihle]

9 hours ago, Levent said:

Get whatever is cheaper and hope that it has the same dram chips and layout. I am personally running a 5800X and 3600 with 4x8G and 4x32G ram with both at 3800mhz.

How would I know the layout/chips?

9 hours ago, Tan3l6 said:

It's better to go upgrading path of 2x16GB i think. Older Ryzen processors might have a bit of a problem sometimes with 4x sticks (not sure if 3000 series is that incompatible though).

  

Usually yeah. 

But 3600MT/s RAM is not that more expensive probably. If going 2x16GB.

8 hours ago, Alex Atkin UK said:

Correct, but its true 4x sticks is more prone to problems than 2x.  That's not to say it wont work, its just a safer bet to replace both sticks than add two more.  Plus you get the slight improvement (honestly not sure its enough to care) of being able to go for 3600MT RAM.

Different people saying different things.
Arent 3600MT CL18 basically the same as 3200 CL16?

For reference, the 2x8GB mentioned in OP, cost about 60€ while replacing with 2x16GB would be about 110€, no matter if its 3200 CL16 or 3600 CL18.

Decisions... People saying different things... Different things being written on different places on the web... Wish there just was an black and white answer you could look up on a website, or know exactly how big the risk for it not working properly is

[Alex Atkin UK]

19 minutes ago, Mihle said:

Different people saying different things.

It seems some of the people who responded are willing to waste time trying to OC RAM manually.  I've never been part of this crowd, if you want it to "just work" than buying the right speed you want and just two sticks is the way to go.

 

If you want to gamble 4x sticks, then by all means.  Its about how much time you want to potentially put into troubleshooting if you get unlucky.

 

19 minutes ago, Mihle said:

Arent 3600MT CL18 basically the same as 3200 CL16?

Not necessarily, 3200 CL16 may be able to OC to 3600MT CL18, but they may also be chips that wouldn't handle that and so were sold as a slower speed bin.

 

The point of buying faster RAM is that the manufacturer has tested it works at that speed and has programmed the right timings into the RAM so you can enable XMP/EXPO and it should "just work".  Overclocking slower RAM to be faster than its rating can involve a hours of tweaking the timings to find the stable settings, or may simply not run stable at all any faster than their rating.

[Mihle]

On 4/1/2024 at 11:44 PM, Alex Atkin UK said:

It seems some of the people who responded are willing to waste time trying to OC RAM manually.  I've never been part of this crowd, if you want it to "just work" than buying the right speed you want and just two sticks is the way to go.

 

If you want to gamble 4x sticks, then by all means.  Its about how much time you want to potentially put into troubleshooting if you get unlucky.

 

Not necessarily, 3200 CL16 may be able to OC to 3600MT CL18, but they may also be chips that wouldn't handle that and so were sold as a slower speed bin.

 

The point of buying faster RAM is that the manufacturer has tested it works at that speed and has programmed the right timings into the RAM so you can enable XMP/EXPO and it should "just work".  Overclocking slower RAM to be faster than its rating can involve a hours of tweaking the timings to find the stable settings, or may simply not run stable at all any faster than their rating.

I didnt talk about OCing or adjusting anything, I was talking about 3200 CL16 and 3600 CL18 having the same latency, and therefore should have the same performance?

[Alex Atkin UK]

14 minutes ago, Mihle said:

I didnt talk about OCing or adjusting anything, I was talking about 3200 CL16 and 3600 CL18 having the same latency, and therefore should have the same performance?

Well obviously not, as the 3600 has more bandwidth.  The difference will likely be less impactful with a 5800X3D due to the V-Cache and if its enough to care, I'm still not sure about.

[Mihle]

If I go 2x16, these ones are fine, right?
Corsair CMK32GX4M2Z3600C18
Kingston KF436C18BBK2/32
Both are 3600 CL18.