Beginner water cooling: cost of entry + is it a mistake?

[Rybo]

So I'm starting to get inklings that water cooling will solve problems I have.  The problem?  I'm folding using dual GTX 1070's and they're running pretty toasty.  The top card is hanging around 79 degrees, and the bottom one is doing better at 73 degrees.  I have them both at a 75% power limit, so they're definitely WAY hotter than they should be under the circumstances.  I feel like water cooling will handily keep these cards cooler than the air is currently doing, and it'll have the fringe benefit of not dumping a bunch of waste heat into the rest of the system.  

Am I correct that a simple loop with a 280mm rad should improve temps pretty dramatically?  I'd consider it a success if they both got below 65 degrees under this same folding load, FYI.  

Having specced out a loop that I think will solve the problem, the price tag comes in at a little north of $500 USD.  The loop comprised of:

 

(GPU block) EK-FC GeForce GTX FE - Nickel x2 $188.98 (this was selected by ekwb's configurator, so I'm taking it on faith that it will fit my GPU)
(res/pump combo) EK-Quantum Kinetic FLT 120 D5 PWM D-RGB - Plexi - $189.99    
(compression fittings) EK-Quantum Torque 8-Pack STC 10/13 - Nickel - $44.99    
(rad) EK-CoolStream SE 280 (Slim Dual) - $69.99    
(soft tubing) EK-DuraClear 9,5/12,7mm 3M RETAIL - $14.99

 

The coolant I'll use will be deionized water bought from a local retailer.  

The pump/res combo is the only place I feel like I'm being a little extravagant, and from what I can see, it's not by much -- getting a separate pump and reservoir seems likely to cost around $130 minimum, so having fewer things to mount and fewer fittings seems like a good tradeoff.  

So does this seem like a reasonable minimum for a 2 GPU loop, or did I go way off the rails somewhere?  More importantly, did I miss a component?  Having perused the guides at the top of this list, I don't believe I did, but also having never done this before, I'd rather not realize after buying that I need to spend another $87 on some other component I forgot about.  

 

[Sauron]

What model are your cards? In most cases better case airflow solves these temp issues. $500 is almost enough to just buy a new, faster, single card if it's just a matter of performance and temperatures.

 

On the other hand if you enjoy tinkering go right ahead, just be aware it's not really a cost effective solution in general.

[Hairless Monkey Boy]

What else have you done to mitigate the issue? Re-paste? Improve airflow?

Seems like a poor reason to drop $500 on a custom loop to me. Like @Sauron basically said, the only good reason would be that you just want to.

 

Anyway, assuming you do this.

 

I like the EK blocks, and pump/res, but the fittings and rads are a bit expensive for what they are imo.

 

For fittings you can save a bunch by going with Barrow. I have Barrow fittings, they are great.

https://modmymods.com/barrow-g1-4-thread-3-8-id-x-1-2-od-compression-fitting-silver-thkn-3-8-b03-silver.html

 

For Rads, you can save money and get better performance by going with Hardwarelabs.

https://www.performance-pcs.com/water-cooling/radiators/black-ice-nemesis-280gts-ultra-stealth-u-flow-low-profile-radiator-black-carbon-n280gts-f2pb.html

[Kilrah]

+1.

For that price you can get a used 2080, 2080S or maybe even a 2080Ti which will be 1.5-2x better than your 2 1070s, not to mention you can get a couple of hundred bucks back by selling them.

 

 

[Rybo]

1 minute ago, Sauron said:

What model are your cards? In most cases better case airflow solves these temp issues. $500 is almost enough to just buy a new, faster, single card if it's just a matter of performance and temperatures.

 

On the other hand if you enjoy tinkering go right ahead, just be aware it's not really a cost effective solution in general.

 

3 minutes ago, HairlessMonkeyBoy said:

Seems like a poor reason to drop $500 on a custom loop to me. Like @Sauron basically said, the only good reason would be that you just want to.

The GPU is this one.  And yes, breaking into water cooling is a bit of an ulterior motive.  

 

As far as what I've done, not much.  The case is already filled to brimming with 140's pushing air from front to back, so unless I mod the case to put more fans closer to the GPUs, I don't know how much lift more air will give me.  Just for kicks I did open the side of the case and blew a box fan into it.  Temps got better (73/67, respectively), but all I gotta do to send them back through the roof is restore their power limits to default.  

 

Hadn't thought of repasting, though.  Might take a stab at that.  

(Thanks for the product recommendations, btw!  I will probably end up going with them if I decide to move forward with this!)

Also: is it reasonable to expect the water blocks I'm using to be pretty much end-of-life?  I.E., either the screws aren't likely to fit future PCB's or the contacts won't actually line up with the VRMs and cores?  I can already feel the bittersweet pain of a new GPU coming out and I haven't even spent a penny on this stuff yet!

[Kilrah]

3 minutes ago, Rybo said:

Also: is it reasonable to expect the water blocks I'm using to be pretty much end-of-life?

Blocks are generation-, and even sometimes card-specific. 

So once you change cards they'll be of no use to keep, and will basically be worthless for resale.

[Rybo]

10 minutes ago, Kilrah said:

Blocks are generation-, and even sometimes card-specific. 

So once you change cards they'll be of no use to keep, and will basically be worthless for resale.

I thought so, but I don't see a huge used market for this model of card, which appears to be a pretty generic founders edition block for the 10 series.  I'd expect to see a bunch of used ones on ebay, but I'm not seeing anything.  The ones that are there are literally cheaper to buy new straight from EK 

[Tristerin]

Dont be me, dont block old cards lol - in the end unless you block cheaply (I.E. block/strap setup with zip ties on a fan on the rest of the PCB, which can be done for less than $10, then some tubes and a pump/res for around $30-40 voila) it, imho, is not worth it.

 

Heres a pic of a R7 260X block/strapped, and on a multi rad loop (80mm rads woot lol)

 

 

 

 

[Rybo]

1 hour ago, Tristerin said:

Dont be me, dont block old cards lol - in the end unless you block cheaply (I.E. block/strap setup with zip ties on a fan on the rest of the PCB, which can be done for less than $10, then some tubes and a pump/res for around $30-40 voila) it, imho, is not worth it.

 

Heres a pic of a R7 260X block/strapped, and on a multi rad loop (80mm rads woot lol)

I'm open to this.  So what block are you using on the core?  Are there generic GPU blocks that are basically guaranteed to fit the core, then I can just buy little VRM heat sinks? 

[Tristerin]

4 minutes ago, Rybo said:

I'm open to this.  So what block are you using on the core?  Are there generic GPU blocks that are basically guaranteed to fit the core, then I can just buy little VRM heat sinks? 

Find the size of the GPU chip you are covering, order one of each of these for block/strap:

 

(may not be cheapest, search around Ebay etc as well)

 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33039531087.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.61032dacBvwviN&algo_pvid=91a2e422-483d-41c3-a1ed-41ef74ace906&algo_expid=91a2e422-483d-41c3-a1ed-41ef74ace906-4&btsid=0bb0600116025484237791686e16d1&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32919686246.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.5f394c4dzLokvL

 

Then some tubing:

(just an example)

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32840646982.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.5f394c4dzLokvL

 

radiator:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32842103958.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.5f394c4dzLokvL

 

pump/res:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000614787954.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.6284740eBXOK0a&algo_pvid=2455a862-8b0a-419c-b352-fa60e368d71e&algo_expid=2455a862-8b0a-419c-b352-fa60e368d71e-1&btsid=0bb0600116025497072347345e17bc&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

 

Some double sided adhesive thermal stick tape and sized heat sinks (cover the VRMs, memory modules, power delivery chip (see my pic can see little aluminum ones on them) for example:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32861527682.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.760a6c16hyCNgD&algo_pvid=72bc68e7-dedf-4780-aaf1-e0ef6f689413&algo_expid=72bc68e7-dedf-4780-aaf1-e0ef6f689413-32&btsid=0bb0622c16025499845142954eb0a8&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

 

Ive bought all those items from aliexpress a few times.  I use antifreeze in my loops (Preston 50/50 premix with their patented Cor-Guard) which is also a natural biocide.  Above is all aluminum, I mix metals no problem using antifreeze.  Pick you fans - Im a fan of Arctic P12's

 

Let me know if you need any other info - once you purchase the rad(s)/pump-res combo everything else is pretty cheap.

 

 

[bowrilla]

16 hours ago, Rybo said:

The coolant I'll use will be deionized water bought from a local retailer. 

Don't!

 

If anything go for distilled water! You should still add some additives.

[Rybo]

11 hours ago, Tristerin said:

Find the size of the GPU chip you are covering, order one of each of these for block/strap:

Ugh, I really don't want to disassemble and reassemble my card just to get the mount dimensions, but the specs for founders edition cards (which PNY's PCB is apparently based on) don't seem to be readily available online.  

 

Which is kinda weird.  Everything is on the internet.  Are you aware of any resources that contain such information?  I don't know if I'll go for the ali express specials, but EK does sell some universal plates with swappable mounting hardware.  It looks like a legacy option for them, but if they're still in stock it sounds like a good option -- anything to at least give me a chance of being able to reuse the blocks  

[Tristerin]

30 minutes ago, Rybo said:

Ugh, I really don't want to disassemble and reassemble my card just to get the mount dimensions, but the specs for founders edition cards (which PNY's PCB is apparently based on) don't seem to be readily available online.  

 

Which is kinda weird.  Everything is on the internet.  Are you aware of any resources that contain such information?  I don't know if I'll go for the ali express specials, but EK does sell some universal plates with swappable mounting hardware.  It looks like a legacy option for them, but if they're still in stock it sounds like a good option -- anything to at least give me a chance of being able to reuse the blocks  

Im a bit buys atm, but search for the GPU chip (I.E. TU102 or something, not sure that generation) and then it should give a MM size - tag me in a few hours if you find nothing (for a reminder) and I can help look later for sure.  Heres what I just quick searched to start to get info:

 

[Mick Naughty]

Just buy the full cover blocks, already cheap and cool the whole thing which should be the point. Whole ass one job instead of half assing two.

I put a block on my 1060 recently, as anything is better than have an air cooled card in the system.

 

But like another said, Id do a repaste, my 1080fe's ran at that temp without lowering the power.

[jtmoseley]

20 hours ago, Rybo said:

So I'm starting to get inklings that water cooling will solve problems I have.  The problem?  I'm folding using dual GTX 1070's and they're running pretty toasty.  The top card is hanging around 79 degrees, and the bottom one is doing better at 73 degrees.  I have them both at a 75% power limit, so they're definitely WAY hotter than they should be under the circumstances.  I feel like water cooling will handily keep these cards cooler than the air is currently doing, and it'll have the fringe benefit of not dumping a bunch of waste heat into the rest of the system.  

Am I correct that a simple loop with a 280mm rad should improve temps pretty dramatically?  I'd consider it a success if they both got below 65 degrees under this same folding load, FYI.  

Having specced out a loop that I think will solve the problem, the price tag comes in at a little north of $500 USD.  The loop comprised of:

 

(GPU block) EK-FC GeForce GTX FE - Nickel x2 $188.98 (this was selected by ekwb's configurator, so I'm taking it on faith that it will fit my GPU)
(res/pump combo) EK-Quantum Kinetic FLT 120 D5 PWM D-RGB - Plexi - $189.99    
(compression fittings) EK-Quantum Torque 8-Pack STC 10/13 - Nickel - $44.99    
(rad) EK-CoolStream SE 280 (Slim Dual) - $69.99    
(soft tubing) EK-DuraClear 9,5/12,7mm 3M RETAIL - $14.99

 

The coolant I'll use will be deionized water bought from a local retailer.  

The pump/res combo is the only place I feel like I'm being a little extravagant, and from what I can see, it's not by much -- getting a separate pump and reservoir seems likely to cost around $130 minimum, so having fewer things to mount and fewer fittings seems like a good tradeoff.  

So does this seem like a reasonable minimum for a 2 GPU loop, or did I go way off the rails somewhere?  More importantly, did I miss a component?  Having perused the guides at the top of this list, I don't believe I did, but also having never done this before, I'd rather not realize after buying that I need to spend another $87 on some other component I forgot about.  

 

If you just enjoy tinkering or want a liquid cooling loop definitely go for it but if you're after performance just spend that 500 on a better singlecard. If you sold the 1070s you could easily get a 3080 with the $500 too

[Rybo]

3 hours ago, Tristerin said:

Im a bit buys atm, but search for the GPU chip (I.E. TU102 or something, not sure that generation) and then it should give a MM size - tag me in a few hours if you find nothing (for a reminder) and I can help look later for sure.  Heres what I just quick searched to start to get info:

 

Ahhh, now I understand what you were referring to when you talked about straps.  Your first picture is blurry enough that I didn't immediately notice it  I don't know if that solution will work too well with two GPUs -- there's little enough room between the cards (and in my case, between the bottom card and the PSU shroud) that the bend in the tube would probably bee too tight.  

 

Thus, I'm looking for universal GPU mounts, of which I've seen a few options.  What I can't find, however, are specs for the screw hole dimensions on the PCB.  Only "configurators" that say "THIS FITS.  PROMISE!"  And the universal mounts just have mounting brackets set to specific mounting hole dimensions without really saying which boards conform to those dimensions.  

 

1 hour ago, Mick Naughty said:

Just buy the full cover blocks, already cheap and cool the whole thing which should be the point. Whole ass one job instead of half assing two.

I put a block on my 1060 recently, as anything is better than have an air cooled card in the system.

I'm leaning toward just buying the full block if I can't find a decent universal gpu block that I'm sure will fit.  It wouldn't be the first $200 I've lit on fire and cast to the winds, but I wanna do what I can to avoid it if at all possible  

[Tristerin]

14 minutes ago, Rybo said:

 

Ahhh, now I understand what you were referring to when you talked about straps.  Your first picture is blurry enough that I didn't immediately notice it  I don't know if that solution will work too well with two GPUs -- there's little enough room between the cards (and in my case, between the bottom card and the PSU shroud) that the bend in the tube would probably bee too tight.  

 

Thus, I'm looking for universal GPU mounts, of which I've seen a few options.  What I can't find, however, are specs for the screw hole dimensions on the PCB.  Only "configurators" that say "THIS FITS.  PROMISE!"  And the universal mounts just have mounting brackets set to specific mounting hole dimensions without really saying which boards conform to those dimensions.  

 

I'm leaning toward just buying the full block if I can't find a decent universal gpu block that I'm sure will fit.  It wouldn't be the first $200 I've lit on fire and cast to the winds, but I wanna do what I can to avoid it if at all possible  

Understandable - the blocks can come in multiple configs btw, I.E. the in/outlets on the side so you can stack cards.  The straps also can either be (the bolts themselves) cut down, or if you look at the pic they don't intrude over a double slot card (but the tubes do thus the mention of other block types).

 

Heres some info on 1080 FE hole spacing, back to being busy but will look later tonight to see if I can find that diagram

https://xdevs.com/guide/pascal_oc/

[Rybo]

3 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

Understandable - the blocks can come in multiple configs btw, I.E. the in/outlets on the side so you can stack cards.  The straps also can either be (the bolts themselves) cut down, or if you look at the pic they don't intrude over a double slot card (but the tubes do thus the mention of other block types).

 

Heres some info on 1080 FE hole spacing, back to being busy but will look later tonight to see if I can find that diagram

https://xdevs.com/guide/pascal_oc/

I saw that page, too.  Didn't read it cover to cover, but they don't mention mounting hole spacing, just that it's compatible with other random gibberish that I'm too uncultured to understand.  They came so close, too; they had high res pictures and everything

[Mick Naughty]

Where are you located? I have an extra 1080fe ek block. Can prolly take the one off my 1060 if you’re serious. Only one back plate left though.