3600 or 2700x for 120$

[Void Master]

Halo everyone !

As the title says, my friend got a deal for a 2700x at 120$.

But he was confused as he originally wanted a 3600 as it performs pretty well at both gaming and productivity.

But if he saves up and goes will a 2700x he can get a 5700xt instead of a 5700 one.

So he can choose from 2 configurations : 2700x + 5700xt OR 3600 + 5700.

He will use this pc for 50% real work ( CAD, video and photo editiong when he needs, also some kind of 3d rendering architectural apps {sorry not my thing :D} )

and 50% gaming (  Both E-sports and AAA titles)

So will the 2700x last him for at least 3 years ( he upgraded form an i7 870 1st gen )

He it's not a big deal if he reduced game settings after some years {he stills rocks an i7 870 in 2019} as long as it does REAL work done.

Thanks in advance from my friend .

 

 

 

 

 

[Morgan MLGman]

2700X is still a great CPU, if it's that much cheaper than the 3600 then it's a no-brainer to me.

[191x7]

Even if the cores are 30% weaker, the 2700X has two more than the 3600.

For pure gaming, the 3600 is better, but for everyting else the 2700X beats it.

[Hugh54321]

Both CPU will last more than three years. I would get the 3600 CPU for the single core performance. 

[Midnitewolf]

I think I would lean toward the 3600 processor myself.  From what I have seen, there isn't as much of a performance gap between the 5700 and the 5700 XT as there is between a 3600 and a 2700x and in general I always found it easier to upgrade a GPU than a CPU if I wanted a performance boost down the road.

[Mister Woof]

You won't notice the difference between a 2700x and 3600 unless you have a 2080 ti and/or play with a high refresh 1080p display.

 

With a 5700 or 5700xt, the difference will be minimal.

 

At 1440p neither a 5700 or 5700x is going to be pushing reliable 144+for anyway in most new games, so it doesn't matter which cpu you pair it with 

 

I don't think the 3600 hits many performance milestones that the 2700x won't, and I think they'll both become obsolete pretty much at the same time

[Midnitewolf]

14 minutes ago, Plutosaurus said:

You won't notice the difference between a 2700x and 3600 unless you have a 2080 ti and/or play with a high refresh 1080p display.

 

With a 5700 or 5700xt, the difference will be minimal.

 

At 1440p neither a 5700 or 5700x is going to be pushing reliable 144+for anyway in most new games, so it doesn't matter which cpu you pair it with 

 

I don't think the 3600 hits many performance milestones that the 2700x won't, and I think they'll both become obsolete pretty much at the same time

At the end of the day your probably right though I think the 3600 might be able to take advantage of a future GPU upgrade better than the 2700x.  I know that in the past when I have built systems on a budget and am looking at max longevity per build, I find I replace my GPU twice as often as my CPU so generally speaking going with the latest generation of CPU at the time of the initial build has usually made sense.

[Mister Woof]

38 minutes ago, Midnitewolf said:

At the end of the day your probably right though I think the 3600 might be able to take advantage of a future GPU upgrade better than the 2700x.  I know that in the past when I have built systems on a budget and am looking at max longevity per build, I find I replace my GPU twice as often as my CPU so generally speaking going with the latest generation of CPU at the time of the initial build has usually made sense.

Probably, but I think if you are going 3000 series you should get the 3700x.

 

If you envision yourself with the 5700xt lasting you at least three years, with a future mid-range gpu upgrade being 2080ti level for another 3 years, then the current 2080ti results may reflect what a future gpu might perform like between these two chips.

 

See here 1080p benchmarks. Even with a 2080ti there's minimal difference between the 2700x and 3600. It would be imperceptible.

 

https://www.techspot.com/review/1871-amd-ryzen-3600/

 

Most bench's look like this, with minimal difference:

 

With this being one of the worst, with a ~10% difference. But at 106 vs 91 minimum and 157 vs 143 average.....yeah you won't be able to perceive that.

 

1440p benchmarks are pretty much a wash among all modern CPUs with 6 or more cores.

 

I think moving forward a 33% bump in cores is going to matter more in the long run as developers are forced to focus on parallelization vs brute force as it seems we've hit a roadblock in single threaded performance.

[Midnitewolf]

1 hour ago, Plutosaurus said:

Probably, but I think if you are going 3000 series you should get the 3700x.

 

If you envision yourself with the 5700xt lasting you at least three years, with a future mid-range gpu upgrade being 2080ti level for another 3 years, then the current 2080ti results may reflect what a future gpu might perform like between these two chips.

 

See here 1080p benchmarks. Even with a 2080ti there's minimal difference between the 2700x and 3600. It would be imperceptible.

 

https://www.techspot.com/review/1871-amd-ryzen-3600/

 

Most bench's look like this, with minimal difference:

 

With this being one of the worst, with a ~10% difference. But at 106 vs 91 minimum and 157 vs 143 average.....yeah you won't be able to perceive that.

 

1440p benchmarks are pretty much a wash among all modern CPUs with 6 or more cores.

 

I think moving forward a 33% bump in cores is going to matter more in the long run as developers are forced to focus on parallelization vs brute force as it seems we've hit a roadblock in single threaded performance.

Your forgetting PCI 4.0.  I mean Radeon is moving its cards to these standards already and I hear Nvidia will be doing so on its next generation of cards as well.  They probably wouldn't be going that direction unless there was a reason.  Now I know that right now, a 2080 ti doesn't even saturate PCI 3.0 so there is no guarantee that PCI 3.0 won't be good enough 3 years down the road, but from what I understand the 2080 ti is getting close to maxing a PCI 3.0 so it is very possible at least, that for max performance 3 years down the road, even on a mid range card, that PCI 4.0 might actually be a requirement. 

 

I think what I have going on right now is a prime example of what I am talking about.  This is unrelated to GPUs but I think illustrates the point so I am going to share.  When I bought my current Ryzen 1600 CPU, AMD mentioned they would be supporting the AM4 socket for years to come.  I was pretty broke back then so bought a pretty basic B350 MB....all the while thinking I would have no issues upgrading to any AM4 socket CPU that came out.  Flash forward and now my B350 board, despite having an AM4 socket, really can't support a Ryzen 3000 CPU.  If I would have just spent an extra $50 or so and upgraded to a B450 MB, I wouldn't have this issue and this isn't the only example I have of where trying to save a few dollars has had some far reaching negative consequences when it comes to computers.   I feel these 2700/2700x vs 3600 processor debate run along the same lines.  You can absolutely buy the 2700/2700x, get nearly the same performance as a 3600 and save a little money, but what happens if you need PCI 4.0 down the road?   To me, based on my own personal experience, it is just better to spend a little be extra now, even if you have to delay a month or two do be able to afford it, that to try to save a few pennies.

[Mister Woof]

5 minutes ago, Midnitewolf said:

Your forgetting PCI 4.0.  I mean Radeon is moving its cards to these standards already and I hear Nvidia will be doing so on its next generation of cards as well.  They probably wouldn't be going that direction unless there was a reason.  Now I know that right now, a 2080 ti doesn't even saturate PCI 3.0 so there is no guarantee that PCI 3.0 won't be good enough 3 years down the road, but from what I understand the 2080 ti is getting close to maxing a PCI 3.0 so it is very possible at least, that for max performance 3 years down the road, even on a mid range card, that PCI 4.0 might actually be a requirement. 

 

I think what I have going on right now is a prime example of what I am talking about.  This is unrelated to GPUs but I think illustrates the point so I am going to share.  When I bought my current Ryzen 1600 CPU, AMD mentioned they would be supporting the AM4 socket for years to come.  I was pretty broke back then so bought a pretty basic B350 MB....all the while thinking I would have no issues upgrading to any AM4 socket CPU that came out.  Flash forward and now my B350 board, despite having an AM4 socket, really can't support a Ryzen 3000 CPU.  If I would have just spent an extra $50 or so and upgraded to a B450 MB, I wouldn't have this issue and this isn't the only example I have of where trying to save a few dollars has had some far reaching negative consequences when it comes to computers.   I feel these 2700/2700x vs 3600 processor debate run along the same lines.  You can absolutely buy the 2700/2700x, get nearly the same performance as a 3600 and save a little money, but what happens if you need PCI 4.0 down the road?   To me, based on my own personal experience, it is just better to spend a little be extra now, even if you have to delay a month or two do be able to afford it, that to try to save a few pennies.

 

So he's going with an x570 board with the 3600? That's more cost, and iirc even a 2080ti won't saturate pcie 3.0. pcie4 is more for ssds at this point.

 

I do agree with you though,  about spending a bit more, which is why i said if he was going 3000 series skip the 3600 and get a 3700x.

[Void Master]

11 minutes ago, Plutosaurus said:

 

So he's going with an x570 board with the 3600? That's more cost, and iirc even a 2080ti won't saturate pcie 3.0. pcie4 is more for ssds at this point.

 

I do agree with you though,  about spending a bit more, which is why i said if he was going 3000 series skip the 3600 and get a 3700x.

Thanks for ur opinions   

we are actually considering the 3700x now.( with an x570 )

he agreed to drop more cash for it. 

 

[Midnitewolf]

4 minutes ago, Plutosaurus said:

 

So he's going with an x570 board with the 3600? That's more cost, and iirc even a 2080ti won't saturate pcie 3.0. pcie4 is more for ssds at this point.

 

I do agree with you though,  about spending a bit more, which is why i said if he was going 3000 series skip the 3600 and get a 3700x.

Yeah I know.  You have to factor in the MB cost but you can get a Gigabyte x570 Elite from Newegg right now for $169.99 with a $20 on top of that.  I wouldn't spend less than $100 on any MB anyway so going the extra $50 there makes sense to me.  

 

As far as the 3700x, yeah I like the performance profile of that chip better than the 3600 mostly because of the increase in core count which I think might become very important in the next few years but your talking a $135 price difference between the two chips.  That is nearly the cost of the entire Gigabyte MB I mentioned and starts moving into the realm of a lot more cost rather than a little bit more. Overall from a longevity standpoint, I think spending an extra $50 on the MB to get PCI 4.0 and ultimately better features that are likely key to being able to upgrade to a future CPU, then adding $25 to upgrade the 2700x to a 3600 while banking the remaining $60 left over is the better option from a value perspective, especially since anyone thinking of going with a 2700/2700x is obviously budget conscious. 

[Mister Woof]

Just now, Midnitewolf said:

Yeah I know.  You have to factor in the MB cost but you can get a Gigabyte x570 Elite from Newegg right now for $169.99 with a $20 on top of that.  I wouldn't spend less than $100 on any MB anyway so going the extra $50 there makes sense to me.  

 

As far as the 3700x, yeah I like the performance profile of that chip better than the 3600 mostly because of the increase in core count which I think might become very important in the next few years but your talking a $135 price difference between the two chips.  That is nearly the cost of the entire Gigabyte MB I mentioned and starts moving into the realm of a lot more cost rather than a little bit more. Overall from a longevity standpoint, I think spending an extra $50 on the MB to get PCI 4.0 and ultimately better features that are likely key to being able to upgrade to a future CPU, then adding $25 to upgrade the 2700x to a 3600 while banking the remaining $60 left over is the better option from a value perspective, especially since anyone thinking of going with a 2700/2700x is obviously budget conscious. 

Right, which is why I backpedal to the 2700x, also an 8/16 chip that in most gaming scenarios isn't much slower than even the 3700x lol.

 

$120 2700x + $120 b450 board ($240) is still much cheaper than a $330 3700x and a $170 x570 ($500). Twice as much.

[Mister Woof]

6 minutes ago, Void Master said:

Thanks for ur opinions   

we are actually considering the 3700x now.( with an x570 )

he agreed to drop more cash for it. 

 

Lol well, be aware the benchmarks for 3700x are there too. It's not HUGE difference between 2700x.

 

Personally we're it me I'd grab the cheap 2700x today and upgrade everything in 3-4 years.

[Void Master]

Just now, Plutosaurus said:

Lol well, be aware the benchmarks for 3700x are there too. It's not HUGE difference between 2700x.

 

Personally we're it me I'd grab the cheap 2700x today and upgrade everything in 3-4 years.

what about a 2700x with an x570 ?

and switch to a pcie 4.0 cpu later ? (2 yrs)

[Mister Woof]

2 minutes ago, Void Master said:

what about a 2700x with an x570 ?

and switch to a pcie 4.0 cpu later ? (2 yrs)

Incompatible with x570

 

But seriously it's a $110 board and a $120 cpu....

 

The 3700x alone costs more than that.

 

So when you upgrade eventually in 3-4 years you already saved enough money here to pay for a new board which at that time will likely have more features anyway. Another reason why I never view upgrade path as a meaningful feature on a motherboard.

[Void Master]

Just now, Plutosaurus said:

Incompatible with x570

 

But seriously it's a $110 board and a $120 cpu....

 

The 3700x alone costs more than that.

 

So when you upgrade eventually in 3-4 years you already saved enough money here to pay for a new board which at that time will likely have more features anyway

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/X570-AORUS-ELITE-rev-10/support#support-cpu

 

no it is

 

[Mister Woof]

Just now, Void Master said:

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/X570-AORUS-ELITE-rev-10/support#support-cpu

 

no it is

 

Interesting, thought I rember reading it not having support. Maybe it's just first gen then.

[Void Master]

Ok then i guess a 2700x + x570 for now and then a zen 2+ or 3 CPU in the future. 

1 minute ago, Plutosaurus said:

Interesting, thought I rember reading it not having support. Maybe it's just first gen then.

Yup they only discounted the 1st gen ones.

Thanks for ur advice !

 

[Mister Woof]

1 minute ago, Void Master said:

Ok then i guess a 2700x + x570 for now and then a zen 2+ or 3 CPU in the future. 

Yup they only discounted the 1st gen ones.

Thanks for ur advice !

 

I mean the others aren't wrong either

 

So just giving some options

 

 

[Mister Woof]

And I wouldn't be honest if I didn't say I could be wrong.

 

I could be wrong.

[Void Master]

1 minute ago, Plutosaurus said:

And I wouldn't be honest if I didn't say I could be wrong.

 

I could be wrong.

chill dude

 

[Midnitewolf]

2 minutes ago, Plutosaurus said:

Incompatible with x570

 

But seriously it's a $110 board and a $120 cpu....

 

The 3700x alone costs more than that.

 

So when you upgrade eventually in 3-4 years you already saved enough money here to pay for a new board which at that time will likely have more features anyway. Another reason why I never view upgrade path as a meaningful feature on a motherboard.

This is a very valid way of looking at things but you have to be careful looking at things like this as well.  The future is unknown and sometimes trying to save a few bucks now means you spend a lot more later.  

 

I remember on my last build, I was going back and forth over to buy a 1070 or a 1080 ti.  I think there was about a $250 difference in cost at the time and I eventually talked myself out of the 1080ti using the logic you laid out in your response.  My expectation was that Nvidia's next generation, 2080 ti would be nearly the same cost as the current generation 1080ti, little did I know that the 2080 ti would be about 30% more expensive than the 1080 ti. I can't help but think that if I would have spent the $250 then and got the 1080 ti, I could have saved the $600 now that it will cost me now to get roughly the same performance as I would be getting with the 1080 ti had I bought it.  Worse, I could have been enjoying the extra performance of the 1080ti for all this time.

 

I guess what I am saying it you got to pick your battles.  If he spent and extra $120 now to get the current generation x570 MB with PCI 4.0 support and a 3600, he might very well find that he doesn't even need to buy a new MB or heck even a new CPU 3-4 years down the road.  Instead just upgrading to the new PCI 4.0 Video Card would do the trick.  Either way there is risk, but considering by the end of 2020 it is looking like all gaming GPU's will be using the PCI 4.0 standard and GPU manufactures wouldn't be moving to the PCI 4.0 standard if they didn't have at least something in mind for taking advantage of it, that spending $120 more now is less risky than having it and not needing it, especially if your looking at building a machine with the intention of it being relevant 4-5 years down the road. 

[Midnitewolf]

17 minutes ago, Plutosaurus said:

Interesting, thought I rember reading it not having support. Maybe it's just first gen then.

The MB can support the 2700/2700x but the 2700/2700x doesn't support PCI 4.0 so you couldn't use any PCI 4.0 only devices if you paired a 2700 with an x570 MB.

[Void Master]

1 minute ago, Midnitewolf said:

The MB can support the 2700/2700x but the 2700/2700x doesn't support PCI 4.0 so you couldn't use any PCI 4.0 only devices if you paired a 2700 with an x570 MB.

we will pair it with a zen 2+ or zen 3 cpu later.