Suitable DAC and Amp for Sennheiser HD650

[mumer8637]

Hello,

I am looking to upgrade my current headphone setup to a Sennheiser HD650 and a DAC.

Currently, I am using Sennheiser HD 558 Open Headphones with my Alienware-18 on-board Realtek Chipset Realtek ALC3661. It is one the highest performing on-board sound card with a 600ohm headphones amp. The SNR of 90dB is also pretty darn good for an on-board solution.

My headphone will most probably be a Sennheiser HD650. It took me over a month to decide so please don't suggest anything else as it will make things more complex for me. For the soundcard, I need a AIO solution for Movies, Music and Gaming. My current on-board solution uses Dolby Home Theatre v4, something I love, and specially, the virtual surround mode which makes my stereo Senns sound better surround than any other gaming headsets (I own many of them and they all suck!).

I can either get the well rated Asus Essence One DAC and Headphone Amp but it’s only a stereo solution with no virtual surround software. Many people suggest that a high-end DAC like this with SNR of 120dB coupled with big soundstage of HD650 gives better surround effect that Dolby!? Another solution would be the Asus Xonar U7 which is a gaming oriented card but has a really high-end Cirrus Logic CS4398 DAC and Dolby Home Theatre V4 just like my current card except better in every way! The only trouble is that its Headphone amp is only 150ohms which is inadequate to drive the HD650. Of course I can add an amp like Objective2 to drive the HD650 and would still cost far less than the ASUS Xonar Essence One DAC.

So to sum up, would you recommend the Asus Essence One DAC and Headphone Amp at £349.97 or ASUS Xonar U7 + Objective 2 Amp with a total cost of £166.99 any why?
I don't mind paying the extra but given its worth it.

Thank you.

Best regards,
mumer8637

 

[cjeffcoatjr]

Get the O2/ODAC. It has the AMP and the DAC in one. 

[Lauen]

I think you'd be alright just using the onboard on your laptop, tbh. Also, I was actually surprised you like virtual surround.. also DAC's sound the same, SNR doesn't matter as long as it's minimum 90 or something. What really matters is the amp. What I would do, if I absolutely were to spend money on something, is just get an o2, and plug it into the line out on your PC. also, virtual surround can be achieved by Razer Surround for free.

 

@EmoRarity did I get the dac part right?

[mumer8637]

Get the O2/ODAC. It has the AMP and the DAC in one. 

I considered that but the O2/ODAC has a neutral sound signature, something I don't like.

 

I think you'd be alright just using the onboard on your laptop, tbh. Also, I was actually surprised you like virtual surround.. also DAC's sound the same, SNR doesn't matter as long as it's minimum 90 or something. What really matters is the amp. What I would do, if I absolutely were to spend money on something, is just get an o2, and plug it into the line out on your PC. also, virtual surround can be achieved by Razer Surround for free.

 

@EmoRarity did I get the dac part right?

Dolbys surround just enhances the soundstage. Unlike surround soundcards, it doesn't adds virtual channels!

I'm sorry but I beg to differ. The SNR is very important especially on loud volumes. SNR of 90dB is just on edge (with my hearing abilities). Some people find slight disturbances with even 100dB especially with high impedance headphones.

Razer surround is an option but it makes the sound muddy and irritating for some reason. I used it for a couple of weeks, then switched back to Dolby Home Theatre v4.

 

And you said you were surprised I like virtual surround. Do you prefer stereo and why cause I could really use your reason.

[MayflowerElectronics]

Your buying the wrong headphone if you want a colored sound.

The headphones should color the sound, not the amp/dac.

[LinusTech]

I'm extremely pleased with the ODAC/O2 for my HD600's (pretty similar to the 650's)

 

I haven't tried much else though tbh.

[cjeffcoatjr]

I considered that but the O2/ODAC has a neutral sound signature, something I don't like.

Well, 99.9% of DAC's have that because its a main point of a DAC...

[Lauen]

Your buying the wrong headphone if you want a colored sound.

The headphones should color the sound, not the amp/dac.

Amps could color the sound, but then we would be looking at tube amps and / or bad amps.

 

I considered that but the O2/ODAC has a neutral sound signature, something I don't like.

 

Dolbys surround just enhances the soundstage. Unlike surround soundcards, it doesn't adds virtual channels!

I'm sorry but I beg to differ. The SNR is very important especially on loud volumes. SNR of 90dB is just on edge (with my hearing abilities). Some people find slight disturbances with even 100dB especially with high impedance headphones.

Razer surround is an option but it makes the sound muddy and irritating for some reason. I used it for a couple of weeks, then switched back to Dolby Home Theatre v4.

 

And you said you were surprised I like virtual surround. Do you prefer stereo and why cause I could really use your reason.

I think some of the "veterans" around here would have some words on the whole SNR thing, hopefully @mr moose stops by, maybe he could explain. And if you say the SNR is important, especially in high volumes, wouldn't that mean that my ASUS Xonar D2X (118 dB SNR) would sound better than my onboard audio (95 dB SNR), right? well in my experience, it sounds exactly the same. The biggest difference being the amps, where the onboard can use IEM's (my J33's don't work with the D2X, but they work with onboard), but the soundcard can drive 600 ohm headphones without issues.

 

Razer Surround, and all virtual surround things I've tried do muddy up the sound. I haven't tried Dolby Home Theatre, it might be better, but it's probably still not as clean and straight-forward as just stereo. I use stereo on everything, and in games (the few I rarely play) I set the audio to "Headphone" if I can. This usually gives me my preferred sound, with the best positional audio (imo). your headphones (the 558's) should give you a quite nice soundstage from before, but as far as I've heard the Audio-Technica ATH-AD700X have the best soundstage for gaming, but aren't good for music, as there isn't any bass (just from stuff I've heard around here)

[EmoRarity]

@EmoRarity Did I get the dac part right?

Yeah. 

[mumer8637]

Thank you everyone. I guess there is no easy way to decide since I am myself confused as what I want!

I'm gonna get the HD650 for sure and then I'll get the ASUS Essence One DAC (for stereo), Xonar U7 (for Dolby surround), Creative Xi-Fi HD (for CMSS-3D).

I'll let you know how it turns out..

[YajirobeFromDC]

Thank you everyone. I guess there is no easy way to decide since I am myself confused as what I want!

I'm gonna get the HD650 for sure and then I'll get the ASUS Essence One DAC (for stereo), Xonar U7 (for Dolby surround), Creative Xi-Fi HD (for CMSS-3D).

I'll let you know how it turns out..

 

:wacko:

[JohnnyGrey]

Why not go with a stereo DAC and then add virtual surround with Razer Surround?

[h264]

I wouldn't use onboard with a 300 Ohm headphone.  It gets louder than you think but when you run across a youtube video (like one of Linus's!) you'd like to get a bit louder you'll wish you had the extra headroom.

 

I'll jump on the O2+ODAC bandwagon since that's in fact what I use with my HD650s, but I'll note that since it's such a high impedance headphone, just about any soundcard, amp, or dac will have a proper damping factor.  So the Xonar DG would also work if your really strapped for cash.  Even the Beringer UCA202 with its very high 50 Ohm output impedance would be alright.

[Lauen]

I am confused as to why you're getting all three of those.. 

[Aaranu]

schiit stack, modi + mini?

[dylandylandylan]

schiit stack, modi + mini?

 

You must be new here

[Mattyc]

Thank you everyone. I guess there is no easy way to decide since I am myself confused as what I want!

I'm gonna get the HD650 for sure and then I'll get the ASUS Essence One DAC (for stereo), Xonar U7 (for Dolby surround), Creative Xi-Fi HD (for CMSS-3D).

I'll let you know how it turns out..

 

lol wut?

 

http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/SennheiserHD650.pdf

 

What a mess!

[YajirobeFromDC]

You must be new here

 

whats wrong with the magni + modi? Yes most of the other schiit products are crap. But the modi/magni is cheaper then the 02+odac and has very similar measurements.

[MayflowerElectronics]

whats wrong with the magni + modi? Yes most of the other schiit products are crap. But the modi/magni is cheaper then the 02+odac and has very similar measurements.

 

Actually, they're about the same price.

 

While the shit stack costs $200, you'll need USB cables and an interconnect cable between the two which will run you on their website $20 for the interconnect cable, and let's just say $10-15 for a nice USB cable.

 

By the way, I had to go on their website to find the costs of the cables, and it's terribly slow.

 

The o2/ODAC is $239.99, and it comes with a USB cable and everything you need to set it up.

[YajirobeFromDC]

Actually, they're about the same price.

 

While the shit stack costs $200, you'll need USB cables and an interconnect cable between the two which will run you on their website $20 for the interconnect cable, and let's just say $10-15 for a nice USB cable.

 

By the way, I had to go on their website to find the costs of the cables, and it's terribly slow.

 

The o2/ODAC is $239.99, and it comes with a USB cable and everything you need to set it up.

 

I guess, you could just buy some cheapo cables tho. Also, to get the nice version of the 02/odac with the power in the back is 275

 

main issue i see with the modi/magni is the stock gain is set WAY to high and there is no way to adjust it.

[MayflowerElectronics]

I guess, you could just buy some cheapo cables tho. Also, to get the nice version of the 02/odac with the power in the back is 275

main issue i see with the modi/magni is the stock gain is set WAY to high and there is no way to adjust it.

Well be changing that soon.

Yes the gain is way too high for 80% of the headphones on the market.

[Michael McAllister]

Tyler, I noticed the specifications for your amplifier doesn't really denote the maximum input impedance.  Would you say that the high gain is for 300 ohms and above, or is that for 250 ohms and above?

[YajirobeFromDC]

Well be changing that soon.

Yes the gain is way too high for 80% of the headphones on the market.

 

could you go into more detail? B)

[MayflowerElectronics]

I'll try to remember to check for the exact number for the input impedance, but it's super high.

As for the gain - it's dependent on impedance and sensitivity. There are headphones that are 40 ohms but have very low sensitivity, so high gain is needed.

[ShearMe]

Tyler, I noticed the specifications for your amplifier doesn't really denote the maximum input impedance.  Would you say that the high gain is for 300 ohms and above, or is that for 250 ohms and above?

 

That's because impedance isn't the only thing that determines how hard a headphone is to drive.  B)

 

The impedance determines how many watts an amp can deliver (higher impedance = less current can flow, and thus, less power), but the sensitivity (dB per Watt) determines how loud a speaker can get. Generally, you want an amp to at least be able to drive the speaker to 120dB at your ear (distance matters for speakers, but not really for headphones), or more if you want any "headroom" at all.

 

Edit:

 

I'll try to remember to check for the exact number for the input impedance, but it's super high.

As for the gain - it's dependent on impedance and sensitivity. There are headphones that are 40 ohms but have very low sensitivity, so high gain is needed.

 

Cheeky bugger beat me to it - isn't it past your bedtime?