4K Camcorder/DSLR for travel

[Dredgy]

Hey all, not too familiar with the camcorder market. 

 

Have a massive round the world trip coming up and going to places where I don't want to be pulled up for being a 'journalist' so won't be taking professional cameras. I want a smallish and discrete camcorder or DSLR/mirrorless that has strong video functionality. I will be using it in conjunction with a GoPro. My requirements are

 

• Good video autofocus.
• Microphone input
• 4K, internal recording. Or at least 2.7K.
• Tripod mount.

Also nice to have:

• Stills capability.
• If no interchangeable lens - a decent zoom range.
• Flippable screen.

Budget is flexible.

 

Thanks for any recommendations.

[iamMINT]

What you want is a Panasonic GH4. Fantastic camera. Full 4k, beautiful color rendering, ect. 

[AkiraDaarkst]

3 hours ago, Dredgy said:

Hey all, not too familiar with the camcorder market. 

 

Have a massive round the world trip coming up and going to places where I don't want to be pulled up for being a 'journalist' so won't be taking professional cameras. I want a smallish and discrete camcorder or DSLR/mirrorless that has strong video functionality. I will be using it in conjunction with a GoPro. My requirements are

 

• Good video autofocus.
• Microphone input
• 4K, internal recording. Or at least 2.7K.
• Tripod mount.

Also nice to have:

• Stills capability.
• If no interchangeable lens - a decent zoom range.
• Flippable screen.

Budget is flexible.

 

Thanks for any recommendations.

Sony, Canon, Panasonic camcorders that are 4K capable?  Use your phone to capture stills, and some camcorders do capture stills.

Panasonic or Sony Mirrorless?

 

Take your pick.

 

[xQubeZx]

Sony A6300 with some nice lens. Internal 4K, awesome stills and very capable AF. Doesn't look anything like a full size proffesional dslr unless you pair it with the 2000€ 24-70 2.8. 

 

I would probably get that one and maybe the 18-105 zoom lens. And a Sigma 30 1.4 prime for the shallow dof look. 

 

If you want a even more discrete look you could stick with the kit lens that is really small and just buy some small primes that is really small. Nothing that would draw attention

 

That kit woud weight under 2kg even with a small travel tripod. 

 

But what is your budget really? This would come in under $2000 but not by that much. But it is something that would perform like a proffesional system while looking like a point and shoot on steroids. (Kinda like a bridge camera) 

[xQubeZx]

Also worth mentioning the Fujifilm XT-2 coupled with a few primes. It looks very retro and is said to be a great performer. Is slightly more expensive if I remember right though. 

[AkiraDaarkst]

More than budget and kitting up with bodies and lenses, what's your use case scenario?

How regular will your access be to power outlets to recharge batteries?

How many accessories (like lenses) do you want to carry?

What kind of reach do you want with lenses?  Power zoom lenses on camcorders can have a very long reach while with photo cameras with interchangeable lenses you need longer and generally bigger lenses to achieve the same reach.

How discreet or inconspicuous do you want to be?

 

I can think of a few countries/regions where carrying a "professional" looking camera without permits can get you arrested, namely a country called North Korea.  While you can risk getting mugged and gear stolen in almost every region in the world.

[cc143]

Practically every other (predominantly Asian) tourist I have ever seen has a 5dmk3 with a 24-70 strapped around their necks, so carrying a DSLR shouldn't be that conspicuous.

 

Look at the a6300/a6500 and get whichever one can charge over usb while operating, get something like an anker 20,000mah battery bank off amazon for ~$30 and you'll be set. https://www.amazon.com/EasyAcc-20000mAh-Dual-Input-External-Portable/dp/B01422TC14/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1487072196&sr=8-2&keywords=20000+mah+portable+power+bank

 

Other options are the Panasonic GH4/G7, depending on your budget. I don't know much about their battery performance, and I would take the sony over them because of the larger sensor, but you they are still worth mentioning.  

 

Lenses tend to be more expensive, but for snapshots you can get a Canon FD 35mm f/2.0 for ~$100 and an FD-E mount adapter for ~$20, you'll have to use manual focus, but the peaking on sony cameras makes that easier than it sounds. The kit 16-50mm is kinda crap, but will do the job for video or when you absolutely need AF capability. 

 

This is a handy table with all FD lenses ever made: http://cameraplex.com/list-every-canon-fd-lens-ever-made/ you can also get other mounts or brands, manual adapters can be had for practically change, and you get some great deals in pawn shops etc if you look around. 

[Dredgy]

4 hours ago, AkiraDaarkst said:

More than budget and kitting up with bodies and lenses, what's your use case scenario?

How regular will your access be to power outlets to recharge batteries?

How many accessories (like lenses) do you want to carry?

What kind of reach do you want with lenses?  Power zoom lenses on camcorders can have a very long reach while with photo cameras with interchangeable lenses you need longer and generally bigger lenses to achieve the same reach.

How discreet or inconspicuous do you want to be?

 

I can think of a few countries/regions where carrying a "professional" looking camera without permits can get you arrested, namely a country called North Korea.  While you can risk getting mugged and gear stolen in almost every region in the world.

 

Easiest post to answer, but thanks to the other replies. Budget is no more than $2k - an amount I'm comfortable with having stolen. Anything more expensive and insurance excess gets annoyingly high. I have most equipment I need - though its geared towards bigger cameras.

 

1. Use case scenario is it's mainly for a travel vlog. So I will be using the camcorder for pieces to camera. Probably suction mounting it to the wall of the front of an airplane suite. Also be using it for landscapes and close ups of people/things etc. Facial recognition and autofocus is really important for the pieces to camera since I won't have monitors to accurately pull focus.

2. Hand luggage amounts. No more than 3 lenses, no monitors would be preferable. Wireless streaming to an iPad could be useful though. Phone would likely be in use for stills

3. I have an 18-135mm lens on a Canon APSC sensor - that is plenty of reach, but more wouldn't hurt, especially if wildlife comes into it,  

4.  Very inconspicuous. I will be travelling in North Korea, sensitive areas in Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, Mauritania and Arab countries that are generally sensitive about taking photos (I've been arrested in Kuwait before just with a normal DSLR). Mugging is a risk I'm fine with, least of my concerns haha.

 

Looking at the 4K handicam as my best option so far I thin.

[cc143]

29 minutes ago, Dredgy said:

 

Easiest post to answer, but thanks to the other replies. Budget is no more than $2k - an amount I'm comfortable with having stolen. Anything more expensive and insurance excess gets annoyingly high. I have most equipment I need - though its geared towards bigger cameras.

 

1. Use case scenario is it's mainly for a travel vlog. So I will be using the camcorder for pieces to camera. Probably suction mounting it to the wall of the front of an airplane suite. Also be using it for landscapes and close ups of people/things etc. Facial recognition and autofocus is really important for the pieces to camera since I won't have monitors to accurately pull focus.

2. Hand luggage amounts. No more than 3 lenses, no monitors would be preferable. Wireless streaming to an iPad could be useful though. Phone would likely be in use for stills

3. I have an 18-135mm lens on a Canon APSC sensor - that is plenty of reach, but more wouldn't hurt, especially if wildlife comes into it,  

4.  Very inconspicuous. I will be travelling in North Korea, sensitive areas in Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, Mauritania and Arab countries that are generally sensitive about taking photos (I've been arrested in Kuwait before just with a normal DSLR). Mugging is a risk I'm fine with, least of my concerns haha.

 

Looking at the 4K handicam as my best option so far I thin.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1310845-REG/sony_ilce6300l_b_lkit_alpha_a6300_mirrorless_digital.html

 

This might interest you, I personally hate the 16-50mm as a lens and although I have no particular experience with the 55-210, I'm sure its not the sharpest lens around, judging from its counterparts in the canon system. However, if you want to be inconspicuous, I can't think of a lens you could convert that would achieve that. 

 

I know the a6000 didn't pull focus all that great, even with a native lens, although it had face detection, I'm not sure they have fixed that in the a6300/a6500. The best you could do with mirrorless for AF is I believe the EOS M5, but it only records in 1080p. In that regard you could be better off with a camcorder, although you lose all stills capability.  

[AkiraDaarkst]

54 minutes ago, Dredgy said:

Very inconspicuous. I will be travelling in North Korea, sensitive areas in Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, Mauritania and Arab countries that are generally sensitive about taking photos (I've been arrested in Kuwait before just with a normal DSLR). Mugging is a risk I'm fine with, least of my concerns haha.

LOL those countries you listed were on the top of my head when you mentioned wanting to avoid getting into trouble.

 

I would recommend that you try not to carry too many parts and accessories you'd have to worry about managing.  A camcorder has lens, stabilizer, mic, etc. already built in.  For stills, you can even use disposable cameras and film.  They're very cheap.

 

In NK you'll be guided by a "tour guide" anyway so you will have to be sneaky about filming what they don't want you to film.  And you may want to check out the blogs of other people who have visited NK.  Make sure you don't carry anything the don't want to bringing into the country.

 

Cheapest 4K camcorder listed on B&H

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1109406-REG/panasonic_hc_vx870_4k_ultra_hd.html

[AkiraDaarkst]

Oh and one tip (which may or may not work all the time):

From my own personal experience with working in restrictive countries, sometimes being openly seen doing something is better than trying to be sneaky.  They wouldn't believe you'd be foolish enough to do something so brazen.  You can always say "ahh my mistake, I didn't know", smile be friendly and act a bit embarrassed.  Basically, act like a tourist.

[xQubeZx]

J

2 hours ago, cc143 said:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1310845-REG/sony_ilce6300l_b_lkit_alpha_a6300_mirrorless_digital.html

 

This might interest you, I personally hate the 16-50mm as a lens and although I have no particular experience with the 55-210, I'm sure its not the sharpest lens around, judging from its counterparts in the canon system. However, if you want to be inconspicuous, I can't think of a lens you could convert that would achieve that. 

 

I know the a6000 didn't pull focus all that great, even with a native lens, although it had face detection, I'm not sure they have fixed that in the a6300/a6500. The best you could do with mirrorless for AF is I believe the EOS M5, but it only records in 1080p. In that regard you could be better off with a camcorder, although you lose all stills capability.  

I own the 55-210, its not incredibly sharp, at the long end (200mm) it gets a lot softer. I preffer to use it at 180 ish as furthest unless I need the extra reach. Its quite small though and is better than the kit lens imo. Worth mentioning though, there isn't internal zoom so it extends quite a bit and it has a variable f-stop so I usally just set it a f/6.3 so I wont mess up my exposure, but that isn't so shallow dof. 

 

I think the 18-105 is a better lens, if you can trade away the 100mm, because next lens in that category would be the 70-200 and that will draw a lot of attention. (The 18-200 is said to be quite bad, expensive as fuck, and at its best as sharp as the 55-210. 

 

 

 

But OP, either go with a camcorder, or id you want a mirrorless I think the a6300 is the best option. The AF is said to be vastly improved over the a6000, mainly in tracking and such. It also has eye af which a lot of people praise. (Have not tried it myself yet though). 

 

If you go that route, I would personally use two lenses, the 18-105 and either the sigma 30 1.4 or the sony 50 1.8 for portraits. 

[Dredgy]

15 hours ago, AkiraDaarkst said:

LOL those countries you listed were on the top of my head when you mentioned wanting to avoid getting into trouble.

 

I would recommend that you try not to carry too many parts and accessories you'd have to worry about managing.  A camcorder has lens, stabilizer, mic, etc. already built in.  For stills, you can even use disposable cameras and film.  They're very cheap.

 

In NK you'll be guided by a "tour guide" anyway so you will have to be sneaky about filming what they don't want you to film.  And you may want to check out the blogs of other people who have visited NK.  Make sure you don't carry anything the don't want to bringing into the country.

I've been to NK twice before, I'm relatively comfortable with it. And it's not like I am actually doing journalistic work, but want to be able to produce a quality vlog in places that most other people don't get to go to. 

 

I'll look at all the recommendations and see if I can find a camcorder to rent and try.

[Dredgy]

Because I'm unable to show restraint, my final purchase looked like this:

 

• Panasonic HC-X1000GC - everything I want plus manual focus, iris and zoom so best of both worlds. Little bigger and more professional looking than I wanted and more expensive.
• DJI Mavic. It just looked so cool. Hopefully I'll be able to use it with no big issues
• GoPro Hero 5 with gymbal
• Benro Air tripod/monopod.

All fits comfortably into my hand luggage.

[AkiraDaarkst]

6 hours ago, Dredgy said:

Because I'm unable to show restraint, my final purchase looked like this:

 

• Panasonic HC-X1000GC - everything I want plus manual focus, iris and zoom so best of both worlds. Little bigger and more professional looking than I wanted and more expensive.
• DJI Mavic. It just looked so cool. Hopefully I'll be able to use it with no big issues
• GoPro Hero 5 with gymbal
• Benro Air tripod/monopod.

All fits comfortably into my hand luggage.

OK if you get arrested and killed in North Korea because they think you're a journalist or spy, can you put my name as the recipient of all your gear (big Ursa, the Blackmagic stuff you own, etc.) in your Last Will and Testament?  I'm sure @ShadowCaptain will want a few items too.

 

[Dredgy]

1 hour ago, AkiraDaarkst said:

OK if you get arrested and killed in North Korea because they think you're a journalist or spy, can you put my name as the recipient of all your gear (big Ursa, the Blackmagic stuff you own, etc.) in your Last Will and Testament?  I'm sure @ShadowCaptain will want a few items too.

 

North Korea is easy to manage - just get the guide drunk

Still have a BM Studio Camera in the box that's been sitting there for over a year...

 

Small chance I'll be entering Europe via Zurich though, so if this new camera doesn't suck I can show it off to you!