Tube Doesn't Mate with Fitting

[Yoshi Moshi]

I ordered a bunch of water cooling parts online for my first water cooling build.

 

The fitting in particular that I'm using is a Bykski Flex 10mm ID x 13mm OD Fitting - White (B-FT3-TN-V2W). Product page is here: https://www.performance-pcs.com/water-cooling/fittings-connectors/bykski-flex-10mm-id-x-13mm-od-fitting-white-b-ft3-tn-v2w-b-ft3-tn-v2w.html

The tube that I'm using is PrimoFlex Advanced LRT 10ft Tubing - 3/8in. ID X 1/2in. OD - Crystal Clear. Product page is here: https://www.performance-pcs.com/water-cooling/water-tubing-soft-hard/pvc-soft-tubing/primoflex-advanced-lrt-10ft-tubing-3-8in-id-x-1-2in-od-crystal-clear-pflexa10-12.html

 

If you look at the details of both products. Download the pdf from performance-pcs, both claim to be 10 mm ID 13 mm OD. I can't seem to get them to mate however.

 

I really struggle with getting the tube over what I believe is called the barb? There's a lip sort of thing, where the barb gets wider until it gets to the lip. After it gets to the lip it narrows out to a perfect cylindrical shape. Anyways after struggling I was finally able to get the tube to go over the barb completely (not shown in picture) so that way it was flush with the the rest of the fitting, kind of like how you see in the last picture that I attached. The tube was flushed with the fitting, right before the threads. Now once I accomplished this, and boy was it on there tight and took a lot of work, I was not able to get the locking ring completely on . Is the locking ring supposed to thread all the way down so that it's flush with the rest of the fitting? Kind of like so except with a tube sticking out of it? So that way there's no gap at all between the locking ring and the fitting?

No mater how hard I twisted I could not get the locking ring to sit flush with the rest of the fitting. So I figured I would stop before I broke something and come on here to ask for help. Looking at the products I got, the inner diameter and outer diameter match. The fitting on got is advertised for flexible tubing (not hard tubing). So I'm really lost here on why I'm having such great difficulty. It was a great pain to get the tube over the barb and sit flush against the fitting. I wasn't successful in screwing the locking ring all the way on so that it sat flush with the rest of the fitting. Sorry if this is a noob question, I thought maybe it was the difference between 3/8 inch and 10 mm, as well as 1/2 inch and 13 mm. But the tube is advertised as both, while the fitting is advertised as 10 mm and 13 mm. And the difference between 10 mm and 3/8 probably doesn't make much of a difference when I'm using flexible tubing that can stretch that small difference.

 

I also ordered multiples of these fittings. I tried another one of these fitting, and had the same issue.

 

[Bombastinator]

Barb is a contraction.  The full word is barbette.  It’s a system used in many liquid and gas applications.  If you want to do a google search the full word may be more useful. It’s a friction fitting so you need to push hard.  The tighter it is the better it will work.

 

i should admit at this point that I clicked because of the title.  What I wanted to say is “of course not.  That’s unnatural.  If you want your tube to make little tubes you need to mate it with another tube” which is both obnoxious and useless.  I liked it though.

[Yoshi Moshi]

I understand so the tube is supposed to sit flush with the rest of the fitting, before the threaded portion, and the locking ring is supposed to sit flush with the rest of the fitting? I was able to get the tube flush with the fitting, after a lot pushing, but had no lock with the locking ring. It doesn't seem to be possible with my hands. Is there a tool that I can use, it's not possible with my hand.

 

This is as tight as I could get it, with hand fighting. There's still a gap between the locking ring and the the rest of the fitting. Is this ok? There's still about a thread and a half left.

[Bombastinator]

17 minutes ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

I understand so the tube is supposed to sit flush with the rest of the fitting, before the threaded portion, and the locking ring is supposed to sit flush with the rest of the fitting? I was able to get the tube flush with the fitting, after a lot pushing, but had no lock with the locking ring. It doesn't seem to be possible with my hands. Is there a tool that I can use, it's not possible with my hand.

 

This is as tight as I could get it, with hand fighting. There's still a gap between the locking ring and the the rest of the fitting. Is this ok? There's still about a thread and a half left.

I strongly suspect it will leak.  I already don’t like that thing much because it’s got only one barb ring.  A lot of non watercooling stuff uses 3.  Or more.  The temptation to heat the end of the tube to soften the plastic slightly with a hair dryer is strong but it may not be a good idea.  There are people who know a lot more about watercooling than me will perhaps weigh in on tricks to get it on properly.  You may have to wait a while though.

[For Science!]

47 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Barb is a contraction.  The full word is barbette.  It’s a system used in many liquid and gas applications.  If you want to do a google search the full word may be more useful. It’s a friction fitting so you need to push hard.  The tighter it is the better it will work.

 

i should admit at this point that I clicked because of the title.  What I wanted to say is “of course not.  That’s unnatural.  If you want your tube to make little tubes you need to mate it with another tube” which is both obnoxious and useless.  I liked it though.

Source for barbette? We went over this before, barbs are not from barbette. 

[Bombastinator]

3 minutes ago, For Science! said:

Source for barbette? We went over this before, barbs are not from barbette. 

Do you want the gas tubing one or the plumbing one?  In plumbing a barb fitting actually has spikes.  It is an older term.  The fitting type itself has been around for over a hundred years.

[For Science!]

31 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Do you want the gas tubing one or the plumbing one?  In plumbing a barb fitting actually has spikes.  It is an older term.  The fitting type itself has been around for over a hundred years.

Either is fine but both is preferable, just link a reputable source 

[For Science!]

1 hour ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

 

 

I am pretty sure this is down to primochill being a imperial-perfect tube and barrow being a metric-perfect fitting. You did the right thing of forcing down the tube onto the barb, and put the compression collar as far as you can go. Given the tight fit, normally barb fittings can hold their own with just the barb portion, and so the extra security provided by the compression collar is just a bonus at that point. If you are satisfied with how it looks (i.e. not too ugly because of a gap between the barb portion and collar portion), then leak wise, you are fine.

[Bombastinator]

10 hours ago, For Science! said:

Either is fine but both is preferable, just link a reputable source 

Internet Link specifically seems to be impossible.  There’s only one reference I can find to a fitting I would describe as barbette At granger and it is referred to as barbed.  Widipedia only references gun emplacements though the word predates that use.
 

 The original meaning of barbette was a small hill.  In plumbing there used to be barbed fittings and barbette fittings.  A barbed fitting had triangular protrusions around the tube.  They had problems because they couldn’t be removed without cutting them off, tended to make holes in the tube of a hose clamp was used on them, and the ID of the hose had to be sized more accurately with the OD of the fitting more accurately or they would leak.  They were easier to get on though.  There are fittings that use a system that is not the same but has similar protrusions.  they are referred to as shark tooth.  I’ve held those fittings in my hand. I’ve seen them.  I’ve not used them.  I did remove them though and replace them with what apparently only I anymore would call the barbette type, which was actually older.  The internet seems to have passed them by though.  Perhaps I am just too old. 
 

the term will not help with internet search.  That much seems clear to me.  Words do funny things over time.  

[For Science!]

1 hour ago, Bombastinator said:

Internet Link specifically seems to be impossible.  There’s only one reference I can find to a fitting I would describe as barbette At granger and it is referred to as barbed.  Widipedia only references gun emplacements though the word predates that use.
 

 The original meaning of barbette was a small hill.  In plumbing there used to be barbed fittings and barbette fittings.  A barbed fitting had triangular protrusions around the tube.  They had problems because they couldn’t be removed without cutting them off, tended to make holes in the tube of a hose clamp was used on them, and the ID of the hose had to be sized more accurately with the OD of the fitting more accurately or they would leak.  They were easier to get on though.  There are fittings that use a system that is not the same but has similar protrusions.  they are referred to as shark tooth.  I’ve held those fittings in my hand. I’ve seen them.  I’ve not used them.  I did remove them though and replace them with what apparently only I anymore would call the barbette type, which was actually older.  The internet seems to have passed them by though.  Perhaps I am just too old. 
 

the term will not help with internet search.  That much seems clear to me.  Words do funny things over time.  

Dictionaries are also fine as a source, any formal etymological sources are also reliable. Otherwise unfortunately it sounds like its only you who uses this term, and therefore probably inaccurate.

 

If you truly believe that barbette is used outside of gun placement, any piece of literature, academic, manuals etc can be used to support your claims. You mentioned there was one use, please show us.

 

Therefore without further evidence, you should stop spreading this piece of misinformation. To me, its as bad as trying to convince somebody else that barb fittings are a contraction of barbarian fittings.

 

Barb is not a contraction of barbette. Barbette is a word derived from the same origins as barb, not the other way around. Source: Oxford English Dictionary

 

 

[Bombastinator]

12 minutes ago, For Science! said:

Dictionaries are also fine as a source, any formal etymological sources are also reliable. Otherwise unfortunately it sounds like its only you who uses this term, and therefore probably inaccurate.

 

If you truly believe that barbette is used outside of gun placement, any piece of literature, academic, manuals etc can be used to support your claims. You mentioned there was one use, please show us.

 

Therefore without further evidence, you should stop spreading this piece of misinformation. To me, its as bad as trying to convince somebody else that barb fittings are a contraction of barbarian fittings.

 

Barb is not a contraction of barbette. Barbette is a word derived from the same origins as barb, not the other way around. Source: Oxford English Dictionary

 

 

Too much work.  I’d have to go to a library, and I don’t even know if they’re open in my area.  It’s clearly disappeared without a ripple on the internet.  

[For Science!]

2 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Too much work.  I’d have to go to a library, and I don’t even know if they’re open in my area.  It’s clearly disappeared without a ripple on the internet.  

Or how about Encyclopedias?

From where did you learn the term? For something like this to not be recorded anywhere is staggering (especially if it is an old term), are you sure you were not just misinformed to begin with?

 

https://www.britannica.com/technology/barbette

https://www.britannica.com/search?query=barbette

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/barbette

 

[Bombastinator]

1 minute ago, For Science! said:

Or how about Encyclopedias?

From where did you learn the term? For something like this to not be recorded anywhere is staggering (especially if it is an old term), are you sure you were not just misinformed to begin with?

 

https://www.britannica.com/technology/barbette

https://www.britannica.com/search?query=barbette

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/barbette

 

From an old plumber near 20 years ago. He felt very strongly about it.  I was assisting him in doing the replacements on my building.

[For Science!]

4 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

From an old plumber near 20 years ago. He felt very strongly about it.  I was assisting him in doing the replacements on my building.

Unfortunately feeling very strongly has no relation with accuracy, so I guess without further support from the man himself, I think maybe we can agree on the fact that barb fittings are simply barb fittings and not barbette fittings (and that the old plumber, was misinformed)? I would be happy to even compromise and say "limited to English" as it may be different in other languages.

[Bombastinator]

Just now, For Science! said:

Unfortunately feeling very strongly has no relation with accuracy, so I guess without further support from the man himself, I think maybe we can agree on the fact that barb fittings are simply barb fittings and not barbette fittings? I would be happy to even compromise and say "limited to English" as it may be different in other languages.

I’m sure he is dead.  He was old 20 years ago.  Plumbing is also generally a family business so it’s possibly older than he was.  The building was built in 1929 so the original install could have occurred any time after that.

[For Science!]

4 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

I’m sure he is dead.  He was old 20 years ago.  Plumbing is also generally a family business so it’s possibly older than he was.  The building was built in 1929 so the original install could have occurred any time after that.

Yes, but that the fact that he may have had a family business, or the fact that the building was older than 1929 has very little to do with whether the plumber knew the correct etymology of the word barb. 

[Bombastinator]

1 minute ago, For Science! said:

Yes, but that the fact that he may have had a family business, or the fact that the building was older than 1929 has very little to do with whether the plumber knew the correct etymology of the word barb. 

My suspicion is he did, even if I can’t prove it.  He went on at length.  It’s possible he was BSing me I guess.  I can say for sure though that gun emplacement wasn’t the original definition of barbette.  Words ported to English from French are generally older than cannon.

[For Science!]

1 minute ago, Bombastinator said:

I can say for sure though that gun emplacement wasn’t the original definition of barbette.

Please link your source explaining the original definition of barbette. Preferably peer-reviewed sources or general textbook material such as dictionaries/encylopedias.

 

4 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Words ported to English from French are generally older than cannon.

At least according to Oxford Languages, barbette was a merge rather than a port of the already existing word barb (English) and barbe (French.

Analyzing its use (Case insensitive) over time in literature also points towards it clearly being used after the invention of the cannon (13th century). Early uses in the 17th century are largely associated with anatomical texts associated with a certain Dr. Barbette.

[Bombastinator]

6 minutes ago, For Science! said:

Please link your source explaining the original definition of barbette. Preferably peer-reviewed sources or general textbook material such as dictionaries/encylopedias.

 

At least according to Oxford Languages, barbette was a merge rather than a port of the already existing word barb (English) and barbe (French.

Analyzing its use (Case insensitive) over time in literature also points towards it clearly being used after the invention of the cannon (13th century). Early uses in the 17th century are largely associated with anatomical texts associated with a certain Dr. Barbette.

Sounds like you did it yourself already.  The invasion of England by France was 1216.  There are a lot of English words that got ported.  The classic example is the difference between animal or plants and the foodstuffs produced from them.  Pig and pork for example.  The locals raised it, the rulers ate it.  In German it’s Schweine and schweine fleisch

[For Science!]

8 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Sounds like you did it yourself already.  The invasion of England by France was 1216.  There are a lot of English words that got ported.  The classic example is the difference between animal or plants and the foodstuffs produced from them.  Pig and pork for example.  The locals raised it, the rulers ate it.  In German it’s Schweine and schweine fleisch

Again, that has nothing to do with the matter in question. The only thing I ask of you is to acknowledge that barb fittings not short of barbette, and in future to not to mention barbettes in the context of fittings. I have gone to lengths showing you from multiple angles and sources that there is nothing to support the use of the word "barbette" in this scenario. I think you were BSed by your old plumber, or (s)he genuinely didn't know any better; perhaps its time to let go of that old story, and base your knowledge on reliable sources that are accounted and traceable or peer-reviewed.

[Bombastinator]

27 minutes ago, For Science! said:

Again, that has nothing to do with the matter in question. The only thing I ask of you is to acknowledge that barb fittings not short of barbette, and in future to not to mention barbettes in the context of fittings. I have gone to lengths showing you from multiple angles and sources that there is nothing to support the use of the word "barbette" in this scenario. I think you were BSed by your old plumber, or (s)he genuinely didn't know any better; perhaps its time to let go of that old story, and base your knowledge on reliable sources that are accounted and traceable or peer-reviewed.

I am willing to say that it isn’t anymore.  Your demand smacks me as way too similar as the traditional “demand for apology” which right wingers do constantly but never proffer themselves because they know it to be something that ends a bout.  This is not a bout.

 

i will agree that the internet does not cover it as a concept, and as such it is not a useful term for modern watercooling.  That has already happened earlier.  You want much more than that though.  That is not the same as it never having happened.  Your arguments about etymology never precluded it and had errors.  I do not believe it has been proven to have never happens though I do agree that the concept that it did has become prohibitively difficult to research.  That we agree on.  You want full nullification though and that has not been shown either.

[For Science!]

42 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

I am willing to say that it isn’t anymore.  Your demand smacks me as way too similar as the traditional “demand for apology” which right wingers do constantly but never proffer themselves because they know it to be something that ends a bout.  This is not a bout.

 

i will agree that the internet does not cover it as a concept, and as such it is not a useful term for modern watercooling.  That has already happened earlier.  You want much more than that though.  That is not the same as it never having happened.  Your arguments about etymology never precluded it and had errors.  I do not believe it has been proven to have never happens though I do agree that the concept that it did has become prohibitively difficult to research.  That we agree on.  You want full nullification though and that has not been shown either.

I do not seek an apology as there is nothing inherently wrong about being misinformed, and If that is how you felt after this conversation, know that that it is not my intention to belittle you or anything of that nature. Just as you wish to spread information, I also wish to do the same, just that this particular time, I felt your information was incorrect and needed pointing out. 

 

This is indeed not a bout, and I hope you would not be offended if I told you that from my perspective, it felt akin to arguing with flat-earthers/anti-vaxxers/anti-maskers as I kept presenting evidence only to be faced with the "but I heard from somebody else to be the contrary", in this case, an old plumber.

 

I of course do not doubt that what experience you may have had in the past with this old plumber, and maybe that in his immediate vicinity that this term was used in that particular way. However this is clearly not been a widely accepted term, as indicated by the complete absence of its recorded use in literature. And as you correctly mention, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence; but certainly without evidence of presence, presence cannot be supported.

 

I am glad that we can move on forward without using the term barbette in watercooling. I am sure that our collective knowledge can better the watercooling community further.

[Bombastinator]

36 minutes ago, For Science! said:

I do not seek an apology as there is nothing inherently wrong about being misinformed, and If that is how you felt after this conversation, know that that it is not my intention to belittle you or anything of that nature. Just as you wish to spread information, I also wish to do the same, just that this particular time, I felt your information was incorrect and needed pointing out. 

 

This is indeed not a bout, and I hope you would not be offended if I told you that from my perspective, it felt akin to arguing with flat-earthers/anti-vaxxers/anti-maskers as I kept presenting evidence only to be faced with the "but I heard from somebody else to be the contrary", in this case, an old plumber.

 

I of course do not doubt that what experience you may have had in the past with this old plumber, and maybe that in his immediate vicinity that this term was used in that particular way. However this is clearly not been a widely accepted term, as indicated by the complete absence of its recorded use in literature. And as you correctly mention, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence; but certainly without evidence of presence, presence cannot be supported.

 

I am glad that we can move on forward without using the term barbette in watercooling. I am sure that our collective knowledge can better the watercooling community further.

Your case is compelling and most distinctively is functionally useful.  If I hadn’t held one in my hand I would agree with you.

[bowrilla]

Back to the issue at hand. It is normal for the tubing to need quite a push and stretch to fit. In this case it looks like quite a mismatch. The thing is, you're usually using something like 9.5mm ID and 12.7mm OD and not real 10/13. Makes sense since the imperial measurements given (3/8" and 1/2") don't really match 10/13. Some manufacturers though do produce actual 10/13 tubing and others stick to the imperial 9.5/12.7. Some fitting manufacturers go more towards the actual 3/8" / 1/2" tubing, others aim for the nominal 10/13 measurements. You might have been unlucky here.

 

Have you checked measurements with a caliper?

 

P.S.: Pushing the tube onto the fitting is sometimes really tricky if the tube is very soft and wiggly. A) leave as little wiggle room as possible for the tube to kink B) heat it up with a heat gun to make it soft and stretchy and quickly push it over the fitting. That's one way to make very tight bends with soft tubing as well (next to pushing a spring over the tube)

[For Science!]

32 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

If I hadn’t held one in my hand I would agree with you.

Sorry, I swear I will just accept whatever answer you give, but I need to ask since I don't understand - held what in your hand? a barb fitting?