Do you need Windows 10?

[SHG_Marsh]

I have windows 10 (The full version) But before that I had the free version for a while. Was it worth the $120? The only thing that you couldn't do in the free version was customize your windows 10 experience. You could still download games and play them. And when I upgraded I didn't see any performance boosts. So do you really need to get the full version?

[WhiteAirLock]

To be honest, it isn't important to get the full version but you won't get any support, if they would find out that your system isn't activated. There won't be any performance boost at all and only 0,06% of the Software or Games will tell you to activate your OS first before installing.

 

 

Just some tips for the future

I actually always installed Windows 7 Ultimate (64bit or 32bit) from my DVD with normal license key (not the OEM one) and then I was able to legally upgrade to Windows 10 Pro 64bit/32bit by just mounting the Windows 10 Pro iso to an virtual dvd drive.

You can still get the free upgrade and Windows 10 Pro iso can be easily downloaded from Microsoft with their media creation tool.

[SHG_Marsh]

1 minute ago, WhiteAirLock said:

To be honest, it isn't important to get the full version but you won't get any support, if they would find out that your system isn't activated. There won't be any performance boost at all and only 0,06% of the Software or Games will tell you to activate your OS first before installing.

 

 

Just some tips for the future

I actually always installed Windows 7 Ultimate (64bit or 32bit) from my DVD with normal license key (not the OEM one) and then I was able to legally upgrade to Windows 10 Pro 64bit/32bit by just mounting the Windows 10 Pro iso to an virtual dvd drive.

You can still get the free upgrade and Windows 10 Pro iso can be easily downloaded from Microsoft with their media creation tool.

I have windows 10 the full version im just asking if I wasted money

[WhiteAirLock]

9 hours ago, SHG_Marsh said:

I have windows 10 the full version im just asking if I wasted money

I would say that it isn't worth to pay that much money to get the customization enabled

[ZacoAttaco]

6 minutes ago, WhiteAirLock said:

To be honest, it isn't important to get the full version but you won't get any support, if they would find out that your system isn't activated.

It's funny you say that actually. I remember Linus saying that Windows licensing is strange because they don't really offer support for their products. There's no hotline to call and have your issues addressed. That's why forums like this are so popular, people are left to themselves and their community to fix issues that could be fixed via a Windows support team.

[pipnina]

Even 9 years after launch... You will not be missing out on much of anything by keeping windows 7 around.

I doubt games will stop running on it until after its EOL in 2021 either. Maybe even later than that depending on how many people stick to W7 at that time.

DX12 is not exactly a floating ship (compared to Vulkan) so I think until newer versions of Vulkan stop working on W7, W7 users won't be missing out.

[AngryBeaver]

7 minutes ago, pipnina said:

Even 9 years after launch... You will not be missing out on much of anything by keeping windows 7 around.

I doubt games will stop running on it until after its EOL in 2021 either. Maybe even later than that depending on how many people stick to W7 at that time.

DX12 is not exactly a floating ship (compared to Vulkan) so I think until newer versions of Vulkan stop working on W7, W7 users won't be missing out.

People that hold on to old OS's until they go EOL are a huge problem though, because these are the same people that run them AFTER they are EOL and lose the security patching.

 

There is no reason to stay on 7 vs move to 10. Windows 10 is more secure and has added many new security features and levels of access. It has improved application and OS performance. It boots,shuts down, sleeps, resumes, and hibernates much quicker than previous windows versions. It has some pretty good built-ins. It does a much better job of keeping SSD's optimized and the same for keeping your windows up to date. There is no prompt or user action needed... it just happens.

 

Then we have limits on ram size on windows 7. If you are on a home version you can't use more than 8gb of ram (assuming you are on 64 bit) You an upgrade to home premium for 16gb of ram... or go to a professional version for 196gb of ram support. Windows 10 does limit home users, but that is at 128gb and all other versions support up to 2 tb of ram. So here is another limitation of 7... and having to upgrade to home premium down the road to move to 16gb of ram seem pretty pointless these days. Oh ya lets also not forget the nice memory compression algorithms in windows 10 which makes the ram you have go further.

 

This isn't even looking at the much improved search functions, cortana or DX12 support. Let's also not forget the bloat-free edge browser.

[Sauron]

There is no such thing as a free version, there are only copies that haven't been activated yet. You can do everything with a non activated copy except for a few aesthetic customizations. That is designed to annoy you into buying a key, but still give you what you need so you're tempted to actually buy it and not move to something else. You also won't be eligible for tech support if you don't own a key.

 

So no, if you are content with what the non activated copy offers then you don't need to actually buy it. Microsoft provides the system image for free so it's legal for you to use it that way if you so choose. Just be aware of the lack of support.

 

 

[Sauron]

17 minutes ago, AngryBeaver said:

the much improved search functions

I agree with everything else you said, but honestly I find the search function to be utter garbage in windows 10. It simply does not find what I want it to find sometimes, even if I write the whole name. It also wildly changes results if you so much as add a single letter for no apparent reason. I use a third party tool called launchy, it's much better in my opinion.

[pipnina]

50 minutes ago, AngryBeaver said:

People that hold on to old OS's until they go EOL are a huge problem though, because these are the same people that run them AFTER they are EOL and lose the security patching.

 

There is no reason to stay on 7 vs move to 10. Windows 10 is more secure and has added many new security features and levels of access. It has improved application and OS performance. It boots,shuts down, sleeps, resumes, and hibernates much quicker than previous windows versions. It has some pretty good built-ins. It does a much better job of keeping SSD's optimized and the same for keeping your windows up to date. There is no prompt or user action needed... it just happens.

 

Then we have limits on ram size on windows 7. If you are on a home version you can't use more than 8gb of ram (assuming you are on 64 bit) You an upgrade to home premium for 16gb of ram... or go to a professional version for 196gb of ram support. Windows 10 does limit home users, but that is at 128gb and all other versions support up to 2 tb of ram. So here is another limitation of 7... and having to upgrade to home premium down the road to move to 16gb of ram seem pretty pointless these days. Oh ya lets also not forget the nice memory compression algorithms in windows 10 which makes the ram you have go further.

 

This isn't even looking at the much improved search functions, cortana or DX12 support. Let's also not forget the bloat-free edge browser.

And also let's not forget the adware Microsoft bundles with Windows 10. Candy crush, Minecraft W10 edition, and a dozen other "demo" games that you often go through and uninstall only for them to re-appear in the next update.

 

And while you can disable it, the default behaviour of "out-of-hours" reboots for updates is still a horrendous policy. Automatic updates is one thing, but forcefully rebooting the computer to perform them is another form of scumbaggery.

 

And of course we then get to the data collection, which we know is far greater than the settings you get to choose at install let in on. I don't know how much of that W7 does, but it's almost certainly a lot less than W10's.

 

There's a reason why, three years on, even after almost a year of neigh-on forcing people to update, windows 7 has still got 37% market share in the gaming world (according to steam), and Windows 10 54%. Microsoft destroyed their reputation and consumer trust repeatedly with windows 8 and windows 10. Is it surprising that people will want to stick with windows 7?

[AngryBeaver]

49 minutes ago, Sauron said:

I agree with everything else you said, but honestly I find the search function to be utter garbage in windows 10. It simply does not find what I want it to find sometimes, even if I write the whole name. It also wildly changes results if you so much as add a single letter for no apparent reason. I use a third party tool called launchy, it's much better in my opinion.

Ok, I agree with this is can be finnicky. That being said I still find it to do better than windows 7 and 8 did. I think the biggest thing I can suggest with it is to make sure you have it ONLY searching your machine... if not then you will have hell trying to find anything when it is using online sources.

[Sauron]

4 minutes ago, AngryBeaver said:

make sure you have it ONLY searching your machine...

Oh I already do that, but I have a *lot* of stuff on my desktop

[AngryBeaver]

9 minutes ago, pipnina said:

And also let's not forget the adware Microsoft bundles with Windows 10. Candy crush, Minecraft W10 edition, and a dozen other "demo" games that you often go through and uninstall only for them to re-appear in the next update.

 

And while you can disable it, the default behaviour of "out-of-hours" reboots for updates is still a horrendous policy. Automatic updates is one thing, but forcefully rebooting the computer to perform them is another form of scumbaggery.

 

And of course we then get to the data collection, which we know is far greater than the settings you get to choose at install let in on. I don't know how much of that W7 does, but it's almost certainly a lot less than W10's.

 

There's a reason why, three years on, even after almost a year of neigh-on forcing people to update, windows 7 has still got 37% market share in the gaming world (according to steam), and Windows 10 54%. Microsoft destroyed their reputation and consumer trust repeatedly with windows 8 and windows 10. Is it surprising that people will want to stick with windows 7?

Everything has some form of bundled software these days. I find it is easy to just delete all of the items you are talking about and on top of that I have been on windows 10 since the testing days and none of these items have magically come back. On top of that for your average user there is little to no downside for leaving these on the machine... you give up what... maybe 200mb?

 

For the average person the out-of-hours reboot is a good thing. It picks a time frame that most people are not on their machine and does a reboot to make sure they are running the latest versions of windows, defender, and security patches. So the benefits far out weight the cons here for your average user. I would much rather see the majority of people more secure and be inconveniences by a reboot once every blue moon.

 

People need to get over this data collection crap. This has been going on for a decade and only really came to light with the facebook incident. If you are browsing the web or pretty much doing anything on your pc or phone then chances are you are being tracked in one form or another. Windows does collect certain NON-PII data. They use it to improve your experience, to possibly sell for a profit, but then again it keeps the cost of windows down for you as well. On top of that you can disable much of this practice and they aren't using or sharing information that can be used to identify YOU. This is pretty much common practice everywhere now.

 

Destroyed their trust with windows 8? I used windows 8 as well. The thing is people as a whole rather complain about change than embrace it. So people were upset they lost their start menu, well a quick 3rd party download would restore it. So I can understand why people were put off, it was a little harder to get use to coming from a version with a start menu, that being said there was nothing wrong with it as a whole. Just people didn't like having to learn something new.

 

As for market share.. there are still plenty of people running 8800 gtxs and 2xx and 4xx nvidia GPU's. Probably in about the same rate that you are seeing windows 7 machines. So this is nothing new, there will be people with outdated hardware and software regardless... and often these people are not tech savvy and are using what they have on their prebuild system. Some of these people did the free upgrade, others didn't know what it was, and some others just missed the free upgrade window. Still the number will continue to grow. We still are seeing very little actual dx12 titles so when they become more mainstream I would expect to see that gap close relatively quickly for gamers.

[AngryBeaver]

10 minutes ago, Sauron said:

Oh I already do that, but I have a *lot* of stuff on my desktop

I did too until I decided to break things up into categories and create desktop folders for them. Now my desktop is pretty clean and I still can get to what I need in just a few seconds.

[CriticalCarrot]

Windows 10 is a great OS and I think it really is worth it . I managed to get Windows 10 bundled with my build since I used PC part picker , so if you're getting a new build I would say that Windows 10 is good to get with it.

[ZacoAttaco]

7 hours ago, AngryBeaver said:

Then we have limits on ram size on windows 7. If you are on a home version you can't use more than 8gb of ram (assuming you are on 64 bit) You an upgrade to home premium for 16gb of ram... or go to a professional version for 196gb of ram support.

Wasn't aware of those limitations... That'll be what kills Windows 7 adoption, people will need to run more than 8/16gb.

6 hours ago, AngryBeaver said:

I agree with everything else you said, but honestly I find the search function to be utter garbage in windows 10.

It's not even worth using to be honest. When you search for Steam, an Edge suggestion pops up, then 2 steamreporter.exe files. Useless. Online search should not even be included, I never go to my start menu to Google or Bing search something.

 

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

8 hours ago, pipnina said:

And also let's not forget the adware Microsoft bundles with Windows 10. Candy crush, Minecraft W10 edition, and a dozen other "demo" games that you often go through and uninstall only for them to re-appear in the next update.

 

And while you can disable it, the default behaviour of "out-of-hours" reboots for updates is still a horrendous policy. Automatic updates is one thing, but forcefully rebooting the computer to perform them is another form of scumbaggery.

 

And of course we then get to the data collection, which we know is far greater than the settings you get to choose at install let in on. I don't know how much of that W7 does, but it's almost certainly a lot less than W10's.

 

There's a reason why, three years on, even after almost a year of neigh-on forcing people to update, windows 7 has still got 37% market share in the gaming world (according to steam), and Windows 10 54%. Microsoft destroyed their reputation and consumer trust repeatedly with windows 8 and windows 10. Is it surprising that people will want to stick with windows 7?

Data collection has been implemented into Windows 7 for a long while. Windows 7 is not immune to it. What made people think that Microsoft couldn't shoe horn that stuff in through an update? 

 

[kirashi]

10 hours ago, Sauron said:

So no, if you are content with what the non activated copy offers then you don't need to actually buy it. Microsoft provides the system image for free so it's legal for you to use it that way if you so choose. Just be aware of the lack of support.

Providing it for free does not negate the fact that the EULA requires one to buy a key after the grace period expires. However, Microsoft doesn't really care to go after home users for this because it's more profitable to go after businesses running 100 unlicensed copies of Windows instead since they can fine them much more for not buying enough copies to cover the number of licenses in use.

[Sauron]

10 hours ago, kirashi said:

Providing it for free does not negate the fact that the EULA requires one to buy a key after the grace period expires.

As most EULAs that's probably not legally binding, after all you didn't sign a contract, no money changed hands and you got it through legal channels. If they really cared they should grow a pair and lock the copy until you enter a key, but they won't because ultimately that would hurt their monopoly.

 

But yes, they will go after small businesses with a vengeance and in a business setting eulas hold a lot more weight as far as I know.

 

I'm definitely not a legal expert though.