PSU Designs

[LienusLateTips]

I don't know THAT much about PSUs, but in addition to DC-DC and group regulated, lately I have been hearing about something called "LLC-Resonant." What is this and what are some competing designs to it?

 

 

@quan289 @Stefan Payne @STRMfrmXMN @Energycore @jonnyGURU

[STRMfrmXMN]

34 minutes ago, JDE said:

I don't know THAT much about PSUs, but in addition to DC-DC and group regulated, lately I have been hearing about something called "LLC-Resonant." What is this and what are some competing designs to it?

 

 

@quan289 @Stefan Payne @STRMfrmXMN @Energycore @jonnyGURU

It's almost 11 PM dude I don't wanna have to work mah brain

 

Here's an article on how LLC resonant converters work. If you know how LLC works on motherboards (maybe you've learned from overclocking the rather LLC setting-dependent Ryzen CPUs..?) then it's the same-ish ordeal on a PSU, all in the name of efficiency. Resonant topology types are efficient and LLC resonant is relatively cheap.

 

EDIT: Thought I might add that LLC means "load line calibration" in case you want to do some Googling about that.

[LienusLateTips]

14 minutes ago, STRMfrmXMN said:

It's almost 11 PM dude I don't wanna have to work mah brain

 

Here's an article on how LLC resonant converters work. If you know how LLC works on motherboards (maybe you've learned from overclocking the rather LLC setting-dependent Ryzen CPUs..?) then it's the same-ish ordeal on a PSU, all in the name of efficiency.

oh thanks

 

i'll read the whole thing.

[Stefan Payne]

2 hours ago, JDE said:

I don't know THAT much about PSUs, but in addition to DC-DC and group regulated, lately I have been hearing about something called "LLC-Resonant." What is this and what are some competing designs to it?

 

 

@quan289 @Stefan Payne @STRMfrmXMN @Energycore @jonnyGURU

LLC-Resonant Mode Converter is something that reduces the losses in the primary part of it. 

And it becomes the standard. Some Datasheets of an CM6900 or the Infineon Chips help understanding it.

 

The next competing design is Active Clamp (reset) Topology that FSP uses in their lower end Gold units (FSP Aurum based ones), but it seems that that one is replaced by LLC-Resonant Mode Designs as well.

 

A 'disadvantage' of this Topology is that it only works with one voltage, so only +12V comes out of the transformer. And it's not a good design for a PSU with variable voltage. But that doesn't matter for ATX PSUs right now...

 

In the old days there were other things as well. Noticable mentions:
Huntkey X7-1200W (Like the one I have ;))

Enermax Platimax/MrRevo 1200W and more. 

High Power/Sirfa 1200W Thingy

 

 

Some others (like HEC, CWT) pushed normal Double Forward/PWM Designs to Gold Level. Not sure about platinum though...

[Guest]

9 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

In the old days there were other things as well. Noticable mentions:
Huntkey X7-1200W (Like the one I have ;))

Enermax Platimax/MrRevo 1200W and more. 

High Power/Sirfa 1200W Thingy

Hey.. Don't forget BFG ES-800.     The first consumer desktop PSU to use LLC.

 

 

[Stefan Payne]

1 minute ago, jonnyGURU said:

Hey.. Don't forget BFG ES-800.     The first consumer desktop PSU to use LLC.

Wasn't that the first 450W Silverstone Fanless?

But after seeing that, I'd rather forget it again

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/BFG/ES-800_800W/3.html

[Guest]

Hey man.. That was 9 years ago.  I was still young.... and noise wasn't as much of an issue back then because, you know, 8800 GTX.

 

Also, there was no closed loop coolers readily available back then.  Cool IT just came out and they were pretty crappy.  I had a custom loop, mostly Danger Den blocks and a submerged Eheim pump, so the PSU was the loudest part in my PC, so I used the Koolance liquid cooled 1200W instead of the BFG I was product manager for.

 

[Stefan Payne]

Well, I meant the primary capacitors. They are a bit "interesting"...

 

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

Well, I meant the primary capacitors. They are a bit "interesting"...

 

 

What?  Being sideways?

 

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

Wasn't that the first 450W Silverstone Fanless?

Nope.  The BFG predates that by 1 or 2 years.

 

[Stefan Payne]

2 hours ago, jonnyGURU said:

What?  Being sideways?

Being all over the place and 3 in total..

If I see it correctly, that PCB behind that is that the PFC circuit?? WIth the small Nippon Chemicon Cap soldered to it (that's hangin around in the breeze somewhat)...

And the Cap with that PCB screwed between the heatsinks is rather interesting...

 

€dit:
Oh and by the way, one of the first Digital Designs seems to be a Minebea 400W WTX Thing with two PCB, aPFC and so on - early 2000s.

Got mine out of an old Celsous 670 (the one with the green case and the RAMBUS Riser)

[Guest]

I said first consumer level desktop PSU with LLC.  Not first PSU with LLC.

 

Anyhoo.. the design was unique, but the goal was to provide ultimate airflow.  There's a main PCB with a bunch of daughter cards.  This allowed the fan to actually provide airflow across the daughter cards.  Worked very well.