HiFi setup

[Dantemoulin]

Hi everyone!

I need some clarification help with my future HiFi setup.

I am new to the whole HiFi stuff and I am not sure what is good and what is not.

I have a neighbor who has a pair of Cerwin Vega XLS-215's and they sound awesome so I was going to get a pair of those and a good pre-amp but everyone says their sound quality is not as good as HiFi speaker's so I have decided to try getting in to some HiFi stuff to see if there are anything interesting for me.

As I just stated I am not sure what is good and what is not so I thought it would be nice if you guys could give me some tips of good speakers and receivers.

Also, do I need anything else besides speakers and a receiver to get the best possible sound quality? Bass shaker?

Thanks in advance!

[t0wer]

Used or refurbished can save you a ton of money in audio equipment.

the only main parts the break or wear out is vacuum tubes and speaker surrounds. both of which are easy and cheap to fix.

one thing to keep an eye on is how the speakers are sold. higher end speakers are usually sold seperately.

I would say the best thing you can do is find local audio stores and go listen to the speakers you plan to buy.

also check thrift stores. You might get lucky.

if you're looking to buy online this pair is about the same cost as a new pair of XLS-215 and should sound a little better.

http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php?loudspeakers=b-stock&p=arx-a5-floorstanding-loudspeaker-b-stock&cPath=21_41&products_id=222&osCsid=ad9946fbf

now for amps

You will want to look for an integrated amp (has both pre-amp and power amp) or a receiver.

I'd look into brands like yamaha or NAD.

I haven't run into a system with a subwoofer that I've really liked, I don't know if they haven't been setup right, or they've just been cheap.

I'd find a set of speakers first and if you think they need more lower end then buy a subwoofer.

[knight_40k]

Audio is a tricky beast. Speakers are extremely subjective to each individuals ears. You need to demo speakers at a local shop and find what you like. Also note that receivers and processors have difference characteristics which change the sound of speakers. Example, if you upgrade your receiver you've been using for the last 6 years and go with a different brand or a significantly higher model but keep the same speakers, it may take some getting used to for your ears to adjust, you may like it, you may not.

When you say best sound quality possible, you need to specify a budget. Most people use receivers for 5.1 or 7.1 but you can also get higher end ones that support 9.1 natively or by use of external amplification (depending on the model) or you can go even higher and get 11 channel. Note, no receiver currently supports 11 channel natively and will require an external amp. If you go beyond that you are getting into separates such as pre-amps, processors and power amplifiers for each speaker but I won't get into that.

Do you have any equipment you will be using or starting a build from scratch? Generally you want to start with a good pair for your front L/R, then when the budget allows get a sub and center channel. surrounds are less important. Also note you want to stick with the same brand and same line of speaker so that you have matching drivers and tweeters. It won't hurt to mix and match brands and lines but it's not recommended when starting a build because depending on quality of the speakers there may be a noticeable difference. But if you are doing it just to hold you over until you can afford something better then that's fine.

Other things to consider, how large is your room? Is the system mainly for music or movies or games? This will determine what size of sub to buy and how many you'll need. In general 8" and 10" subs are for music listening. 12's or larger are for movie and games. Most people use 1 or 2 subs for medium to large rooms unless you are a major "basshead". Also, are you living in a condo or sharing a wall with a neighbor? This will affect your choice as well.

[Dantemoulin]

Used or refurbished can save you a ton of money in audio equipment.

the only main parts the break or wear out is vacuum tubes and speaker surrounds. both of which are easy and cheap to fix.

one thing to keep an eye on is how the speakers are sold. higher end speakers are usually sold seperately.

I would say the best thing you can do is find local audio stores and go listen to the speakers you plan to buy.

also check thrift stores. You might get lucky.

if you're looking to buy online this pair is about the same cost as a new pair of XLS-215 and should sound a little better.

http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php?loudspeakers=b-stock&p=arx-a5-floorstanding-loudspeaker-b-stock&cPath=21_41&products_id=222&osCsid=ad9946fbf

now for amps

You will want to look for an integrated amp (has both pre-amp and power amp) or a receiver.

I'd look into brands like yamaha or NAD.

I haven't run into a system with a subwoofer that I've really liked, I don't know if they haven't been setup right, or they've just been cheap.

I'd find a set of speakers first and if you think they need more lower end then buy a subwoofer.

Thanks for your response!

The sad thing is that I have to drive a loooooong way to get to the nearest local audio store so I don't think that will be an option.

I have been looking a lot at NAD receivers, they look awesome and has some really cool features, I really like that you can replace the hardware if a new technology is released.

I am a real bass freak so not having a subwoofer is out of the question but like you I have not heard any good hifi subs and I do not know how I should begin my search for the right one yet but I guess that I will have to deal with that later.

[Dantemoulin]

Audio is a tricky beast. Speakers are extremely subjective to each individuals ears. You need to demo speakers at a local shop and find what you like. Also note that receivers and processors have difference characteristics which change the sound of speakers. Example, if you upgrade your receiver you've been using for the last 6 years and go with a different brand or a significantly higher model but keep the same speakers, it may take some getting used to for your ears to adjust, you may like it, you may not.

When you say best sound quality possible, you need to specify a budget. Most people use receivers for 5.1 or 7.1 but you can also get higher end ones that support 9.1 natively or by use of external amplification (depending on the model) or you can go even higher and get 11 channel. Note, no receiver currently supports 11 channel natively and will require an external amp. If you go beyond that you are getting into separates such as pre-amps, processors and power amplifiers for each speaker but I won't get into that.

Do you have any equipment you will be using or starting a build from scratch? Generally you want to start with a good pair for your front L/R, then when the budget allows get a sub and center channel. surrounds are less important. Also note you want to stick with the same brand and same line of speaker so that you have matching drivers and tweeters. It won't hurt to mix and match brands and lines but it's not recommended when starting a build because depending on quality of the speakers there may be a noticeable difference. But if you are doing it just to hold you over until you can afford something better then that's fine.

Other things to consider, how large is your room? Is the system mainly for music or movies or games? This will determine what size of sub to buy and how many you'll need. In general 8" and 10" subs are for music listening. 12's or larger are for movie and games. Most people use 1 or 2 subs for medium to large rooms unless you are a major "basshead". Also, are you living in a condo or sharing a wall with a neighbor? This will affect your choice as well.

Thanks for your response!

I am not planning to go any greater than 7.2 channels

I guess you can not get away with not listening to lots of speakers to get to know your ears better.

I think I will start building a system from scratch because my current setup is some random speakers in a ghetto setup.

Something like this:

Front: Logitech Z-2300

Rear: Some old stereo

Sub: disabled since the Logitech speakers has an 8" sub

Center: Random speaker I got with my phone (sounds surprisingly good).

You are probably laughing you a*s off right now but I have not cared much about sound till recently.

I was reading about the Bowers and Wilkins 600 and 800 series Diamond speakers because of their looks and they have gotten some really good reviews.

But then comes a little problem... the price

My budget lays around $500 at the moment for the speakers and about $200 for the receiver.

[josh_05]

OK, to clarify something, Hi-Fi is not home theater. Hi_Fi is a 2 channel setup. 90% of Hi-Fi setups don't use a receiver they will use a class A/B integrated amp or separate Class A/B minimum pre and power amp and either a DAC, turntable or CD player for sources. Hi-Fi is for the very best SQ for music, home theater is surround sound for movies. Looking at your current setup, any of the B&W speakers would simply blow you away, they are miles and i mean miles above in SQ of what you currently have.

what type of music do you listen to? do you like a lot of bass? or a more even tonal balance? what is the size of the room you will have it in? and finally is it more for movies/games or music or a bit of both?

[Dantemoulin]

OK, to clarify something, Hi-Fi is not home theater. Hi_Fi is a 2 channel setup. 90% of Hi-Fi setups don't use a receiver they will use a class A/B integrated amp or separate Class A/B minimum pre and power amp and either a DAC, turntable or CD player for sources. Hi-Fi is for the very best SQ for music, home theater is surround sound for movies. Looking at your current setup, any of the B&W speakers would simply blow you away, they are miles and i mean miles above in SQ of what you currently have.

what type of music do you listen to? do you like a lot of bass? or a more even tonal balance? what is the size of the room you will have it in? and finally is it more for movies/games or music or a bit of both?

Hi and thanks for your response!

I must have misunderstood the term Hi-Fi.

I will use my system mainly for music and movies, I use headset when gaming.

I want that clean sound quality that you do not get a headache from when listening for an extended period of time.

Is it possible to get the sound quality of a Hi-Fi system in a surround setup?

I listen to almost all kinds of music but mostly hardstyle if I were to choose only one style. My music style is dependent on my mood.

Yes I LOVE Bass! I want to be able to hear the very lowest drops.

My room is pretty small, about 4m wide and 6m long.

[josh_05]

OK, to clarify something, Hi-Fi is not home theater. Hi_Fi is a 2 channel setup. 90% of Hi-Fi setups don't use a receiver they will use a class A/B integrated amp or separate Class A/B minimum pre and power amp and either a DAC, turntable or CD player for sources. Hi-Fi is for the very best SQ for music, home theater is surround sound for movies. Looking at your current setup, any of the B&W speakers would simply blow you away, they are miles and i mean miles above in SQ of what you currently have.

what type of music do you listen to? do you like a lot of bass? or a more even tonal balance? what is the size of the room you will have it in? and finally is it more for movies/games or music or a bit of both?

I'm thinking with your budget that Q-acoustics might have something nice to offer. They are not the last word in detail and resolution but they are very easy to listen to, very neutral for the price and have very nice timing which your hard style will demand because of how fast paced it is.

http://www.whathifi.com/review/q-acoustics-2000i-51-pack

Whathifi is a great site to look at reviews btw :)

To get Hi-Fi quality sound in 5.1 the problem is music will always sound better when listened to with an analogue source in 2 channel, hence audiophiles loving DAC's (digital to analogue converters) for all their digital gear to connect to their analogue amplifiers. Another thing is a $1000 analogue amplifier is probably going to have just as good SQ as a $5000 dollar receiver reason being, you have to spend about 5k to get class A/B amplification in a reciever and your paying for 5 top 7 channels to be amped not just 2 and all the the technology that goes with them, digital decoding of dolby/DTS etc.

[josh_05]

OK, to clarify something, Hi-Fi is not home theater. Hi_Fi is a 2 channel setup. 90% of Hi-Fi setups don't use a receiver they will use a class A/B integrated amp or separate Class A/B minimum pre and power amp and either a DAC, turntable or CD player for sources. Hi-Fi is for the very best SQ for music, home theater is surround sound for movies. Looking at your current setup, any of the B&W speakers would simply blow you away, they are miles and i mean miles above in SQ of what you currently have.

what type of music do you listen to? do you like a lot of bass? or a more even tonal balance? what is the size of the room you will have it in? and finally is it more for movies/games or music or a bit of both?

Here's a nice receiver that should give you nice synergy with Q-Acoustics.

BTW when i say the Q-Acoustics aren't the last word in detail and resolution, they will still be miles ahead of what you currently have :D

http://www.whathifi.com/review/rx-v373

[Dantemoulin]

OK, to clarify something, Hi-Fi is not home theater. Hi_Fi is a 2 channel setup. 90% of Hi-Fi setups don't use a receiver they will use a class A/B integrated amp or separate Class A/B minimum pre and power amp and either a DAC, turntable or CD player for sources. Hi-Fi is for the very best SQ for music, home theater is surround sound for movies. Looking at your current setup, any of the B&W speakers would simply blow you away, they are miles and i mean miles above in SQ of what you currently have.

what type of music do you listen to? do you like a lot of bass? or a more even tonal balance? what is the size of the room you will have it in? and finally is it more for movies/games or music or a bit of both?

Thanks for the tips!

Those Q-Acoustic speakers looks pretty sharp.

What is the difference between those and a pair of Cerwin Vega XLS speakers in terms of sound quality?

[Dantemoulin]

I want to add a question.

Are there any Hi-Fi speaker that compares to the Cerwin Vega XLS-215's that are in their price range?

[josh_05]

OK, to clarify something, Hi-Fi is not home theater. Hi_Fi is a 2 channel setup. 90% of Hi-Fi setups don't use a receiver they will use a class A/B integrated amp or separate Class A/B minimum pre and power amp and either a DAC, turntable or CD player for sources. Hi-Fi is for the very best SQ for music, home theater is surround sound for movies. Looking at your current setup, any of the B&W speakers would simply blow you away, they are miles and i mean miles above in SQ of what you currently have.

what type of music do you listen to? do you like a lot of bass? or a more even tonal balance? what is the size of the room you will have it in? and finally is it more for movies/games or music or a bit of both?

Thanks for the tips! Those Q-Acoustic speakers looks pretty sharp. What is the difference between those and a pair of Cerwin Vega XLS speakers in terms of sound quality?

Hard for me to say mate, I haven't actually heard them but they have good reviews and if you like the sound of them it maybe worth just adding rears, a center and sub to get your 5.1. They will defiantly be louder and more bass heavy than the Qs by a fair margin.. If you can listen to as many as you can and compare, that is the best way to decide, your ears are better than any advice that can be given.

EDIT: From what I've been reading about the CVs if you want a huge sound at a reasonable price they are a no brainer but they aren't exactly audiophile quality.. I would suggest listening to the Qs, B&Ws, Monitor Audio's etc and decide whether you want quality over pure power. the brands i just mentioned will most likely have a much more refined sound (tighter bass, better timing, more accurate, more detail, better stereo imaging, more clarity etc.. If you can listen to anything of this caliber you will be able to decide whether you want to sacrifice SQ for big sound.

[Dantemoulin]

OK, to clarify something, Hi-Fi is not home theater. Hi_Fi is a 2 channel setup. 90% of Hi-Fi setups don't use a receiver they will use a class A/B integrated amp or separate Class A/B minimum pre and power amp and either a DAC, turntable or CD player for sources. Hi-Fi is for the very best SQ for music, home theater is surround sound for movies. Looking at your current setup, any of the B&W speakers would simply blow you away, they are miles and i mean miles above in SQ of what you currently have.

what type of music do you listen to? do you like a lot of bass? or a more even tonal balance? what is the size of the room you will have it in? and finally is it more for movies/games or music or a bit of both?

I will go to my neighbor and listen to his CW's and then try to find some local audio store that has speakers of those brands.

For now the CW's are more appealing to me but I guess there is no other way to know than to listen to lots of different speakers to get a real picture of what you like.

Thank you very much for your help!

[josh_05]

I want to add a question.

Are there any Hi-Fi speaker that compares to the Cerwin Vega XLS-215's that are in their price range?

Defiantly not at that price range. JBL's would be the closest but would still probably be near double the price. There are plenty of other brands worth listening to as well to give you a comparison of SQ i'll list as many as i can think of. Your CV's are still extremely good at that price point for their shear size and power so keep that in mind as well, they are reccomneded to people who want that big sound and cant afford it in a more premium speaker.

Tannoy, Dali, Dynaudio, Kef, Rega, PMC, Mission, Wharfedale, Spendor, Boston Acoustics, mission, Acoustic Energy.

[Rale]

Klipsch not good anymore?

[josh_05]

Klipsch not good anymore?

Defiantly worth a listen! Yeah there are an endless amount of others as well it's just hard to think of them all haha.

[knight_40k]

Audio is a tricky beast. Speakers are extremely subjective to each individuals ears. You need to demo speakers at a local shop and find what you like. Also note that receivers and processors have difference characteristics which change the sound of speakers. Example, if you upgrade your receiver you've been using for the last 6 years and go with a different brand or a significantly higher model but keep the same speakers, it may take some getting used to for your ears to adjust, you may like it, you may not.

When you say best sound quality possible, you need to specify a budget. Most people use receivers for 5.1 or 7.1 but you can also get higher end ones that support 9.1 natively or by use of external amplification (depending on the model) or you can go even higher and get 11 channel. Note, no receiver currently supports 11 channel natively and will require an external amp. If you go beyond that you are getting into separates such as pre-amps, processors and power amplifiers for each speaker but I won't get into that.

Do you have any equipment you will be using or starting a build from scratch? Generally you want to start with a good pair for your front L/R, then when the budget allows get a sub and center channel. surrounds are less important. Also note you want to stick with the same brand and same line of speaker so that you have matching drivers and tweeters. It won't hurt to mix and match brands and lines but it's not recommended when starting a build because depending on quality of the speakers there may be a noticeable difference. But if you are doing it just to hold you over until you can afford something better then that's fine.

Other things to consider, how large is your room? Is the system mainly for music or movies or games? This will determine what size of sub to buy and how many you'll need. In general 8" and 10" subs are for music listening. 12's or larger are for movie and games. Most people use 1 or 2 subs for medium to large rooms unless you are a major "basshead". Also, are you living in a condo or sharing a wall with a neighbor? This will affect your choice as well.

Hey, everyone has to start somewhere.

B&W make nice speakers, I personally have not demo'd any of their stuff myself, but I definitely have them on my short list when I decide to revamp my system. They are also very well regarded in the audio community, even their lower end lines.

For $200 you will be looking at an entry level, very basic receiver. If you are willing to buy used you might be able to find something a little better but the trade off may be not having the latest and greatest features, however sometimes those features may not even apply to your application. What sorts of things are you looking for?

$500 won't get you far if this is for an entire 7.1 system, especially if you are after full size bookshelf/tower speakers and not el-cheap-o satellites (ie: bose or other HTIB systems). If this is the case, I would recommend starting with a nice pair of front L/R speakers and just keep using what you have as surrounds until you can save more. How long are you hoping this system to last you before you upgrade? It's always important to think about that before putting money into low end stuff. If you're on a budget and want a surround setup then it really doesn't matter what you do. Just food for thought but a pretty decent 5.1 can be had for under a grand.

Some other things to note is if space is an issue, satellites or mini bookshelves are designed for just such reasons and there is nothing wrong with being confined to that, just know that they tend to be limited in terms of frequency range due to the small form factor. Also, whats the room layout? A well placed 5.1 will do more for you than an improperly placed 7.1.

Sorry if I'm throwing out to many questions or "what ifs" at you.

[genkifd]

audio can get extremely expensive - so really set your budget and aim for the equipment suited to your price range. my lounge currently has a 7.1 home theatre setup in which my entire system including the tv cost me well over $20k AUD and this is considered as a mid tier system.

One day i will upgrade to high end.

[ijchan223]

Klipsch not good anymore?

They are ok, but like all the other brands they have gone down hill. Way overpriced for what you get.

[Dantemoulin]

I want to add a question.

Are there any Hi-Fi speaker that compares to the Cerwin Vega XLS-215's that are in their price range?

I think I might go with the CV's. They best suit my budget.

[Dantemoulin]

audio can get extremely expensive - so really set your budget and aim for the equipment suited to your price range. my lounge currently has a 7.1 home theatre setup in which my entire system including the tv cost me well over $20k AUD and this is considered as a mid tier system.

One day i will upgrade to high end.

Wow, that is a lot of money, guess you have to be an extreme enthusiast to even dare to spent that large amount of money on audio.

I would personally spend more money on a good quality TV and a really high-end workstation.