Win 10 Server Build - Need Advice

[mealto]

Hey guys,

 

I need some advice on this build. Have not kept up with hardware so am a little rusty. Will get NCIX to build this for me. I have Win 10 and all the harddrives, just need them to get this tower to me. Goal is to run Win 10 Pro as a server for PC image backups and file backups. Won't have it on 24/7, maybe a few hours a day on most days. And when there is a big data dump, maybe keep it on over the weekend etc... 

 

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/H9YXPs

 

Will keep replying with the updated cart URL once I get more advice. Any thoughts on this one?

 

Add On: Here is the list:

 

Intel Core i3-6100 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor
Asus Z170-E ATX LGA1151 Motherboard
G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2133 Memory
Fractal Design Define R5 (Black) ATX Mid Tower Case
EVGA SuperNOVA NEX 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply

[Guest]

get a board that costs less and get more RAM

8GB doesn't cut it as a server.

[mealto]

2 minutes ago, Ronnie76 said:

get a board that costs less and get more RAM

8GB doesn't cut it as a server.

I have looked everywhere and I cannot seem to find a board with 6 SATA ports and that costs that much less. I did see some but for $10-$20 more, I think the ASUS board is more highly rated. Can you make a recommendation?

 

Also, 8 GB on Win 10 is plenty for my needs. Not running a full fledged server OS.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, mealto said:

I have looked everywhere and I cannot seem to find a board with 6 SATA ports and that costs that much less. I did see some but for $10-$20 more, I think the ASUS board is more highly rated. Can you make a recommendation?

 

Also, 8 GB on Win 10 is plenty for my needs. Not running a full fledged server OS.

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/F8ckd6

To be completely honest.

8GB is 2015. For real. Unless your going to upgrade to 16GB in a week or two, 8GB is just stupid. its mental for servers. 

[mealto]

14 minutes ago, Ronnie76 said:

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/F8ckd6

To be completely honest.

8GB is 2015. For real. Unless your going to upgrade to 16GB in a week or two, 8GB is just stupid. its mental for servers. 

Thanks for the suggestion. I did see that ASRock has 6 SATA ports and it was one of the first board that I chose. Then I noticed it does not ask 3200 RAM so found an Asus that did. Then decide to go with cheaper RAM and no longer have that as a deciding factor, good reminder.

 

1. How is that ASRock MB?

 

2. Adjusted your RAM since NCIX does not carry that particular stick. 

 

Here is the updated list. Thoughts?

 

A: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/tjMFtJ

 

vs

 

B: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/hfBvnn

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, mealto said:

Thanks for the suggestion. I did see that ASRock has 6 SATA ports and it was one of the first board that I chose. Then I noticed it does not ask 3200 RAM so found an Asus that did. Then decide to go with cheaper RAM and no longer have that as a deciding factor, good reminder.

 

1. How is that ASRock MB?

 

2. Adjusted your RAM since NCIX does not carry that particular stick. 

 

Here is the updated list. Thoughts?

 

A: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/tjMFtJ

 

vs

 

B: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/H9YXPs

Dunno how the board is. Probably just as good as the Asus one. ASRock has a pretty good reputation for budget motherboards (Speaking form first hand)

Doesn't matter which brand of RAM you pick, I just picked the cheapest 16GB stick i could find.

 

[mealto]

ok, here is what I am down to. Same everything, different board. Thanks for all your help during this stressful time! Need to get this rebuild done in the next few days. $70 price difference.

 

Asus

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/hfBvnn

 

vs

 

ASRock

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/tjMFtJ

 

Who else can chime in about these board differences and what else should I consider?

[leadeater]

2 hours ago, Ronnie76 said:

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/F8ckd6

To be completely honest.

8GB is 2015. For real. Unless your going to upgrade to 16GB in a week or two, 8GB is just stupid. its mental for servers. 

8GB of ram for a computer that will not have an active user on that is acting purely as a file server is actually more than is needed. This won't be running multiple VMs and no user is going to be logged on to it with tons of chrome tabs open. It will sit idle using around 1.2GB to 2.5GB of ram 99% of the time and only going higher when there is an active network backup happening/file copy.

[leadeater]

@mealto You could look at using a supermicro motherboard which are slightly more server rated and have ECC support if you ever need it at a later time. Not a big deal, an Asus or ASRock are good choices.

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813182980R

[mealto]

2 hours ago, leadeater said:

@mealto You could look at using a supermicro motherboard which are slightly more server rated and have ECC support if you ever need it at a later time. Not a big deal, an Asus or ASRock are good choices.

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813182980R

I have thought about it, ran a DLink NAS for years, then graduated to WHS then WHS 2011. I am familiar with Win 10 and can RDP in from any machine, this is a big plus since I run the box headless.

 

My one concern with building out a NAS was the recovery process. I like the idea that if the OS drive ever died, I could unplug all those drives from Win 10, then just plug in into any other Windows machine to grab all data. I remember doing this for the DLink NAS installing something so that Windows recognizes ext2 drives but like I said, I like not having to learn anymore things when it comes to data management. Knowing Windows just makes things easier especially when backups and troubleshooting becomes more complicated if things ever hit the fan. Knowing the environment well means less risk to data in my opinion.

 

 

[mealto]

Come to think of it, I may build a more powerful machine. Since I plan to use WIn 10 Pro as the server, I am wondering what others think about making it more powerful (i5-6500 + 16 GB RAM) and using this as my desktop. Then just use it to back up other PC's and data on it with duplication across drives. The only downside is if the machine goes down, everything goes down but if I run Crashplan, that should help with offsite backups. 

[Dark]

11 minutes ago, mealto said:

Come to think of it, I may build a more powerful machine. Since I plan to use WIn 10 Pro as the server, I am wondering what others think about making it more powerful (i5-6500 + 16 GB RAM) and using this as my desktop. Then just use it to back up other PC's and data on it with duplication across drives. The only downside is if the machine goes down, everything goes down but if I run Crashplan, that should help with offsite backups. 

Probably need to sit back and determine what your requirements/goals/direction with this is.  Building a desktop that stores backup images is perfectly fine (certainly not a true backup solution).  If all you are looking for is a repository for files/backups then you're better off assigning that role to a system that will share other roles versus buying a relatively powerful dedicated system.

 

To support off-site, if you're doing cloud backups to crashplan then great, otherwise you can setup a seperate system just for this (store it at another location) and go with cheap/slow hardware (used is fine as well), don't worry about RAID.

 

 

To give you an idea, here's a solution I use...

Client systems: my desktop, laptop, and my wifes laptop

Backup server: A server that hosts other services but also acts as a crashplan destination

Off-site backup server: a dual core windows box with a single large hard drive, sitting at my in-laws running crashplan.

 

All client systems backup to BOTH the backup and off-site server via crashplan (two seperate jobs).

My server backs up to my desktop and the off-site server.

[mealto]

27 minutes ago, Dark said:

Probably need to sit back and determine what your requirements/goals/direction with this is.  Building a desktop that stores backup images is perfectly fine (certainly not a true backup solution).  If all you are looking for is a repository for files/backups then you're better off assigning that role to a system that will share other roles versus buying a relatively powerful dedicated system.

 

To support off-site, if you're doing cloud backups to crashplan then great, otherwise you can setup a seperate system just for this (store it at another location) and go with cheap/slow hardware (used is fine as well), don't worry about RAID.

 

 

To give you an idea, here's a solution I use...

Client systems: my desktop, laptop, and my wifes laptop

Backup server: A server that hosts other services but also acts as a crashplan destination

Off-site backup server: a dual core windows box with a single large hard drive, sitting at my in-laws running crashplan.

 

All client systems backup to BOTH the backup and off-site server via crashplan (two seperate jobs).

My server backs up to my desktop and the off-site server.

Good insight, you clearly have given this some thought. I have something similar at the moment. Bare with me while I walk you through it, it may give me more clarity. Right now:

 

Server runs backups using WHS 2011 so this is easy as heck. Set it and forget it. Can roll back at anytime. Server holds legacy files from old PC's that have been decommissioned. Using Stabelbit Drivepool to duplicate important files across drives. Not duplicating client backups, just important data. There is a chance that server and PC's can all go down at the same time but that chance is low. Once I get offsite backups going, this should protect me against things like earthquake destroying the house etc... Server backups all PC's in household and my desktop backups server. No offsite yet. I like how you have offsite backups at your in-law's but if they are in the same city, and an earthquake hits, chances are both your location and your offsite will take a hit. That is why I am looking at Crashplan cloud backups.

 

We don't run the server much anymore, only for me to turn it on to grab legacy files and to run backups. This is why I am thinking why don't I just use my desktop to replace the PC and just make it run double duty if I can get that offsite backup up and running. Also, if I keep using Stablebit Drivepool, I can still duplicate important files across drives.

 

Server hardware is aging and so is my desktop so I thought this may be a good time to merge the 2 and not have to keep 2 pieces of hardware going. Plus, accessing anything locally is just so much more fun (faster) than going through a Gigabit connection! At least for me.

 

You indeed have a great plan going. I have often thought about putting another WHS box or even just a PC with Crashplan at a family member's house but I was too cheap to pay for their unlimited internet. I have about 6-10TB of data (after duplication) to back up.

 

Last note, I have heard crazy stories about how Crashplan is built with Java technology and the way it's done, there is a chance of you losing your entire storage in one fell swoop. You experience has been good when you need to recover files?

 

Hence I am looking at this: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/zMx9JV (6 sata ports on the MB, 16 GB RAM and lots of bays in this Fractal case).

[Dark]

Sounds like upgrading your desktop along with crashplan cloud backups is going to work best for you given those points.

 

To this day, I have not experience any array/storage failures via CP.  I've had a restore a fair amount after losing an SSD in a previous laptop and I actually restored the files from my off-site system to simply verify that the solution was holding.

 

We're starting to allow family to utilize our CP servers and we hope to toss one additional CP off-site host out there (so if you ever need to 'sell' the idea of having a family member host your off-site, there's a good pitch).

[alex75871]

This will get you started on an entry level server:

 

Core i3-6100

16GB RAM ECC Crucial

Supermicro server board - X11SSL?

 

Use server grade componants (minus the i3, but that still have ECC support). If you want moar CPU power swap the i3 for a Intel Xeon 1220 v5 or 1230 v5.

[mealto]

1 hour ago, Dark said:

Sounds like upgrading your desktop along with crashplan cloud backups is going to work best for you given those points.

 

To this day, I have not experience any array/storage failures via CP.  I've had a restore a fair amount after losing an SSD in a previous laptop and I actually restored the files from my off-site system to simply verify that the solution was holding.

 

We're starting to allow family to utilize our CP servers and we hope to toss one additional CP off-site host out there (so if you ever need to 'sell' the idea of having a family member host your off-site, there's a good pitch).

I never considered that but you have a good selling point. Now, I guess you just have to trust your family members to not mess your CP backups. If they install the connector software on their machine, they can recover and delete backed up files from your PC correct?

 

I am thinking about the family plan and offering it family as well. Is this what you have?

[dalekphalm]

20 hours ago, Ronnie76 said:

get a board that costs less and get more RAM

8GB doesn't cut it as a server.

 

18 hours ago, leadeater said:

8GB of ram for a computer that will not have an active user on that is acting purely as a file server is actually more than is needed. This won't be running multiple VMs and no user is going to be logged on to it with tons of chrome tabs open. It will sit idle using around 1.2GB to 2.5GB of ram 99% of the time and only going higher when there is an active network backup happening/file copy.

I second this. @Ronnie76, you're generalizing, and spreading misinformation. 8GB is definitely overkill for this server. 4GB would be sufficient. All it's doing is acting as a file server, with incoming file transfers being written to disk. Hell, you could probably get away with running a backup server with 2GB (though I wouldn't, just for the extra headroom).

 

Furthermore "Server" is such a non-descriptive word. How much a "Server" needs entirely depends on what that server is going to be used for. Not all servers need 192GB of RAM.

 

Take, for example, Minecraft. If I was running a 5-person Minecraft Server, 1GB of RAM would work (depending on OS used). People have gotten away using 512MB on Minecraft servers (though not ideal).

 

This isn't a workstation or an office computer or a gaming computer.

[Dark]

57 minutes ago, mealto said:

I never considered that but you have a good selling point. Now, I guess you just have to trust your family members to not mess your CP backups. If they install the connector software on their machine, they can recover and delete backed up files from your PC correct?

 

I am thinking about the family plan and offering it family as well. Is this what you have?

I provide a low power system, I don't ask to use their system/storage.  The box at my in-laws is a simple G3220+4GBmem+8TB drive.  I remotely manage it and it sits headless in a location that's out of their way.

 

I just use the regular free crashplan, I don't use their cloud storage.  

[mealto]

@leadeater and @dalekphalm, I know that 8GB is enough. There is no point to argue with other users who tell me otherwise, especially ones that do not have first hand experiences. Have been running a Dell Poweredge Tower for years on 4GB of RAM and the still is darn fast for file transfer and backups.

 

ok, I am heading down to the local store tomorrow to see if they will do that build for $50. Pretty sure that is only at the warehouse only but we will see. Kind of like the old days where the local computer store would do all of these things. Not sure if the store would build the unit enough to the point where I can just go home and install Win 10 myself. Would it be better for the corporate to build it (ie. buy it from their website NCIX) since they build thousands of systems a year versus depending on the local tech who is working at the time I go in?

 

Here is what I am going to buy: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/zMx9JV

 

What do you think?

[AshleyAshes]

On ‎7‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 7:52 PM, Ronnie76 said:

get a board that costs less and get more RAM

8GB doesn't cut it as a server.

 

On ‎7‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 8:03 PM, Ronnie76 said:

8GB is 2015. For real. Unless your going to upgrade to 16GB in a week or two, 8GB is just stupid. its mental for servers. 

Ha ha, More than 8GB for a Windows server that will just sit around and serve files in someone's home?  8GB is almost overkill for hat.  4GB would easily get the job done.  You really have to consider WHAT a server is doing when it comes to how much RAM it needs, and just a little file server for home use, there are not huge RAM demands.

[Dark]

6 hours ago, alex75871 said:

This will get you started on an entry level server:

 

Core i3-6100

16GB RAM ECC Crucial

Supermicro server board - X11SSL?

 

Use server grade componants (minus the i3, but that still have ECC support). If you want moar CPU power swap the i3 for a Intel Xeon 1220 v5 or 1230 v5.

At that price range I would start to recommend an avoton setup (~$280 for the quad, $450 for the octa).  Lower power draw and lots of server grade features. 

[dalekphalm]

9 hours ago, Dark said:

At that price range I would start to recommend an avoton setup (~$280 for the quad, $450 for the octa).  Lower power draw and lots of server grade features. 

Avaton's are stupidly overpriced in Canada. They sound like such an awesome product. I wish I could get my hands on the octo-core one.

[Dark]

22 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Avaton's are stupidly overpriced in Canada. They sound like such an awesome product. I wish I could get my hands on the octo-core one.

That bites!  You could always have a USA friend help get one to you

Not to say they are 'cheap' down here either.