Seeking Opinions on Computer Build

[Slyther]

(Build revised in posts below)

 

Hello TechTips community!

 

I'm here because I'd like second opinions on a computer that I will be buying for my boyfriend. Before we start, here's some info:

-His current computer is 'on loan' of sorts, and needs to eventually be returned as it is, so upgrading the current computer is not an option and must be built new

-We live in Canada, so CAD is our currency

-Our vendor of choice is Memory Express, they have nearby stores and a decent product selection. In addition they have a price beat program that will beat the price of any Canadian competitor. Oddly, they are no longer listed on PCPartPicker...

-Although my boyfriend happens to have a friend that works at Memory Express, said friend has suggested to us to buy what we can on Boxing Day (Dec 26^th), so that's when I will be buying the parts.

-The PC will be used for gaming. He currently plays League and Final Fantasy, but has expressed a desire to play many more games including some demanding titles.

-I know there is no such thing as true future-proofing, but I am building this computer with the intention of having it last four years minimum.

-I am not afraid to overclock but I'm more of a 'casual' overclocker, and am not concerned about spending hours to squeeze every ounce of performance. I'll be fine with moderate overclocks.

 

Anyway, onto the meat of the post... Please remember, if you suggest any alternate parts try to be sure it's available at Memory Express!

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/L78nP6

http://www.memoryexpress.com/

 

CPU i7-6700k: I listed the 6700k in the build, but am debating dropping down to the 6600k. Although my research has indicated that there is not a lot of performance gains over Gen 4, the price jump to Gen 6 is relatively small

CPU cooler: My boyfriend's current computer is a toaster of a jet engine, and he now understands the importance of adequate cooling. Especially being as I do plan to moderately overclock I'm looking to invest in a decent cooler. I personally purchased a 140 AiO cooler, and later learned that dual radiator can do a much better job, hence why I have a dual radiator listed for his build. Certainly looking forward to much quieter cooling too!

Motherboard: This is an area I could use a lot of advice for. I don't need anything fancy, but I also know from personal experience that going with a cheap motherboard is not necessarily the best, hence why I went with a mid-range price reputable brand. Also helps that I like dragons and red/black themed builds.

RAM: Seems RAM is not an overly important component these days as long as it's a reputable brand. Although 8 GB is enough, 16 GB seems to be a more modern sweet spot and help future-proof a bit.

SSD: Kind of a no brainer, 850 EVO is highly praised as one of the best low cost SSD's around

Hard-drive: Not needed. This is the only component I will be reusing a part for, as I have an extra 1 TB WD Black lying around.

Video Card: I've learned from experience that 2 card set-ups aren't necessarily the best way to go, and just about every reviewer I look up seems to concur that it's better to go with a more expensive single card than two lower tier cards. With that in mind the price tier I'm looking at pegs me at the 970 vs 390 bracket. Although the 960 vs 380 is much cheaper and likely adequate for most 1080p games, the performance increase from going up the single tier to 970/390 seems well worth it, and I know those cards will handle 1440p as well which my boyfriend is now showing interest in, even though he initially wasn't. We will NOT be buying new monitors in the immediate future, so for now he will be using two 1080p monitors. I am leaning toward AMD 390, as it is similar price, similar performance, 8GB vs the 3.5/0.5, and red/black themed. (Though I guess I could go with MSI 970 for red/black as well)

Case: I am honestly open to suggestions for a case, the Storm Enforcer is just what caught my eye.

PSU: I went with 750W which is the suggested wattage for an AMD 390 card, also specifically tried to pick a PSU in tier 1 or 2 off this list http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-2547993/psu-tier-list.html

OS: It seems between the time of my initial research and build plan a few months ago and now that Windows 7 is suddenly not available any more, thus I stuck in Window 10 Home. I wanted to go with 7 to give my boyfriend the choice to upgrade to 10, but seems that won't happen any more.

 

Others: He has a headset, keyboard and mouse already. No speakers, but it seems he doesn't want them anyway when I offered to buy him some.

 

Not done quite yet! While I'm here, gonna cram in some thoughts on upgrades for myself...

I built my computer roughly 4.5 years ago, i7-2600k, 8 GB RAM, 2xRadeon 6870's in Crossfire.

I upgraded to an SSD last year or so, and am finding that the 2600k CPU still seems to be holding up quite well. However... I'm finding the 6870's have become a bottleneck in my system, mostly because 1GB VRAM seems to just not cut it these days. As such, I'm thinking of picking up a second R9 390 for myself.

I'm also looking for keyboard recommendations as I'm just using a cheapy k200 right now, and want a keyboard that's more forgiving on ghosting. Thoughts on this Redragon keyboard/mouse combo on Amazon? http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00NLZUM36/ref=s9_simh_gw_p147_d11_i1?pf_rd_m=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&pf_rd_s=desktop-1&pf_rd_r=0GX3RQRE8Z4R2N3Y1KD2&pf_rd_t=36701&pf_rd_p=2055621862&pf_rd_i=desktop I don't need anything super fancy, and it seems to be highly praised and a good price. And again red/black dragon theme...

 

Thanks to anyone who reads and provides opinions!

[brob]

Samsung has terrible support for its ssd in Canada. In fact warranty registration & claims have to done through Samsung USA. Sandisk has a Canadian depot for ssd returns. They make a number of decent drives.

 

I would suggest a Z170 motherboard for cpu overclocking. I personally like Asus. You might consider the Z170-P or Z170-K.

 

http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX50962 is a fully modular psu. It is better than the VSM 750.

 

CoolerMaster only shows 120mm AIO coolers as compatible with the Enforcer case. If you want to use a 2x120mm radiator I would suggest a different case. The Nzxt S340 is quite popular at the moment.

[Streetguru]

Hello TechTips community!

Includes a 1440p 144hz TN free-sync display, there's also the option of a 4k IPS free-sync display at that price point as well

 

Otherwise gaming performance of the rig is going to be about the same, if that's the normal i7 skylake price in canada that really isn't worth it

 

4k display, costs $100 more

http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/part/lg-monitor-27mu67

Also tell him to step it up to dota

PCPartPicker part list: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/sVCx8d

Price breakdown by merchant: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/sVCx8d/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel Xeon E3-1231 V3 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor  ($355.98 @ Newegg Canada)

Motherboard: Asus H87M-E Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($103.95 @ Vuugo)

Memory: Crucial 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory  ($45.48 @ DirectCanada)

Storage: A-Data Premier SP550 480GB 2.5" Solid State Drive  ($169.95 @ NCIX)

Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  ($59.15 @ Vuugo)

Video Card: Sapphire Radeon R9 390 8GB Nitro Video Card  ($399.88 @ Canada Computers)

Case: Fractal Design Core 1000 USB 3.0 MicroATX Mid Tower Case  ($38.99 @ NCIX)

Power Supply: Rosewill 750W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply  ($94.98 @ Newegg Canada)

Monitor: Acer XG270HU 144Hz 27.0" Monitor  ($550.40 @ DirectCanada)

Total: $1818.76

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-12-22 03:48 EST-0500

[Slyther]

Samsung has...

Thank you for pointing out the cooling incompatibilities of the Enforcer case, that honestly slipped past me as I forgot to check for that when looking at cases. I'll look for some alternates.

 

As for motherboard, does the chipset really make that much of a difference for overclocking? I'm assuming this B150 one is new, as my initial research a few months back had all Z170's... the board I chose was one I hadn't seen before but seemed to fit my particular needs.

 

Samsung's support may be bad, but the product itself is a quality product is it not? Tech vendors usually have their own warranty programs as well.

If you advise not going Samsung, I personally use a Crucial MX100 and it's performed well, could go with the new BX series or such instead.

[Slyther]

Includes a 1440p...

We were going to buy monitors at a later date. (He's going to use his two current 1080p's for now)

 

You've also basically changed the entire build without telling me WHY you chose these parts.

 

And Canadian prices are just higher in general, it's something we're used to, just about everything is 20-30% more expensive up here. It's worth pointing out again that I'll be picking up a lot of these parts on Boxing Day as well, so I won't be paying full retail for a lot of components.

 

I don't mean to sound unappreciative, but there are multiple problems with that build as well:

No CPU cooler

No OS (New computer)

Included an HDD when I stated I have an extra 1 TB WD Black already (The only part that won't be new in the tower)

Only 8 GB Memory? Not even dual channel? Was planning on 16

[Streetguru]

We were going to buy monitors at a later date. (He's going to use his two current 1080p's for now)

Because the CPU performance difference is going to be negligible

 

the stock cooler on the CPU will be fine

You have a massive wall of text going there, and the builds I post are generally already done for the hard drive and OS part of that

 

if he's just gaming he only needs 8gbs of RAM, and RAM speed doesn't matter for anything really, so if you end up needing 16gbs down the line you can just throw in anyhting and be set

 

http://anandtech.com/show/8959/ddr4-haswell-e-scaling-review-2133-to-3200-with-gskill-corsair-adata-and-crucial/6

 

I threw the monitor in because you could get about the same performance for about $600 less, it's also free-sync, so that makes it pretty great for gaming, if you wanna get one later just save the money anyways

[brob]

Thank you for pointing out the cooling incompatibilities of the Enforcer case, that honestly slipped past me as I forgot to check for that when looking at cases. I'll look for some alternates.

 

As for motherboard, does the chipset really make that much of a difference for overclocking? I'm assuming this B150 one is new, as my initial research a few months back had all Z170's... the board I chose was one I hadn't seen before but seemed to fit my particular needs.

 

Samsung's support may be bad, but the product itself is a quality product is it not? Tech vendors usually have their own warranty programs as well.

If you advise not going Samsung, I personally use a Crucial MX100 and it's performed well, could go with the new BX series or such instead.

 

Simple answer to overclocking is that Intel only includes overclocking features in its Z chipsets. The MSI web pages for the B150 Gaming M3 do not talk about overclocking the cpu. Although they do mention including oc utilities and the user manual lists BIOS oc settings. I did find https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=262433.0 which is pretty definitive. That said, while one may not be able to oc by adjusting the cpu multiplier, it is often possible to get a small boost playing with other BIOS settings. http://www.gamersnexus.net/hwreviews/2186-msi-b150a-gaming-pro-motherboard-review may prove informative.

 

Samsung ssd are excellent products. I would not advise against buying one. I just wanted you to be aware that warranty claims would have to be done through Samsung USA. I believe Crucial ssd, (also excellent drives), are serviced out of the US as well. Personally, I don't think vendor warranties are worth the investment.

[Slyther]

Revised build! http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/9fPmXL

Please note the case is NOT listed as for some reason the case I picked off Memory Express is not listed on pcpartpicker

http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX53556 ~60 CAD

 

Changes:

-Stuck with Skylake because I'm unsure I want to go with the Xeon build suggested above. Still considering dropping to 6600k

-Changed motherboard to Z170 chipset as suggested, although it doesn't look as nice it seems to have the features I need (Going to do some research after this post to see if the other chipsets have any benefit to them)

-Staying with Samsung EVO

-Changed PSU, but I don't really care for full modular so I actually went down the price bracket to EVGA SuperNOVA (Still tempted to go back to the Cooler Master V750 though because of the Gold rating)

-Case, linked above, fits 240 radiator, looks nice, and decent price

[Streetguru]

Revised build! http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/9fPmXL

That motherboard doesn't appear to have very great reviews

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130871

you aren't going to see much difference on a 60hz display between investing in overclocking and getting the Xeon as far as gaming goes, it would only matter a bit if you were trying to run every game at 144fps for a high refresh rate display, but that isn't too advisable.

The difference at least from passmark doesn't appear to be much at stock, more so not worth the $150 price increase + 50 or more on the motherboard

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare.php?cmp[]=2246&cmp[]=2565

[Slyther]

That motherboard doesn't appear to have very great reviews

Yeah just so happens that I've been doing further research into motherboards and am already looking at bumping a tier, looking at this board at the moment http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130874&AID=10657534&PID=3938566&SID=&nm_mc=AFC-C8JunctionCA&cm_mmc=AFC-C8JunctionCA-_-na-_-na-_-na&utm_medium=affiliates&utm_source=afc-%zn

 

We will eventually look at a 1440p monitor for this build, but getting the computer tower is the priority at the moment.

[Streetguru]

Yeah just so happens that I've been doing further research into motherboards and am already looking at bumping a tier, looking at this board at the moment http://www.newegg.ca/Produc

see like, now you're up to like $250 more, for what? the performance gain really isn't worth it, and you'd be off to the races right now with my build that includes a free-sync display, if anything just get an overclockable haswell build going and drop the display down to a 1080p 144hz free-sync display

[brob]

Revised build! http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/9fPmXL

Please note the case is NOT listed as for some reason the case I picked off Memory Express is not listed on pcpartpicker

http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX53556 ~60 CAD

 

Changes:

-Stuck with Skylake because I'm unsure I want to go with the Xeon build suggested above. Still considering dropping to 6600k

-Changed motherboard to Z170 chipset as suggested, although it doesn't look as nice it seems to have the features I need (Going to do some research after this post to see if the other chipsets have any benefit to them)

-Staying with Samsung EVO

-Changed PSU, but I don't really care for full modular so I actually went down the price bracket to EVGA SuperNOVA (Still tempted to go back to the Cooler Master V750 though because of the Gold rating)

-Case, linked above, fits 240 radiator, looks nice, and decent price

 

Corsair only lists 120mm AIO coolers as compatible with the Spec 01 case. I have seen youtube video of a Spec-02 build with an H100i installed in the top. The fans hang down below the top of the motherboard. Did you see http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cases/2014/04/11/corsair-carbide-series-spec-01-review/2, 2nd para from the bottom? If you do go with the Nepton 240M and Spec-01 it would be great if a build log was posted.

 

An i5-6600K will be fine for gaming. Stock is more abundant for the i5. Shortages of the i7-6700K are expected to continue into the new year. I suspect that is part of the reason prices remains fairly high for the cpu.

[Slyther]

Alright, so I changed cases again, NZXT S340

 

As for the CPU, I've done some of my own research and the Xeon just doesn't seem to compare to 4790k/6600k/6700k

 

I think the 6600k vs 6700k may come down to the kind of deals available on boxing day... and I've a feeling 6600k will win simply because the 6700k's are on backorder right now, and as attractive as hyper-threading may be a large amount of discussion seems to say to go with the i5 for gaming builds. But now I'm looking at the 4790k more as well after having originally brushed it aside for the newer Skylake architecture.

 

So, this is the 6600k build http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/LkgTGX

And a 4790k build http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/sBhDP6

Almost identical price

 

Also, never got any opinions on that Redragon keyboard/mouse for myself as well http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00NLZUM36/ref=s9_simh_gw_p147_d11_i1?pf_rd_m=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&pf_rd_s=desktop-1&pf_rd_r=0GX3RQRE8Z4R2N3Y1KD2&pf_rd_t=36701&pf_rd_p=2055621862&pf_rd_i=desktop

[Streetguru]

Alright, so I changed cases again, NZXT S340

it naturally has better multi-threaded performance than the i5 6600k, and has comparable performance to the i7, at a good amount less money, especially when factoring in the motherboard price differences.

 

also in that i7 4960k build you need a Z series chipset to overclock

 

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare.php?cmp[]=2246&cmp[]=2565&cmp[]=2570

keyboard/mouse should be fine, the red dragon mouse is pretty solid overall aside from having different switches for the side buttons

[brob]

Alright, so I changed cases again, NZXT S340

 

As for the CPU, I've done some of my own research and the Xeon just doesn't seem to compare to 4790k/6600k/6700k

 

I think the 6600k vs 6700k may come down to the kind of deals available on boxing day... and I've a feeling 6600k will win simply because the 6700k's are on backorder right now, and as attractive as hyper-threading may be a large amount of discussion seems to say to go with the i5 for gaming builds. But now I'm looking at the 4790k more as well after having originally brushed it aside for the newer Skylake architecture.

 

So, this is the 6600k build http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/LkgTGX

And a 4790k build http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/sBhDP6

Almost identical price

 

Also, never got any opinions on that Redragon keyboard/mouse for myself as well http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00NLZUM36/ref=s9_simh_gw_p147_d11_i1?pf_rd_m=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&pf_rd_s=desktop-1&pf_rd_r=0GX3RQRE8Z4R2N3Y1KD2&pf_rd_t=36701&pf_rd_p=2055621862&pf_rd_i=desktop

 

Not trying to make a case for Xeon, just clear up an apparent misconception. The E3-123x V3 and above are hyperthreaded. They have Haswell cores and almost identical performance to same clock i7-47xx. There are minor variations in feature set between Xeon and i7, and the Xeon has a touch better memory handling.

 

The two builds are not really comparable. The i7-4790K is a much more powerful processor with a higher base clock.

[Slyther]

Update, build revision: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/xcWXK8

 

Got a hold of one of my boyfriends tech friends today, and he's got personal experience with Skylake as he uses a 6600k as well.

 

-Dropped the cooler to single radiator, friend said that Skylake is energy efficient and cool and doesn't need a ton of cooling

-Dropped to 250GB SSD, we concluded that my boyfriend doesn't need a 500 SSD, and the 250's went on a nice boxing day deal (One of the only parts with good deals going...)

-Despite downsizing the cooler we're sticking with the S340, seems there's not a lot of benefit to getting cheaper cases... would either have to buy additional fans, or have potential space issues or what not. The case he suggested is only ~7 price difference too, so seems one of the best options still.

-Removed OS from build, turns out my friend has some extra keys and can give us one

[Streetguru]

Update, build revision: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/xcWXK8

Unless you're going to spring for a 240mm radiator just get a large air cooler, it'll perform about the same as that AiO, also too much RAM for an i5, should drop to 8gbs and get a larger SSD

[brob]

Update, build revision: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/xcWXK8

 

Got a hold of one of my boyfriends tech friends today, and he's got personal experience with Skylake as he uses a 6600k as well.

 

-Dropped the cooler to single radiator, friend said that Skylake is energy efficient and cool and doesn't need a ton of cooling

-Dropped to 250GB SSD, we concluded that my boyfriend doesn't need a 500 SSD, and the 250's went on a nice boxing day deal (One of the only parts with good deals going...)

-Despite downsizing the cooler we're sticking with the S340, seems there's not a lot of benefit to getting cheaper cases... would either have to buy additional fans, or have potential space issues or what not. The case he suggested is only ~7 price difference too, so seems one of the best options still.

-Removed OS from build, turns out my friend has some extra keys and can give us one

 

Other than the cpu cooler everything looks good. Unlocked Skylake cpu have a TDP of 91W, 3W more than the previous generation. So they can actually generate more heat, not less. Also, the 140XL is a bit noisy. If a good overclock is desired, I would suggest a 2x120mm or 2x140mm cooler.