Why you should not buy AMD GPUs for DX11 games

[Monarch]

It's been a long time now, this isn't exactly new news. Nvidia released a dx11 update in their drivers that gave the single biggest performance boost to cpu bottlenecked games I have ever seen. We honestly haven't seen any new driver improvements since then on cards that were around when that driver came out around a year ago.

 

A lot of people don't know this. I didn't know this 8 months ago when I purchased 290X. I see a lot of people on many different forums complain, confused what's going on. I just wanted to spread the word, to reach out to those that are unaware how bad AMD's DX11 is.

[Raudi_]

8350 + GTX 970 *cringe*

Yeah he wants to water cool it, I almost cried. Suggested that he at least waits for intels new i7 to be launched and pick that up instead.

[THGM]

Hey, i can confirm the low gpu usage amd cards have in GTA V, i just tried it, but i seem to experience other bugs as well such as these - http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/347885-gta-v-stuttering-r9-290/

I'd like to see if you guys have the same issues with your R9's!

[SeanBond]

 

Yeah, their DX11 drivers are on par with Mantle atm. Atleast, with current drawcall limitations.

 

 

 

8350 + GTX 970 *cringe*

 

I definitely wouldn't say their dx11 drivers are on par with mantle. That is just crazy talk. But obviously why ahead of amd dx11 drivers.

[Caeradwyn]

From what I can see, it seems like the GTA V engine is very poorly optimized for multiple CPU cores, seeing as the table on top of page 2 shows an i3 scoring higher than the FX9590.

It will be interesting to see how this develops as new drivers and also new patches for the game are released.

[Raudi_]

From what I can see, it seems like the GTA V engine is very poorly optimized for multiple CPU cores, seeing as the table on top of page 2 shows an i3 scoring higher than the FX9590.

It will be interesting to see how this develops as new drivers and also new patches for the game are released.

No thats not the cause, its AMD's poor CPU performance. Seeing as I can hit 85% usage on all 8 threads for my 4770k.

[Monarch]

From what I can see, it seems like the GTA V engine is very poorly optimized for multiple CPU cores, seeing as the table on top of page 2 shows an i3 scoring higher than the FX9590.

It will be interesting to see how this develops as new drivers and also new patches for the game are released.

 

It's not poorly optimized for multiple CPU cores. It's DX11 that is somewhat responsible for AMD's CPUs bad performance, however intel CPUs are still more powerful, they have stronger cores.

[Majestic]

I definitely wouldn't say their dx11 drivers are on par with mantle. That is just crazy talk. But obviously why ahead of amd dx11 drivers.

 

I'm not saying it's as good as mantle, I say it approaches mantle with current drawcalls amount. obv. it wouldn't approach mantle at 15mil. drawcalls.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

Would need more evidence than just 2 games and one being GTA 5... lol wut? Didn't this game come out less than 24 hrs ago? 

Honestly would like to see more comparison between games to see how the gpus are fairing against each other right now. Maybe a small compilation perhaps? 

 

Otherwise your post just seems like another "AMD is SHIT! Here are 2 Games right here. You see this shit!? 10 fps lower is fucking pathetic! Flop flop flop flop" 

[Monarch]

Would need more evidence than just 2 games and one being GTA 5... lol wut? Didn't this game come out less than 24 hrs ago? 

Honestly would like to see more comparison between games to see how the gpus are fairing against each other right now. Maybe a small compilation perhaps? 

 

Otherwise your post just seems like another "AMD is SHIT! Here are 2 Games right here. You see this shit!? 10 fps lower is fucking pathetic! Flop flop flop flop" 

 

If you had actually read OP you'd have found this link: http://www.overclock.net/t/1528559/directx-driver-overhead-and-why-mantle-is-a-selling-point-bunch-of-benchmarks

It's a thread on OCN that has a collection of benchmarks in it.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

If you had actually read OP you'd have found this link: http://www.overclock.net/t/1528559/directx-driver-overhead-and-why-mantle-is-a-selling-point-bunch-of-benchmarks

It's a thread on OCN that has a collection of benchmarks in it.

 

Neh didn't read your OP. To put it bluntly your lack of pictorial evidence and numbers bores me. If you had presented your evidence in a more convenient way,

I would have continue reading the OP.  Open some spoilers and throw in the evidence from the thread, getting someone to click on the spoilers means you have captured 

the attention of the reader. Most people just see evidence that one presents. Providing evidence at one's convenience would make your argument much more stronger. 

I too already know that AMD isn't as strong as Nvidia in some dx11 games. BUT if feel that you don't need to change your post then you can ignore whatever I wrote 

[Monarch]

Neh didn't read your OP. To put it bluntly your lack of pictorial evidence and numbers bores me. If you had presented your evidence in a more convenient way,

I would have continue reading the OP.  Open some spoilers and throw in the evidence from the thread, getting someone to click on the spoilers means you have captured 

the attention of the reader. Most people just see evidence that one presents. Providing evidence at one's convenience would make your argument much more stronger. 

I too already know that AMD isn't as strong as Nvidia in some dx11 games. BUT if feel that you don't need to change your post then you can ignore whatever I wrote 

 

You're right, I've updated the OP. 

[xAcid9]

pclab and gamegpu again... ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[Monarch]

pclab and gamegpu again... ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

I can confirm those benchmarks as I'm getting the same (crap) performance on my rig. Don't know why you think ill of them.

[Monarch]

No see the problem here is you have no official proof to back up these accusations your making besides some numbers on a graph that you expect use to believe. Do some realworld testing or use the API overhead test that is in 3DMark between a 290x and a 780 with a 4690k and you will see no difference even in games there is very very little difference and in most cases the R9 290x is half a frame behind with a day 1 launch. I went from running 2x GTX 770's in SLI to a single R9 280, and what is sad that is in all my games I only use the DX11 API and yet I still hold a better average and min frame rate with it then I did with the 770's.

 

Since when is 3DMark considered a real world test?

 

Sigh....

 

2 Benchmarks (with one of them being a launch title) on 1 setting isn't exactly "the truth". There are more games than those. There are more settings than those. Hell, there are more hardware specs than those!

 

Not to mention, you can get 290x for a lot cheaper than 970s. And the fact that the 970 is a much newer product, with AMD's new lineup coming very soon.

 

OP updated, added some more benchmarks. It happens in all games with DX11. As for the settings, what matters is to bench all GPUs with the same settings, and if some perform better well then they are better. That's how benchmarks are done.

[Monarch]

I had a 970 and it was great at 1080p

Then I had a 290x, and at 1080p there is absolutely no noticeable difference whatsoever.

Now I have 2 290xs and it is beast.

Look at the high-res benchmarks, 290x crossfire is ahead of 970 sli and not far from 980 sli.

 

This issue I'm talking about can only be seen in CPU-bound situations. Why do you think 290X is so close to Nvidia GPUs at high res? One of the reasons is because it's not limited by the CPU, it works 100% and only then shows it's true power.

[Raudi_]

Since when is 3DMark considered a real world test?

Its called an API Overhead Test, its a Draw Call test for the different Rendering API's. If and keyword 'IF' AMD cards are as bad a your saying with DX11, then systems with AMD cards will have a lower draw call count vs systems with a Nvidia GPU.

[zappian]

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1056?vs=1355

/thread

[Monarch]

Its called an API Overhead Test, its a Draw Call test for the different Rendering API's. If and keyword 'IF' AMD cards are as bad a your saying with DX11, then systems with AMD cards will have a lower draw call count vs systems with a Nvidia GPU.

 

 

(...)the greatest gains and the highest absolute performnace are achieved by AMD’s Radeon R9 290X. As we saw in Star Swarm and continue to see here, AMD’s DirectX 11 throughput is relatively poor, topping out at 1.1 draw calls for both DX11ST and DX11MT. AMD simply isn’t able to push much more than that many calls through their drivers, and without real support for DX11 multi-threading (e.g. DX11 Dirver Command Lists), they gain nothing from the DX11MT test.

 

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9112/exploring-dx12-3dmark-api-overhead-feature-test/3

[Raudi_]

-snip-

 

(...)the greatest gains and the highest absolute performnace are achieved by AMD’s Radeon R9 290X. As we saw in Star Swarm and continue to see here, AMD’s DirectX 11 throughput is relatively poor, topping out at 1.1 draw calls for both DX11ST and DX11MT. AMD simply isn’t able to push much more than that many calls through their drivers, and without real support for DX11 multi-threading (e.g. DX11 Dirver Command Lists), they gain nothing from the DX11MT test.

 

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9112/exploring-dx12-3dmark-api-overhead-feature-test/3

This is better to see vs a list of Games from websites no one likes, AMD is more ready for DX12 then Nvidia Currently is, but still my point stands AMD doesn't struggle as bad as your making is sound with DX11.

[-CLASSIFIED-]

Seeing as I currently run an AMD GPU I can tell you this is bullshit.

ditto ! I'm having no problems either

[Monarch]

This is better to see vs a list of Games from websites no one likes, AMD is more ready for DX12 then Nvidia Currently is, but still my point stands AMD doesn't struggle as bad as your making is sound with DX11.

 

In BF4 and GTA V for example, it's a difference between dropping and not dropping below 60 with my CPU. Gameplay at ~40 fps is not smooth, and I didn't pay for high-end hardware to get <60 fps.

[Raudi_]

In BF4 and GTA V for example, it's a difference between dropping and not dropping below 60 in my case. Gameplay at ~40 fps is not smooth, and I didn't pay for high-end hardware to get <60 fps.

GTA V I hold a Constant 60FPS ON ultra 2x MSAA no frame drops, BF4 Ultra with DX11 APU I hold 65-70FPS Average.

[xAcid9]

I can confirm those benchmarks as I'm getting the same (crap) performance on my rig. Don't know why you think ill of them.

 

Because for the past years only these 2 websites show significant performance different between AMD and Nvidia when it come to DX11 optimization. 

 

What is your ingame setting? I want to try replicate it.

[FernandoTeixeira]

well... even 280x is running better than a 780 according : http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/gta-v-pc-graphics-performance-review,6.html