AMD Begins Massive Wave of Price Cuts on R9 290x and 290

[patrickjp93]

Shit maybe is not too late so listen closely: Never address an off topic Apple related comment. It's just an invitation to a bunch of fucking idiots to make any and all topics about Apple whenever is arguing for or against them. It's beyond me why LTT moderation doesn't bans this people (on both sides) on sight but for fuck's sake, please don't ever reply to them unless for some inexplicable reason you're willing to go into an Apple related thread and dive head first into that shithole. 

It wasn't off-topic. 4K and GPUs are related, and the only reason 4K monitors are so expensive is because there isn't much competition or enough demand to drive it, but now laptop makers can provide a full 4K machine for less than the cost of a 27" monitor.

[Sakkura]

I wouldn't quite say that about Apple. They are the sole providers of the most powerful mobile CPU I7 4980HQ. Their speakers are the best of any laptop I've ever heard, and despite the fact I hate trackpads, I find theirs close to tolerable. And they're smart enough to build a keyboard in such a way that you can use a silicon guard to prevent crumbs, hair, shedding cells, or even water from getting into the machine to possibly short out the motherboard.

 

They make good stuff, but you certainly get to pay for it. Other than that, I still don't really see the relevance when it comes to the R9 290/290X and GTX 970/980. Maxwell may be efficient, but you still don't put those things in laptops.

 

And really, for 4K gaming a single GTX 980 still isn't really enough. So I don't see 4K gaming going mainstream anytime soon.

[patrickjp93]

They make good stuff, but you certainly get to pay for it. Other than that, I still don't really see the relevance when it comes to the R9 290/290X and GTX 970/980. Maxwell may be efficient, but you still don't put those things in laptops.

 

And really, for 4K gaming a single GTX 980 still isn't really enough. So I don't see 4K gaming going mainstream anytime soon.

single-monitor 4K it's enough for everything but FPS games where every last frame per second matters.

 

And yeah, $3400 for a laptop, even with 1TB of SSD and 32 GB of RAM, is ridiculous when the dGPU you get is the gtx 750m... I mean come on...the 850m's been out for a while now. Still, hopefully it will last me 6-7 years like every other computer I've ever owned except the shitty Dell Latitude I bought for class because English teachers are dicks.

[Silent_Xaxal]

They make good stuff, but you certainly get to pay for it. Other than that, I still don't really see the relevance when it comes to the R9 290/290X and GTX 970/980. Maxwell may be efficient, but you still don't put those things in laptops.

 

And really, for 4K gaming a single GTX 980 still isn't really enough. So I don't see 4K gaming going mainstream anytime soon.

 

We're at least a generation or two away before a mobile GPU can run 4K at high levels on a non-sli configuration.

[patrickjp93]

We're at least a generation or two away before a mobile GPU can run 4K at high levels on a non-sli configuration.

Key words being high levels. At mid-range...I don't know. I think the 980m might do it.

[Silent_Xaxal]

Thing is, we don't have anything but those rumored benchmarks to go by. So I won't assume, though I do hope that's the case, seeing as I'd like a good laptop with such a GPU inside. Should make for a powerful moving workstation/game machine.

[patrickjp93]

Thing is, we don't have anything but those rumored benchmarks to go by. So I won't assume, though I do hope that's the case, seeing as I'd like a good laptop with such a GPU inside. Should make for a powerful moving workstation/game machine.

If only mobile workstations were actually effective...We're close to it though. AMD will make ECC-enabled APUs, and so will Intel, even if they're not quite as strong as a full Kepler Quadro.

[Silent_Xaxal]

If only mobile workstations were actually effective...We're close to it though. AMD will make ECC-enabled APUs, and so will Intel, even if they're not quite as strong as a full Kepler Quadro.

 

BTW, I was acually referring to using a high-end gaming laptop as a workstation for the more basic Cuda processing tasks (editing, rendering,  basic animation, etc.).

 

Still sounds good, though.

[patrickjp93]

BTW, I was acually referring to using a high-end gaming laptop as a workstation for the more basic Cuda processing tasks (editing, rendering,  basic animation, etc.).

 

Still sounds good, though.

I think MSI has a multimedia mobile workstation with a mobile quadro in it, but it works like shit. If only Intel had bought Nvidia back when they weren't competing... It'd be great to watch Carrizo go up against an x86-enabled Tegra K1.

[Builder]

I think MSI has a multimedia mobile workstation with a mobile quadro in it, but it works like shit. If only Intel had bought Nvidia back when they weren't competing... It'd be great to watch Carrizo go up against an x86-enabled Tegra K1.

Why do you seem to think x86 would make everything better? Not that there's really anything wrong with that point of view per se but I know people who would say adding x86 to everything would make it worse

[patrickjp93]

Why do you seem to think x86 would make everything better? Not that there's really anything wrong with that point of view per se but I know people who would say adding x86 to everything would make it worse

The number of apps built on x86. ARM doesn't have the software ecosystem yet to be viable for mobile computing beyond tablets.

[Builder]

The number of apps built on x86. ARM doesn't have the software ecosystem yet to be viable for mobile computing beyond tablets.

That answer occurred to me after I wrote the post. Thank god we have LLVM!

 

I think it will be interesting to see what Apple does following this Broadwell delay if the stuff isn't knock your socks off fantastic or if Apple could have done better. We already know they're ready to switch from platforms that interfere with their supply chain because they like controlling everything through vertical integration.

 

Do you think there's a possibility they'd switch to ARM based laptops in maybe ~2 years and write another BIL for x86 code like Rosetta? Or is that infeasible?

[patrickjp93]

That answer occurred to me after I wrote the post. Thank god we have LLVM!

 

I think it will be interesting to see what Apple does following this Broadwell delay if the stuff isn't knock your socks off fantastic or if Apple could have done better. We already know they're ready to switch from platforms that interfere with their supply chain because they like controlling everything through vertical integration.

 

Do you think there's a possibility they'd switch to ARM based laptops in maybe ~2 years and write another BIL for x86 code like Rosetta? Or is that infeasible?

For tablets and Macbook Air I see that being possible, but not on the Pros until at least 5 years down, and that might not even happen. Apple can't put out a 2 Teraflop SOC the way Intel claims will happen with its top Broadwell SKUs, and Skylake is promising unified memory and even more graphics power in an even smaller thermal package at the same clock speeds we're seeing now. Not to mention Apple lost Keller to AMD, and two of his teammates.

 

I'm very glad we have LLVM, although I'm not completely happy with their OPENCL compilation. Just over the course of my Heterogeneous Computing class I've discovered it has deficits against GCC.

[Builder]

For tablets and Macbook Air I see that being possible, but not on the Pros until at least 5 years down, and that might not even happen. Apple can't put out a 2 Teraflop SOC the way Intel claims will happen with its top Broadwell SKUs, and Skylake is promising unified memory and even more graphics power in an even smaller thermal package at the same clock speeds we're seeing now. Not to mention Apple lost Keller to AMD, and two of his teammates.

There are probably more than three people designing chips at Apple or they wouldn't be having such wild success lately...they don't need to do it for the tablets because they already run ARM. You know that, right?

[patrickjp93]

There are probably more than three people designing chips at Apple or they wouldn't be having such wild success lately...they don't need to do it for the tablets because they already run ARM. You know that, right?

There's a mix of x86 and ARM tablets. It'll be interesting to see if Apple stays with ARM for the iPad going forward from Broadwell.

 

And yes, they have more people, but Keller was their spearhead. He did after all lead AMD to chips which beat Intel through 2006.

[Builder]

There's a mix of x86 and ARM tablets. It'll be interesting to see if Apple stays with ARM for the iPad going forward from Broadwell.

Oh of course they will. Why the hell would they go through the pain of porting iOS to x86 when they have a perfectly good platform in which they control almost all elements of the design?

 

If Broadwell is any indicator Skylake will probably be delayed too if it hasn't been/isn't already.

[patrickjp93]

Oh of course they will. Why the hell would they go through the pain of porting iOS to x86 when they have a perfectly good platform in which they control almost all elements of the design?

 

If Broadwell is any indicator Skylake will probably be delayed too if it hasn't been/isn't already.

No delay on Skylake. Kirzanich confirmed this at IDF. The deployment order is switched though. Desktop is coming first in May with mobile following up in November along with Skylake K.

 

Also, they have LLVM. It takes no time to recompile the code for x86.

[Builder]

No delay on Skylake. Kirzanich confirmed this at IDF. The deployment order is switched though. Desktop is coming first in May with mobile following up in November along with Skylake K.

 

Also, they have LLVM. It takes no time to recompile the code for x86.

Yeah I know they have LLVM. There's got to be at least SOME assembly in there though...not to mention they'd have to ask all the developers to either release LLVM bytecode sources or port their apps.

 

Actually do they do that already? It seems like too good of an idea for that not to be the case...

[patrickjp93]

Yeah I know they have LLVM. There's got to be at least SOME assembly in there though...not to mention they'd have to ask all the developers to either release LLVM bytecode sources or port their apps.

 

Actually do they do that already? It seems like too good of an idea for that not to be the case...

Bytecode? iOS doesn't run on a virtual machine. It's written in C like every other OS.

[Builder]

Bytecode? iOS doesn't run on a virtual machine. It's written in C like every other OS.

LLVM uses bytecode as an intermediary state. I know it doesn't run on a virtual machine. It's also mostly written in Objective-C with probably a bit of C++ and Swift here and there but I strongly doubt there's a significant amount of pure C.

[patrickjp93]

LLVM uses bytecode as an intermediary state. I know it doesn't run on a virtual machine. It's also mostly written in Objective-C with probably a bit of C++ and Swift here and there but I strongly doubt there's a significant amount of pure C.

C++ has a lot of overhead that's usually intolerable in a production OS. I don't know much about Objective C, but I thought it was  virtual language like Java and C#. Is this incorrect? And since OpenCL is technically not C++ compliant, anything that wants to comply with HSA cannot be written in C++.

[79wjd]

inb4 @I/O calls himself an Nvidiot for buying an overpriced 970. 

[Builder]

C++ has a lot of overhead that's usually intolerable in a production OS. I don't know much about Objective C, but I thought it was  virtual language like Java and C#. Is this incorrect? And since OpenCL is technically not C++ compliant, anything that wants to comply with HSA cannot be written in C++.

You're so knowledgeable about some things but you seem completely incompetent with others...no offense meant here, but the other day you called OS X Linux based too. Just a bit inconsistent for a CS major is all...

 

Objective-C is a compiled language originally a competitor to C++. It took bits of Smalltalk, and added them to C to make an object oriented language. It was never considered particularly better than C++ though, hence the adage "Objective-C took the runtime speed of Smalltalk combined with the syntactical elegance of C." (i.e., the worst parts of both languages) Apple is really the only company using it at this point.

 

I don't know where you're getting C++ having a lot of overhead from, though. Windows AND OS X use it for at least something. Windows is mostly C++ I believe. Linux is pure C though. C is only used for the kernels in Windows and OS X. 

 

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/580292/what-languages-are-windows-mac-os-x-and-linux-written-in

 

Basically they have an LLVM bytecode compiler for Objective-C and now Swift so theoretically they can recompile on any platform with an LLVM bytecode to native compiler. They love LLVM. They hired the guy who invented it.

 

Come to think of it you probably confused Objective-C with C#, Microsoft's Java that is JIT compiled on the .NET virtual machine.

[monstercameron]

On top of all that opencl spir and c++ amp can be used to make hsa programs.

[Humbug]

The great thing about this is that builders on a budget can afford powerful cards and the average PC gaming spec becomes more powerful. It's very good for our pc gaming ecosystem; more people with strong GPUs.

 

 

2. Does AMD hate earning money? Did they suddenly come across so much money they can afford to slash prices like this? 

They have their old generation currently competing against Nvidia's new generation.

They have to compete on price until their new cards come out. They won't sell them at a loss but they will cut their margins.