help Building my first pc and i'm not sure which parts to pick

[podkall]

6 minutes ago, Markz2023 said:

I chose it because I don't have it

what about AM4 build?

[BahnStormer]

2 hours ago, Markz2023 said:

I chose it because I don't have it

A word of advice.... people get very frustrated when the goal posts get randomly moved.

 

Is the monitor in the €1100 target budget or was that purchase completely separate ?

[BahnStormer]

3 hours ago, podkall said:

One thing about AM5, it doesn't always have to be good idea in all countries,

 

for instance, how is this for you?:

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D 3.4 GHz 8-Core Processor  (€277.31 @ Galaxus)
CPU Cooler: Deepcool AG400 75.89 CFM CPU Cooler  (€31.38 @ Galaxus)
Motherboard: MSI B550 GAMING GEN3 ATX AM4 Motherboard  (€104.90 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Memory: *Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL18 Memory  (€41.00 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Storage: Kingston NV2 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€63.90 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Case: Deepcool MATREXX 55 MESH ADD-RGB 4F ATX Mid Tower Case  (€73.25 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Power Supply: MSI MPG A750GF 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€98.70 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Total: €690.44
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
*Lowest price parts chosen from parametric criteria
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-03-28 21:45 CET+0100

I'm not sure I understand why, but you keep pushing a really peculiar AM4 build.

 

Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love AM4 - I'm still running several right now, including my main gaming rig.... it is also top of the recommendations for €500 budget builds.... or if somebody has already has an AM4 board or sometimes even just good DDR4 RAM.

 

If you're building new, especially with €1000 or more, then the newer AM5 platform makes more sense.

 

The IPC on on AM5 and the higher clock speeds mean that it can overcome the lack of L3 cache and even the lower end AM5 chips can deliver something very close to the top end AM4.

 

It is technically cheaper to go with the AM4 build you're pointed out, but the only way you save money because you're only paying €41 for 16Gb of VERY low spec CAS 18 DDR4 (absolutely scraping the barrel). You're comparing that to other builds with €100-€120 for 32Gb of high spec, low latency DDR5 that will last for the next 2 or more CPU upgrades.

 

The core components you've suggested are:
"CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D 3.4 GHz 8-Core Processor  (€277.31 @ Galaxus)
Motherboard: MSI B550 GAMING GEN3 ATX AM4 Motherboard  (€104.90 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Memory: *Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL18 Memory  (€41.00 @ Amazon Deutschland)"

 

€423 on the best spec (CPU) that an AM4 is likely to ever be (unless you replace the RAM, which you would need to to get the performance out of the 5800X3D).

Instead of that you could pay:

€160 7500F

€150 AsRock RS Pro AM5 motherboard

€110 DDR 6000MT/sec CAS30

 

€430 on a system that will have:

1) an equivalent gaming CPU now

2) 32Gb of low latency DDR 5 RAM instead of 16Gb of slower RAM

(overall better gaming performance with a similar capacity CPU and WAY more RAM that is also faster)

3) a single chip upgrade path in a year or two (just drop in a 7800X3D) 

[podkall]

32 minutes ago, BahnStormer said:

If you're building new, especially with €1000 or more, then the newer AM5 platform makes more sense.

the idea is to pay same amount for faster PC, even if it locks you onto AM4 socket with DDR4 RAM,

 

33 minutes ago, BahnStormer said:

It is technically cheaper to go with the AM4 build you're pointed out, but the only way you save money because you're only paying €41 for 16Gb of VERY low spec CAS 18 DDR4 (absolutely scraping the barrel). You're comparing that to other builds with €100-€120 for 32Gb of high spec, low latency DDR5 that will last for the next 2 or more CPU upgrades.

exactly, you are saving 60€, even though you're losing 16GB of RAM, but I'd take that risk if it's just gaming

 

35 minutes ago, BahnStormer said:

The core components you've suggested are:
"CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D 3.4 GHz 8-Core Processor  (€277.31 @ Galaxus)
Motherboard: MSI B550 GAMING GEN3 ATX AM4 Motherboard  (€104.90 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Memory: *Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL18 Memory  (€41.00 @ Amazon Deutschland)"

oh yes, I did scrap it out of the 5600 build, because that's the only AM4 build in the recommended,

 

but the CL16 isn't that much more expensive for Germany:

Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory  (€54.90 @ Alza)

 

36 minutes ago, BahnStormer said:

Instead of that you could pay:

€160 7500F

€150 AsRock RS Pro AM5 motherboard

€110 DDR 6000MT/sec CAS30

 

€430 on a system that will have:

1) an equivalent gaming CPU now

2) 32Gb of low latency DDR 5 RAM instead of 16Gb of slower RAM

(overall better gaming performance with a similar capacity CPU and WAY more RAM that is also faster)

3) a single chip upgrade path in a year or two (just drop in a 7800X3D)

yeah, but then I look at OP's list and I wonder, if AM4 would give better GPU while barely hurting CPU performance,

 

because OP wants to play cs2 and "many more" games,

 

but they also are getting a 240Hz monitor,

 

more pressure for CPU, but the build then leaves like 250€ for GPU, which is like RTX 4060 or RX 7600,

 

and I pause and think if these GPUs are in balance with that build,

 

but now that I'm putting the prices together, I can see that both builds would amount to same GPU,

 

and I also think that I'm still confused, because 7600 is basically the "slowest" CPU for AM5, but basically similar speed as 5800x3D,

 

to add an easy comparison, it's like saying GTX 1080ti and RTX 2060 were same speed, but they aren't, RTX 2060 is 22% slower.

 

So I guess the AM5 with 7600 or 4060 is decent, though the 8GB of VRAM is not fun, but on 1080p it's probably fine, I guess I'm really frustrated about the SSD being crappy, while everything else is super speed basically if we compare them to each other...

[Markz2023]

8 hours ago, BahnStormer said:

A word of advice.... people get very frustrated when the goal posts get randomly moved.

 

Is the monitor in the €1100 target budget or was that purchase completely separate ?

I counted it with the price of the monitor but it's seperate. 

[BahnStormer]

1 hour ago, Markz2023 said:

I counted it with the price of the monitor but it's seperate. 

okay, that's a relief

[BahnStormer]

9 hours ago, podkall said:

and I also think that I'm still confused, because 7600 is basically the "slowest" CPU for AM5, but basically similar speed as 5800x3D,

 

to add an easy comparison, it's like saying GTX 1080ti and RTX 2060 were same speed, but they aren't, RTX 2060 is 22% slower.

 

Almost correct on the CPU, completely misleading to compare to GPUs!

 

Ryzen 5 7500F is currently the slowest.... then about 1-2% faster you have the R5 7600, then another 2-3% faster you have the R5 7600X.

 

Some product lines overlap dramatically (all recent Intel CPUs, most recent GPU's, etc)... but others don't, especially on specific tasks like games than benefit from high bandwidth memory, plus the double-whammy of higher clock speed AND higher IPC.

There are other games where the 5800X3D takes a lead, but it's pretty even: 4% lead on average.
 

This debate about 7600 vs 5800X3D was settled before CS2 came out, but in games like CS:GO, the AM5 chips are faster than even the VERY best AM4.... expect similar for CS2:


Worth noting that this was done where the AM5 system has the same RAM I'm recommending, but the AM4 was given (what was at the time) a ~€400 set of CL14 latency, tuned DDR4, which makes a difference. If you put memory that's 25% slower (CL18) into a 5800X3D, I'm sure even a 7500F would win most of the benchmarks, let alone a 7600X.

Full details on here: 

 

 

9 hours ago, podkall said:

because OP wants to play cs2 and "many more" games,

 

but they also are getting a 240Hz monitor,

And yes, I was looking at the 1080P high refresh monitor.... this lower res is where the CPU capacity to deliver more frames to the GPU buffer is more important than a high end GPU.... the GPU can't be a potato, but CPU and memory latency are the most important.

[BahnStormer]

On 3/25/2024 at 8:09 PM, Markz2023 said:

is there any similar motherboards to that msi that are a little cheaper?

AsRock do several - the B650 ProRS has phenomenal VRMs (for <€150!) and even their cheaper ones are pretty good (better than the Gigabyte Eagle).

Try to avoid the A-series as there are a lot of limitations to PCIe lanes, USB and even basic PBO.

 

Although the X-series are nice, there won't be any performance difference: slightly better VRMs and more USB / PCIe gen5 lanes: so things like the ability to add 4x M.2 and have 3 of them as high speed.... instead of 2 high speed and one slower M.2 on a B650.