Are proper motherboard reviews economically viable?

[FlyingPotato_is_taken]

With two exceptions, there are good reviews available for every component in the PC:

1. RAM

2. Motherboard's

 

With RAM, it is a technical/statistical limitation that requires an unreasonable sample size.

For Motherboards? Properly reviewing them takes knowledge across multiple domains including signal integrity [RAM speed, PCIE-validation, etc.], power delivery (VRM-architecture, layout , thermal design, noise and transient response), audio, networking/peripherals and BIOS/firmware.

The takeaway is that there is no technical limitation that makes them impossible, but every motherboard "review" is a glorified unboxing.

 

Does this mean that motherboard reviews are economic suicide and therefore we can't have them?

[RONOTHAN##]

15 minutes ago, FlyingPotato_is_taken said:

For Motherboards? Properly reviewing them takes knowledge across multiple domains including signal integrity [RAM speed, PCIE-validation, etc.], power delivery (VRM-architecture, layout , thermal design, noise and transient response), audio, networking/peripherals and BIOS/firmware.

The takeaway is that there is no technical limitation that makes them impossible, but every motherboard "review" is a glorified unboxing.

TechPowerUp does some good reviews, same with Guru3d and Hardware Unboxed. Buildzoid also does some PCB analysis, which is half a review, though his are explicitly not reviews and just going through how well the PCB is designed, not going through how the BIOS behaves or anything like that. 

[Middcore]

The stuff you're talking about that would be the basis of a "proper" motherboard review are functionally irrelevant to ~95% of users.

 

Does the board have the right socket for the CPU you want? Does the chipset have the features you want? Does the board have the I/O you want? Do you care about WiFi? Nice-to-haves like BIOS flashback and debug codes?

 

Answer these questions and you end up with a board that you will be perfectly happy with most of the time. You will gain nothing from worrying about things like signal integrity.

 

So, yes, the types of review you're talking about are economically unviable, and if people could be convinced to watch them it would just lead to a lot of insufferable hand wringing over things most of them would never notice in actual use.

[Somerandomtechyboi]

14 minutes ago, Middcore said:

The stuff you're talking about that would be the basis of a "proper" motherboard review are functionally rrelevant to ~95% of users.

^^^

its the kind of reviews that are aimed at overclockers or power users

 

Think these reviews existed back in the bclk oc days since youd wanna know what kind of fsb/bclk your mobo can run since that was used for ocing, but nowadays oc reviews are more or less limited to ram overclocking which is pretty niche

 

 

As an example there wouldnt be any real difference between my x58a ud3r and the x58a-oc for normies thatd only run 200-220bclk and run their rams at pitifully slow <2000 speeds, but for me i do notice the difference as this x58a ud3r has a garbage outer channel that wont clock for shit (>2600) whereas the x58a oc can do 3000+ possibly >4000 on all 3 channels

[FlyingPotato_is_taken]

44 minutes ago, Middcore said:

are functionally irrelevant to ~95% of users.

With budget/price boards it's a valid question what the VRM can support (e.g. overheating with a stock Ryzen 5 7500). Also RAM speeds can be limited by bad designs.  Going from one mainboard to another where both where at the same price point (around $150) reduced my RAM speed by 500 "MHz" with the exact same CPU, RAM and PSU.

 

With midrange (somehow these days $200) to higher end boards the question changes but there isn't anybody writing reviews focused on that either.

[toasty99]

1 hour ago, FlyingPotato_is_taken said:

With budget/price boards it's a valid question what the VRM can support (e.g. overheating with a stock Ryzen 5 7500). Also RAM speeds can be limited by bad designs.  Going from one mainboard to another where both where at the same price point (around $150) reduced my RAM speed by 500 "MHz" with the exact same CPU, RAM and PSU.

 

With midrange (somehow these days $200) to higher end boards the question changes but there isn't anybody writing reviews focused on that either.

First off, ram compatibility is a complex issue. If your ram is not on the QVL list of the motherboard you purchased, then that's user error. XMP/Expo are overclocking, the only way you should expect the rated speeds are if you are using a kit of memory with a motherboard where it is explicitly listed on the QVL. Otherwise, it's just overclocking and your mileage may vary. Now, there are absolutely boards that overclock ram better. EVGA mounts their ram slots above the CPU to lower the trace distance to improve ram overclocking. It's a well known and highly touted feature on the enthusiast motherboards they make. The thing is, to get the fastest ram overclocking they also only have two ram slots, a sacrifice your average customer may not want to make. 

 

As for budget vs mid range boards, HWunboxed tested cheap b650 boards and most of the $120 boards had no issue running a 7950x at full load without overheating. That's certainly within specification and reasonable. There are a620 boards out there that have tdp limits for the CPU because they don't have good enough VRMs, so I would in general just avoid A620 with the pricing of b650. Of the b650 boards HWunboxed tested, only two boards (both Asus) failed with a 7950x at full load, so that's legitimately a worst case scenario and most of them were fine.

 

https://youtu.be/DTFUa60ozKY?si=T05QqTnpw583fYsy

 

As for calling the mid range $200, that's your opinion. If a $120 b650 motherboard can handle a Ryzen 7950x, that's really more than enough for most users is it not? I've even seen PCI-e gen 5 support on $120 motherboards!

 

Now, your concern of ANY board having an issue with a Ryzen 7500 is completely unfounded. Even the worst A620 board can handle that chip. As I brought up above, with higher end chips there is a concern, but the low end chips you'll never have an issue.

 

There's really only two things in motherboard reviews worth evaluating:

 

1. The "HALO" products. Enthusiast motherboards designed for overclocking. It's completely valid to test and push those extremely expensive $500+ boards to see what the best case scenario of performance can be.

 

2. Just finding where "good enough" is. What's the point where "hey this budget motherboard can handle the 14900k/7950x just fine at stock, so you're good to go".

[FlyingPotato_is_taken]

@toasty99 Tell that Biostar with a B650 motherboard.

If I search for B650 mainboards and sort by price: 200€ is absolutely midrange where the most boards are.