Z790 motherboard and ram for 13600K?

[RONOTHAN##]

6 minutes ago, Melodist said:

So you can run all the 13 and 14th gen processors with that connector without overclocking or just the 13700K? You mean by overclocking doing more than the K boost clock?

Most CPUs should be fine, though the 13900K can be a little sketchy. If you're buying a 13900K, I'd want to have both EPS connectors plugged in, even though you can probably get away without doing that. 

 

9 minutes ago, Melodist said:

I mean who wants to overclock these CPUs nowadays anyways lol?

slowly raises hand

 

Though yeah, for the most part CPU overclocking is basically dead. Only the 13600K really has worthwhile headroom anymore. 

[Melodist]

3 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Most CPUs should be fine, though the 13900K can be a little sketchy. If you're buying a 13900K, I'd want to have both EPS connectors plugged in, even though you can probably get away without doing that. 

 

slowly raises hand

 

Though yeah, for the most part CPU overclocking is basically dead. Only the 13600K really has worthwhile headroom anymore. 

Ah gotcha, I was just asking whether the power delivery for a CPU like the 13900K or 14900K is fine for what the Z790 Creator offers (8+4)? Or would you need 8+8 to power such the CPU? I never meant to only connect one 8 port

[RONOTHAN##]

Just now, Melodist said:

Ah gotcha, I was just asking whether the power delivery for a CPU like the 13900K or 14900K is fine for what the Z790 Creator offers (8+4)? Or would you need 8+8 to power such the CPU? I never meant to only connect one 8 port

Oh, the Z790 ProArt is fine for those chips, the VRM on it is plenty for a 13900K. Don't know why they only put the 4 pin on instead of the 8 pin for the secondary EPS connector, though it won't cause issues either. 

[Melodist]

On 9/23/2023 at 3:37 AM, RONOTHAN## said:

Oh, the Z790 ProArt is fine for those chips, the VRM on it is plenty for a 13900K. Don't know why they only put the 4 pin on instead of the 8 pin for the secondary EPS connector, though it won't cause issues either. 

I also found really good offers for the following boards:

 

ASUS ROG Strix Z790-E

 

GIGABYTE Z790

AORUS Master

 

Do you think either of these would be a better choice for durability and stability for 14th Gen CPUs than the Proart?

[RONOTHAN##]

1 hour ago, Melodist said:

Do you think either of these would be a better choice for durability and stability for 14th Gen CPUs than the Proart?

They'll be about the same. I wouldn't really expect one of them to be better than another, it just comes down to what features you want. 

[Melodist]

2 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

They'll be about the same. I wouldn't really expect one of them to be better than another, it just comes down to what features you want. 

Currently deciding between Proart Z790 / Gaming-E vs Taichi Lite still.

 

Between the 2 Asus Boards

 

Proart advantages

- Dual x16 Gen 5

- 10G

- 5 Years warranty

- Thunderbolt

 

Gaming-E advantages

- Better VRM

- PCIe 5 NVMe

- lots of USB ports

- Postcode

- better audio

 

I mean I could later on add a thunderbolt card and 10g network card. Also generally the question whether the onboard Gen5 M.2 is worth it? Technically two could be added over the Z790 Proart's PCIe slot right?

 

What do you think between the two boards?

 

And yeah lastly is the Z790 Taichi Lite, which has the best features of them all, 24 phase VRM, Gen 5 M.2, 2 x 16 Gen 5 PCIe, Thunderbolt, good amount of USB ports, 2.5g and 1g Internet, incredible audio, feels like it stacks features of two Asus Boards together into one.

 

But then, I'm not very trustful when it comes to the ASRock, it feels like we slap a lot of stuff on it but are software and controller / performance / durability / bios wise not as good as the rest.

 

Also God knows what the actual warranty for the Taichi Lite is, also their website looks like from 2001.

 

But I'd really would like to use the Taichi Lite, but my trust in ASRock for operation and durability is very low, also don't know about the drivers.

 

What do you think, what should I do? All parts are ordered besides the motherboard.

 

I'm between the Proart, Strix Gaminf-E and Taichi Lite but really would love the Taichi Lite to be a good product because it packs the most features of them all.

 

But I need for my computer to last for the next 5 years and perform well. Btw I'm very grateful for you to bear with me, haven't experienced such kindness and support on the Internet for a very long time.

[Melodist]

Also one advantage I've heard of is that the Proart will immediately be exchanged when faulty because it falls under the server motherboard category apparently, is that true? You don't have to send it in first.

[RONOTHAN##]

17 minutes ago, Melodist said:

Proart advantages

- Dual x16 Gen 5

- 10G

- 5 Years warranty

- Thunderbolt

 

Gaming-E advantages

- Better VRM

- PCIe 5 NVMe

- lots of USB ports

- Postcode

- better audio

Fixed the advantages. The better VRM doesn't really mean much since they're both overkill for a 13900K, the PCIe 5.0 NVMe drive is because it steals 8 lanes from the GPU meaning that a simple AIC will get the ProArt to have the same capability, and IMO if you actually care about audio you'll buy an external DAC rather than using onboard. 

 

20 minutes ago, Melodist said:

Also generally the question whether the onboard Gen5 M.2 is worth it? Technically two could be added over the Z790 Proart's PCIe slot right?

Yes, the on board slots are actually just a downgrade over the dual x8 slots since those you could use for more than just fast SSDs. 

 

22 minutes ago, Melodist said:

What do you think between the two boards?

If it wasn't for the lack of the POST code I'd be 100% recommending the ProArt. The Z790-E Strix is just a really weird board, the feature set is pretty lacking compared to competing vendors, and the only advantage of it is that it's ASUS's cheapest Z790 board with a POST code, and for a system that needs to be easily troubleshooted if something goes wrong that's a very useful feature. 

 

27 minutes ago, Melodist said:

I'm not very trustful when it comes to the ASRock, it feels like we slap a lot of stuff on it but are software and controller / performance / durability / bios wise not as good as the rest.

Software wise they're not great (though no worse than Gigabyte or ASUS IMO, and it's not like you need to use any of the in-Windows tools they make for RGB and stuff), performance wise they're in line with everyone else (ASRock does consistently have their motherboard own world records, partially because they sponsor Splave), durability wise their high end offerings like the Taichi series are generally built really well, and BIOS wise they have come a long way in the past few years. I've used their boards for the past while, they really aren't bad, and realistically I've had a better experience with them than I have with some of the ASUS boards I've used (I still despise the Z690 Apex I used a while back, and I had less BIOS problems with the Z170 OC Formula I have than with the Maximus X Apex I've got). The X570 Taichi I used to use was a really fantastic AM4 board, the only reason I sold it was because I was bored and the X570 Master I replaced it with was better at memory overclocking (plus I wanted dual BIOS). 

 

39 minutes ago, Melodist said:

What do you think, what should I do? All parts are ordered besides the motherboard.

I would be going Taichi if you need the Thunderbolt support, ProArt if you need the 10GbE on-board and the ATX sizing. 

[Melodist]

36 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

I would be going Taichi if you need the Thunderbolt support, ProArt if you need the 10GbE on-board and the ATX sizing. 

The Proart also has Thunderbolt support.

 

So I'm not gaining anything with the VRMs on the Taichi when it comes to stability with the 14th Gen? If I really wanted to run a 14900K at it's full capability specd by Intel's Turbo? Over the Taichi or not by much? Just running the standard boost of whatever 5.4 something?

 

2 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Software wise they're not great (though no worse than Gigabyte or ASUS IMO, and it's not like you need to use any of the in-Windows tools they make for RGB and stuff), performance wise they're in line with everyone else (ASRock does consistently have their motherboard own world records, partially because they sponsor Splave), durability wise their high end offerings like the Taichi series are generally built really well, and BIOS wise they have come a long way in the past few years. I've used their boards for the past while, they really aren't bad, and realistically I've had a better experience with them than I have with some of the ASUS boards I've used (I still despise the Z690 Apex I used a while back, and I had less BIOS problems with the Z170 OC Formula I have than with the Maximus X Apex I've got). The X570 Taichi I used to use was a really fantastic AM4 board, the only reason I sold it was because I was bored and the X570 Master I replaced it with was better at memory overclocking (plus I wanted dual BIOS). 

So you're saying you'd potentially recommend the Taichi over the Proart based on your experience with Asus? I rather meant the BIOS software talking to the Board rather than the Windows software.

 

2 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

The Z790-E Strix is just a really weird board, the feature set is pretty lacking compared to competing vendors, and the only advantage of it is that it's ASUS's cheapest Z790 board with a POST code, and for a system that needs to be easily troubleshooted if something goes wrong that's a very useful feature.

Yeah you're right, thinking about it it's an odd board with features in the middle not commiting to something besides the Postcode.

 

2 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

If it wasn't for the lack of the POST code I'd be 100% recommending the ProArt.

So you're saying despite the Postcode, you'd rather recommend the Proart as a board, also for 14th Gen even though the VRAM is a lot better on the Taichi? Or is that also dependant on how they implement it with their BIOS? Would the Proart be able to run the 14900K nicely at it's turbo of apparently 5.7 GHz as long as cooling is a available without straining / overheating the VRMs?

 

2 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Fixed the advantages. The better VRM doesn't really mean much since they're both overkill for a 13900K, the PCIe 5.0 NVMe drive is because it steals 8 lanes from the GPU meaning that a simple AIC will get the ProArt to have the same capability, and IMO if you actually care about audio you'll buy an external DAC rather than using onboard. 

I just don't mind getting something nice onboard when it comes additionally, besides the external solutions.

 

I do have an extern AD/DA converter, the Lynx Aurora (n), it's amongst or rather the most transparent converter on the market, feeding my ProAc SM 100 and Amphion One 18s through a Bryston 3BST Pro with trim options:

https://www.lynxstudio.com/products/aurora-n/

 

 

[RONOTHAN##]

59 minutes ago, Melodist said:

The Proart also has Thunderbolt support.

I know, I should've phrased it as just thunderbolt support. 

 

1 hour ago, Melodist said:

So I'm not gaining anything with the VRMs on the Taichi when it comes to stability with the 14th Gen? If I really wanted to run a 14900K at it's full capability specd by Intel's Turbo? Over the Taichi or not by much? Just running the standard boost of whatever 5.4 something?

Yeah, you aren't really gaining anything with the bigger VRM on the Taichi. There are two things that matter with VRM quality, voltage regulation and current capacity. Basically every Intel motherboard has pretty good voltage regulation, so the Taichi won't really be any better or worse than the ProArt as long as both have the LLC settings dialed in. As for current capacity, this is what matters with how big the VRM is, but are plenty power efficient enough that they wouldn't overheat with the 13900K, and the 14900K shouldn't draw more power than the 13900K. Sure, the Taichi can have the VRM heatsink removed and not overheat while the ProArt would overheat, but unless you're planning on running the board naked for whatever reason that makes no difference. 

 

1 hour ago, Melodist said:

So you're saying you'd potentially recommend the Taichi over the Proart based on your experience with Asus? I rather meant the BIOS software talking to the Board rather than the Windows software.

Eh, both are about as good as each other. I wouldn't expect either to have BIOS issues, there's just some things about ASUS boards that annoy me more than ASRock boards annoy me. 

 

1 hour ago, Melodist said:

So you're saying despite the Postcode, you'd rather recommend the Proart as a board, also for 14th Gen even though the VRAM is a lot better on the Taichi?

Yes, if the ProArt had a POST code I would 100% be recommending it. The VRM on the Taichi isn't really necessary outside of the extreme overclocking scene, the ProArt is plenty for anything you'd do at ambient. The ProArt does have displayport inputs, which is really nice on boards that support Thunderbolt, and the 10G LAN is pretty useful as well. 

 

1 hour ago, Melodist said:

Would the Proart be able to run the 14900K nicely at it's turbo of apparently 5.7 GHz as long as cooling is a available without straining / overheating the VRMs?

Yes, I'd be surprised if you couldn't run a 14900K at full turbo on the ProArt. 

[Melodist]

22 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

I know, I should've phrased it as just thunderbolt support. 

 

Yeah, you aren't really gaining anything with the bigger VRM on the Taichi. There are two things that matter with VRM quality, voltage regulation and current capacity. Basically every Intel motherboard has pretty good voltage regulation, so the Taichi won't really be any better or worse than the ProArt as long as both have the LLC settings dialed in. As for current capacity, this is what matters with how big the VRM is, but are plenty power efficient enough that they wouldn't overheat with the 13900K, and the 14900K shouldn't draw more power than the 13900K. Sure, the Taichi can have the VRM heatsink removed and not overheat while the ProArt would overheat, but unless you're planning on running the board naked for whatever reason that makes no difference. 

 

Eh, both are about as good as each other. I wouldn't expect either to have BIOS issues, there's just some things about ASUS boards that annoy me more than ASRock boards annoy me. 

 

Yes, if the ProArt had a POST code I would 100% be recommending it. The VRM on the Taichi isn't really necessary outside of the extreme overclocking scene, the ProArt is plenty for anything you'd do at ambient. The ProArt does have displayport inputs, which is really nice on boards that support Thunderbolt, and the 10G LAN is pretty useful as well. 

 

Yes, I'd be surprised if you couldn't run a 14900K at full turbo on the ProArt. 

I mean, the Taichi Lite has crazy specs for just 400 Euro here, 24 VRM phases, 2 x 16 Gen5, 1 x Gen 5 NVMe, 1 x Gen4 slot, 4080 and Sabrent DAC, Thunderbolt 4, lots of ports, 2 x Ethernet, lots of SATA ports, Post code etc cetera.

 

That's like features of two Asus motherboards combined. Only the 10G is missing that I'd get from picking the Proart Z790 Creator which I could add by installing a card and I'd still be value-wise a lot better than with the Asus.

 

But at what price? Support, BIOS functionality and general durability through how it's designed to operate all the controllers? I should be super happy about this product and simply pick it for the specs and features but when I look on their website for example, it's very badly designed, Infos are scarce, I have to call a hotline at the Netherlands HQ to gain information etc cetera. I've figured out that they actually give 3 years of warranty for their Taichi products.

 

If I wasn't biased at all, purely based on the specs, the Taichi Lite should be the best pick right? Or am I missing something?

 

Just from a comfort pick of view, it'd be obviously the Asus, having more trust in the product but simply going by the specs, it's Taichi Lite all the way.

[RONOTHAN##]

1 hour ago, Melodist said:

If I wasn't biased at all, purely based on the specs, the Taichi Lite should be the best pick right? Or am I missing something?

 

The only disadvantage of the Taichi Lite is it doesn't have DP passthrough, so if you were using a display with it you'd be stuck with the iGPU. Otherwise it really is the best pick. 

[Melodist]

23 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

The only disadvantage of the Taichi Lite is it doesn't have DP passthrough, so if you were using a display with it you'd be stuck with the iGPU. Otherwise it really is the best pick. 

Proart just arrived, manufacturing date says 2023-02, which is February of this year. Also box is scruffy, red flag? Was ordered new at Amazon.

 

Should I try a different retailer or is that normal?

[RONOTHAN##]

14 minutes ago, Melodist said:

Proart just arrived, manufacturing date says 2023-02, which is February of this year. Also box is scruffy, red flag? Was ordered new at Amazon.

 

Should I try a different retailer or is that normal?

 

I have seen boxes come in rougher shape, so I wouldn't necessarily discount it because of that. Might as well give it a shot.