SO0oooO... How about a 16 core Ryzen 7000 THREADRIPPER?

[Uttamattamakin]

Lots of leaks about threadripper pro 7000's and we are deep in the "mainstream is basically HEDT now cope.  The highest end mainstream component is 16 cores.  Does a threadripper at the same core count make sense? 

https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-threadripper-7000-cpu-16-cores-up-to-5-2-ghz-clocks-benchmark-leak/

Quote

This chip doesn't has any official branding attached to it but it uses the "100-000000886-30_Y" OPN which should make it part of the upcoming Threadripper 7000 family. We just can't tell if this will be a PRO or Non-PRO SKU. 

 

As for the specifications, the AMD Ryzen Threadripper 7000 CPU features 16 cores based on the Zen 4 core architecture so that should give us 32 threads, 64 MB of L3 cache, & 16 MB of L2 cache. This chip should have just two Zen 4 CCDs enabled whereas the top chips would feature up to 12 CCDs on the SP5 and 8 CCDs on the SP6 platforms. The CPU was tested on a Lenovo platform featuring 32 GB of DDR5 memory.

The one thing I can't imagine threadripper would have built in is any sort of IGP ... but would have the capacity to have as many GPU's for acceleration and display out as anyone could want.  IT would be great for anyone who wants to virtualize for the sake of security and privacy.  You know having a linux environment for work.  A separate one for dealing with their money and banking.  Then a Windows environment for gaming and entertainment.  With 16 cores one could devote 4 cores to 3 VM's at once, and have 4 left over for the hypervisor or KVM.  With threadripper each could have a GPU devoted to it. 

 

What other use cases are there for a threadripper? 

[YoungBlade]

The main reasons for such a CPU is for those who need lots of PCIe lanes or tons of memory bandwidth, but don't need high core counts. It lets you get on a platform that supports that without spending a ton for a 64 core.

[Agall]

7 minutes ago, Uttamattamakin said:

Lots of leaks about threadripper pro 7000's and we are deep in the "mainstream is basically HEDT now cope.  The highest end mainstream component is 16 cores.  Does a threadripper at the same core count make sense? 

https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-threadripper-7000-cpu-16-cores-up-to-5-2-ghz-clocks-benchmark-leak/

The one thing I can't imagine threadripper would have built in is any sort of IGP ... but would have the capacity to have as many GPU's for acceleration and display out as anyone could want.  IT would be great for anyone who wants to virtualize for the sake of security and privacy.  You know having a linux environment for work.  A separate one for dealing with their money and banking.  Then a Windows environment for gaming and entertainment.  With 16 cores one could devote 4 cores to 3 VM's at once, and have 4 left over for the hypervisor or KVM.  With threadripper each could have a GPU devoted to it. 

 

What other use cases are there for a threadripper? 

 

2 minutes ago, YoungBlade said:

The main reasons for such a CPU is for those who need lots of PCIe lanes or tons of memory bandwidth, but don't need high core counts. It lets you get on a platform that supports that without spending a ton for a 64 core.

 

As well as better ECC support. There's also something to be said about the lower heat flux of the TR4 size substrate that the AM5 substrate doesn't get.

 

A scenario I can think of where this is similar being the i7 4770k vs i7 4820k, being consumer vs HEDT. Though there was architectural and cache differences, on top of memory controllers, PCIe, etc. I ended up going with the 4820k at the time because I was planning on running SLI.

[Uttamattamakin]

46 minutes ago, YoungBlade said:

The main reasons for such a CPU is for those who need lots of PCIe lanes or tons of memory bandwidth, but don't need high core counts. It lets you get on a platform that supports that without spending a ton for a 64 core.

True I can see that.  Get a foot on the HEDT platform.  Then gradually upgrade to a higher core count OR a newer core (at least once right.  At least once right?) without having the shell out.  Build a computer that will be a monster even in 8 years. 

[YoungBlade]

22 minutes ago, Uttamattamakin said:

True I can see that.  Get a foot on the HEDT platform.  Then gradually upgrade to a higher core count OR a newer core (at least once right.  At least once right?) without having the shell out.  Build a computer that will be a monster even in 8 years. 

I was more talking about a purpose built system for a specific use case.

 

Let's say you're working with simulation software that can only take advantage of a handful of cores. Some simulations just can't be parallelized beyond a certain point, because they are modeling something sequential. There's just no way to split up a simulation like that across multiple threads, because further calculations entirely rely upon previous calculations. However, such simulations can involve large amounts of data.

 

Let's say that you have a simulation that can only use a few threads, but you find that it benefits from 512GB of RAM. You'd want a CPU that is as fast as possible for single-threaded workloads - so a modern Zen 4 CPU makes sense - but you need more than the max 192GB supported by AM5.

 

In that case, a Threadripper 7000 series system would actually be ideal - fast single-core and tons of RAM supported - but you wouldn't benefit from a higher core count CPU, so you might as well save money on that component. It's not really about an upgrade path, just building the right tool for the job at hand.

[igormp]

Summarizing what was said above: it's useful as a cheap CPU for cases where you don't need many cores, but still need many PCIe devices or just need more than the 192GB that's available on AM5 (you should be able to do 1tb+ on TR Pro).

[Blue4130]

On 8/22/2023 at 12:09 AM, Uttamattamakin said:

Lots of leaks about threadripper pro 7000's and we are deep in the "mainstream is basically HEDT now cope.  The highest end mainstream component is 16 cores.  Does a threadripper at the same core count make sense? 

https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-threadripper-7000-cpu-16-cores-up-to-5-2-ghz-clocks-benchmark-leak/

The one thing I can't imagine threadripper would have built in is any sort of IGP ... but would have the capacity to have as many GPU's for acceleration and display out as anyone could want.  IT would be great for anyone who wants to virtualize for the sake of security and privacy.  You know having a linux environment for work.  A separate one for dealing with their money and banking.  Then a Windows environment for gaming and entertainment.  With 16 cores one could devote 4 cores to 3 VM's at once, and have 4 left over for the hypervisor or KVM.  With threadripper each could have a GPU devoted to it. 

 

What other use cases are there for a threadripper? 

I'd love one for my main workstation. All of that PCIe would be great for u.2 storage.

[Uttamattamakin]

11 hours ago, Blue4130 said:

I'd love one for my main workstation. All of that PCIe would be great for u.2 storage.

I know.  The real allure of it beyond the potential for an insane core count down the line is being able to expand the system.  What I'd really like is to have a platform where I can use all the slots and all of the ports included at their full capability.  No "if you use this lot then this port will work slower / not work because they share bandwidth" nonsense. 

What I really want might be more available in a threadripper PRO but the pro tax is huge.  I'd be willing to pay that if this new generation of Threadripper PRO includes motherboards with 2 or more fully usable Thunderbolt 4 ports.  Even if it needs an add in card to do it.  As long as every other card can get full fat 16 lane PCI-E.  I could use a 15 year mortgage to pay for that, but such a computer would be usable for 15-20 years. 

[Blue4130]

3 hours ago, Uttamattamakin said:

I know.  The real allure of it beyond the potential for an insane core count down the line is being able to expand the system.  What I'd really like is to have a platform where I can use all the slots and all of the ports included at their full capability.  No "if you use this lot then this port will work slower / not work because they share bandwidth" nonsense. 

What I really want might be more available in a threadripper PRO but the pro tax is huge.  I'd be willing to pay that if this new generation of Threadripper PRO includes motherboards with 2 or more fully usable Thunderbolt 4 ports.  Even if it needs an add in card to do it.  As long as every other card can get full fat 16 lane PCI-E.  I could use a 15 year mortgage to pay for that, but such a computer would be usable for 15-20 years. 

That's one draw of epyc and h12ssl combo. 7 slots of full x16, no exceptions. The downside is clock speeds are low for workstation use.

[jaslion]

On 8/21/2023 at 7:40 PM, YoungBlade said:

Let's say you're working with simulation software that can only take advantage of a handful of cores. Some simulations just can't be parallelized beyond a certain point, because they are modeling something sequential. There's just no way to split up a simulation like that across multiple threads, because further calculations entirely rely upon previous calculations. However, such simulations can involve large amounts of data.

It's exactly why on intels w790 platform a xeon w3 2423 exists. It's basically a i5 12400. Quite low end cpu but if you need the pcie lanes and thats about it it's plenty and a good budget option.

[Blue4130]

45 minutes ago, jaslion said:

It's exactly why on intels w790 platform a xeon w3 2423 exists. It's basically a i5 12400. Quite low end cpu but if you need the pcie lanes and thats about it it's plenty and a good budget option.

Good call. I always forget that exists. Seems like it launched with little to no fanfare.

[jaslion]

Just now, Blue4130 said:

Good call. I always forget that exists. Seems like it launched with little to no fanfare.

I mean it does only one thing well and that is be available to the diy builders and offer a bunch of lanes for less than other platforms.

 

But the moment you need a decent cpu it becomes so expensive you might as well go epyc. Or even threadripper 5000 as those are weirdly enough performance wise still matching a new cpu architecture from intel whilst being equally power efficient and costing less for the higher tier parts.

[Blue4130]

1 hour ago, jaslion said:

I mean it does only one thing well and that is be available to the diy builders and offer a bunch of lanes for less than other platforms.

 

But the moment you need a decent cpu it becomes so expensive you might as well go epyc. Or even threadripper 5000 as those are weirdly enough performance wise still matching a new cpu architecture from intel whilst being equally power efficient and costing less for the higher tier parts.

After looking, I can't even find it for sale. Released, but not really released?

[jaslion]

3 minutes ago, Blue4130 said:

After looking, I can't even find it for sale. Released, but not really released?

https://www.amazon.com/ASUS-Pro-WS-Motherboard-Server-Grade/dp/B0BZGGW2JP

 

The xeons are a bit weird rn as you can buy them but they are very hard to get for consumers.

[Blue4130]

52 minutes ago, jaslion said:

https://www.amazon.com/ASUS-Pro-WS-Motherboard-Server-Grade/dp/B0BZGGW2JP

 

The xeons are a bit weird rn as you can buy them but they are very hard to get for consumers.

Ye, the boards are easy to get, and the higher core count xeons are available. But the low end are not sold retail and even are hard to be found from dell/hpe etc.

 

Spoke too soon. HPE has the 2425

[jaslion]

2 minutes ago, Blue4130 said:

Ye, the boards are easy to get, and the higher core count xeons are available. But the low end are not sold retail and even are hard to be found from dell/hpe etc.

Got a couple local shops that sell em for 530€ here but yeah hard to get

[Uttamattamakin]

16 hours ago, jaslion said:

It's exactly why on intels w790 platform a xeon w3 2423 exists. It's basically a i5 12400. Quite low end cpu but if you need the pcie lanes and thats about it it's plenty and a good budget option.

My use case being Linux KVM virtualization and Nvidia GPU passthrough to  Windows and /or linux VM's for calculations and gaming.   That or trying to really use Qubes OS and get that level of insane security.

The key thing my current computers limited PCIE Lanes does not allow is passing through every slot.  Both of my PCIE X16 slots are their own IOMMU group.  The rest share bandwidth and slots are PICE x1 or share bandwith with an NVME or my TB4 ports etc.  

What really I can't do is pass through a USB controller card or other card straight to a VM without loosing one of my GPU's.    That is the one thing that threadripper level components HEDT or workstation would give me.    

IDK.  I may have the funds latter in the year to build a new system and we'll see what it looks like.  Here's hoping AMD gives us a platform where ordinary people don't need to compromise.