Madison reveals experiences working at LMG

[TrustMeBro]

How many tone-deaf jokes, product placements, and laughs can we expect as you claim to be taking it seriously?  Also, will the video be monetized again?  

 

[HesCalledTheStig]

Just now, Magnus33 said:

Taking my own advice i am done.  There too many picking sides without waiting for facts and going any further into this mess well make me feel dirty. Best advice people park the emotions step back and let the people who job it is do it . Then when the facts are known you can tar and feather the party who did the wrong whoever it maybe. Sadly this social media vigilantism is a downside of the internet and nearly always does far more harm then good.

You can pick a side and still have a decent debate. Some just don’t seem to realize that.  I hadn’t picked a side but I know where I’m leaning now. 

[kalleth]

Just now, Magnus33 said:

Taking my own advice i am done.  There too many picking sides without waiting for facts and going any further into this mess well make me feel dirty. Best advice people park the emotions step back and let the people who job it is do it . Then when the facts are known you can tar and feather the party who did the wrong whoever it maybe. Sadly this social media vigilantism is a downside of the internet and nearly always does far more harm then good.

I should just let you leave without replying, but. Those of us who have been giving LMG money every month, and are disturbed that we might have been financially supporting a company that enables abuse, are entitled to be very angry when allegations of abusive behaviour are posted. That's why emotions are running high.

 

People who are angry about this need to be rebutting toxic viewpoints in threads like this, otherwise those with more extreme views (such as -- and I'm not saying this is entirely you, although your comments earlier about the JD/AH proceeding are disturbing) will post on through and it'll appear like their views are the majority, when they're not.

[Taf the Ghost]

1 minute ago, HenrySalayne said:

There are no "deep legal issues". The only ones talking about "deep legal issues" is the self-proclaimed fanbase army, complaining about a lack of evidence and making up unfounded claims - the irony of this is rather stunning.

 

Right now one party has complained about a toxic work environment with a lack of checks and balances. The other party has started an investigation by a third party investigator. Everything else is just unfounded speculation or in most cases wishful thinking.

Part of the issue with Linus' Monday response to GN was completely missing the massive issue with how their entire internal system could have Billet Lab's Prototype end up in the charity auction, after it should have been shipped back to them over 2 weeks before.  It wasn't about the price/money.  It was about the "big picture".

 

"Deep legal issues" is real. Madison has done at least a couple of million CAD in Brand damage to LMG and some level of damage to Linus personally. Just because LMG is in internal & external review at the moment doesn't change that damage. Just because it isn't in court at this moment, doesn't mean that liability doesn't still exist. Oh, and there's also still the issue about required reporting under BC employment law for management.

[RatKnight]

Just now, HesCalledTheStig said:

You can pick a side and still have a decent debate. Some just don’t seem to realize that.  I hadn’t picked a side but I know where I’m leaning now. 

This is a fair point, I keep trying to point out that any assumptions that any of us make right now are basically based on one side of the story, and with very little other information one way or the other.

 

All anyone here is doing is grasping at straws to try to prove their, already decided, point.

 

There is no point in debating, or strawmanning, or even speculating beyond a certain point.  None of us know anything, and the people who do know something aren't going to talk about it, because doing that opens you up to all kinds of potential problems.

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, AcidBurn98 said:

I am sure you are really professional lawyer and not just pulling that out of your unwashed poop hole. Oh wait we have this beautiful thing called freedom of speech in both america and canada. So her releasing these statements is not illegal or defamatory, especially since we already have her coworkers backing her up, and a hr meeting from after her termination.

Freedom of expression in Canada comes with limits.   The bar for defamation (which can include defamation of corporations) is much lower in Canada than in the USA. 

 

I do not know whether her comments could be considered defamatory or not.   I am not certain how you came to that conclusion...perhaps you are a "really professional lawyer"?     
 

The utterly inane "HR" meeting corroborates that an employee left under bad terms.

Colin's statements corroborate that Madison expressed these same concerns while at the company.

Anything else is speculation.

[HesCalledTheStig]

1 minute ago, RatKnight said:

This is a fair point, I keep trying to point out that any assumptions that any of us make right now are basically based on one side of the story, and with very little other information one way or the other.

 

All anyone here is doing is grasping at straws to try to prove their, already decided, point.

 

There is no point in debating, or strawmanning, or even speculating beyond a certain point.  None of us know anything, and the people who do know something aren't going to talk about it, because doing that opens you up to all kinds of potential problems.

Yep. And I’m guilty of it as well. I’m here more for the updates now. Reddit is just too toxic for me

[fade]

1 hour ago, kewtz said:

The people that are throwing shade at Madison's allegations with zero knowledge or involvement with her alleged experience are part of the problem.

 

The allegations are serious. It's not your job to play internet lawyer. It's also not your job to defend LTT in this situation.

Blind loyalty for a situation like this is toxic. You're not going to get an internet badge for sticking up for a company that allegedly treated a human-being less than human.

 

This thread is disappointing. Our cohesive message should be:

 

• We hope the allegations are not true.
• If the allegations are true, they should be taken seriously.
• If the allegations are true, involved parties must be held accountable.

 

Seriously...this is a basically for geeky gamer hardware and people are asking for evidence as if this is a court of law and the case is being tried right now.  Nobody here is trying to throw anyone in LTT at jail for sexual assault nor does anyone here have the power to.  We are disseminating the information as we receive it.

[RatKnight]

Just now, HesCalledTheStig said:

Yep. And I’m guilty of it as well. I’m here more for the updates now. Reddit is just too toxic for me

Reddit has gone full mob mode.  The pitchforks and torches have been out for days, but I think a lot of that is an influx of people who have never been, and will not be after, part of the community.  A lot of folks are professionally offended.

 

Before this, I didn't post much here, but I lurked since 2020.  A lot of 0 day old accounts posting either fanboying for or attacking LMG.

 

The sad truth is that regardless of what the truth is, most people have already dug in their heals and decided what they want to believe.

[robrobbierobertson]

3 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Part of the issue with Linus' Monday response to GN was completely missing the massive issue with how their entire internal system could have Billet Lab's Prototype end up in the charity auction, after it should have been shipped back to them over 2 weeks before.  It wasn't about the price/money.  It was about the "big picture".

He came out later and said the person who was supposed to send it back was on a 2 week vacation. Why the fuck didn't he say that in the first place?
The smarter way to handle this would have been a long video addressing every step of how things went wrong in EXCRUCIATING detail. There wouldn't be any speculation or debate. Then the lay-man can see where the chain of custody got screwed up and what could be done to fix the issue.

Instead we got a typical Linus response.

 

[sc3liu]

4 hours ago, ProbablyNotFidel said:

You're assuming third party investigators don't need to uphold credibility in order to stay in business. If their findings are unbelievable, what's the point of hiring them?

 

Its akin to business audits. We and/or our customers pay the auditor to come in and audit our processes. They have to work with us professionally, but their job is to find deficiencies and give guidance on what needs to change. If they just give you a check mark and then someone else comes in and says our systems are junk. How does that reflect on the first auditor? 

That’s a very idealistic (and naïve) point of view. Of course we would hope these investigators care about their reputation too much to be biased on their verdicts. In reality if you were accused of a problematic behaviour what kind of investigators are you going to hire? The ones that are known to spell the truth regardless whether it hurts their paying client, or the ones that protect their customers’ interests? You’re right that this is similar to business audits, and look at how many scandals we’ve seen from the Big Four? External investigators are in a race to the bottom, until someone gets caught red-handed.

[RatKnight]

Just now, sc3liu said:

That’s a very idealistic (and naïve) point of view. Of course we would hope these investigators care about their reputation too much to be biased on their verdicts. In reality if you were accused of a problematic behaviour what kind of investigators are you going to hire? The ones that are known to spell the truth regardless whether it hurts their paying client, or the ones that protect their customers’ interests? You’re right that this is similar to business audits, and look at how many scandals we’ve seen from the Big Four? External investigators are in a race to the bottom, until someone gets caught red-handed.

At least in my line of work, professional, 3rd party, investigators are step 1 in trying to determine if there is legal liability.  The reports generated are used to correct policies, and decide if it is worth, say, fighting something in court, or if you should just settle.

 

Basically, they are used as a way to identify issues, and possible fixes for those issues, before deciding anything else.  This means that it is in the companies best interest to have an impartial, 3rd party review that is honest.

[kalleth]

2 minutes ago, RatKnight said:

Reddit has gone full mob mode.  The pitchforks and torches have been out for days, but I think a lot of that is an influx of people who have never been, and will not be after, part of the community.  A lot of folks are professionally offended.

 

Before this, I didn't post much here, but I lurked since 2020.  A lot of 0 day old accounts posting either fanboying for or attacking LMG.

 

The sad truth is that regardless of what the truth is, most people have already dug in their heals and decided what they want to believe.

~Half of reddit is really angry that a company they've been supporting could treat other human beings this way. The other ~half of reddit is a toxic cesspool of misogyny.

[RatKnight]

Just now, kalleth said:

~Half of reddit is really angry that a company they've been supporting could treat other human beings this way. The other ~half of reddit is a toxic cesspool of misogyny.

That is... a viewpoint that definitely isn't at all biased or tainted.  This is exactly my point that people have just decided to take a side, with no other information then what is available.

 

Part of it is certainly misogyny, is it HALF? No.  I do not, however think that saying "we should wait for the report" or pointing out flaws in someones accusations is that, unless they are finding flaws over something like "I guess she should have dressed better" or something..

 

I also don't think that many of the people who are really angry have ever, or will ever support LMG.  The second these things hit the front page, any remote thinking that anything being posted was "community members" is a joke.  That is not to say the community is not split, it is to say that reddit is not where I go to find the community sentiment.

 

I am in the "wait and see" camp.  I won't buy anything else from LTT, or give them any money until the report has been published, and then I will decide what I want to do from there.  There are certainly other things that could come out between now and then which may change my mind, but I am not going to speculate on those things because I am not a seer.

 

My sincere hope is that people leave all of the involved parties alone, even if that is fantasyland.

[HesCalledTheStig]

2 minutes ago, RatKnight said:

That is... a viewpoint that definitely isn't at all biased or tainted.  This is exactly my point that people have just decided to take a side, with no other information then what is available.

 

Part of it is certainly misogyny, is it HALF? No.  I do not, however think that saying "we should wait for the report" or pointing out flaws in someones accusations is that, unless they are finding flaws over something like "I guess she should have dressed better" or something..

 

I also don't think that many of the people who are really angry have ever, or will ever support LMG.  The second these things hit the front page, any remote thinking that anything being posted was "community members" is a joke.  That is not to say the community is not split, it is to say that reddit is not where I go to find the community sentiment.

 

I am in the "wait and see" camp.  I won't buy anything else from LTT, or give them any money until the report has been published, and then I will decide what I want to do from there.  There are certainly other things that could come out between now and then which may change my mind, but I am not going to speculate on those things because I am not a seer.

 

My sincere hope is that people leave all of the involved parties alone, even if that is fantasyland.

That is exactly where I stand right now. But it seems the more information that comes out, the more I’m leaning away from LMG. I’m not going to be one of those people that is going to completely boycott them but, they need to do a lot of housecleaning before they ever have my business again.
 

That’s if it turns out to all be true.

[kalleth]

Just now, RatKnight said:

That is... a viewpoint that definitely isn't at all biased or tainted.  This is exactly my point that people have just decided to take a side, with no other information then what is available.

 

Part of it is certainly misogyny, is it HALF? No.  I do not, however think that saying "we should wait for the report" or pointing out flaws in someones accusations is that, unless they are finding flaws over something like "I guess she should have dressed better" or something..

 

I also don't think that many of the people who are really angry have ever, or will ever support LMG.  The second these things hit the front page, any remote thinking that anything being posted was "community members" is a joke.  That is not to say the community is not split, it is to say that reddit is not where I go to find the community sentiment.

 

I am in the "wait and see" camp.  I won't buy anything else from LTT, or give them any money until the report has been published, and then I will decide what I want to do from there.  There are certainly other things that could come out between now and then which may change my mind, but I am not going to speculate on those things because I am not a seer.

 

My sincere hope is that people leave all of the involved parties alone, even if that is fantasyland.

It's a viewpoint informed by looking at the top and bottom of the comments of the relevant posts that went viral on reddit, combined with being a human being, who works in tech, and understands some of these issues, as much as a 30-something man can. "Half" was an approximation, but it's a pretty close one.

 

I'm angry, and I've had a floatplane subscription since 2018.

 

[RatKnight]

Just now, HesCalledTheStig said:

That is exactly where I stand right now. But it seems the more information that comes out, the more I’m leaning away from LMG. I’m not going to be one of those people that is going to completely boycott them but, they need to do a lot of housecleaning before they ever have my business again.
 

That’s if it turns out to all be true.

Yeah, Emily's comment definitely moved me more towards the "There is probably a fire here".  I, however am not a big fan of the social justice via social media stuff.  I will make my decision one way or the other when there is more information.

[RatKnight]

3 minutes ago, kalleth said:

It's a viewpoint informed by looking at the top and bottom of the comments of the relevant posts that went viral on reddit, combined with being a human being, who works in tech, and understands some of these issues, as much as a 30-something man can. "Half" was an approximation, but it's a pretty close one.

 

I'm angry, and I've had a floatplane subscription since 2018.

 

You are welcome to feel however you like about it.  As I said, I am not saying the community is not split.  The only thing I am trying to get across is that we have one side of a story, and the other side has shut up, and is investigating.  I have followed LTT for a long time as well, and I hope that these allegations are a misunderstanding or exaggerated... but to be clear, if they are not, and heads do not roll, I will be gone as well.  

 

I am waiting to see what comes of their internal investigations, and/or comes out in the coming days.

[HesCalledTheStig]

2 minutes ago, RatKnight said:

Yeah, Emily's comment definitely moved me more towards the "There is probably a fire here".  I, however am not a big fan of the social justice via social media stuff.  I will make my decision one way or the other when there is more information.

I think LMG is moving in the right direction if they are in fact investigating the situation.  But everything is still speculation at this point  and remains to be seen.

[CrabbyDadTech]

What concerns me is it will be the usual song and dance in a "he said / she said" situation. Anyone sensible knows there are three sides to every story, "He Said / She Said / and The Truth" - Somewhere in the middle of all of this is the truth, but because Madison has clearly admitted to some mental health challenges she will be minimized as a woman, all the while Linus had a crying public meltdown on webcam, he will be cheered for his honesty and sensitivity.... Women just don't get a fair shake in these incidents. Look at Johnny Depp vs Amber Heard. Most of the media I saw vilified Amber Heard as mentally ill and painted Johnny Depp as a victim, but if you paid attention to all the details it was clear how abusive Depp was as a narcissistic drug addict. But you know, rough childhood, so he gets a pass, she... obviously she has got to be the only crazy one there. It's not fair, and that's how Madison will be painted by the people who want to minimize her claims, while the man who clearly has a narcissistic personality disorder will get to cry victim of mean lady who just wants to tear him down out of jealousy or spite. It's the classic playbook in a fundamentally sexist society, and it will likely work. 

[HesCalledTheStig]

2 minutes ago, CrabbyDadTech said:

What concerns me is it will be the usual song and dance in a "he said / she said" situation. Anyone sensible knows there are three sides to every story, "He Said / She Said / and The Truth" - Somewhere in the middle of all of this is the truth, but because Madison has clearly admitted to some mental health challenges she will be minimized as a woman, all the while Linus had a crying public meltdown on webcam, he will be cheered for his honesty and sensitivity.... Women just don't get a fair shake in these incidents. Look at Johnny Depp vs Amber Heard. Most of the media I saw vilified Amber Heard as mentally ill and painted Johnny Depp as a victim, but if you paid attention to all the details it was clear how abusive Depp was as a narcissistic drug addict. But you know, rough childhood, so he gets a pass, she... obviously she has got to be the only crazy one there. It's not fair, and that's how Madison will be painted by the people who want to minimize her claims, while the man who clearly has a narcissistic personality disorder will get to cry victim of mean lady who just wants to tear him down out of jealousy or spite. It's the classic playbook in a fundamentally sexist society, and it will likely work. 

I don’t believe this to be correct at all. I think Madison has the upper hand here. And rightly so if her allegations are true.

[CrabbyDadTech]

Just now, HesCalledTheStig said:

I don’t believe this to be correct at all. I think Madison has the upper hand here. And rightly so if her allegations are true.

I hope you are correct 

[Taf the Ghost]

4 minutes ago, CrabbyDadTech said:

What concerns me is it will be the usual song and dance in a "he said / she said" situation. Anyone sensible knows there are three sides to every story, "He Said / She Said / and The Truth" - Somewhere in the middle of all of this is the truth, but because Madison has clearly admitted to some mental health challenges she will be minimized as a woman, all the while Linus had a crying public meltdown on webcam, he will be cheered for his honesty and sensitivity.... Women just don't get a fair shake in these incidents. Look at Johnny Depp vs Amber Heard. Most of the media I saw vilified Amber Heard as mentally ill and painted Johnny Depp as a victim, but if you paid attention to all the details it was clear how abusive Depp was as a narcissistic drug addict. But you know, rough childhood, so he gets a pass, she... obviously she has got to be the only crazy one there. It's not fair, and that's how Madison will be painted by the people who want to minimize her claims, while the man who clearly has a narcissistic personality disorder will get to cry victim of mean lady who just wants to tear him down out of jealousy or spite. It's the classic playbook in a fundamentally sexist society, and it will likely work. 

Aside from being off topic, the stuff about Depp / Hurd is objectively false.

[CrabbyDadTech]

3 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Aside from being off topic, the stuff about Depp / Hurd is objectively false.

I'd argue on topic because it compares a media "He said / She said" incident in regard to claims of abuse. To me, both those parties were abusive, but Depp gets a pass as a guy. Guys can be mentally ill, I mean, he is just a rowdy rock star that had a bad childhood you know?? Lady shows a hint of mental illness (and I'm not saying she wasn't awful too) but if she does, she is characterized as full out insane. I could give several other relevant examples, but that isn't important, what I'm saying is that is my concern for Madison, that she admitted to some mental health struggles her claims will be minimized. 

[ReallyThough]

To start, sorry for the upcoming wall of text, but keep in mind my point of view on these situations have been formed
from my own experiences simliar to what Madison is describing.

As someone who has experienced this myself and witnessed it happening to other people, I have to take this story
with a huge grain of salt.

I have witnessed female and male coworkers abuse he said/she said allegations to get what they want way too
many times.

Examples would be a female coworker when I was in college. She disliked the work we did and as long as no one was
watching, would basically do nothing and study or do homework (both things against employement agreement).
At some point she got into an argument with the manager about this very topic, indicating that the rules don't apply
to them for whatever reason and when she didn't get what she wanted she escalated to the person who ran the business.

When she still didn't get what she wanted and was told to go back to work and to stop doing school work during work hours,
she ignored this and eventually got fired.

A few weeks later the manager was escorted out of the building under allegations of sexual misconduct and assault.

Big surprise for me as I was the only one who knew he was gay, and found this particular female repulsive in both looks and
personality and would do everything to not be physically around them. Upper management ignored this as it was out of their hands
at that point.

3 years this person waited for their court date, and on the day of their court date, the ex employee told the judge
that they decided not to go through with it and that they had lied. She apologized to her manager for what happened as her
mother pushed her to make these allegations.

Nothing happened to either of these people, the manager was unable to get any good employement after that, even though
the case was dropped, and there were 0 ramifications for the female employee.

Another instance of a place I worked at, they hired me and a women (we were both around 20 at the time).
We worked together and got along well. That includes flirting and innapropriate for workplace comments and touching.
Never went further than light flirting and gentle tickles or putting an arm around shoulders etc.

The issue wasn't with me but the owner. He was an old fellow, probably close to 60, and she would flirt with him
constantly. She would sit in his lap and it was obvious he was enjoying the attention. His wife had been passed away for
20ish years and he never got together with someone else.

At some point, their inter office banter changed. I noticed that she was getting lazy and just screwing around all shift,
and it wasn't ever busy so I could easliy keep myself busy picking up her slack.
The owner didn't like this and made a comment about it and how he wanted to see us both working equally hard.

She did not like this and got into an argument about how she works just as hard as I do etc.
The next few days were awkward silence etc.

Then she left and a few days later the police came to speak to us.
I got interviewed and asked questions about the work place and my interactions with the ex employee.
It was freaking nerve wracking as I had been flirting with this person and worried that I was going to get in trouble.
She had made allegations that the owner would flirt with her and say innapropriate things (he did but she had set the bar for their interactions).
and they made her feel uncomfortable and he would touch her innaproprietly.
I just explained truthfully the things I witnessed myself and that was that, we never heard back from them or the ex employee and I left
soon after that. The owner was never the same after that, he didn't joke or smile, and people had obviously heard about
the police and allegations etc. And even though nothing happened, his rep was destroyed and he lost business and eventually retired.

The last time I witnessed something similar to this was a male employee who liked to joke innapropriately with his female
manager.
They would have fun one upping each other in who could say the most awful thing, usually sexual in nature. They would have frank conversations
about their dating life etc. They were truly what I would consider "bros".
At some point something changed and he accused her of assaulting him and touching him without his consent.
Like my other experiences, this was not a black and white situation where both parties participated in innparopriate talk/behaviour for an office
location, but in this case it didn't matter, manager was fired.

Now I have also had conversations with friends who've been on the receiving end of absolute sexaul assualt at work places,
where the situations were pretty straight up black and white, so I know it happens.

But in this case, I hope that Madison is being completely honest here in describing what happened, because
engaging in conversations where you indicate that certain topics are ok with you, then turning around and saying they were innapropriate is NOT ok.
And I've seen people have their lives unfairly ruined because of this.

If what she said is true, then people need to be fired at LMG, and potential criminal charges for assault, that's not ok.