Is it worth to buy a PS5 today?

[Ertman]

10 hours ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

They could have increased the power budget last gen and put a halfway competent cpu instead of something that clocked at 1.6GHz but they cheaped out.

I am not even saying my opinion couldn’t be wrong, but You’re really dug in here, and I don’t know of why. I have already tried to explain how that’s not “cheaping out”. Either you don’t understand or are too invested in an opinion which you can’t substantiate beyond repeatedly saying of “they cheaped out”. 

[SteveGrabowski0]

12 minutes ago, Ertman said:

I am not even saying my opinion couldn’t be wrong, but You’re really dug in here, and I don’t know of why. I have already tried to explain how that’s not “cheaping out”. Either you don’t understand or are too invested in an opinion which you can’t substantiate beyond repeatedly saying of “they cheaped out”. 

You're just making circular arguments about hitting a budget for why they didn't cheap out. The cpu in last gen consoles was trash and bottlenecked the systems, especially the mid gen refreshes, hard.

[Ertman]

10 hours ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

You're just making circular arguments about hitting a budget for why they didn't cheap out. The cpu in last gen consoles was trash and bottlenecked the systems, especially the mid gen refreshes, hard.

At least  I am positing an argument, you just keep saying “cheap out” like a broken record, like it has any meaning. The very least you could do is provide anything substantive to support your point. It’s also weird to call product development budgeting a circular argument, it demonstrates a real lack of understanding  and maturity.

 

I would agree that the CPUs were trash, never argued otherwise,  and it being trash does not contradict anything I have stated. Although I wonder how much the low power many core CPUs in console helped push towards an increase in multithreaded games.

[SteveGrabowski0]

3 hours ago, Ertman said:

At least  I am positing an argument, you just keep saying “cheap out” like a broken record, like it has any meaning. The very least you could do is provide anything substantive to support your point. It’s also weird to call product development budgeting a circular argument, it demonstrates a real lack of understanding  and maturity.

 

I would agree that the CPUs were trash, never argued otherwise,  and it being trash does not contradict anything I have stated. Although I wonder how much the low power many core CPUs in console helped push towards an increase in multithreaded games.

I don't see what's so hard to see about this. They were willing to make their system a loss leader this gen to get a decent cpu and good gpu in their system this time around even though it cost them more on not only the SOC but also the power supply, cooling, and case. They weren't last gen, hence the cheaping out comment. You seem to think it's set in stone that they had to go with a mobile low power cpu when they could have upped the power budget and had a cpu that wasn't stuck at 30 fps in almost all AAA games.

[Ertman]

5 hours ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

I don't see what's so hard to see about this. They were willing to make their system a loss leader this gen to get a decent cpu and good gpu in their system this time around even though it cost them more on not only the SOC but also the power supply, cooling, and case. They weren't last gen, hence the cheaping out comment. You seem to think it's set in stone that they had to go with a mobile low power cpu when they could have upped the power budget and had a cpu that wasn't stuck at 30 fps in almost all AAA games.

This has already been addressed, multiple times. Nothing you say is hard together,  its just either repetitive without substantiation, factually incorrect,  makes little difference or is irrelevant. Its fascinating that you think that what you are saying is hard to understand. I think you have demonstrated that are you are not discussing this in good faith.

 

All that was asked of you was to illustrate how spending $50-80 more will net the PS4 vastly superior performance in the CPU and GPU (as you complained about both), while keeping the power budget below 220 watts (around a 50% boost). Please provide hypothetical examples. Also remember, higher power consumption will also affect cooling design, and the PS4 was inadequate for for the 150watts of draw so that will need to factored in.

 

My argument was that both consoles were a compromise to keep costs from ballooing out of control and to hit power target while being limited by the hardware offerings at the time. I could see the less IPC efficient Piledriver being used instead with 2-4 substantially underclocked cores, but you could easily run into power and thermal issues. The Piledriver chip would rely less on the multithreaded approach which was not easy to implement so it might have been a better performer, just not by much.

[SteveGrabowski0]

5 hours ago, Ertman said:

This has already been addressed, multiple times. Nothing you say is hard together,  its just either repetitive without substantiation, factually incorrect,  makes little difference or is irrelevant. Its fascinating that you think that what you are saying is hard to understand. I think you have demonstrated that are you are not discussing this in good faith.

 

All that was asked of you was to illustrate how spending $50-80 more will net the PS4 vastly superior performance in the CPU and GPU (as you complained about both), while keeping the power budget below 220 watts (around a 50% boost). Please provide hypothetical examples. Also remember, higher power consumption will also affect cooling design, and the PS4 was inadequate for for the 150watts of draw so that will need to factored in.

 

My argument was that both consoles were a compromise to keep costs from ballooing out of control and to hit power target while being limited by the hardware offerings at the time. I could see the less IPC efficient Piledriver being used instead with 2-4 substantially underclocked cores, but you could easily run into power and thermal issues. The Piledriver chip would rely less on the multithreaded approach which was not easy to implement so it might have been a better performer, just not by much.

Why are you insisting you'd need 2-4 underclocked FX cores to fit into a console power envelope? FX-6300 was a 95W chip and could have been made a little more efficient on 28nm while the gpu was like an HD 7970M that was a 100W card. Why would that have been impossible to put on an SOC when the PS5 SOC is roughly a combination of the 65W Ryzen 7 3700X and a 175W RX 6700? Not to mention PS4 having another serious cost advantage of using a cheap hard drive instead of an at the time of PS5 launch a pretty expensive PCIE-4.0 SSD like we saw on PS5.

[Ertman]

42 minutes ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

Why are you insisting you'd need 2-4 underclocked FX cores to fit into a console power envelope? FX-6300 was a 95W chip and could have been made a little more efficient on 28nm while the gpu was like an HD 7970M that was a 100W card. Why would that have been impossible to put on an SOC when the PS5 SOC is roughly a combination of the 65W Ryzen 7 3700X and a 175W RX 6700? Not to mention PS4 having another serious cost advantage of using a cheap hard drive instead of an at the time of PS5 launch a pretty expensive PCIE-4.0 SSD like we saw on PS5.

Finally... not sure what that was so hard.

 

Even with that gpu, which isn't any better than the ps4, without underclocking (and/or cutting cores), the total system power consumption  will be quite a bit over the power budget.

 

The SOC manufacturing cost increases easily outweigh the ssd cost to the manufacturer, so let's call tha even. Benefits of smaller production node.

 

I am curious to why both console chose the low power cpu over the fx option, they were presented with both, I can't see the cost savings being that large? Maybe they got all glossy eyed over the 8core number?

[mcnabb100]

On 4/10/2023 at 11:57 AM, Jelt said:

Hi guys, im wondering if its worth to buy a ps5 now or just wait for the pro, im asking because now i have the money but the internet says that is possible for a pro version to be release soon, how soon you guys think it will be ?, because i want a gpu upgrade if i dont buy the ps5, im still deciding which one to choose (4070ti or amd 7900xt i think ), any recommendations will be appreciated 

I’m in a similar boat and decided to go ahead and get the ps5 ragnarok bundle. I’m in the process of updating my home theater setup and my newest console is an Xbox 360 if you don’t count my switch OLED

 

i think the PS5 is going to go a while longer before anything changes, consoles have very long lives these days.