Build advise needed

[Im-Trying]

Budget (including currency): Between €1400 and €1800

Country: The Netherlands

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Skyrim SE with a lot of mods and diverse modern AAA titles

Other details (existing parts lists, whether any peripherals are needed, what you're upgrading from, when you're going to buy, what resolution and refresh rate you want to play at, etc): 

It's a new build, so no existing parts. Current monitor is a 75hz panel.

 

Hi guys,

 

Hoping you can help me out here.

 

I need to build a new gaming rig for my girlfriend. She has been gaming on some older hardware i had laying around and has really gotten a taste for it.

The last build i did was for myself, which was 5 years ago. Back then it was quite simple, just take a curent gen i5 and spend the rest of the budget on a Nvidia GPU.

For the last couple days i have been looking around with the same mindset, but i quickly found out that a lot has changed since then.

Apparently AMD CPU's and GPU's are competitive now.

 

So my question then: what CPU/GPU combo if worth should i get and is AM5 worth it or should i go AM4 with DDR4?

 

 

[Radium_Angel]

20 minutes ago, Im-Trying said:

DDR4?

The current wisdom is that DDR5 isn't financially worth it and so on a budget, stick with DDR4

[deadlou666]

Am4 is probably best given the target games so ddr5 won't be too much of a deal. I recommend getting a 5600x for the cpu and just spend the rest on a gpu and stuff!! The Am4 socket allows for up to a 5800x3d which is extremely powerful and more than you'd need in a long time! 

[deadlou666]

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bR6GTn

 

 

For the budget a 5800x is achievable though so this should be a good build. All AMD as that's where the value is at. 

[Im-Trying]

Hi Deadlou666,

 

Appreciate the feedback.

I was looking at the 5800x and noticed that the i5-13400f is the same price here.

When comparing the 2 it looks like the i5 is slightly better.

Should i just get the i5 then?

 

What do you think?

[NekoBubbles]

11 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

The current wisdom is that DDR5 isn't financially worth it and so on a budget, stick with DDR4

Its not just wisdom but its also the fact a lot of DDR5's are often for the same GB's of ram as their DDR4 = you end up coughing up as much as an extra third of their DDR4 equivalents price. Often times thats a 100 to 150 dollar premium for the same cost as it would be to just to anyways just upgrade your DDR4 ram up another tier whether its the DDR4's speed or RAM memory.

 

DDR5 to a degree similar to the obsolete Win8 that is like windows 7's mobile addicted cousin. Atm till we get hardware that can actually utilize the extra headroom. Which we might be like a full 5 to 10 years out till game devs make the swap from DDR4 to DDR5. Cause the big issue atm for DDR5 is that its upgrade of a digit is facing the one issue of tech currently is the performance gain is a little bit plateauing. (At least for the general consumer) 

 

12 minutes ago, deadlou666 said:

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bR6GTn

 

 

For the budget a 5800x is achievable though so this should be a good build. All AMD as that's where the value is at. 

If  you go all AMD beware MAKE SURE TO GET A WELL VENTALATED CASE. Both GPU's and CPU's on AMD side while slightly more like energy efficient TDP wise they  make that up in heat...  

[Zando_]

11 minutes ago, deadlou666 said:

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bR6GTn

 

 

For the budget a 5800x is achievable though so this should be a good build. All AMD as that's where the value is at. 

Netherlands has a PCPP, use that for more accurate numbers. 

 

If you stretch to the very top of the budget and slightly over (1884 instead of 1800 flat) you can fit in an AM5 system and 4070 Ti:

PCPartPicker Part List: https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/Pzx8gb

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Motherboard: ASRock B650M PG RIPTIDE Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€179.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Memory: Kingston FURY Beast 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€149.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€184.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: Inno3D X3 GeForce RTX 4070 Ti 12 GB Video Card  (€909.00 @ Azerty) 
Case: Fractal Design Define Mini C MicroATX Mid Tower Case  (€98.85 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM650x (2021) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€118.85 @ Azerty) 
Total: €1884.54
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 21:47 CET+0100

 

Stepping down to an RX 6800 XT would put you at the 1600 euro mark, so mid-budget:

PCPartPicker Part List: https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/dsfXrD

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Motherboard: ASRock B650M PG RIPTIDE Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€179.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Memory: Kingston FURY Beast 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€149.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€184.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: PowerColor Red Dragon OC Radeon RX 6800 XT 16 GB Video Card  (€649.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Case: Fractal Design Define Mini C MicroATX Mid Tower Case  (€98.85 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM650x (2021) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€118.85 @ Azerty) 
Total: €1624.54
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 21:49 CET+0100

 

If you wanted to stick with the lower end ~1400, dropping to a 6700XT and 1TB drive will get you a bit below that: 

PCPartPicker Part List: https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/NxdyPX

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Motherboard: ASRock B650M PG RIPTIDE Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€179.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Memory: Kingston FURY Beast 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€149.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€100.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: MSI MECH 2X Radeon RX 6700 XT 12 GB Video Card  (€419.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Case: Fractal Design Define Mini C MicroATX Mid Tower Case  (€98.85 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM650x (2021) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€118.85 @ Azerty) 
Total: €1310.63
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 21:50 CET+0100

 

With that budget there's little reason to stick with a DDR4 platform. I wouldn't advise Intel 13th gen either, as the next gen of chips should require new motherboards, whereas AM5 should get at least one new gen of chips, ending up with more CPU upgrade headroom in future. Also, not sure whether Intel's P/E cores cause issues with Skyrim but that could be something to check into if you wanted to go that route. I do remember some older games had issues with them, but I never dove into the specifics. 

Just now, NekoBubbles said:

If  you go all AMD beware MAKE SURE TO GET A WELL VENTALATED CASE. Both GPU's and CPU's on AMD side while slightly more like energy efficient TDP wise they  make that up in heat...  

Not how that works. Power drawn = heat output. They run hot because they're very dense chips, not because they're actually pulling a lot of watts/outputting a lot of heat. A case with decent airflow and a good CPU cooler is enough for them. Basically just use actual intake fans and  a case that isn't a glass slab directly against the front fans and you're good. Which is most cases, as the ones that choke computers get endlessly ragged for doing so, and so larger brands tend to avoid making them if they care about their reputation. 

[PDifolco]

52 minutes ago, Im-Trying said:

Budget (including currency): Between €1400 and €1800

Country: The Netherlands

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Skyrim SE with a lot of mods and diverse modern AAA titles

Other details (existing parts lists, whether any peripherals are needed, what you're upgrading from, when you're going to buy, what resolution and refresh rate you want to play at, etc): 

It's a new build, so no existing parts. Current monitor is a 75hz panel.

 

Hi guys,

 

Hoping you can help me out here.

 

I need to build a new gaming rig for my girlfriend. She has been gaming on some older hardware i had laying around and has really gotten a taste for it.

The last build i did was for myself, which was 5 years ago. Back then it was quite simple, just take a curent gen i5 and spend the rest of the budget on a Nvidia GPU.

For the last couple days i have been looking around with the same mindset, but i quickly found out that a lot has changed since then.

Apparently AMD CPU's and GPU's are competitive now.

 

So my question then: what CPU/GPU combo if worth should i get and is AM5 worth it or should i go AM4 with DDR4?

 

 

You can get some nice rig on that budget

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D 3.4 GHz 8-Core Processor  (€344.95 @ Azerty) 
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 360 56.3 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler  (€114.85 @ Megekko) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte B550 AORUS ELITE V2 ATX AM4 Motherboard  (€148.85 @ Megekko) 
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory  (€50.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€83.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: ASRock Phantom Gaming D OC Radeon RX 6800 16 GB Video Card  (€648.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Case: Phanteks ECLIPSE G500A DRGB ATX Mid Tower Case  (€169.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM850x (2021) 850 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€169.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Total: €1732.24
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 21:57 CET+0100

 

[PcBeExpensive]

3 minutes ago, Zando_ said:

Netherlands has a PCPP, use that for more accurate numbers. 

 

If you stretch to the very top of the budget and slightly over (1884 instead of 1800 flat) you can fit in an AM5 system and 4070 Ti:

PCPartPicker Part List: https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/Pzx8gb

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Motherboard: ASRock B650M PG RIPTIDE Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€179.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Memory: Kingston FURY Beast 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€149.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€184.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: Inno3D X3 GeForce RTX 4070 Ti 12 GB Video Card  (€909.00 @ Azerty) 
Case: Fractal Design Define Mini C MicroATX Mid Tower Case  (€98.85 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM650x (2021) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€118.85 @ Azerty) 
Total: €1884.54
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 21:47 CET+0100

 

Stepping down to an RX 6800 XT would put you at the 1600 euro mark, so mid-budget:

PCPartPicker Part List: https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/dsfXrD

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Motherboard: ASRock B650M PG RIPTIDE Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€179.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Memory: Kingston FURY Beast 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€149.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€184.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: PowerColor Red Dragon OC Radeon RX 6800 XT 16 GB Video Card  (€649.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Case: Fractal Design Define Mini C MicroATX Mid Tower Case  (€98.85 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM650x (2021) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€118.85 @ Azerty) 
Total: €1624.54
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 21:49 CET+0100

 

If you wanted to stick with the lower end ~1400, dropping to a 6700XT and 1TB drive will get you a bit below that: 

PCPartPicker Part List: https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/NxdyPX

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Motherboard: ASRock B650M PG RIPTIDE Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€179.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Memory: Kingston FURY Beast 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€149.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€100.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: MSI MECH 2X Radeon RX 6700 XT 12 GB Video Card  (€419.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Case: Fractal Design Define Mini C MicroATX Mid Tower Case  (€98.85 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM650x (2021) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€118.85 @ Azerty) 
Total: €1310.63
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 21:50 CET+0100

 

With that budget there's little reason to stick with a DDR4 platform. I wouldn't advise Intel 13th gen either, as the next gen of chips should require new motherboards, whereas AM5 should get at least one new gen of chips, ending up with more CPU upgrade headroom in future. Also, not sure whether Intel's P/E cores cause issues with Skyrim but that could be something to check into if you wanted to go that route. I do remember some older games had issues with them, but I never dove into the specifics. 

Not how that works. Power drawn = heat output. They run hot because they're very dense chips, not because they're actually pulling a lot of watts/outputting a lot of heat. A case with decent airflow and a good CPU cooler is enough for them. Basically just use actual intake fans and  a case that isn't a glass slab directly against the front fans and you're good. Which is most cases, as the ones that choke computers get endlessly ragged for doing so, and so larger brands tend to avoid making them if they care about their reputation. 

7000 series AMD is not worth it. DDR5 is stupid to buy on a budget these days. DDR4 is better

[RevGAM]

28 minutes ago, deadlou666 said:

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bR6GTn

 

 

For the budget a 5800x is achievable though so this should be a good build. All AMD as that's where the value is at. 

Just curious about the GC. Why not an rx 6800 xt instead?

[Zando_]

Just now, PcBeExpensive said:

7000 series AMD is not worth it. DDR5 is stupid to buy on a budget these days. DDR4 is better

DDR4 isn't much cheaper and is slower. 7000 series is fine, more expensive than last gen stuff because duh its new, but because it's new more room to grow and it performs better. There isn't much reason in buying last gen hardware if you have the budget for new stuff, unless you're an enthusiast of that specific platform. OP didn't declare themselves an AM4 enthusiast so I'm going to guess they aren't. I already mentioned why I didn't put down Intel 13th gen as a recommendation. 

[PcBeExpensive]

1 hour ago, Im-Trying said:

Budget (including currency): Between €1400 and €1800

Country: The Netherlands

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Skyrim SE with a lot of mods and diverse modern AAA titles

Other details (existing parts lists, whether any peripherals are needed, what you're upgrading from, when you're going to buy, what resolution and refresh rate you want to play at, etc): 

It's a new build, so no existing parts. Current monitor is a 75hz panel.

 

Hi guys,

 

Hoping you can help me out here.

 

I need to build a new gaming rig for my girlfriend. She has been gaming on some older hardware i had laying around and has really gotten a taste for it.

The last build i did was for myself, which was 5 years ago. Back then it was quite simple, just take a curent gen i5 and spend the rest of the budget on a Nvidia GPU.

For the last couple days i have been looking around with the same mindset, but i quickly found out that a lot has changed since then.

Apparently AMD CPU's and GPU's are competitive now.

 

So my question then: what CPU/GPU combo if worth should i get and is AM5 worth it or should i go AM4 with DDR4?

 

 

https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/BcsdVw
This
Price is 1809
CPU: Ryzen 7 5700x
MOBO: MSI B550-A Pro
Cooler: CoolerMaster Masterliquid Ml240 RGB 
RAM: Corsair vengeance RGB pro 16g 3600 MHZ CL18
Storage: Samsung 980 Pro 1tb
GPU: MSI Radeon 6900 XT Gaming Trio 16g
Case: Deepcool Matrexx 55 Mesh ADD-RGB 4F
PSU: Corsair RM650x

[PcBeExpensive]

4 minutes ago, Zando_ said:

DDR4 isn't much cheaper and is slower. 7000 series is fine, more expensive than last gen stuff because duh its new, but because it's new more room to grow and it performs better. There isn't much reason in buying last gen hardware if you have the budget for new stuff, unless you're an enthusiast of that specific platform. OP didn't declare themselves an AM4 enthusiast so I'm going to guess they aren't. I already mentioned why I didn't put down Intel 13th gen as a recommendation. 

yes but by taking the 7000 series out you would be able to fit a 6900 XT in there. AMD 5000 series is perfectly fine.

[Zando_]

Just now, PcBeExpensive said:

yes but by taking the 7000 series out you would be able to fit a 6900 XT in there. AMD 5000 series is perfectly fine.

You made a list that's only ~80 euros less than the 4070 Ti list above, while being worse. 16GB RAM vs 32GB, 6900XT vs 4070 Ti (4070 Ti is the faster card of the 2), 1TB storage vs 2TB. Pretty sure the 7600 will match or beat the 5700X as well. Aaand looks like it does: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-ryzen-5-7600-non-x/20.html. It beats everything in 5000 series but the 5800X3D, where it'll trade blows and comes out only 1% slower overall. Considering you can slot in a 7000 series X3D chip later down the line, not really an issue. 

[RevGAM]

Power drawn != heat output. How much heat is produced, ignoring cooling,  is determined by the "wiring" and components, so quality plays a role, both in terms of the material used as well a the quality of parts.  The smaller a wire/circuit, adjusting for the quality, the greater the resistance, just like with pipes really. So, heat output is determined by the size and quality + power used. You can have tiny wiring and stay cool if the power is low enough, and you can have it overheat with large wiring and a very high draw.

 

Resistance produces heat, which reduces performance and increases power usage... so there's a bit of a degrading spiral effect. 

 

The systems suggested by @Zando_ and @PDifolcoare really good,  but I would suggest a brand other than Kingston (and PNY and Adata) because of the fraud against consumers. 

[Zando_]

1 minute ago, RevGAM said:

but I would suggest a brand other than Kingston (and PNY and Adata) because of the fraud against consumers. 

What'd they do? I didn't see any big drama state-side, wasn't aware of any fraud. Unless you mean parts swapping? That's industry norm, Samsung (and I'm sure other OEMs) has done it as well. Only an issue when it causes lower performance than advertised, which IIRC it did on some specific models in Adata's case. 

[Im-Trying]

HI guys,

 

Didn't expect my post to stir up a quite a discussion.

I would like to thank you all for the information.

 

If i could bother you one more time.

 

So my girlfriend just showed me the case she would like to buy. It's the Lian Li PC-o11 Dynamic Mini. Which is offcourse a Mini-ITX case. Oh, and she would really like to be able to have addressable RGB. Which makes it even more of a headache.

When adding the case, a SFX PSU and a Mini-ITX mobo to the list i came to €2400, which is a fair bit over budget.

 

Seeing as a 4070TI wouldn't really be necessary i was looking at the 6700 XT or 6800 XT.

But at that point i am wondering if the 7600 makes any sense.

If i downgrade to one of those GPU's does it make sense to still go for a AM5 build?

 

Here is the PCPP list.

https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/nv94fv

[PDifolco]

17 minutes ago, RevGAM said:

Power drawn != heat output. How much heat is produced, ignoring cooling,  is determined by the "wiring" and components, so quality plays a role, both in terms of the material used as well a the quality of parts.  The smaller a wire/circuit, adjusting for the quality, the greater the resistance, just like with pipes really. So, heat output is determined by the size and quality + power used. You can have tiny wiring and stay cool if the power is low enough, and you can have it overheat with large wiring and a very high draw.

 

Resistance produces heat, which reduces performance and increases power usage... so there's a bit of a degrading spiral effect. 

 

The systems suggested by @Zando_ and @PDifolcoare really good,  but I would suggest a brand other than Kingston (and PNY and Adata) because of the fraud against consumers. 

My build didn't include any Kingston/Adata/PNY, but idk why you talk about "fraud" ? If it's about the RAM single/dual rank shennanigans, *all* brands did it...

[Zando_]

6 minutes ago, Im-Trying said:

HI guys,

 

Didn't expect my post to stir up a quite a discussion.

I would like to thank you all for the information.

 

If i could bother you one more time.

 

So my girlfriend just showed me the case she would like to buy. It's the Lian Li PC-o11 Dynamic Mini. Which is offcourse a Mini-ITX case. Oh, and she would really like to be able to have addressable RGB. Which makes it even more of a headache.

When adding the case, a SFX PSU and a Mini-ITX mobo to the list i came to €2400, which is a fair bit over budget.

 

Seeing as a 4070TI wouldn't really be necessary i was looking at the 6700 XT or 6800 XT.

But at that point i am wondering if the 7600 makes any sense.

If i downgrade to one of those GPU's does it make sense to still go for a AM5 build?

 

Here is the PCPP list.

https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/nv94fv

It supports mATX and ATX:

 

You can sub in the O11, drop to a 6800XT (a 6700XT would get you even lower), and have room in the budget for some RGB fans and/or an RGB AIO or something: 

PCPartPicker Part List: https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/XM94fv

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Motherboard: ASRock B650M PG RIPTIDE Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€179.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Memory: Kingston FURY Beast 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€149.99 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€184.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: PowerColor Red Dragon OC Radeon RX 6800 XT 16 GB Video Card  (€649.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Case: Lian Li O11 Air Mini ATX Mid Tower Case  (€159.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Power Supply: Corsair RM650x (2021) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (€118.85 @ Azerty) 
Total: €1685.59
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 22:43 CET+0100

 

AM5 build still makes sense IMO, as either way you can fit it in the budget, and there's little point to limiting yourself to a 5800X3D at best. No more chips are being designed for AM4 so that's the best it'll ever get, and it's only ~1% faster in games (on average) vs the 7600, which is the lowest current AM5 SKU I know of. Everything else is faster, the 7000 series X3D chips are releasing soon, and then there should be another gen of chips on top of that if AMD stays at least competitive with Intel's standard 2-gens-per-platform trend. So once the 7600 gets long in the tooth, you drop in a top SKU chip from whatever generation is the latest for it, and bam you can get a couple more years out of the platform before needing to rebuild the whole PC. You also get a PCIe 5.0 M.2 SSD slot so yay, if DirectStorage ever does take off and PCIe 5.0 drives become available at reasonable prices, you're set . 

[RevGAM]

21 minutes ago, Zando_ said:

What'd they do? I didn't see any big drama state-side, wasn't aware of any fraud. Unless you mean parts swapping? That's industry norm, Samsung (and I'm sure other OEMs) has done it as well. Only an issue when it causes lower performance than advertised, which IIRC it did on some specific models in Adata's case. 

Didn't you see the video Linus did on the topic of those 3 companies recently? Pretty interesting. People can choose to continue to buy from companies that do this but, as I explained in another thread, that just encourages the criminals to continue to rip off consumers. I have used Kingston for decades but I'm not going to support illegal behavior, and I will actively work against them because of: (1) swapping parts for cheaper ones AFTER they receive great reviews, (2) not alerting the public about the changes, and (3) not changing the packaging to reflect the decreased specs on what is essentially a product that should have a different model number. I would be willing to bet that they do not lower the price, either, after these shenanigans.

9 minutes ago, PDifolco said:

My build didn't include any Kingston/Adata/PNY, but idk why you talk about "fraud" ? If it's about the RAM single/dual rank shennanigans, *all* brands did it...

I was not referring to your build, just Zando_'s. Sorry for the confusion.

11 minutes ago, Im-Trying said:

So my girlfriend just showed me the case she would like to buy. It's the Lian Li PC-o11 Dynamic Mini. Which is offcourse a Mini-ITX case. Oh, and she would really like to be able to have addressable RGB. Which makes it even more of a headache.

In my opinion, seeing as she's not your wife, you should suggest that she either chooses something less expensive (I know nothing about Lian Li other than that they're supposed to be good but expensive, and that's just what I've seen others write), or she should cover the difference in the price...Especially if you're not just building this but paying for it, too...Which I wouldn't recommend. Also, there are lots of other ways to uselessly prettify a case, such as LED strips, stickers, paint, etc. Heck, a creative person could probably make it look prettier with a glue gun and some macaroni, too. In the end, she's going to look at the monitor most of the time, not the waste-of-money RGB crap...But that's just how I feel and you go right ahead and do what you feel is best.

[Zando_]

1 minute ago, RevGAM said:

Didn't you see the video Linus did on the topic of those 3 companies recently?

Have not, or I wouldn't be asking. 

2 minutes ago, RevGAM said:

People can choose to continue to buy from companies that do this but, as I explained in another thread, that just encourages the criminals to continue to rip off consumers. I have used Kingston for decades but I'm not going to support illegal behavior, and I will actively work against them because of: (1) swapping parts for cheaper ones AFTER they receive great reviews, (2) not alerting the public about the changes, and (3) not changing the packaging to reflect the decreased specs on what is essentially a product that should have a different model number. I would be willing to bet that they do not lower the price, either, after these shenanigans.

Did it effect performance? I know some ADATA models it did, the rest I believe it did not. Also as said earlier, Samsung did it too (to no negative effect, thus no uproar, it was a controller swap on 970 Evo Plus models IIRC, for supply chain reasons). 

 

Again, shuffling parts seems to be an industry norm, it's only an issue if it effects advertised/reviewed performance negatively. If it's the same or better then I don't see how anyone would take issue with it. Heck, it's a commonly known thing with RAM for years now, people always recommend matched kits because companies will shuffle around RAM ICs in the same model line depending on what bins to the desired XMP profile and what's available. 

[PDifolco]

32 minutes ago, Im-Trying said:

HI guys,

 

Didn't expect my post to stir up a quite a discussion.

I would like to thank you all for the information.

 

If i could bother you one more time.

 

So my girlfriend just showed me the case she would like to buy. It's the Lian Li PC-o11 Dynamic Mini. Which is offcourse a Mini-ITX case. Oh, and she would really like to be able to have addressable RGB. Which makes it even more of a headache.

When adding the case, a SFX PSU and a Mini-ITX mobo to the list i came to €2400, which is a fair bit over budget.

 

Seeing as a 4070TI wouldn't really be necessary i was looking at the 6700 XT or 6800 XT.

But at that point i am wondering if the 7600 makes any sense.

If i downgrade to one of those GPU's does it make sense to still go for a AM5 build?

 

Here is the PCPP list.

https://nl.pcpartpicker.com/list/nv94fv

 

Mmm, sure you like her but you don't need to get the most expensive parts

Imo a 6800XT will be cheaper and quite good already

Your cooler price is just a scam! And don't mix LianLi and Corsair RGB, they use both proprietary connectors run by different softwares..

Can save a bit on RAM, board and SSD as well, then you're just below 1900EUR; to get even lower still on SFX build you can swap to 5700X and DDR4

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor  (€243.95 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
CPU Cooler: Lian Li Galahad AIO360 (2022) 69.17 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler  (€155.85 @ Alternate) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte B650M AORUS ELITE AX Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard  (€253.00 @ Azerty) 
Memory: TEAMGROUP T-Force Delta RGB 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory  (€158.23 @ Azerty) 
Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  (€83.90 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Video Card: PowerColor Red Dragon OC Radeon RX 6800 XT 16 GB Video Card  (€649.00 @ Amazon Netherlands) 
Case: Lian Li O11 Dynamic Mini ATX Mid Tower Case  (€113.85 @ Azerty) 
Power Supply: Corsair SF750 750 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply  (€212.00) 
Total: €1869.78
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-07 23:14 CET+0100

 

 

[RevGAM]

15 hours ago, Zando_ said:

Have not, or I wouldn't be asking. 

Did it effect performance? I know some ADATA models it did, the rest I believe it did not. Also as said earlier, Samsung did it too (to no negative effect, thus no uproar, it was a controller swap on 970 Evo Plus models IIRC, for supply chain reasons). 

 

Again, shuffling parts seems to be an industry norm, it's only an issue if it effects advertised/reviewed performance negatively. If it's the same or better then I don't see how anyone would take issue with it. Heck, it's a commonly known thing with RAM for years now, people always recommend matched kits because companies will shuffle around RAM ICs in the same model line depending on what bins to the desired XMP profile and what's available. 

So, what I got from the video is that those companies went for cheaper parts after getting great reviews, resulting in a decrease in the specs. We're the changes big? Probably not.  They didn't tell the public or correct the packaging, etc to show the reduced specs.  I don't care if a company has to find different parts because of the supply chain, or to save money while maintaining the quality and specs,  that's just part of doing business. But this behavior is fraudulent, potentially like what Gateway did.  If your specs change, you should alert consumers and change the model #. Does that make sense?

[RevGAM]

@PDifolcojust gave you another great build. 

[Zando_]

4 hours ago, RevGAM said:

So, what I got from the video is that those companies went for cheaper parts after getting great reviews, resulting in a decrease in the specs. We're the changes big? Probably not.  They didn't tell the public or correct the packaging, etc to show the reduced specs.  I don't care if a company has to find different parts because of the supply chain, or to save money while maintaining the quality and specs,  that's just part of doing business. But this behavior is fraudulent, potentially like what Gateway did.  If your specs change, you should alert consumers and change the model #. Does that make sense?

Again. Standard practice. The companies you listed are not the only ones to do so. Only if it effects actual performance does it matter. It would be nice if they'd put a revision # to denote hardware changes, but they don't. I don't care if you personally dislike the company due to what's perceived as an offense against consumers. Every companies offends consumers to make a buck, unless there's an actual effect to the product then each person can pick for themselves which company they'll harbor a grudge against. I have personal grievances with companies too, I do my best to not clutter my hardware advice with those opinions unless they're actually relevant. For example, I don't like AMD. And especially don't like AMD GPUs as I have personally had a rough time with their drivers. But it's what makes the most sense for OP, so thus my recommendation is AMD CPU, and either a 4070 Ti or AMD GPUs due to their price/performance.