household media nas

[leonardmartin29]

im looking for around 15-20tb. nas. easy to setup. must be ssd not hdd!!!!!!!!!! idc dont argue please. i have 3 computers in the house 2 htpc and 1 gaming

[SupaKomputa]

14 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

must be ssd not hdd!!!!!!!!!! idc dont argue please.

SSD for home nas is stupid. ask nicely.

[leonardmartin29]

2 minutes ago, SupaKomputa said:

SSD for home nas is stupid. ask nicely.

i thought i was asking nicely

[Blue4130]

26 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

im looking for around 15-20tb. nas. easy to setup. must be ssd not hdd!!!!!!!!!! idc dont argue please. i have 3 computers in the house 2 htpc and 1 gaming

If you want easy, a Synology 1621 with 6x 4tb sata ssds. Hope you have deep pockets.

[BondiBlue]

33 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

must be ssd not hdd

I'm not going to argue with you on this (it's your money, spend however much of it you want), but I would like to ask why you want to use SSDs in a NAS setup. What connection speeds are you planning to have for each of the clients? 10Gb/s? If it's gigabit you're almost certainly just wasting your money. Also, what services do you need this NAS to handle? Just file sharing? Plex? Something else?

 

A mechanical hard drive setup would give you much more capacity per dollar without sacrificing much speed if you just have a gigabit network. I have a 48TB array (four 12TB mechanical drives) that can achieve sequential speeds that are multiple times faster than what my gigabit network can manage. The drives alone cost me less than the price of three decent 2TB SSDs. Just want to throw that out there in case you'd like to get more storage for your money. Obviously SSDs would be more sensible if you have a faster network, but you didn't specify. 

[leonardmartin29]

11 minutes ago, BondiBlue said:

I'm not going to argue with you on this (it's your money, spend however much of it you want), but I would like to ask why you want to use SSDs in a NAS setup. What connection speeds are you planning to have for each of the clients? 10Gb/s? If it's gigabit you're almost certainly just wasting your money. Also, what services do you need this NAS to handle? Just file sharing? Plex? Something else?

 

A mechanical hard drive setup would give you much more capacity per dollar without sacrificing much speed if you just have a gigabit network. I have a 48TB array (four 12TB mechanical drives) that can achieve sequential speeds that are multiple times faster than what my gigabit network can manage. Just want to throw that out there in case you'd like to get more storage for your money. Obviously SSDs would be more sensible if you have a faster network, but you didn't specify. 

i am totally rebuilding a house infrastructure. network room etc. installing 10gb switch throughout the house. so people will be able to plug in in every room. there will be 3 pc that are being built that will constantly be used by various people in the household for various tasks, including gaming, movies, school work, everything you name it. 2 of the pc's are hooked to 2 75" tv's another is hooked to a 32" monitor. the house is being wired with cat6a. i have not yet choosen a switch. i want pure speed for multiple users at a time. im willing to pay 30k-40k for it thats not a problem. i have even thought about going nvme m.2 nas but people thought that was even more rediculous. seems like this site is for poor people or budget conscientious people. 

as for things i will be doing with it. i do some video editing of family events and stuff long videos, lots of data. i like to transfer them fast when i have to im very impatient. also movies, game files,  if you could recommend a high quality 10gb switch that would be great. i need at least 15 ports

[BondiBlue]

Just now, leonardmartin29 said:

im willing to pay 30k-40k for it thats not a problem.

Oh. Well, if you can afford it then why not go for an all SSD setup lol? 

 

1 minute ago, leonardmartin29 said:

i have even thought about going nvme m.2 nas but people thought that was even more rediculous. seems like this site is for poor people or budget conscientious people. 

Yes, a lot of people here simply wouldn't be able to drop that kind of money on something as simple as a NAS. I know I sure as hell can't. Still, even if you do have that kind of money to blow you really wouldn't be getting much of an advantage with an NVMe based setup vs. a good SATA setup. You could absolutely do it, but that's a ton of money to spend on drives for a server IMHO. 

[Electronics Wizardy]

4 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

i am totally rebuilding a house infrastructure. network room etc. installing 10gb switch throughout the house. so people will be able to plug in in every room. there will be 3 pc that are being built that will constantly be used by various people in the household for various tasks, including gaming, movies, school work, everything you name it. 2 of the pc's are hooked to 2 75" tv's another is hooked to a 32" monitor. the house is being wired with cat6a. i have not yet choosen a switch. i want pure speed for multiple users at a time. im willing to pay 30k-40k for it thats not a problem. i have even thought about going nvme m.2 nas but people thought that was even more rediculous. seems like this site is for poor people or budget conscientious people. 

as for things i will be doing with it. i do some video editing of family events and stuff long videos, lots of data. i like to transfer them fast when i have to im very impatient. also movies, game files,  if you could recommend a high quality 10gb switch that would be great. i need at least 15 ports

Do you want DIY or premade? rackmount or tower?

 

Probably go synology if premade, pretty good systems, and easy to use os.

 

For the switch, what 10gbe standard are you using? 10gbe base-t? Probaby get the netgear 24port 10gbe switches, but there aren't silent if thats a issue.

[leonardmartin29]

Just now, BondiBlue said:

Oh. Well, if you can afford it then why not go for an all SSD setup lol? 

 

Yes, a lot of people here simply wouldn't be able to drop that kind of money on something as simple as a NAS. I know I sure as hell can't. Still, even if you do have that kind of money to blow you really wouldn't be getting much of an advantage with an NVMe based setup vs. a good SATA setup. You could absolutely do it, but that's a ton of money to spend on drives for a server IMHO. 

all three of the pc's being built have 4tb seagate firecuda 530 drives. so im trying to make it as fast as possible, money is no concern. 

[leonardmartin29]

Just now, Electronics Wizardy said:

Do you want DIY or premade? rackmount or tower?

 

Probably go synology if premade, pretty good systems, and easy to use os.

 

For the switch, what 10gbe standard are you using? 10gbe base-t? Probaby get the netgear 24port 10gbe switches, but there aren't silent if thats a issue.

everything is going in a air conditioned utility room in the basement of the house. ive thought about doing both rack or tower. i could built a closet or shelf and install it. or buy a rack like jaystwocents did and put in a floor rack. which do you think is better. once again money is no issue. ive tried looking at the synology website it only recommends a 1 bay setup which is hdd if i switch to business it gives me huge 4U rack 20 ssds etc. seems to be no middle. right now im figuring out the system. i have rogers fibe internet which is gigabite down and 30 mbps up which is the best i can get here for the house. ive instructed the electrictions different places to wire cat6a cables to the utility room in the basement. other than that i havnt configured anything. and do not have alot of experience. i just know i want the best money can buy.

[Electronics Wizardy]

13 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

everything is going in a air conditioned utility room in the basement of the house. ive thought about doing both rack or tower. i could built a closet or shelf and install it. or buy a rack like jaystwocents did and put in a floor rack. which do you think is better. once again money is no issue. ive tried looking at the synology website it only recommends a 1 bay setup which is hdd if i switch to business it gives me huge 4U rack 20 ssds etc. seems to be no middle. right now im figuring out the system. i have rogers fibe internet which is gigabite down and 30 mbps up which is the best i can get here for the house. ive instructed the electrictions different places to wire cat6a cables to the utility room in the basement. other than that i havnt configured anything. and do not have alot of experience. i just know i want the best money can buy.

If you got a room, Id go rack, then its easy to make the switch, router, nas, patch panel and other devices tiday.

 

Since you have cat 6a you want 10g base-t, so something like this guy would be a good switch. https://www.netgear.com/business/wired/switches/smart/xs728t/

 

THis guy is about 3.5k, 1u, 10ssd https://www.synology.com/en-us/products/FS2500. There are alos 2u verisions with 24 bays.

 

You can also get the 3.5in models made for hdds, then get a 12 bay 2u, and put ssds in.

 

Do you have plans for router? Id be tempted to go unifi for router + aps. Then you get one nice easy to manage web ui for the network. In that case, Id go with their switches, so its one management panel for wifi, router, and switching.

[leonardmartin29]

1 hour ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

If you got a room, Id go rack, then its easy to make the switch, router, nas, patch panel and other devices tiday.

 

Since you have cat 6a you want 10g base-t, so something like this guy would be a good switch. https://www.netgear.com/business/wired/switches/smart/xs728t/

 

THis guy is about 3.5k, 1u, 10ssd https://www.synology.com/en-us/products/FS2500. There are alos 2u verisions with 24 bays.

 

You can also get the 3.5in models made for hdds, then get a 12 bay 2u, and put ssds in.

 

Do you have plans for router? Id be tempted to go unifi for router + aps. Then you get one nice easy to manage web ui for the network. In that case, Id go with their switches, so its one management panel for wifi, router, and switching.

oh sweet now you are starting to talk my wants. switch looks great can you send a link for the 24 bay nas. maybe ill add extra bays now incase i want extra space down the road. 

i dont have plans for a router yet. i need to figure something out for wifi. house is 2000 sq ft bungalow plus basement. rectangle. any suggestions for routers for wifi id appreciate it i was looking at asus RT-AX89X

also any suggestions for server racks for me appreciated something with air cooling would be great. maybe like a 12u wall mount unit would be big enough

[Blue4130]

1 hour ago, leonardmartin29 said:

i am totally rebuilding a house infrastructure. network room etc. installing 10gb switch throughout the house. so people will be able to plug in in every room. there will be 3 pc that are being built that will constantly be used by various people in the household for various tasks, including gaming, movies, school work, everything you name it. 2 of the pc's are hooked to 2 75" tv's another is hooked to a 32" monitor. the house is being wired with cat6a. i have not yet choosen a switch. i want pure speed for multiple users at a time. im willing to pay 30k-40k for it thats not a problem. i have even thought about going nvme m.2 nas but people thought that was even more rediculous. seems like this site is for poor people or budget conscientious people. 

as for things i will be doing with it. i do some video editing of family events and stuff long videos, lots of data. i like to transfer them fast when i have to im very impatient. also movies, game files,  if you could recommend a high quality 10gb switch that would be great. i need at least 15 ports

Well since we are getting into silly money territory, go for something from Pure, HPE, liqid, 45drives etc.

[Electronics Wizardy]

1 hour ago, leonardmartin29 said:

oh sweet now you are starting to talk my wants. switch looks great can you send a link for the 24 bay nas. maybe ill add extra bays now incase i want extra space down the road. 

i dont have plans for a router yet. i need to figure something out for wifi. house is 2000 sq ft bungalow plus basement. rectangle. any suggestions for routers for wifi id appreciate it i was looking at asus RT-AX89X

also any suggestions for server racks for me appreciated something with air cooling would be great. maybe like a 12u wall mount unit would be big enough

One other option would be this 12 bay 2u, RackStation RS2421+

 

Then get the sas expansion chassis if needed for a total of 24 drives. 

 

You can get the 24 bay fs series boxes like the fs3400, but its not cheap, and probably way overkill here.

 

That router seems fine, but I haven't worked much with Asus router. 2000sqft shoudln't need that great of a wifi setup to cover.

 

The RS2421+ is pretty shallow, so it should fit in a wall mount rack. You shouldn't need aditional cooling, none of these parts make much heat, and the included fans will move plenty of air.

 

[leonardmartin29]

9 minutes ago, Blue4130 said:

Well since we are getting into silly money territory, go for something from Pure, HPE, liqid, 45drives etc.

i personally wouldnt call it silly money. spending millions would be silly 100k-200k for a great home electronics setup is just plain good advice to me. 

heres what we have figured out so far.

Cat6a cabling (done)

router asus RT-AX89X (possibility) any other suggestions

switch https://www.netgear.com/business/wired/switches/smart/xs728t/

nas https://www.synology.com/en-us/products/FS6400

 

[leonardmartin29]

9 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

One other option would be this 12 bay 2u, RackStation RS2421+

 

Then get the sas expansion chassis if needed for a total of 24 drives. 

 

You can get the 24 bay fs series boxes like the fs3400, but its not cheap, and probably way overkill here.

 

That router seems fine, but I haven't worked much with Asus router. 2000sqft shoudln't need that great of a wifi setup to cover.

 

The RS2421+ is pretty shallow, so it should fit in a wall mount rack. You shouldn't need aditional cooling, none of these parts make much heat, and the included fans will move plenty of air.

 

what do you think of this https://www.synology.com/en-us/products/FS6400

[Electronics Wizardy]

24 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

what do you think of this https://www.synology.com/en-us/products/FS6400

Pretty overkill, but will be fast. 

 

It is a good amount deeper, so it likely won't fit in most wall mount rackes, as they are made for switches, not servers

[leonardmartin29]

2 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Pretty overkill, but will be fast. 

 

It is a good amount deeper, so it likely won't fit in most wall mount rackes, as they are made for switches, not servers

overkill i like lol. so a floor mount option server rack would be best. maybe one with wheels so it is easily moveable so i can clean around it and stuff. do you know any good brands for server racks

[Blue4130]

2 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

overkill i like lol. so a floor mount option server rack would be best. maybe one with wheels so it is easily moveable so i can clean around it and stuff. do you know any good brands for server racks

APC make some of the best racks.

39 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

i personally wouldnt call it silly money. spending millions would be silly 100k-200k for a great home electronics setup is just plain good advice to me. 

heres what we have figured out so far.

Cat6a cabling (done)

router asus RT-AX89X (possibility) any other suggestions

switch https://www.netgear.com/business/wired/switches/smart/xs728t/

nas https://www.synology.com/en-us/products/FS6400

 

200k is what some people spend on the house

 

But since you want high end and good, skip asus or any other brand like that for a router. Get a professional setup. Cisco, Aruba, Ruckus.

[leonardmartin29]

6 minutes ago, Blue4130 said:

APC make some of the best racks.

200k is what some people spend on the house

 

But since you want high end and good, skip asus or any other brand like that for a router. Get a professional setup. Cisco, Aruba, Ruckus.

if you could help. ive heard good things about cisco, could you suggest a model. maybe a link. 

[Blue4130]

7 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

if you could help. ive heard good things about cisco, could you suggest a model. maybe a link. 

Something like a CW9164 would probably work well.

https://meraki.cisco.com/product/wi-fi/indoor-access-points/cw9164/

 

Pair it with a Cisco switch to stay in the ecosystem...

https://meraki.cisco.com/product/switches/stackable-access-switches/ms390-24/

[leonardmartin29]

1 minute ago, Blue4130 said:

Something like a CW9164 would probably work well.

https://meraki.cisco.com/product/wi-fi/indoor-access-points/cw9164/

 

Pair it with a Cisco switch to stay in the ecosystem...

https://meraki.cisco.com/product/switches/stackable-access-switches/ms390-24/

that switch is a 1gb switch. i want 10gb switch

[Blue4130]

2 minutes ago, leonardmartin29 said:

that switch is a 1gb switch. i want 10gb switch

No, it is multigig. Each port can be configured to be either 100m,1,2.5,5 or 10gig

 

 

[LIGISTX]

4 hours ago, leonardmartin29 said:

seems like this site is for poor people or budget conscientious people. 

Not exactly.... its just there is almost no home use case where a flash NAS is actually useful. A decent ZFS array can easily saturate 10 gigabit with only spinning rust, and spinning rust is much easier to actually deploy since flash storage arrays are just starting to become "not bleeding edge and partially experimental".

 

I am 100% for going ham on things if you can afford it, so don't take this as me trying to talk you out of it. Its just, realistically, unless your turning your home into a video production studio with MANY people editing 4k+ video at the same time directly off the NAS, or running very, very serious databases, the flash storage is just going to sit there asking "am I ever actually going to get pushed to actually try and do something fast?" A full flash array is extremely bottlenecked by 10 gigabit.... if you actually want fast, and you are redoing your house currently, run fiber. If money isn't really an issue, dump the copper cables, and run fiber everywhere you can. Get a bunch of connectX (whatever cards people would recommend, this is above my level of experience), and actually put in a home network that gives your way over the top NAS a way to actually not just sit there idle all day - still HIGHLY doubt your workloads would need any of this, but if your going to do it anyways, might as well really do it.

 

10 gigabit rj45 is cool and all, but for a full flash NAS, you're just throwing money into a tire fire since 10 gigabit won't even sort of touch the raw speeds of the storage appliance. Yes, random reads and writes will be phenomenal, but again you can accomplish that with a decent ZFS setup.

 

A typical use case for a full flash storage appliance would be with a 40 or 100 gigabit link to a switch, and then from there it would break out to 10 GbE to many many clients so all clients can actually hit it at once at full 10 GbE. 3 clients hitting a NAS that only has a single (or even 2) GbE links just doesn't make much sense going full flash storage.

 

But, again, this is miles out of my price range and thus out of my knowledge range. I know enough to be dangerous, and I am looking into 10 GbE myself for my full spinning rust ZFS array (as that array should have no issues saturating a single 10 GbE link...), but when you start talking about full flash storage, things get a little wild.

 

I'd even recommend contacting someone like Lawrence Systems, who has a fantastic youtube channel btw, and have them consult on what you should actually do. If your spending 200k on home networking/infrastructure, whats another ~5-10k in consulting/configuration to make sure its actually worthwhile, and actually works...

 

Also i just re-read the original post. 2/3 of the machines will be HTPC’s. Will they actually be doing anything that needs anything near these speeds? Massive data ingest, 8k video editing from data stored on the NAS, I honestly don’t even know what else an HTPC could possibly do. But, protip, I’d just use nvidia shield TV’s for HTPC duty. They are basically the best option for Plex playback. I have one, it’s fantastic. Using a PC is sort of difficult, but Plex on the nvidia shield tv pro handles 4k Dolby vision/Atmos content perfectly, whereas PC’s just never quite work right. But, again, being that an HTPC doesn’t even need 100 Mb, non the less a full flash backed 10 gigabit link. Just to sort of put this into perspective, you’d need to stream ~140 bluray 4k movies, at the same time, to the same HTPC, to saturate 10 GbE… 

[leonardmartin29]

4 hours ago, LIGISTX said:

Not exactly.... its just there is almost no home use case where a flash NAS is actually useful. A decent ZFS array can easily saturate 10 gigabit with only spinning rust, and spinning rust is much easier to actually deploy since flash storage arrays are just starting to become "not bleeding edge and partially experimental".

 

I am 100% for going ham on things if you can afford it, so don't take this as me trying to talk you out of it. Its just, realistically, unless your turning your home into a video production studio with MANY people editing 4k+ video at the same time directly off the NAS, or running very, very serious databases, the flash storage is just going to sit there asking "am I ever actually going to get pushed to actually try and do something fast?" A full flash array is extremely bottlenecked by 10 gigabit.... if you actually want fast, and you are redoing your house currently, run fiber. If money isn't really an issue, dump the copper cables, and run fiber everywhere you can. Get a bunch of connectX (whatever cards people would recommend, this is above my level of experience), and actually put in a home network that gives your way over the top NAS a way to actually not just sit there idle all day - still HIGHLY doubt your workloads would need any of this, but if your going to do it anyways, might as well really do it.

 

10 gigabit rj45 is cool and all, but for a full flash NAS, you're just throwing money into a tire fire since 10 gigabit won't even sort of touch the raw speeds of the storage appliance. Yes, random reads and writes will be phenomenal, but again you can accomplish that with a decent ZFS setup.

 

A typical use case for a full flash storage appliance would be with a 40 or 100 gigabit link to a switch, and then from there it would break out to 10 GbE to many many clients so all clients can actually hit it at once at full 10 GbE. 3 clients hitting a NAS that only has a single (or even 2) GbE links just doesn't make much sense going full flash storage.

 

But, again, this is miles out of my price range and thus out of my knowledge range. I know enough to be dangerous, and I am looking into 10 GbE myself for my full spinning rust ZFS array (as that array should have no issues saturating a single 10 GbE link...), but when you start talking about full flash storage, things get a little wild.

 

I'd even recommend contacting someone like Lawrence Systems, who has a fantastic youtube channel btw, and have them consult on what you should actually do. If your spending 200k on home networking/infrastructure, whats another ~5-10k in consulting/configuration to make sure its actually worthwhile, and actually works...

 

Also i just re-read the original post. 2/3 of the machines will be HTPC’s. Will they actually be doing anything that needs anything near these speeds? Massive data ingest, 8k video editing from data stored on the NAS, I honestly don’t even know what else an HTPC could possibly do. But, protip, I’d just use nvidia shield TV’s for HTPC duty. They are basically the best option for Plex playback. I have one, it’s fantastic. Using a PC is sort of difficult, but Plex on the nvidia shield tv pro handles 4k Dolby vision/Atmos content perfectly, whereas PC’s just never quite work right. But, again, being that an HTPC doesn’t even need 100 Mb, non the less a full flash backed 10 gigabit link. Just to sort of put this into perspective, you’d need to stream ~140 bluray 4k movies, at the same time, to the same HTPC, to saturate 10 GbE… 

now see you are starting to get me. im very new at this and dont know awhole lot. ive built a few computers but in regards to tech pffft im not that great. i went to the local canada computers to see if they could help me they tried giving me a 500$ nas and when i spoke with the manager he was like stop wasting our time we have better things to do. 

where do i find a fiber technician? idk how to install it. i would love it. i want the best. i want something that when a rich nerd or a Linus or jaytwocents shows up to my house they dont laugh at the network they drewl over the network. how would you make linus drewl over a house with tech for 3 computers and a nas. im saying 100k-200k but if its 250k-500k for the best then lets do that. money is no option. i dont want in 20 years wanna redo this again. im gonna contact that guy you said and see if he will help me