12900k in a Lian Li Q58W4 with a 280mm AIO

[Cashmaster]

Budget (including currency): 3500 Euros

Country: Germany

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Adobe Suite, Gaming

 

Hey guys,

 

I wanted to build a new PC after around 10 years of not owning a proper one (I know it has been a long time...). I wanted to build a mini-ITX system in the Lian Li Q58W4 with a 12900K. Now most mini-ITX cases sadly only go up to 280mm (if at all, most stop at 240). Do you guys think it would be enough to cool the 12900k? or should I go with a 5900X or 5950X. Thunderbolt 4 would be kind of nice but I am not really married to that. I am planning on obviously gaming on it as well as starting a small film production company, mainly to stay busy once I finish acting school. I saved up a pretty decent budget over the years and rn in germany you can get pretty good deals on 3090s so I thought i would throw that one in there as well. How do you guys think that will affect temps? Anyone have any experience with that case? 

 

Thanks in advance for your help guys!
 

 

[PDifolco]

From what I've seen/read/watched mini ITX  isn't really good for a 12900K, too powerful/too hot, a 12700K or 5900X/5950X would be more adapted 

[Alvin853]

Couple things to consider: 

• Not all 280mm AiOs are compatible with the Q58, so check beforehand the one you want is.
• You may not be able to use the 2.5" drive bay in combination with a 280mm AiO.
• The opening ratio of the top panel is very small, restricting airflow and causing the top panel to get extremely warm. Even on my 3700X+3070Ti system the top can get so hot I can barely touch it. But removing the top panel is very easy and helps greatly, as the radiator then is exposed and no heat is being trapped. 
• You could opt for a mesh sidepanel kit to make all 4 side panels mesh, if temps are a concern. 
• As far as cooling goes, it should be fine overall. This guy has a 12900K and a 3090 in a much smaller case (though on cutom loop watercooling) 

[RONOTHAN##]

280mm can be OK if it's a good AIO, though it's definitely a bit on the weak side for a 12900K. If you want Thunderbolt 4 though, it's your only real option (there aren't any ITX Thunderbolt 4 AM4 motherboards I'm aware of, at least not yet), and a board like the Z690I Unify would be a pretty good pairing. Downgrading to a 12700K would be a decent option, it's a lot easier to cool and it's really not that much slower in most tasks. 

 

That said, new CPUs are just around the corner, so if you can wait another month you should be able to get something a bit better for the same amount of money, or might be able to score a deal on a last gen CPU and motherboard

[Super panda]

10 minutes ago, Cashmaster said:

Budget (including currency): 3500 Euros

Country: Germany

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Adobe Suite, Gaming

 

Hey guys,

 

I wanted to build a new PC after around 10 years of not owning a proper one (I know it has been a long time...). I wanted to build a mini-ITX system in the Lian Li Q58W4 with a 12900K. Now most mini-ITX cases sadly only go up to 280mm (if at all, most stop at 240). Do you guys think it would be enough to cool the 12900k? or should I go with a 5900X or 5950X. Thunderbolt 4 would be kind of nice but I am not really married to that. I am planning on obviously gaming on it as well as starting a small film production company, mainly to stay busy once I finish acting school. I saved up a pretty decent budget over the years and rn in germany you can get pretty good deals on 3090s so I thought i would throw that one in there as well. How do you guys think that will affect temps? Anyone have any experience with that case? 

 

Thanks in advance for your help guys!
 

 

Lian Li 280mm is pretty good according to a gamers nexus so I think you should be fine. I have a 12900KS myself and I'm using a corsairH150i Pro XT from 5 years ago to cool it and it's doing the job just fine (not good enough for any overclocks tho but with stock clocks and some undervolting it stays cool enough) Mind if I ask for how much you can buy a 3090 there right now ?

[Cashmaster]

10 minutes ago, Super panda said:

Lian Li 280mm is pretty good according to a gamers nexus so I think you should be fine. I have a 12900KS myself and I'm using a corsairH150i Pro XT from 5 years ago to cool it and it's doing the job just fine (not good enough for any overclocks tho but with stock clocks and some undervolting it stays cool enough) Mind if I ask for how much you can buy a 3090 there right now ?

Thank you so much for your response. Right now a 3090 from asus goes for around 1400. In Europe prices are always far more expensive than in the U.S. or Canada. Probably tariffs and taxes. I saw a 3080ti from zotac for 1000 so i might also go for that one but the extra vram would be nice.

10 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

280mm can be OK if it's a good AIO, though it's definitely a bit on the weak side for a 12900K. If you want Thunderbolt 4 though, it's your only real option (there aren't any ITX Thunderbolt 4 AM4 motherboards, at least not yet), and a board like the Z690I Unify would be a pretty good pairing. Downgrading to a 12700K would be a decent option, it's a lot easier to cool and it's really not that much slower in most tasks. 

 

That said, new CPUs are just around the corner, so if you can wait another month you should be able to get something a bit better for the same amount of money, or might be able to score a deal on a last gen CPU and motherboard

Thanks for your response. I am also hesitant with getting an AM4 CPU because it is the end of the line for that socket. with 1700 i have some upgrade paths down the line. And I think I will wait a bit for announcements to come and buy them then, but right now is a pretty good time to buy GPUs and CPUs in Germany. 

10 minutes ago, Alvin853 said:

Couple things to consider: 

• Not all 280mm AiOs are compatible with the Q58, so check beforehand the one you want is.
• You may not be able to use the 2.5" drive bay in combination with a 280mm AiO.
• The opening ratio of the top panel is very small, restricting airflow and causing the top panel to get extremely warm. Even on my 3700X+3070Ti system the top can get so hot I can barely touch it. But removing the top panel is very easy and helps greatly, as the radiator then is exposed and no heat is being trapped. 
• You could opt for a mesh sidepanel kit to make all 4 side panels mesh, if temps are a concern. 
• As far as cooling goes, it should be fine overall. This guy has a 12900K and a 3090 in a much smaller case (though on cutom loop watercooling) 

Thanks so much!
i had not considered the first point actually! thank you. I was thinking of getting one by EKWB as 280 AiOs are hard to come by weirdly enough.
I was actually thinking of leaving the top panel off as well and also to opt for the mesh kit as i really like that aesthetic. 

[Alvin853]

11 minutes ago, Cashmaster said:

Thank you so much for your response. Right now a 3090 from asus goes for around 1400. In Europe prices are always far more expensive than in the U.S. or Canada. Probably tariffs and taxes. I saw a 3080ti from zotac for 1000 so i might also go for that one but the extra vram would be nice.

You need to be a bit careful with GPU length in the Q58. ASUS ROG Strix is cutting it real close, some people say they made it work, others say it's too long by a mm or two, could be manufacturing tolerances or how much force you're willing to apply. Lian Li rates the case at 320mm GPU clearance, a ROG Strix card is rated 318.5mm length. ASUS TUF Gaming fits very comfortably as it has a slightly smaller cooler. I know the MSI Gaming X Trio doesn't fit, Gainward/Palit/PNY and EVGA cards all fit fine, not sure about Zotac

[Cashmaster]

On 8/17/2022 at 10:49 AM, Alvin853 said:

You need to be a bit careful with GPU length in the Q58. ASUS ROG Strix is cutting it real close, some people say they made it work, others say it's too long by a mm or two, could be manufacturing tolerances or how much force you're willing to apply. Lian Li rates the case at 320mm GPU clearance, a ROG Strix card is rated 318.5mm length. ASUS TUF Gaming fits very comfortably as it has a slightly smaller cooler. I know the MSI Gaming X Trio doesn't fit, Gainward/Palit/PNY and EVGA cards all fit fine, not sure about Zotac

That is actually a good point to consider! Thank you so much for the feedback.

Just as a little thought experiment. Would a peltier type cooler like this https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-quantum-delta2-tec-d-rgb-full-nickel technically not work with a custom 280 loop? What do you guys think the performance would be?
 

[jaslion]

For a 12900k in a more restricted itx build thats a hard no. Youll be at 100c in no time.

 

For your usecase a 5950x would make a lot more sense.

 

Also as a case the nr200p is the better one as long as you do the MESH panel.

[brob]

You might consider an i9-12900(F). It offers more cooling room for a small performance penalty. Could be paired with something like the z690i-Unify if Thunderbolt is required, otherwise something like the STRIX B660i could be used.

[DADDYDOM]

On 8/17/2022 at 1:35 AM, Super panda said:

Lian Li 280mm is pretty good according to a gamers nexus so I think you should be fine. I have a 12900KS myself and I'm using a corsairH150i Pro XT from 5 years ago to cool it and it's doing the job just fine (not good enough for any overclocks tho but with stock clocks and some undervolting it stays cool enough) Mind if I ask for how much you can buy a 3090 there right now ?

Hey man... May I ask what undervolting values you are using? 

 

I am in a situation where I have a 12900k on an MSI Carbon Wifi MoBo and an NZXT Kraken x73 (360 AIO) and when everything is left on stock setings in BIOS except XMP being on, when running CinebenchR23 and monitoring with HWinfo64, It Thermal Throttles with a final 10 miinuteww score of about 26700 ish and this is with the pump on the AIO running in FIXED Mode at its highest RPM. I will also say I am built in the NZXT h710i Case BUT... My Top, Front and SIde (glass) panels are all modded / aftermarket with hexagon holes cut into them throughout the panels for MAXIMUM air flow so the flowe is definitely not the problem.

 

When you say "Stock Bios Settings" (I dont know what board youre using but...) what is your COOLER setting set to? On my board I have 3 choices - The "stock / out of the box" setting is called WATER COOLER and allows for maximum wattage to be drawn with the max wattage showing at 4096 Watts, AIR COOLER allows for a maximum of 288 Watts and BOXED COOLER allows for maximum wattage of 241 Watts (I think it is). That being said, I cant even run full stock settings at the BOXED COOLER level due to Thermal Throttling as per HWinfo64.

 

Someone on the MSI Forums has assisted me in setting the PL1 and PL2 to 200w (Long Duration) and 220w (Short Duration) and this has netted me a typical CinebenchE23 score of about 25600 with no "Thermal Throttling" but it is obviously Power Limit Throttling as Cinebench wants to pull atleast 281 Watts or so.

 

The next steps he has advised me to do on top of the PL1 and 2 changes as per the above is to now play with the CPU Lite Load modes until I find where it is stable and then go 1 higher for assured stability - while trying to get as close to Mode 1 as possible he says. So yesterday I tried it and jumped from Mode 9 (stock setting) to mode 5 and ran linpak and got really good temps but the CPU seemed really sluggish so I then ran a CinebenchR23 while set up like that and after the first completion of the picture, it reported a score of like 14000 so I shut it all down and turned the CPULite mode back to Mode 9 and am now getting the approximate 25600 scores again while at 200W LONG / 220W SHORT PL levels

 

Its almost upsetting that although I have a decent 360mm AIO, I have to set my PL levels so low for it to run without cooking itself - especially if it is expected that a BOXED COOLER will keep the CPU tamed at 241W both Short and Long Duration.

 

Do you or does anyone else have any insights?