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Fairly large virtualization server spec help

0xFellowComrade
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Hey! Looking to build a fairly large first virtualization server (Budget of around $2000 aud or about $1500 US) for a multitude of reasons, mostly for development services for myself and some friends (Gitlab, Codeserver and Docker to deploy code, Plex + bittorrent and a Windows 10 VM and a couple more)

Was looking at building a 1st gen EPYC server, but couldn't find anything great with a high clock speed + expensive components like ECC memory. So i was looking at a used 1950X Threadripper on ebay that i fit into my budget. Specs are here: (https://au.pcpartpicker.com/user/Wrecked256/saved/ZMbWt6)

I haven't run a server before only some Virtualbox VMs for learning so am not familiar with resource requirement for services or a hypervisor to run it all on (was thinking Proxmox?)

Any suggestions on what hardware i should consider? Noise is also a big factor as the machine will be sitting right next to me (No proper ethernet networking throughout the house)

Thanks for any help!

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1st gen threadrippe sucks there is a reason it's cheap.

 

I mean you don't need much here at all. Some rando cheapo xeon v3 that has a boost clock of over 3ghz and whatever amount of cores you want + 1 or 2 gpu's (one for the plex server) that can encode would be plenty good.

 

Your pcpartpciker setup is just not good. First gen threadripper is garbage bin material stuff.

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I wouldn't go with 1st Gen TR, if you can't go with at least a Zen 2 base product then better to stick to a used Intel Xeon platform honestly. Zen/Zen+ was never really that good for VM platforms unless the VM sizes were small i.e 4 vCPUs or 8 vCPUs (max and only a few).

 

E5-2680v4's are going for around $130 USD on ebay and you can get a good SSI-EEB/EATX single or dual socket motherboards for not a lot and you can get ECC UDIMM for not a lot if you don't need very high total system ram, ECC RDIMM is more expensive.

 

If you have to have high clocks then a E5-2667v4 will cost you around $230 USD but I really doubt you need it.

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5 minutes ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

Thank you both for the swift reply, will look into xeon v4 CPUs. Is buying second hand worth it or should i try to stick to new items?

CPUs are very reliable and I've brought around 20 ish used Xeons on ebay without issue. Stick to well know motherboards when buying used and check photos and descriptions well, also brought quite a few without problem but much more important to QA the purchase first for these.

 

Also by well known I mean in the server market, like Supermicro. Don't go with some weird hybrid motherboard that is trying to be a server one while not actually being one.

 

ebay is rather good a refunds anyway.

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20 minutes ago, leadeater said:

CPUs are very reliable and I've brought around 20 ish used Xeons on ebay without issue. Stick to well know motherboards when buying used and check photos and descriptions well, also brought quite a few without problem but much more important to QA the purchase first for these.

 

Also by well known I mean in the server market, like Supermicro. Don't go with some weird hybrid motherboard that is trying to be a server one while not actually being one.

 

ebay is rather good a refunds anyway.

Just one other question, how much of a performance difference are V3 xeons to V4?. e.g E5-2667 V3 vs V4

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3 hours ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

How about something like a 3900x/5900x? Should be faster in most apps, lower power consumption. But its limited to 128gb of ram if that matters to you.

Only reason i didn't at the time was due to the price of said CPUs, being about $1100, And with seeing the 1950X for so cheap brought be to believe that the 1950X would at least be on par with a Ryzen 9

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Just now, 0xFellowComrade said:

Only reason i didn't at the time was due to the price of said CPUs, being about $1100, And with seeing the 1950X for so cheap brought be to believe that the 1950X would at least be on par with a Ryzen 9

Where are you seeing those prices? on PCPP AU it seems to be about $700. And it will smoke a 1950x in single threaded tasks, so things like updates, program installs,  most scripts and other tasks will be much faster.

 

Also the power savings will be pretty signifant with the chip too.

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2 minutes ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

Was being dumb and thought of the wrong CPU, not too concerned about power draw but that's good to know

Also with that build, Id probably focus much more on ram and ssds than the cpu. 


Normally the RAM is the most limiting factor with vms, Id go 64gb here, maybe 128gb.

 

Id also get higher end ssds, those a400s and p1s aren't great drive. Get used server drives if you want cheaper.

 

 

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1 minute ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

Thanks for the help i will see what i can find on used server drives. I plan to upgrade to more ram in the future, however was only able to fit 32gb into that build

Id probably go with a 3800x/10700 and get better drives here. The cpu isn't gonna be the limit here.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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On 11/1/2021 at 8:10 PM, leadeater said:

CPUs are very reliable and I've brought around 20 ish used Xeons on ebay without issue. Stick to well know motherboards when buying used and check photos and descriptions well, also brought quite a few without problem but much more important to QA the purchase first for these.

 

Also by well known I mean in the server market, like Supermicro. Don't go with some weird hybrid motherboard that is trying to be a server one while not actually being one.

 

ebay is rather good a refunds anyway.

Sorry for a late reply, but finished E5-2680 V4 build.. https://au.pcpartpicker.com/user/Wrecked256/saved/#view=cj8L99 Is there anything else this might need or anything else to suggest? Will expand on memory at a later date.

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8 minutes ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

Sorry for a late reply, but finished E5-2680 V4 build.. https://au.pcpartpicker.com/user/Wrecked256/saved/#view=cj8L99 Is there anything else this might need or anything else to suggest? Will expand on memory at a later date.

Id get a used server, should be cheaper, much better build quality, more ram slots, better remote management.

 

Those hdds are smr, stay away.

 

Id stay away from the a400 ssds, there pretty slow and don't have dram. Id get some more 860 evos/870 evos.

 

ALso 32gb of ram isn't much, and will limit you, and its single channel. Probalby go like 128-256gb of ram with this amount of cpu power.

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9 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Id get a used server, should be cheaper, much better build quality, more ram slots, better remote management.

 

Those hdds are smr, stay away.

 

Id stay away from the a400 ssds, there pretty slow and don't have dram. Id get some more 860 evos/870 evos.

 

ALso 32gb of ram isn't much, and will limit you, and its single channel. Probalby go like 128-256gb of ram with this amount of cpu power.

Any particular model or brand of server that i could begin looking for?
 

If i got a used server i could most likely upgrade so SAS disks

Will do

 

Didn't realize it was single channel, will always expand memory at a later date.

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11 minutes ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

Any particular model or brand of server that i could begin looking for?
 

Dell r730? HP dl380 g9. Should be a lot of them on ebay.

 

Also for your uses, you can probalby go down a notch on cpu.

 

Yea memory is easy to add.

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1 minute ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Dell r730? HP dl380 g9. Should be a lot of them on ebay.

 

Also for your uses, you can probalby go down a notch on cpu.

 

Yea memory is easy to add.

How noisy are the two? the server would be sitting in my office

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13 minutes ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

How noisy are the two? the server would be sitting in my office

There both pretty noisy. 

 

Id probably suggest getting something like a ryzen chip here. Faster for almost all of these tasks, lower power, quieter.

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2 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

There both pretty noisy. 

 

Id probably suggest getting something like a ryzen chip here. Faster for almost all of these tasks, lower power, quieter.

Only reason that i didn't go with a consumer chip was due to a lack of pcie lanes and SATA connectors. I could fix the issue of sata connections with a pcie expansion card but that, with NVMe ssds and a graphics card that occupied all of the Ryzens pcie lanes.

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2 minutes ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

Only reason that i didn't go with a consumer chip was due to a lack of pcie lanes and SATA connectors. I could fix the issue of sata connections with a pcie expansion card but that, with NVMe ssds and a graphics card that occupied all of the Ryzens pcie lanes.

I don't think pcie lanes would be an issue. 

 

How many drives do you need? From the build you listed you aren't needing many drives, and it can easily handle 2 gpus.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

I don't think pcie lanes would be an issue. 

 

How many drives do you need? From the build you listed you aren't needing many drives, and it can easily handle 2 gpus.

 

 

Not sure at the moment but i can imagine that i may need to expand more as both a plex media library grows (will have multiple clients) and even for room for more virtual machines. For gpus i was going to have the 1st for the server, a 2nd for Plex and potentially a third if i could fit it in for a virtual machine, haven't bought any at the moment due to gpu prices. I thought that the cpu wouldn't be able to utilize 2 gpus, 2 nvme disks and the sata expander.

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3 minutes ago, 0xFellowComrade said:

Not sure at the moment but i can imagine that i may need to expand more as both a plex media library grows (will have multiple clients) and even for room for more virtual machines. For gpus i was going to have the 1st for the server, a 2nd for Plex and potentially a third if i could fit it in for a virtual machine, haven't bought any at the moment due to gpu prices. I thought that the cpu wouldn't be able to utilize 2 gpus, 2 nvme disks and the sata expander.

You shoudln't need a gpu for plex, something like a 3900x will hangle many transcodes at the same time, no gpu needed.

 

You can get a ryzen board with a gpu included, won't need one for plex, and then use the slot for the vm. 

 

I don't see ryzen causing you issues with expansion here. You also have 

 

Look at a board like this guy https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X570D4U-2L2T#Specifications. there is a gpu on the board so you don't need one for video out. And it has 2 nvme m.2 slots too.

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1 minute ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

You shoudln't need a gpu for plex, something like a 3900x will hangle many transcodes at the same time, no gpu needed.

 

You can get a ryzen board with a gpu included, won't need one for plex, and then use the slot for the vm. 

 

I don't see ryzen causing you issues with expansion here. You also have 

 

Look at a board like this guy https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X570D4U-2L2T#Specifications. there is a gpu on the board so you don't need one for video out. And it has 2 nvme m.2 slots too.

Ok thanks for the help! will have a look at the board(s) and try making a ryzen build

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