How much power do I really need?

[BiffsPC]

Hello, building my first PC. Need some advice on what PSU and size to get. Its a higher end build, mostly an all around PC, some CAD and some gaming, bit of video editing. Parts were chosen partial based on ratings partially what was on good sales/available over the last couple of months.

 

These are the parts I have:

Fractal Design Meshify 2 Case (White)

Ryzen 7 5800X Processor

MSI MEG X570 Unify Motherboard

Corsair Vengeance Pro Ram (32gb)

Western Digital Black SN750 500 gb NVME (Boot Drive)

2 Western Digital Red WD30EFRX 3Tb (Storage)

Aorus Liquid Cooler 360 AIO CPU Cooler

Asus TUFF RTX 3090 Video Card 

 

I did have a Corsair AX850 Titanium PSU but was dead out of box and has been sent back, Corsair told me it is no longer being produced. So was thinking of getting a different PSU while i wait for the replacement/store credit.

[CommanderAlex]

7 minutes ago, BiffsPC said:

I did have a Corsair AX850 Titanium PSU but was dead out of box and has been sent back, Corsair told me it is no longer being produced. So was thinking of getting a different PSU while i wait for the replacement/store credit.

Do you really need a titanium rated power supply??? They are pretty hard to find right now but I'd get a RM850(x) from Corsair, either model is highly rated.  

[YesImThatGuy]

17 minutes ago, BiffsPC said:

Hello, building my first PC. Need some advice on what PSU and size to get. Its a higher end build, mostly an all around PC, some CAD and some gaming, bit of video editing. Parts were chosen partial based on ratings partially what was on good sales/available over the last couple of months.

 

These are the parts I have:

Fractal Design Meshify 2 Case (White)

Ryzen 7 5800X Processor

MSI MEG X570 Unify Motherboard

Corsair Vengeance Pro Ram (32gb)

Western Digital Black SN750 500 gb NVME (Boot Drive)

2 Western Digital Red WD30EFRX 3Tb (Storage)

Aorus Liquid Cooler 360 AIO CPU Cooler

Asus TUFF RTX 3090 Video Card 

 

I did have a Corsair AX850 Titanium PSU but was dead out of box and has been sent back, Corsair told me it is no longer being produced. So was thinking of getting a different PSU while i wait for the replacement/store credit.

Power Supply Calculator - PSU Calculator | OuterVision I think it will helps.

[LpoolTech]

Anything from Tier A 850 or above

 

[RONOTHAN##]

I'd try to run a 1000w+ unit that's highly rated, just to be safe. You'll be able to get by with a 850w, but if you have 3090 money, you can afford to get a higher wattage unit.

[seon123]

A high end 850W should be fine. The RM850x is in stock, decently priced, and quiet.
https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/product/VgQG3C/corsair-rmx-2018-850w-80-gold-certified-fully-modular-atx-power-supply-cp-9020180-na

[BiffsPC]

9 hours ago, SpiderMan said:

Do you really need a titanium rated power supply??? They are pretty hard to find right now but I'd get a RM850(x) from Corsair, either model is highly rated.  

Need no probably not but it was on a good sale and was in stock and well rated. My electrical engineer buddy told me based on our energy price the titanium vs a gold if I use it 8 hours a day would be 15-20 cheaper a year. 

[CommanderAlex]

5 hours ago, BiffsPC said:

Need no probably not but it was on a good sale and was in stock and well rated. My electrical engineer buddy told me based on our energy price the titanium vs a gold if I use it 8 hours a day would be 15-20 cheaper a year. 

I highly doubt it would be 15-20 times cheaper on a titanium vs gold unless kW/price is very high in your region. Definitely check out the PSU Tier List and grab a power supply on there from Tier A due to RTX-30 transient loads and need a good, quality power supply. 

 

[seon123]

5 hours ago, BiffsPC said:

Need no probably not but it was on a good sale and was in stock and well rated. My electrical engineer buddy told me based on our energy price the titanium vs a gold if I use it 8 hours a day would be 15-20 cheaper a year. 

You don't need to be an EE to figure out how much it would cost. It's just basic middle school maths that anyone should be able to do.

0.500kW * (0.90^-1 - 0.94^-1) * 8 h/day * 365 days/year * 0.105 USD/kWh = 7.25 USD/year

And that is assuming that you spend 8 hours per day gaming. If you spend some time on anything else, the difference will be even smaller. $15-20 cheaper per year just sounds like numbers they pulled out of their ass.

 

Ignore the efficiency (and anyone that recommends based on 80+ ratings), get a good PSU instead.

14 hours ago, seon123 said:

A high end 850W should be fine. The RM850x is in stock, decently priced, and quiet.
https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/product/VgQG3C/corsair-rmx-2018-850w-80-gold-certified-fully-modular-atx-power-supply-cp-9020180-na

 

[Ankerson]

46 minutes ago, seon123 said:

You don't need to be an EE to figure out how much it would cost. It's just basic middle school maths that anyone should be able to do.

0.500kW * (0.90^-1 - 0.94^-1) * 8 h/day * 365 days/year * 0.105 USD/kWh = 7.25 USD/year

And that is assuming that you spend 8 hours per day gaming. If you spend some time on anything else, the difference will be even smaller. $15-20 cheaper per year just sounds like numbers they pulled out of their ass.

 

Ignore the efficiency (and anyone that recommends based on 80+ ratings), get a good PSU instead.

 

 

 

Actually....

 

At idle assuming 0.11 Cents per KWH.

 

Comparing Titanium to Platinum at say at 100W load that's about $5 a year difference running 24/7.

 

Would be around $13 a year difference say gaming 8 Hours a day assuming a 625W load.

 

So take the $13 gaming expense and add the 16 hour idle expense of about $3.50 and add those together for $16.50 a year saving going from a Platinum to Titanium.

 

Or about $165 difference in power cost over 10 years.

 

Gold rated would even be a larger difference in cost.

 

Titanium rated PSUs run MUCH MORE efficient at low loads than the rest, they will stay in the 90% or higher range while the others could drop into the low to mid 70% range. PCs are idle or at low loads for MOST of the time per day in general.

 

So depending on the PSU and say 10 years of usage it could pay for itself in that time period depending.

 

Just at idle loads alone over 10 years that's a $50 difference between Titanium and Platinum.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BiffsPC]

11 hours ago, SpiderMan said:

I highly doubt it would be 15-20 times cheaper on a titanium vs gold unless kW/price is very high in your region. Definitely check out the PSU Tier List and grab a power supply on there from Tier A due to RTX-30 transient loads and need a good, quality power supply. 

 

Ooops didn't see my typo when I submitted it. I meant $15-20 cheaper per year. My bad. 15-20 times would be amazing.

[CommanderAlex]

6 minutes ago, BiffsPC said:

Ooops didn't see my typo when I submitted it. I meant $15-20 cheaper per year. My bad. 15-20 times would be amazing.

No worries about the typo. It would be amazing though if that was the case. If you value the price difference between a titanium rated and a gold rated PSU, then go for the titanium unit as it will pay off in the long run/over the lifetime of the power supply.  

[seon123]

10 hours ago, Ankerson said:

Comparing Titanium to Platinum at say at 100W load that's about $5 a year difference running 24/7.

Show your working out.

10 hours ago, Ankerson said:

Would be around $13 a year difference say gaming 8 Hours a day assuming a 625W load.

Show your working out.

I used 500W, which is roughly the DC side draw under a gaming load with a 3950X, from Techspot's review of the 3090 FE.

https://www.techspot.com/review/2105-geforce-rtx-3090/

Even using your 625W and 0.11 USD / kWh, I got a different number than your $13 per year.

10 hours ago, Ankerson said:

and add the 16 hour idle expense of about $3.50

Again, show your working out. I showed the formula I derived and used, so anyone can check the numbers, and check that the formula is correct. I got a lower number, comparing the requirement for 80+ Titanium vs 80+ Gold.

 

 

I showed my working out, you did not. It does kind of seem like you pulled random numbers out of thin air.

 

Additionally, someone using their PC at full load for 8 hours per day, and for it to be idle for the other 16 is not a typical or realistic workload. Using that to figure out ROI is misleading at best.

10 hours ago, Ankerson said:

Titanium rated PSUs run MUCH MORE efficient at low loads than the rest, they will stay in the 90% or higher range while the others could drop into the low to mid 70% range. PCs are idle or at low loads for MOST of the time per day in general.

I opened up a bunch of random Cybenetics reports for 80+ Gold and 80+ Platinum rated PSUs. All of them were >80% efficient at 60W load. At 60W load, the difference between 80% efficiency and 90% efficiency is 8W. That's less than one of my LED light bulbs use.

20 minutes ago, SpiderMan said:

If you value the price difference between a titanium rated and a gold rated PSU, then go for the titanium unit as it will pay off in the long run/over the lifetime of the power supply.  

Ooooor, they could go for an actually decent PSU instead.

Looking at PCPP CA, the 80+ Titanium rated PSUs above 750W available are an 800W Silverstone SFX unit for $290, an 800W Silverstone ATX unit for $310, and the AX850 for $460. All of them lack multi rail OCP, the Silverstone units perform worse than the RMx, and the AX (just a Prime with minor tweaks) has a decent chance of having issues with the 3090's transients. Getting a worse unit, by paying $100-$150 more, for the possibility of getting ROI over 5-10 years. Brilliant advice, right there.

[CommanderAlex]

9 minutes ago, seon123 said:

Ooooor, they could go for an actually decent PSU instead.

Looking at PCPP CA, the 80+ Titanium rated PSUs above 750W available are an 800W Silverstone SFX unit for $290, an 800W Silverstone ATX unit for $310, and the AX850 for $460. All of them lack multi rail OCP, the Silverstone units perform worse than the RMx, and the AX (just a Prime with minor tweaks) has a decent chance of having issues with the 3090's transients. Getting a worse unit, by paying $100-$150 more, for the possibility of getting ROI over 5-10 years. Brilliant advice, right there.

It's not my fault for the current situation with the power supply market being screwed over too as well with high wattage, high efficiency rating PSUs being charged more than their actual price. What about EVGA's PSUs??? I am sure there are many other PSUs that are titanium rated than just the few you picked out. Didn't I also say, "If you value the price difference between a titanium rated and a gold rated PSU"??? I'm not forcing them to purchase a titanium rated PSU to only get screwed over in the long run. 

 

It's really absurd to be going that high with a titanium rated PSU at this range of wattage to begin with. At most, a platinum rated one would be a better pick for price, but overall the gold rated PSU will be the best between efficiency and cost. 

[seon123]

4 minutes ago, SpiderMan said:

It's not my fault for the current situation with the power supply market being screwed over too as well with high wattage, high efficiency rating PSUs being charged more than their actual price.

Okay....? How would that impact OP at all, if they have to get a PSU in the current market anyways?

5 minutes ago, SpiderMan said:

What about EVGA's PSUs??? I am sure there are many other PSUs that are titanium rated than just the few you picked out

 

15 minutes ago, seon123 said:

Looking at PCPP CA, the 80+ Titanium rated PSUs above 750W available are

I looked at the ones OP would actually be able to get. I also just looked at the 80+ Titanium PSUs in general, ignoring their price, and none of them stood out as being particularly better than if you just ignore the 80+ ratings.

The T2 lacks multi rail OCP, and looking at the pricing for the last two years on PCPP CA, it was never available at a reasonable price.

10 minutes ago, SpiderMan said:

Didn't I also say, "If you value the price difference between a titanium rated and a gold rated PSU"???

You seem to have missed my point. I'll highlight the part that I called out for being false.

48 minutes ago, SpiderMan said:

If you value the price difference between a titanium rated and a gold rated PSU, then go for the titanium unit as it will pay off in the long run/over the lifetime of the power supply.  

 

11 minutes ago, SpiderMan said:

It's really absurd to be going that high with a titanium rated PSU at this range of wattage to begin with. At most, a platinum rated one would be a better pick for price, but overall the gold rated PSU will be the best between efficiency and cost. 

Oooooor, you could ignore the 80+ rating, and the potential to save $10 over 10 years, and instead go for the PSU that performs better, is quieter, has fewer QC issues, is known to work with 3090s, and is actually available for OP.

[CommanderAlex]

5 minutes ago, seon123 said:

Okay....? How would that impact OP at all, if they have to get a PSU in the current market anyways?

 

I looked at the ones OP would actually be able to get. I also just looked at the 80+ Titanium PSUs in general, ignoring their price, and none of them stood out as being particularly better than if you just ignore the 80+ ratings.

The T2 lacks multi rail OCP, and looking at the pricing for the last two years on PCPP CA, it was never available at a reasonable price.

You seem to have missed my point. I'll highlight the part that I called out for being false.

 

Oooooor, you could ignore the 80+ rating, and the potential to save $10 over 10 years, and instead go for the PSU that performs better, is quieter, has fewer QC issues, is known to work with 3090s, and is actually available for OP.

You brought up the prices, isn't that facts for you? 

 

Ok, so did you want to sacrifice a body part of mine for mixing up platinum and titanium rated PSUs??? 

 

I did recommend to review the PSU Tier List before these posts and look at Tier A rated PSUs. Any normal person should read up and down to see the footnotes on the PSUs on what one's to avoid for a 3090.  

 

End of discussion.

 

 

[Ankerson]

1 hour ago, seon123 said:

I used 500W, which is roughly the DC side draw under a gaming load with a 3950X, from Techspot's review of the 3090 FE.

 

The FE isn't the typical real world power draw of the 3090 or even the 3080's, not even close really.

 

I know my machine pulls way more than that for a typical gaming load with my 3080 FTW3, and that's from the PSU to the machine, not from the wall.

 

Again real numbers from my machine.

1 hour ago, seon123 said:

Additionally, someone using their PC at full load for 8 hours per day, and for it to be idle for the other 16 is not a typical or realistic workload.

 

Never said that it was, was going by what was already posted, 8 hours of gaming etc.

 

I think maybe 4 or 5 hours max as far as gaming goes really, that's all I can do anyway.

1 hour ago, seon123 said:

I showed my working out, you did not. It does kind of seem like you pulled random numbers out of thin air.

 

Those are actual real numbers pulled from 2 of my machines I am currently running.

 

With a AXI 850 and AXI 1600 that show actual real time efficacy numbers and input and output wattages.

 

Then plugged in those numbers into a calculation program. 

[BiffsPC]

Oh my seems I started a bit of a debate. Sorry. For the record I got the Corsair AX850 Titanium PSU for $260 from Memory Express. At the time I bought it there was limited choice in the 700-850 watt range and it was similar price as some of the other choices. Also I didn't have a video card at the time and planned on a 3080. 

 

I'm going to wait and see what Corsair says about the warranty on the PSU, and will refer to Tier A if need to purchase something different.

 

I appreciate all the input.

 

Thanks Folks!

[Ankerson]

48 minutes ago, BiffsPC said:

Oh my seems I started a bit of a debate. Sorry. For the record I got the Corsair AX850 Titanium PSU for $260 from Memory Express. At the time I bought it there was limited choice in the 700-850 watt range and it was similar price as some of the other choices. Also I didn't have a video card at the time and planned on a 3080. 

 

I'm going to wait and see what Corsair says about the warranty on the PSU, and will refer to Tier A if need to purchase something different.

 

I appreciate all the input.

 

Thanks Folks!

 

The AX 850W does work fine with the 3080's.